Class 23 Baby Deltic - did it even get off the ground?

[bluedepot]

how about just buying a mainline livery class 37.  much easier.


https://youtu.be/Z_Kh0o3sPoY

[KevTheBusDriver]

What about a class 73? It has 40' 9"?

A loooooong time ago I scratched a 73 and a 23 on the same (Bachmann US) chassis. I think the wheelbase is 80.5mm.

[icairns]

Regarding potential donor chassis for a Baby Deltic, I don't know the bogie wheel spacing, but the main wheelbase figures suggest a Class 33 might be closer than a Class 25...

The old Poole Farish 25 and 33 shared the same chassis, so if I had said 33....I would have been closer but the Poole 33 bogies were sooooo wrong. Looks like it could be a Dapol donor again.
Is the Dapol 26/27 chassis the same as the 33 chassis? And what about the 35? I've used the 35 on class 71/74.

Bob

Many years ago, I bought a Sliver Fox Models Class 23 "Baby Deltic" kit (disc headcode version).

The kit was made of resin and the instructions state that the body fits either a Graham Farish Class 25 or Class 33 chassis.  As @Bob G said above, the chassis for the Class 25 and 33 are the same.  When I held a GF Class 25 chassis up against a Class 33, the wheelbase was identical. 

I never bothered to fit the replacement resin underframe tank or the Class 23 bogie sideframes.

The photo shows this model mounted on a Grafar (made in China) Class 33 chassis. 

Ian

[RBTKraisee]

If the Poole era Class 25 and 33 used the same chassis, then at least one of them was incorrect dimensions.

@Bob G  thinks I have some kind of fetish for Dapol, which really isn't the case, in fact I would say my Farish A1 Tornado is probably the pride of my current fleet! However as I already have a Dapol Class 33 here, I would be strongly tempted to use it as the basis for a Class 23 - unless others prefer I stick to Farish chassis' because they already have donors waiting on their shelves?

Who here would like me to add a Class 23 to my list of future projects? And who wants a Farish chassis option and/or a Dapol one? If I could get at least 5 customers lined up it would be worth pursuing.

Ross.

[Bob G]

Ross

The old Poole Farish 33 bogies looked nothing like the Dapol ones. I suspect that the bogies were closer to the 25, but still not quite right. Best to look at real bogie spacing and model bogie spacings to see what would be the better chassis. I suspect it *might* be a new Dapol 33 (what about a Dapol 26/27?) but I'm not so sure.

Long may the affair with Dapol continue It's not a fetish . It's far more extreme than that 

Bob 

[martyn]

Rue d'Etropal does both body versions on his Shapeways page.

No connection to him, just thought I'd mention it.

Martyn

[Dalteth]

If the Poole era Class 25 and 33 used the same chassis, then at least one of them was incorrect dimensions.

@Bob G  thinks I have some kind of fetish for Dapol, which really isn't the case, in fact I would say my Farish A1 Tornado is probably the pride of my current fleet! However as I already have a Dapol Class 33 here, I would be strongly tempted to use it as the basis for a Class 23 - unless others prefer I stick to Farish chassis' because they already have donors waiting on their shelves?

Who here would like me to add a Class 23 to my list of future projects? And who wants a Farish chassis option and/or a Dapol one? If I could get at least 5 customers lined up it would be worth pursuing.

Ross.

Assuming the facts I have are correct and the model is accurate, the Class 73 might be closer than either 33 or 25 in terms of both bogie centres. There would however be a compromise of 3" on the wheel centres.

This is a link I found a while ago that I've found useful:
http://www.clag.org.uk/wheelbase.html] [url]http://www.clag.org.uk/wheelbase.html[/url]

Just to throw more options into the mix

[Bob G]

I'd rather have a reliable chassis. The current 73 is lightweight and plastic. Combined with a printed body doesn't make it a good result.
The nose ends also makes it a difficult shape to fit without surgery so the lighting circuits will have to be reassessed too.
I'd put my money on a 26/27/33 from Dapol or a 24/25 from Farish first.
Oh and has anyone considered the hymek?
Bob

[RBTKraisee]

@Bob G (or anyone) do you have a Class 73 you could pop open and show the internals?

Weights can be moved around, replaced or even added to improve running. As can all the lighting bits and any cab detailing parts too.

New carriers can be designed into a new bodyshell to support correct placement for all sorts of internal workings.

The main issue is whether the plastic and metal motor parts of the Class 73 chassis itself protrude into areas that the lower 'snouts' on the Class 23 bodyshell would cut into.

Even the plastic parts of the chassis could be replaced if necessary, although that's more work and would somewhat affect the cost. I'm already taking this approach with the Tomytec TM-18 chassis that I'm using to power my APT-P - the majority of the Tomytec's plastic chassis parts are being replaced and all I'm really retaining untouched are the electrical and mechanical components.

Ross.

[RBTKraisee]

Rue d'Etropal does both body versions on his Shapeways page.

No connection to him, just thought I'd mention it.

Martyn

What chassis are those are designed to fit?

Ross.

[Bob G]

@Bob G (or anyone) do you have a Class 73 you could pop open and show the internals?

Weights can be moved around, replaced or even added to improve running. As can all the lighting bits and any cab detailing parts too.

New carriers can be designed into a new bodyshell to support correct placement for all sorts of internal workings.

The main issue is whether the plastic and metal motor parts of the Class 73 chassis itself protrude into areas that the lower 'snouts' on the Class 23 bodyshell would cut into.

Even the plastic parts of the chassis could be replaced if necessary, although that's more work and would somewhat affect the cost. I'm already taking this approach with the Tomytec TM-18 chassis that I'm using to power my APT-P - the majority of the Tomytec's plastic chassis parts are being replaced and all I'm really retaining untouched are the electrical and mechanical components.

Ross.

Hi Ross

I will photograph and measure up a 24, 25, 27, 33, 35 and 73 when I have a moment. I also have an old 25 I can throw in the mix.
I'll do a table like you did for the steam era.

There will be a delay but that will be due to my mum. She went into hospital on Saturday after collapsing and we have not been able to see her yet. She 94 with Alzheimer's and doesn't know what is going on, so that makes two of us right now.
They were planning loads of tests but when they found out she was in a care home and had a DNR/end of life form they decided they would stop doing the tests.
But they said we couldn't visit until she was stable, admitted, and her condition assessed. She's been in 3 different wards already and wasn't officially admitted until Monday, when a Doctor saw her. Two days after going to hospital.

Being only next of kin and having full power of attorney makes no odds. We've had no access to hospital, as she wasn't allocated a bed until yesterday, and if she is sent home we have no access to care home as they had a Covid outbreak and have banned visits.

Moral of the story is "Don't get sick and get admitted to a hospital at a weekend".

Bob

[martyn]

@RBTKraisee

Rue d'Etropal does both body versions on his Shapeways page.

No connection to him, just thought I'd mention it.

Martyn

What chassis are those are designed to fit?

Ross.

I'm not sure of his design considerations, and I've never bought one.

From comments elsewhere on the is forum, it would seem that he designs a close to scale body and it's up to the  modeller to find a chassis. AFAIK, there are no recommendations for chassis on his website for any of his locomotives.

Martyn

[Dalek]

Another here that had signed up for a couple from DJM, hopefully sombody does a RTR one day, also a 15, Falcon etc etc... AND THE TWINS !!!!!

[RBTKraisee]

If Rue d'Etropal has a model already, I won't get in his way.

I don't mean to pull the thread off topic but "the twins"??

Ross.

[Bealman]

LMS diesels 10000 and 10001, designed by Ivatt.