New UK layout looking for ideas

[grumbeast]

Hi Everyone,

I'm building a new 6'x2'6" UK layout but have some very fixed parameters and wanted to see if anyone had any ideas (I've been googling like crazy for plans but I'm almost googled out!)

So here are the fixed criteria

1. 6'x2'6" is all the space I have so no extensions / has to be  that shape
2. I can only use the track I have (daughter is now dancing a lot so pocket money = $0), its Kato, I have a fair bit, can do double track around this space plus more but only have 5 #6 switches (3 RH and 2LH)

What I'm planning is :

1. Set in South Wales Valleys, vaguely 60s / 70s / early 80s (I'm not going to be prototypical, just want to give a sense of things
2. I like running trains around and around, as much as anything else this is a build to show off my locomotives
3. I'd like it pretty built up, going to use a lot of scalescenes buildings hopefully
4. Power has to be DC

So the first decision I'm trying to make it whether to have a single line with passing loop station or a double track loop with station,   and then what to do with the remaining switches.

I don't really want any hidden areas on the layout but am ok with a siding or two as "visible storage so to speak.

anyhow, any opinions or ideas, or pointers to existing layouts are appreciated.

Cheers

Graham

[Train Waiting]

Hello Graham

30" width is very good.  I think many people think of 24" width for 'N' gauge.  30" easily allows a station with platforms at one side and a loop or siding at the other.  If you like to see trains running, double track is, I think, a good idea.

My layout, which is an eccentric project, takes this form in 48"x30".  The passenger station is at one side and the semi-scenic storage yard is at the other.  In UK practice, there were some passenger stations with separate goods facilities which makes this arrangement reasonably prototypical.

Here's my layout in case it is in any way helpful:-




At 72" length you might even have the space for a connection into a goods yard behind the station platforms.  I had this on my previous layout - also with Kato track - now abandoned.  This layout was 72"x36".

I had a look and found a very poor picture that, hopefully, shows what I mean:-



With all best wishes for your project.

John

[crewearpley40]

That's pretty reasonable but I would allow for a crossover so trains can access both inner and outer loops

[grumbeast]

Well here is the basic baseboard, just mdf over 1x3s pretty standard.  I now mdf is less than idea; but im on a strict budget and its a nice dry and clean room

[maridunian]

I'm building a new 6'x2'6" UK layout but have some very fixed parameters and wanted to see if anyone had any ideas (I've been googling like crazy for plans but I'm almost googled out!)

I suggest Googling for 8'x4' HO layout plans, then scale down any you like.

Mike

[crewearpley40]

Google rm web. 6ft x 2 ft 6 layouts n gauge.baSsenthwaite lake and georgemas junction ( Inverness to wick / thurso ) are two layouts that spring to mind

[AlexanderJesse]

So the first decision I'm trying to make it whether to have a single line with passing loop station or a double track loop with station,   and then what to do with the remaining switches.

Double track without crossover? Sounds strange and a crossover uses up already 4 switches.
A singleloop with a passing lane (2 switches) leaves you 3 switches for sidings, industries,...

At the passing lane, you "need" a little station and some houses/dwellings and at each industry siding either a small industry or a little village,...

Further more if you make the sidings so that you have some reserves in termas of space, you can modify them with additional switches,... as soon as your finance ministry founds them (eg. some christmas present). And you can add more action if a train must deposit wagons at a siding...

[njee20]

If you like watching trains going round then double track would seem to make sense. Perhaps have either a facing or trailing crossover (ie using two turnouts), then you've got 3 more to create a couple of sidings.

[Train Waiting]

That's pretty reasonable but I would allow for a crossover so trains can access both inner and outer loops

Thank you for this; it is a very good point.  It's also something I thought a lot about for my recent layouts.

