I'm not a prototypical type of guy, but I'm wondering about the way locos 'should' operate on an 'out and back' branch line.
Should the loco be turned around for the return trip using a turntable, or is it OK to haul rolling stock backwards?
I'm planning my layout and am wondering if a passing siding is sufficient, or should I install a turntable at both ends of the line?
As you can probably tell, I am new to this stuff!
Thanks, Chris

Some British branchline termini had turntables, but others did not. It was common practice for tank engines to run around their trains at the platform on a loop. In other words, it's fine for a tank engine (or even a tender engine such as an Ivatt) to haul a train backwards.

GWR branches often ran autocoaches which had a tank engine (usually a pannier), and controls at the coach end so it could be driven from there.

When railcars and DMUs were introduced of course, this became unnecessary.

Most branch stations had small goods yards which were busy areas of shunting activity.

There are many branch track plans available both on the net and in book form, and it could be an idea to have a look at these before going ahead with your layout.

Hope this helps! 

As a rough rule, if a branch was operated primarily by tank engines then running bunker-first for half the journeys would be the norm. Only if tender engines were a regular feaure would a turntable be provided since these were only permitted to run tender-first at low speeds (25mph IIRC).

Quote from: Karhedron on November 04, 2016, 08:56:23 AM
As a rough rule, if a branch was operated primarily by tank engines then running bunker-first for half the journeys would be the norm. Only if tender engines were a regular feaure would a turntable be provided since these were only permitted to run tender-first at low speeds (25mph IIRC).

So is that one of the reasons that speed is restricted on preserved railways, as many of the locos run tender first.

Quote from: austinbob on November 04, 2016, 09:00:08 AM

Quote from: Karhedron on November 04, 2016, 08:56:23 AM
As a rough rule, if a branch was operated primarily by tank engines then running bunker-first for half the journeys would be the norm. Only if tender engines were a regular feaure would a turntable be provided since these were only permitted to run tender-first at low speeds (25mph IIRC).

So is that one of the reasons that speed is restricted on preserved railways, as many of the locos run tender first.

Indeed it is. A low speed also reduces wear-and-tear on both track and stock. As a final benefit, it helps to stretch out the journey times a bit and help customers feel like they are getting better value for money.

I thought the 25 mph overall speed limit was one of the restrictions of the light railway order that all preserved railways run under.

Quote from: Chris Morris on November 04, 2016, 10:05:07 AM
I thought the 25 mph overall speed limit was one of the restrictions of the light railway order that all preserved railways run under.

Me too. I also believe that unless the branch line connects with a main line then a turntable would have been an expensive undertaking and take up valuable land on a line that was very often shoe horned into the countryside as an afterthought

Thanks everyone, no turntable required, which leaves room for other things on the layout.
I'm running a Class 57 Pannier loco on a volunteer run tourist line, slow speed etc.

Quote from: Bealman on November 04, 2016, 04:26:43 AM
GWR branches often ran autocoaches which had a tank engine (usually a pannier), and controls at the coach end so it could be driven from there.

'Push-pull' working was also common on the Southern.

Quote from: Chris Morris on November 04, 2016, 10:05:07 AM
I thought the 25 mph overall speed limit was one of the restrictions of the light railway order that all preserved railways run under.

That is correct, light railways were limited to 25mph as they were built and operated to standards less than required for main line operations, including branch lines. The Lyme Regis branch was limited to 25mph because it was built to light railway standards.

I am not aware of tender first operation being limited to 25mph. I have traveled at more than 25 mph on main lines with the loco running tender first. I doubt if the Swanage branch would have run at 25mph when Standard 2-6-0's were used at the end of steam.

Dodger

I am greatly amused by the notion that Locomotives running tender first were restricted to 25 mph. New one on me! As for branch line locomotives, that depended on a set of circumstances. If the terminal had no turntable then the crews had a choice called Hobson's. Generally if the branch was comparatively short, then tank engines running bunker first on one leg would be acceptable but for longer distances, even tank engines were normally turned as bunker first running at speed was not pleasant for or popular with the crew. Especially for locos without a tender cab. Oldd timers would tell of fast runs bunker first on old tender engines and being bombarded with lumps of coal from the tender. Not to mention the wind and weather. Consequently, any tender loco routinely used for bunker first running would have a tender cab. AS an aside, when O.V.S Bulleid was cooking up his 'Leader' disaster. It was first suggested by the southern Railway Board that a further batch of Q1 locomotives be built but not to utility spec. Bulleid claimed that "The Q1 was unsuitable as it was unstable when running bunker first at speed"  something that was subsequently proven to be untrue.

Apologies, I have rechecked my facts and the speed restrictions on engines running tender-first only applied to light-engine running, not to normal service.

Sorry about that. 

Further to my previous post the Network Rail working timetable CG (Chiltern Lines) for period ending May 2016 allows steam locos to run tender first at 45 mph.

This would be fast enough for most branch lines in steam days.

Dodger

One reason, particularly on branches with curves all over the place, for a turntable at the terminus is to equalise wear on the locomotive wheels.

Quote from: austinbob on November 04, 2016, 09:00:08 AM

Quote from: Karhedron on November 04, 2016, 08:56:23 AM
As a rough rule, if a branch was operated primarily by tank engines then running bunker-first for half the journeys would be the norm. Only if tender engines were a regular feaure would a turntable be provided since these were only permitted to run tender-first at low speeds (25mph IIRC).

So is that one of the reasons that speed is restricted on preserved railways, as many of the locos run tender first.

Nope...

Quote from: Chris Morris on November 04, 2016, 10:05:07 AM
I thought the 25 mph overall speed limit was one of the restrictions of the light railway order that all preserved railways run under.

Yes...

And Tender locos could run tender first at higher speeds than 25mph and indeed still do - for example the NYMR runs up to 45mph on the Grosmont - Whitby section in both directions without turning the locos...