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Author Topic: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016  (Read 19597 times)

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Online Snowwolflair

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #45 on: March 21, 2016, 04:44:09 PM »
£350 !!!  :'(  :veryangry: :censored:

Who can run 8 coaches on its layout ?
Who can spend so much money ?
Do they try kill the project ?

I fear I won't be able to get one with such a pack.

It's not going to go down in value and as I know the designer of the real train its a must have  :beers:

Offline Bob G

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #46 on: March 21, 2016, 05:07:19 PM »
I would like to have seen a six car option and also a re-liveried buffet pair so an owner could have various options of coach consists.

I'm also very surprised they are re-engineering the coaches just for this set.

Also what's the difference between half yellow and full yellow ends? Only thought it had one livery.

And why is there going to be a two coach option?

Nevertheless very impressed and going to work harder to earn the dosh for this beauty.

Best
Bob

Offline davidinyork

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #47 on: March 21, 2016, 05:15:50 PM »
I would like to have seen a six car option and also a re-liveried buffet pair so an owner could have various options of coach consists.

I'm also very surprised they are re-engineering the coaches just for this set.

Also what's the difference between half yellow and full yellow ends? Only thought it had one livery.

And why is there going to be a two coach option?

Nevertheless very impressed and going to work harder to earn the dosh for this beauty.

Best
Bob

While it was in test train use, after the production HSTs had been introduced, it had the yellow front extended further round the cab sites. I imagine that is what is referred to.

Offline Dr Al

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #48 on: March 21, 2016, 05:29:34 PM »
£350 does seem steep IMHO given that they are only new-tooling part of it at a glance - they have the HST powercar chassis, motor, bogies, etc, as well as the Mk3 chassis, glazing, roof tooling; implying that they need tool the powercar body/glazing/lighting and the Mk3 bodies.

Given the the 11 car Rapido Pendolino (tooled totally from scratch) is £15 cheaper, it does seem steep....
http://www.revolutiontrains.com/product/11-car-class-390-pendolino/
...either that or the Pendo is a complete bargain.

....think I'll finish my 3D print....

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Offline Nik96

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #49 on: March 21, 2016, 05:33:03 PM »
I'm booking my overtime now!

Could be interesting with several HST's of varying descriptions soon to be arriving on N gauge layouts. I feel this nations HST fleets are very undermodelled especially in N.
4 Layouts in, I've never got further than ballasting track. 5th time lucky?

Offline davidinyork

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #50 on: March 21, 2016, 05:34:11 PM »
£350 does seem steep IMHO given that they are only new-tooling part of it at a glance - they have the HST powercar chassis, motor, bogies, etc, as well as the Mk3 chassis, glazing, roof tooling; implying that they need tool the powercar body/glazing/lighting and the Mk3 bodies.

Given the the 11 car Rapido Pendolino (tooled totally from scratch) is £15 cheaper, it does seem steep....
http://www.revolutiontrains.com/product/11-car-class-390-pendolino/
...either that or the Pendo is a complete bargain.

....think I'll finish my 3D print....

Cheers,
Alan


New roof tooling will be needed - the prototype carriages had the same layout as the Mk3a carriages, and it's different to the production HST trailers. Up until now they have incorrectly used HST roofs on models of Mk3a carriages, so hopefully they will use the roof tooling from this on future releases.

Offline davidinyork

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2016, 05:35:57 PM »
I'm booking my overtime now!

Could be interesting with several HST's of varying descriptions soon to be arriving on N gauge layouts. I feel this nations HST fleets are very undermodelled especially in N.

It doesn't help that an HST is a long train and needs a large layout. Scale length sets are mostly 7 or 8 carriages, and anything less than five or six looks unrealistic - and even five Mk3s and two power cars is quite a long train.

Offline Nik96

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #52 on: March 21, 2016, 05:41:09 PM »
I'm booking my overtime now!

Could be interesting with several HST's of varying descriptions soon to be arriving on N gauge layouts. I feel this nations HST fleets are very undermodelled especially in N.

It doesn't help that an HST is a long train and needs a large layout. Scale length sets are mostly 7 or 8 carriages, and anything less than five or six looks unrealistic - and even five Mk3s and two power cars is quite a long train.