Up until 2017, I thought a crossover was essential for a double track railway and included them on previous layouts.  What I discovered was that they were rarely used.  There are a lot of reasons for this, I suppose.  Perhaps the main one is I like steam operation.  A crossover means that a tender engine will be facing the wrong way on the 'other' track.  Also, it will be difficult to shunt a siding accessed by trailing points.

A friend of mine was a signalman at a 'box with a crossover.  There was an instruction that the crossover had to be reversed each day to keep it working as it had so few actual movements over it.

Graham has five #6 switches and wants to model UK operation in South Wales.  Graham enjoys trains running round to show off his locomotives.  On any single-track oval, one switch allows for one train to be able to operate, two allows two trains and so on.  The five switches will allow the layout to have five trains, either running or in the 'visible storage' that Graham has in mind.  Using two switches to form a crossover reduces the number of trains on show to three.

Therefore, bearing all this in mind, I wondered if my no-crossover track plans might be appropriate.

Many apologies for including another picture of my layout, but here is the semi-scenic visible storage area with four trains.  The storage area has capacity for five trains.  The layout has five switches.



The steam locomotives seen are by Union Mills.

One final thought.  I might well be tempted to have a crossover if modelling present-day passenger traffic with DMU/EMU operation, as this allows an interesting 'turn back' movement.  These movements can be observed at various places on the ScotRail network with which I'm fairly familiar.

All best wishes.

John

[tunneroner61]

For a watching the trains go by layout I can't think of a reason to included a cross over between the up and down lines. John has put the case succinctly in the previous post. No cross over = 2 more sidings = 2 more trains to vary what is watched. IMHO you couldn't do better than copy John's track plan!!

Norman

[njee20]

Yep, I'm convinced frankly!

[grumbeast]

Wow,

That's given me some serious food for thought, I was playing a little last night and had put a trailing crossover in my plan, but I'm really beginning to find John's logic of no crossover quite compelling.  The layout is really for running trains for show, my Canadian layout is built for OPS so I don't really need it on here too.

Instead of the crossover, I could put a passing loop at the station on the outside line, and use the other switches to put a bay platform and a goods siding on the inside line

forgive the poor rendition in paint, but I'm thinking something like this.




What do you think?  I'm thinking 2 trains on the outside line (1 in the loop, 1 on the main) and 3 on the inner (one on the main, one in the bay and maybe one in the goods yard (I can swap power at the little shed bottom right

G

[Train Waiting]

What do you think?  I'm thinking 2 trains on the outside line (1 in the loop, 1 on the main) and 3 on the inner (one on the main, one in the bay and maybe one in the goods yard (I can swap power at the little shed bottom right
G

Hello Graham

That looks a very nice plan.  Three trains on the inner loop (can we please call that the down line?) is possible - one on the down main (Train 1), one in the bay (Train 2) and one in the goods yard (Train 3).  If you visualise how you would change these over so that the other trains can run on the down main, you might find that you have a little difficulty in that there is nowhere to put Train 1 on the down main whilst either Train 2 or Train 3 runs on to it.

There are two ways, I think, that you can achieve three trains available to run on the down line.

The first is to sacrifice your engine shed track and use the switch to create a siding long enough to store Train 1.  Maybe at the rear of the layout?  As it is l/h, it would be a facing switch to access the siding, which is not the normal British practice... but this a model railway to give you fun!

The alternative is to have isolating sections on the down main line.  I've done this and found three isolating sections works well.  With your Kato 'Unitrak' you can achieve this fairly easily using insulated 'Unijoiners' and three power feeds - one for each section - each with a simple on/off switch in the circuit.

I hope that my rambling makes some sense and am glad to discuss further if you wish.

Best wishes.

John

[grumbeast]

I have some insulating unijoiners so I'm thinking that I;ll have isolated sections of the down main, I'm tempted to use cab control and have multiple sections on both up and down lines(I found a bunch of DPDT switches I'd intended to use on my Canadian layout before I went DCC

[grumbeast]

Going to move this over to the layout construction area, under Aberffilli probably more appropriate there