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Author Topic: Point motor choice HELP please  (Read 303 times)

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Offline exmouthcraig

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Point motor choice HELP please
« on: May 02, 2020, 08:24:15 AM »
Morning All, I am again calling on the informed collective for some much needed help and assistance.......

For Clifton Wood I only have 1 left hand scenic point. This is a new medium uni frog turnout.

For our monster layout with over 100 points we are WIT setup but as Clifton is an extravagant play thing I really like the idea of a slow moving point.

As the layout will only run a maximum of 2 08 shunters, although being wired for dcc I could run it dc with no problem so I dont need to fit an accessory decoder to the point IF it's not needed.

The over used reply to these types of questions is "oh it depends what you want and you need to try lots of them out to see which works best for you"

 :no: I dont, I have 1 point and have no plans for motorising any others.

Basically I'm after a shopping list to tell me which items work well with which and everything I need to be able to fit and wire this complete set up, up.

Many thanks   :thankyousign: :beers:

Offline geoffc

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2020, 09:46:17 AM »
If you join MERG, they do a kit which will drive one model aircraft servo for the points, it is adjustable using three small potentiometers for travel and speed of movement. It is controlled by an on/off switch.

Geoff

Online Bealman

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2020, 09:52:17 AM »
Well if you really want to avoid stuffing around, Peco point = Peco point motor, I guess  ;)
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

Offline chrism

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2020, 10:07:59 AM »
For just one point is there any point (oops) in messing around with a motor?
Wouldn't a wire in tube manual method be simpler?

Offline exmouthcraig

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2020, 10:19:12 AM »
Maybe  :hmmm: but I like the idea of a slow moving point rather them just shoving a handle on the side of the layout.

I'm sure once I've looked at everything needed theres probably much better things I could spend the equivalent amount of cash on.

I know I can at least install WIT and it works  :smiley-laughing:

Offline chrism

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2020, 10:22:35 AM »
Maybe  :hmmm: but I like the idea of a slow moving point rather them just shoving a handle on the side of the layout.

Well, you could always shove it slowly  :P

You could even hook up the actuator to one of your materials handling machines.

Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2020, 10:44:57 AM »
Maybe  :hmmm: but I like the idea of a slow moving point rather them just shoving a handle on the side of the layout.

Well, you could always shove it slowly  :P


Beat me to it, there, Chris ;D

Online Bealman

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2020, 10:55:43 AM »
Well if you really want to avoid stuffing around, Peco point = Peco point motor, I guess  ;)

Oooops, sorry, Craig - I didn't notice the slow motion bit  :smackedface:
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

Online ntpntpntp

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2020, 11:34:39 AM »
I don't use any of them (I use Peco solenoids), but of the ones I'm aware of it seems the choices for a slow action motor include:

servo - pretty much do it yourself alignment and fitting, although there are some mounting kits out there. Plus you'll need driver electronics to control it.
Tortoise - been around a long time, quite bulky from what I've seen.
Cobalt - seem to be used more than Tortoises here in the UK. Variants with integrated DCC decoder are available.
MTB - not even heard of them until I read a thread on here the other day! Look to be not as bulky as some others.

Semi slow-action (motor driven rather than solenoid) :
Hoffmann - seen these used by my former club.
Conrad - a similar but cheaper than Hoffmann.  They used to be cheap to buy but now pricier  :(  Versions with/without changeover switch exist.
Lemaco and Fulgurex -  I remember these being around in the old days. They were expensive in their day. Not sure if still sold new.

« Last Edit: May 02, 2020, 11:36:38 AM by ntpntpntp »
Nick.   2016 celebrating the 20th anniversary of "Königshafen" exhibition layout!

Offline exmouthcraig

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2020, 11:44:14 AM »
Cheers Nick @ntpntpntp, SO if you were to electronically control 1 slow moving point what would your shopping list include???

I have nothing at the moment other then my Unifrog left hand turnout. I have wire for droppers and bus wiring but nothing else.

Online ntpntpntp

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2020, 12:37:40 PM »
@exmouthcraig   I hate to say it but it does depend on which point motor you go for  :)

Most will work with a short pulse of power just like a solenoid point motor, so you have a centre biased  SPDT toggle switch usually described as (ON)-OFF-(ON),   or you can use a pair of push buttons (or even stud and probe).  You will probably have to hold the switch down until the movement completes, unless the motor has "intelligence" and its own power feed.

There are some stall motor designs which I think actually use a low current continuous power feed to the input (Tortoise maybe?)

You'll need a power supply to drive the motor, so again depending on the type you choose this might be AC or DC (and what voltage?).

Sorry can't be more specific until you've made a choice.   As mentioned, the Cobalts seem to be popular here and there are a few forum members using them I'm sure.  Maybe take a look at the info on DCC Concepts' web site?   

I do have an old style Cobalt somewhere but I've not actually played with it (same as I have some servos somewhere and not played with those either). 

I have a small bunch of Conrad motors bought back when they were £4 each, and created a test harness for one some time ago. I found that like the other slow action designs you need to do things like remove the over-centre springs from Peco points. In the end I've stuck with Peco solenoids.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2020, 12:49:38 PM by ntpntpntp »
Nick.   2016 celebrating the 20th anniversary of "Königshafen" exhibition layout!

Offline exmouthcraig

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2020, 12:52:22 PM »
Cheers Nick I've just looked through a few sites and I like the idea of the fulgurex version, that's the type of action I'm after BUT like EVERY point motor in the UK they are all out of stock!!!!!!!!

Might have to be WIT after all

Offline honestjudge

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2020, 01:03:35 PM »
I'm not sure if this is what you are after but...I was toying once with the idea of buying a single servo and servo tester on Ebay. It should come out at under a tenner.
From what I have read, it can operate 1 servo albeit manually, but it could give slow operation.  I can't verify this but it might be worth investigating a bit further as it could be a cost effective solution?

Offline exmouthcraig

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2020, 01:07:54 PM »
 :hmmm: sounds quite interesting @honestjudge probably more readily available then point motors

Offline jpendle

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Re: Point motor choice HELP please
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2020, 03:59:33 PM »
Hi Craig,

As long as you have room underneath the layout.

Tortoise point motor, any old 12-16V laptop power supply, one DPDT switch.

Wire the tortoise to the common pins on the switch, cross wire the other pins to the power supply.

Other opinions are available.

Great modelling on Clifton Wood by the way.

John P
Check out my layout thread.

Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)

https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=39501.msg476247#msg476247

 

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