90% of the reason I would guess they aren't modeled. Even when the shorter sets such as 180's that run as four/five cars ( I think) aren't modeled either. I'm using HST in the broader sense of the term outside of the IC125's. There's the large international themed layout the size of the footprint of my house I seem to remember at exhibitions that was entirely HST's it always satisfied me mildly that it had been modeled.
4 Layouts in, I've never got further than ballasting track. 5th time lucky?

Offline Dr Al

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #53 on: March 21, 2016, 05:44:53 PM »

New roof tooling will be needed - the prototype carriages had the same layout as the Mk3a carriages, and it's different to the production HST trailers. Up until now they have incorrectly used HST roofs on models of Mk3a carriages, so hopefully they will use the roof tooling from this on future releases.

Of course, you assume, like I, that they won't use existing (wrong as you so correctly point out) Mk3a roofs on the prototype....

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Offline davidinyork

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #54 on: March 21, 2016, 05:45:10 PM »
I'm booking my overtime now!

Could be interesting with several HST's of varying descriptions soon to be arriving on N gauge layouts. I feel this nations HST fleets are very undermodelled especially in N.

It doesn't help that an HST is a long train and needs a large layout. Scale length sets are mostly 7 or 8 carriages, and anything less than five or six looks unrealistic - and even five Mk3s and two power cars is quite a long train.

90% of the reason I would guess they aren't modeled. Even when the shorter sets such as 180's that run as four/five cars ( I think) aren't modeled either. I'm using HST in the broader sense of the term outside of the IC125's. There's the large international themed layout the size of the footprint of my house I seem to remember at exhibitions that was entirely HST's it always satisfied me mildly that it had been modeled.

180s are five cars, and neither they (nor the 3-car 185s, which are essential for any modern layout based on much of the north) have been done in either N or OO gauge.

Voyagers - both the 4 and 5 car variant - have been done in both gauges and seem reasonably popular with modellers.

Offline davidinyork

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #55 on: March 21, 2016, 05:46:15 PM »

New roof tooling will be needed - the prototype carriages had the same layout as the Mk3a carriages, and it's different to the production HST trailers. Up until now they have incorrectly used HST roofs on models of Mk3a carriages, so hopefully they will use the roof tooling from this on future releases.

Of course, you assume, like I, that they won't use existing (wrong as you so correctly point out) Mk3a roofs on the prototype....

Cheers,
Alan

The flyer does say 'correct to prototype roof detail'. Mk3a roofs are actually correct for the prototype - the design which Dapol normally use is correct for the HST trailers (Mk3), plus loco-hauled Mk3b first opens, and MK3a sleepers (they haven't done the sleepers though).
« Last Edit: March 21, 2016, 05:58:34 PM by davidinyork »

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #56 on: March 21, 2016, 05:52:31 PM »
The early Farish HST single bogey units were simply crap.  They were vastly improved by the 8 wheel drive second generation mechanisms and the Dapol units available now are also reliable if fragile.

I think this lack of performance put them out of favor in the past, however I agree there could be a renaissance on exhibition layouts particularly with the revised mechanisms and liveries.

Personally I buy an extra mechanism and double head them with a powered power car at each end.

As for 10+ train lengths, can I encourage members to join clubs where big trains are generally accommodated and appreciated.

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #57 on: March 21, 2016, 06:40:29 PM »
From the flyer it sounds like Dapol are not only doing the correct roof but also the correct (frameless) windows.

While it is natural to compare say the Pendolino with the HST set I'm not sure it is at all fair.  If we were starting the Pendolino now from scratch it would be considerably more expensive.

Cheers, Mike



Offline Woodenhead

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #58 on: March 21, 2016, 07:49:41 PM »
It's not a bad price and they've clearly gone for 8 coaches to make the whole thing cost effective.

It's a pity they aren't doing any catering vehicles though, the bane of the whole MK3 saga.

Offline StufromEGDL

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Re: Dapol / Miller project HST model due 2016
« Reply #59 on: March 21, 2016, 07:54:35 PM »
Hi Gang,

The flyer states that this will be a once only production of coaches( minus buffet) with the frameless windows ,no CDL lights and prototypical roof profile. That means it will be a single production run if it makes the cut for production( and I have my doubts it will). I'm assuming dedicated design work won't start until nearing the bottom line for production....and it would be in Dapol's interest (IMHO), to make an additional batch of roofs for the aftermarket.

Personally, I'm also disappointed that the buffets will not be made.....

Later....Stu from EGDL.
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