Relative popularity of the main modelling gauges

pinball · December 08, 2022, 01:34:56 PM

As someone who only started modelling railways last year, the immediate attraction of N was the prototype HST. However the secondary aspect was space and the third aspect was cost.

I would hate to think how much assembling a full OO gauge HST would cost and indeed how much room it would take up. I've found the Dapol Mark III's reasonably priced in comparison when I look at the cost of OO gauge coaches, and 5 foot or so for a realistic set is far more managable. I still haven't built a big layout yet, but I can run reasonably sized realistic trains on Shipcombe which is 1.5m x 0.6m. I've also found the N gauge Class 33s reasonably priced too, so have started building up a decent selection of stock over the past year.

The only real gripe I have with N is the availablity of coaches - but I have no idea what the OO situation is like for that either.

O gauge meanwhile looks like something either for the millionaire or more suited to club layouts.

Chris Morris · December 08, 2022, 02:43:18 PM

I was an 00 guy from my very early years in the early 1960s right through to the mid 1990s . I decided to take a sabbatical and sold all my 00. Around about 2000 I started G scale on the garden which I still have. After about ten years I realised that it gets cold in the winter and being outside wasn't much fun so I looked to go back indoors in a smaller scale. Back in the days of Poole Graham Farish there is no way I would have given N a second thought; it was just too crude. When looking at the standard of N gauge models around in 2010/2012 it was an easy decision to choose N rather than 00. The N gauge stock was well detailed and realistic. N is the way to go if you live in a normal size house and want to run realistic length trains. All of us here know that but I think the message needs to be passed on to more people. In my view N deserves to be more popular and is a logical choice compared to 00. I think 00 remains still popular because so many people already have a good collection of 00 and would find it hard to change. I guess I was lucky in that by taking a break and selling everything I was able to make a clean start.

As I mentioned in a different topic N gauge layouts have shown themselves to be popular with visitor votes at exhibitions this year which is very encouraging. Where people have made good looking N gauge layouts I think they should contact the magazines to see if they are interested in featuring them. The more N gauge layouts there are in magazines the greater the chance of increasing the number of N gauge modellers.

martyn · December 08, 2022, 03:06:42 PM

I've put it in another thread on the Forum somewhere, but for me the beauty of N is, as others have said, the ability to run scale, or near scale, length trains in a reasonable space. For me that means loco plus 8-10 coaches, and up to about 35 SWB wagons.

Cost?.........can't, better not, say, but I think I'm now needing a bit of a thinning out!

Martyn

Nbodger · December 08, 2022, 03:51:17 PM

Unfortunately however, for good reasons N Gauge has plastered over the boxes for Adult Collectors Only and not for Children U14 due to small parts. How much affect has this statement got on the younger element not taking up N and starting in OO and staying with it.

Bob G · December 08, 2022, 04:05:54 PM

Quote from: Nbodger on December 08, 2022, 03:51:17 PM
Unfortunately however, for good reasons N Gauge has plastered over the boxes for Adult Collectors Only and not for Children U14 due to small parts. How much affect has this statement got on the younger element not taking up N and starting in OO and staying with it.

Sometimes I still want to chew my models when they stop working...

Southerngooner · December 08, 2022, 04:48:48 PM

With regard to Chris's comment about getting N gauge layouts into magazines, Steve Flint from RM was virtually begging for more to be sent in when he did an interview (was it for last years Virtual Show?). I think the problem is that there are less N gauge layouts around, and therefore less good ones (or ones that their owners feel are good enough) to go into magazines compared to OO.

Dave

jpendle · December 08, 2022, 04:52:40 PM

Quote from: Nbodger on December 08, 2022, 03:51:17 PM
Unfortunately however, for good reasons N Gauge has plastered over the boxes for Adult Collectors Only and not for Children U14 due to small parts. How much affect has this statement got on the younger element not taking up N and starting in OO and staying with it.

I would have thought that detailed OO models have just as many, if not more, small parts, both metal and plastic, shouldn't they also have the same warning?

Regards,

John P

Bigmac · December 08, 2022, 05:30:05 PM

Quote from: Chris Morris on December 08, 2022, 02:43:18 PM
I was an 00 guy from my very early years in the early 1960s right through to the mid 1990s . I decided to take a sabbatical and sold all my 00. Around about 2000 I started G scale on the garden which I still have. After about ten years I realised that it gets cold in the winter and being outside wasn't much fun so I looked to go back indoors in a smaller scale. Back in the days of Poole Graham Farish there is no way I would have given N a second thought; it was just too crude. When looking at the standard of N gauge models around in 2010/2012 it was an easy decision to choose N rather than 00. The N gauge stock was well detailed and realistic. N is the way to go if you live in a normal size house and want to run realistic length trains. All of us here know that but I think the message needs to be passed on to more people. In my view N deserves to be more popular and is a logical choice compared to 00. I think 00 remains still popular because so many people already have a good collection of 00 and would find it hard to change. I guess I was lucky in that by taking a break and selling everything I was able to make a clean start.

