One other minor detail I've just discovered (after buying a replacement bodyshell for a reasonably good runner with a battered + incomplete body) is that there are two variants of the GER Holden tank, one (a later modification?) has no toolboxes or condensing gear, and the dome further back. The former modifications were applied to the real loco in later years according to F.J. Roche's scale drawings, but I'm not sure the dome was ever changed, so I don't know quite what Grafar were doing!
I suspect these changes were done simply to make the loco look more "generic" and suitable for production in other railway liveries (the dome location in particular is quite a distinctive feature of the J67/J69).

What about the Fowler 4F 0-6-0 tender loco?

The 'proper' Holden Tank was done in GER, LNER and BR liveries. A simplified version became their first General Purpose Tank loco in LMS and Southern liveries. All these models were replaced by the chunky 'Super Jinty' General Purpose tank in the late 1970s, which used the 94xx chassis.
The 4F tender loco was a 1980s introduction and had it's own, more accurate chassis.

Quote from: BernardTPM on August 23, 2012, 12:02:43 AM
The 4F tender loco was a 1980s introduction and had it's own, more accurate chassis.

The 4F was later than that - mid 1990s I'm sure as I remember reading the RM review of them in a mag around that time.

Cheers,
Alan

Sorry, I had thought late 1980s, but on checking it was 1993.

Quote from: BernardTPM on August 23, 2012, 09:18:51 AM
Sorry, I had thought late 1980s, but on checking it was 1993.

The 1990s models were actually pretty accurate (4F and later Jinty) and make good detailing bases.

As such, it's maybe unsuprising that they are still in the Bachmann catalogue.

Cheers,
Alan

Quote from: Dr Al on August 23, 2012, 10:17:13 AM

Quote from: BernardTPM on August 23, 2012, 09:18:51 AM
Sorry, I had thought late 1980s, but on checking it was 1993.

The 1990s models were actually pretty accurate (4F and later Jinty) and make good detailing bases.

As such, it's maybe unsuprising that they are still in the Bachmann catalogue.

Cheers,
Alan

I'm sure they'll replace it eventually with a new super detailed tooled up version.
(And by 'tooled up' I don't mean with shooters!  )
They'll want the same quality across their range eventually and the 'I want every detail correct' out of the box modellers will come to expect it.
Until then you have two choices, as it is or add the detail yourself! 

Just catching up with this particular thread.

I have the SR tank engine, and one of the first things I noticed was that the numbering, 2579, was actually for a Class E4 0-6-2T. I was wondering about getting hold of a spare set of trailing wheels to attach to the N Gauge version, but on closer inspection, it's not particularly close to the E4 in terms of exact detail.

It's probably best to keep the 0-6-0 chassis for use with a kit one day in the future because I suspect there are too many differences to make it worthwhile trying a conversion to an E4. I'd appreciate hearing anyone else's thoughts on the idea.

Quote from: Pete33 on December 13, 2013, 04:05:45 PM
Just catching up with this particular thread.

I have the SR tank engine, and one of the first things I noticed was that the numbering, 2579, was actually for a Class E4 0-6-2T. I was wondering about getting hold of a spare set of trailing wheels to attach to the N Gauge version, but on closer inspection, it's not particularly close to the E4 in terms of exact detail.

It's probably best to keep the 0-6-0 chassis for use with a kit one day in the future because I suspect there are too many differences to make it worthwhile trying a conversion to an E4. I'd appreciate hearing anyone else's thoughts on the idea.

Do Langley still sell their E5 (I think) kit which is designed to fit the GP chassis.  They provide the trailer axle.  I have turned one of these combinations into the ex Caley 044T  No 55124, one of 2 Caley 19 class which survived into the early 60s.

Quote from: Portpatrick on December 13, 2013, 04:18:17 PM
Do Langley still sell their E5 (I think) kit which is designed to fit the GP chassis.  They provide the trailer axle.  I have turned one of these combinations into the ex Caley 044T  No 55124, one of 2 Caley 19 class which survived into the early 60s.

They do indeed still stock the E5:
http://www.langleymodels.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Locomotive_Body_kits_73.html

They don't say anything about providing the trailer axle, though. Presumably this can be picked up as a spare from somewhere?

The E2 is also rather nice, so there's need there for a second 0-6-0 chassis if I find one going cheap.

Hi,

You might find the old GF catalogues here

http://www.ness-st.co.uk/N-gauge-catalogues.html

of some use.

Langley used to do the E4, I have one, then discontinued it and brought out the E5, the Langley E2 has been in production since at least the 1980s if not before.

For many years all the Farish 6 coupled  locos with the 3 or 5 pole motors used virtually the same basic chassis, all had the same wheel spacing, only the size of wheel differed. About the only differences were the motion, and a few variations in front and rear ends to cope with bogies, pony trucks, cylinders and couplings;the only one that was  considrably differentwas te J94/08 in which the motor was horizontal not inclined, that chassis was also used for the 4P 4-4-0 with different slots for the axles and provision for cylinders and a bogie and with a drawbar for the tender in place of a coupling.

They must have saved quite a bit on tooling!

As they were at the time almost the only maker of UK stock, kit makers had to make do with the chassis available, this led to some awful looking results,as somebody already mentioned, an LMS pacific kit on a Black 5 chassis looked ridiculous, so did the D&M SR King Arthur (now produced by BHE) it looked better with Duchess wheels in place of the Black 5, better still with a Peco Jubilee chassis (provided you could find a suitable 8 wheel tender drive (Minitrix 2077), now I use a Union Mills drive with an extra axle.

If staying within one region without applying Rule 1 the number of current new 0-6-0s is a heck of a lot less than it used to be. The Dapol 57xx, the current Terrier, is about it although hopefully to be swelled by the Farish 64xx (but when?) and the Jinty. That leaves about two only per region.

Crack expresses are two a penny though.

Hitting eBay for the old little' a seems like the only option other than switching to OO of course.

For tender 0-6-0s Union Mills have improved the situation considerably for LNER, LMS and SR,  Considering that 0-6-0 and 4-4-0 were the most numerous of all locos on most railways the lack of smaller locos in N make it near imposible to run a prototypical railway.

Apart from Union Mills,  for tender locos I can only think of 1 RTR 4-4-0 - Farish 4P  and 3 0-6-0s Farish 4F,  Dapol Q1  and Peco Collett; one more 4-4-0 announced Dapol Schools - if and when it ever appears

What about the j39?