At the risk of getting everybody moaning again I must say I was rather taken aback at the price of the Kernow 00 limited edition 159. This seems to have taken pricing into a new league.



It does look like an excellent model and I'm sure nobody is getting rich from this but it is a heavy price. To be fair you would get free postage and the sound version is only £100 more. I hope it will be a success for Kernow as it is an excellent model of a sought after livery. I'm not angry, I'm not criticising and I'm not really moaning because, like I say, I'm sure it reflects the costs involved but I was kind of surprised by the price for a 3 car DMU.

I'm hoping N gauge pricing doesn't go the same way but I fear it will. In the meantime us N gaugers can perhaps be relieved that the soon to arrive Farish 158 will only be £233.70 from Rails.

I s'pose, just like the Kernow Class 31 in Ochre, the run from Farish would have been small and there is a livery applied to 3 carriages as opposed to the one loco. The class 31 is full RRP and the full RRP of a NSE class 159 in 00 is £379.95.
I guess if one wants one, one would stump up

Quote from: Newportnobby on November 25, 2022, 09:34:59 AM
I s'pose, just like the Kernow Class 31 in Ochre, the run from Farish would have been small and there is a livery applied to 3 carriages as opposed to the one loco. The class 31 is full RRP and the full RRP of a NSE class 159 in 00 is £379.95.
I guess if one wants one, one would stump up

The Bachmann 158s / 159s are very expensive anyway - Rails have the forthcoming standard-issue batch of two car ones listed at £280. That's a lot for a two-car unit!

Yep we are lucky.
If you want to pay that amount in N you can have a full length Pullman livery 125 (new tooling with the right body and roof vents).
Bob

Quote from: Bob G on November 25, 2022, 11:44:04 AM
Yep we are lucky.
If you want to pay that amount in N you can have a full length Pullman livery 125 (new tooling with the right body and roof vents).
Bob

The forthcoming N gauge version is £233! Farish multiple units are pretty expensive these days.

Just as a note, high RRPs don't always remain the asking price.

The Grey / Blue 6 car Pullman set from Farish was available from TMC at some 40% off at Warley.

Skyline2uk

The latest run of Dapol Ivatt tank engines is reasonably priced.

It includes one in Keighly & Worth Valley maroon livery, for those who like exotica

I guess its a case of demand.   For years now modellers have been asking / insisting for more finer detail to make the model look more realistic and to match the full sized item.  In order to do this more and more parts are made as a separate item (handrails, vents, fans, under floor boxes etc)  This naturally makes the model more costly to produce.  But it also prices the model out of the reach of the average person, and certainly beyond the pocket money pricing of most kids.  With todays pricing  it's very easy to have £700 - £800 tied up into one train with a £300 loco pulling eight coaches at £50 a pop....

Quote from: Skyline2uk on November 27, 2022, 10:26:13 AM
Just as a note, high RRPs don't always remain the asking price.

The Grey / Blue 6 car Pullman set from Farish was available from TMC at some 40% off at Warley.

Skyline2uk

To an extent - but that level of discount normally only happens with niche models.

Not always — the £70 Bachmann OO auto-trailers sat around for a long time. Rails had a "flash sale" at about £35: all remaining stocks sold out in a day. The Liliput (i.e. Bachmann) N gauge DB/DR class 56 2-8-0 started at £330 but ended up being discounted down to less than £200 by DM-Toys.

The prices of models seem to be set at what the manufacturer thinks the market will bear, rather than having any relationship to the manufacturing cost. Since most Model railway companies are privately owned, we can't tell whether they're making a profit or not. Except for Hornby, who are not.

Hi all,

So yeah I saw that offering and personally not one for me, although I have a feeling for some things on my hit list the cost of the base model and then professional repaint into the required guise may bring things a little close...

While no we don't know the margins, there is one factor that may be in play here and I know its not as common as has been but could have an impact.
So some TOC and FOC have and may still actually demand a percentage of sales or cost per unit sold to use a livery, the TEAs from revolution had that where the EWS versions were a pound per model more expensive as that was part of the agreement to allow the livery to be used so for every model sold it cost a pound to use the livery...

I also know of another model where the operator of the locomotives gave livery agreement for a nominal fee to use their liveries and branding but it didn't cover all their locos which had special liveries.
As such one of their locomotives had unique livery which had customer branding on and wasn't part of the agreement and it came back to bite the manufacturer on the back side when they did it and the brand owner came knocking asking for a substantial sum and wiped out the profit margin for that particular model!!

Of course what I write is potential speculation and may not be the case with this model, but it does highlight some of the inner workings that aren't always visible to us when we wonder why some models aren't produced in liveries we may expect or cost more than some others..

Quote from: malc-c on November 27, 2022, 02:11:09 PM
With todays pricing  it's very easy to have £700 - £800 tied up into one train with a £300 loco pulling eight coaches at £50 a pop....

You're not wrong there. My 20 wagon Yeoman train with a class 58 cost a total of £804.77 
The 58 will of course be replaced by a Revolution 59 so the whole train will have cost a little more than that and the Yeoman wagons were purchased at a lower price than they are today when they would cost about £50 more in total.

It's a nice train though 

And the JHAs aren't particularly expensive.

Anyone buying a full rake of Revolution Caledonian Sleepers will have spent £720, chuck a sound fitted 92 on there and it's over £1000.

Realtrack's PCAs are £27 each, for a 2-axle wagon, so a full rake of 36 is just under £1000, without a loco.

Farish's FIA multifrets are now £80/pair, even a modest train becomes very expensive. A full length rake is about £1500.

Those examples have always existed. If you want a SWR 159 then the Kernow one is the cheapest way to get one RTR. I'm sure a few would want one who may not be able to afford one, but I'm sure there's rationale in the pricing (even if that's just 'everyone getting their slice of the pie'). It'll be interesting to see if it lingers.

I suppose at it all depends where folk want to be with their hobby. Each one of us will be different. Many folk love the Union Mills locos. They are very affordable but they are not well enough detailed for me. They are good enough to form a basis for a detailing project though. At the other end some of the latest Farish is expensive but extremely well detailed. I would imagine most of us are in between. I think the Kato 800 is a great value model and I love mine; it looks the part well enough for me after toning down the roof and the coach ends. It has to be said that it has been built to a price though. If Farish built the same unit it would probably cost more than twice as much but the coach ends would be far better and it would have other little details that the Kato one hasn't. Like I say while I know the coach ends aren't great I'm very happy with the overall level of detail and the total look of the Kato 800.

One thing that does disappoint though. You can buy an exquisitely detailed and expensive model but the it never looks right in out of the box pristine condition. Even after a few days on the road the bogies will have just a little road grime on them.