As I mentioned in a different topic N gauge layouts have shown themselves to be popular with visitor votes at exhibitions this year which is very encouraging. Where people have made good looking N gauge layouts I think they should contact the magazines to see if they are interested in featuring them. The more N gauge layouts there are in magazines the greater the chance of increasing the number of N gauge modellers.

i was thinking earlier about the popularity at shows. Mega layouts like James street are great entertainment---but, there is a but. How many potential newcomers to the hobby are, in reality, a bit discouraged by the big layouts, simply because they only have a small amount of room for this hobby--if they were to take the plunge. The real beauty of n gauge is creating a work of art in a small space--so exhibitions could do well to book several small layouts that most people could have at home.

Southerngooner · December 08, 2022, 07:10:12 PM

As one of the James Street team it's not the first time I've hear comments like that above. If it's true that big layouts like JS scare people off, and the only solution is small, then no-one would ever try to make anything just that little bit different and special. I'm not just thinking about JS, but about anything in life. Why should the Beatles bother with Sergeant Pepper, because the average musician couldn't record music like it? Or why try to go to the Moon, when you could just sit at home and look at it through the window? Sadly, I think the truth is that many people out there see something like JS and miss the fact that it's lots of little ideas for a layout put into one model. I apppreciate that a lot of people don't have space or vision, but does that mean that everyone should therefore act the same.

Vive la difference as those pesky French say!

Dave

martyn · December 08, 2022, 07:29:20 PM

By the same logic, I wouldn't go to a show and see, eg, 'Gresley beat' or Stoke Bank and think there's no point me beginning in 4mm.

For each large layout, in any scale, there are far more smaller layouts in those scales at a show that would give me, as a beginner, ideas to go ahead and build.

Martyn

Chris Morris · December 08, 2022, 09:06:50 PM

I really don't think JS will have put anyone off modelling in N. I think most of us would describe it as inspirational even if we feel no need to make something so big. The question of what does inspire folk is a good question. If all layouts at a show are very high quality many folk may decide they could never get near to that and decide to give up. On the other hand some folk might find lower quality layouts a turn off while others looking at the same layout might think "I could do that" and be inspired.

It remains up to is to act as ambassadors for N gauge in whatever' way we can.

Newportnobby · December 08, 2022, 09:56:35 PM

Many is the time I've wondered how many people start off in N as they think they can get a lot in a small space but they purchase set track points so as to create more space then wonder why the locos they want won't traverse the points or 9" curves. Then they become disillusioned and it's probably packed away in the attic/sold on Fleabay.
The issue is they are not warned the locos they want maybe have'Minimum radius 2' on the box until they get it, and do they understand what that means anyway?
Likewise, Peco don't warn folks about that possibility and perhaps retailers don't warn people as they want the sale.
I think much reading/education is needed before anyone jumps into N gauge.
Apologies if this is considered controversial but they're just my thoughts.

Bealman · December 08, 2022, 11:15:15 PM

I think one of the best arguments for N is the 'railway in a landscape' one.

Plus, as I have said many times on this forum, OO models look like plastic toys to me.

longbow · December 09, 2022, 07:12:49 AM

QuoteO gauge meanwhile looks like something either for the millionaire or more suited to club layouts.

I model in both O and N, and I can assure you that neither is true. As others have noted, items in the bigger scales cost more but you need less of them in a given space. So the cost per square meter of layout is not that much different.

Chris Morris · December 09, 2022, 08:11:23 AM

Quote from: Newportnobby on December 08, 2022, 09:56:35 PM
Many is the time I've wondered how many people start off in N as they think they can get a lot in a small space but they purchase set track points so as to create more space then wonder why the locos they want won't traverse the points or 9" curves. Then they become disillusioned and it's probably packed away in the attic/sold on Fleabay.
The issue is they are not warned the locos they want maybe have'Minimum radius 2' on the box until they get it, and do they understand what that means anyway?
Likewise, Peco don't warn folks about that possibility and perhaps retailers don't warn people as they want the sale.
I think much reading/education is needed before anyone jumps into N gauge.
Apologies if this is considered controversial but they're just my thoughts.

I would agree. The basic set track point should be at least R2 so it is compatible with larger locos. R1 track packs should have a clear warning panel stating they are not suitable for all locos. The Peco set track point was almost certainly brought to the market place many years ago, probably in the days of GF from Poole. Things have moved on but the Peco set track point hasn't. The set track curved point which is more modern is also an issue for some larger steam outline locos. I have huge respect for Peco and believe they have been brilliant servants to our hobby over the years but that set track point with it's compatibility problems should have been replaced with a bigger one many years ago.