Last NGS journal had a conversion of an old Matchbox toy Dean single using a tender drive.

I had a couple of Triang Dean singles "back in the day" and they were useless at pulling anything more than 3 coaches unless they were on steel track where the "magnedesion" I think it was called came into effect.

Quote from: Pete33 on January 30, 2016, 03:00:48 PM
No problem, Philip.

Even Railway Modeller made the mistake of accepting the blue livery in their review, so it's surprising how many people don't know they were black. The book says delivery was 1922, but you can bet that a few probably didn't enter service until 1923 (or perhaps even 1924). The S&D five were delivered in 1922 though.

The Landship pack also comes with that lovely Deeley tender, and the loco could easily be re-lettered for LMS pre-1927 livery. The number doesn't need to be changed at all.

I would guess RM used Farish's press info on it, which doesn't acknowledge the livery goof, obviously. I really ought to have remembered as there was discussion of this on the Collectors Club thread.

I think part of the confusion comes from the fact that there are precious few pictures of them which you can identify as SDJR and partially because they were technically eligible for the SDJR Prussian blue livery, but never actually wore it, it seems.

And I could never imagine taking a perfectly good pre-grouping livery and spoiling it! I suppose some are that crazy, but I'm not.

Speaking of train sets and of the S&DJR, the Countryside Coal set comes with a SDJR Jinty, but it is technically a post-grouping loco as well as the S&DJR Jinty's were produced in 1929 (SDJR Nos. 19-25). The 3F is remarkably similar to the MR 2441 Class though, which they are a development of, and converting an LMS one to MR livery may prove easy enough

Quote from: N-Gauge-US on January 30, 2016, 05:52:57 PM
I think part of the confusion comes from the fact that there are precious few pictures of them which you can identify as SDJR and partially because they were technically eligible for the SDJR Prussian blue livery, but never actually wore it, it seems.

Cost cutting. The more things change...

Quote from: N-Gauge-US on January 30, 2016, 05:52:57 PM
Speaking of train sets and of the S&DJR, the Countryside Coal set comes with a SDJR Jinty, but it is technically a post-grouping loco as well as the S&DJR Jinties were produced in 1929 (SDJR Nos. 19-25)...

Perfectly okay for my 1929/30 layout, but getting my hands on one is another thing entirely.

Quote from: Pete33 on January 30, 2016, 06:20:24 PM

Quote from: N-Gauge-US on January 30, 2016, 05:52:57 PM
I think part of the confusion comes from the fact that there are precious few pictures of them which you can identify as SDJR and partially because they were technically eligible for the SDJR Prussian blue livery, but never actually wore it, it seems.

Cost cutting. The more things change...

Quote from: N-Gauge-US on January 30, 2016, 05:52:57 PM
Speaking of train sets and of the S&DJR, the Countryside Coal set comes with a SDJR Jinty, but it is technically a post-grouping loco as well as the S&DJR Jinties were produced in 1929 (SDJR Nos. 19-25)...

Perfectly okay for my 1929/30 layout, but getting my hands on one is another thing entirely.

And I assumed that they simply left it in black because it did more goods than passenger work, mixed designation or not. You are probably more on the money (excuse the pun) with the cost saving measures though, as I remember reading that at the turn of the century the LBSCR was famous for having immaculate paint jobs and livery work, implying that the cost of such maintenance was probably higher than was justifiable for S&DJR locomotives relegated primarily to goods duties.

And agreed, I'm not eager to buy the EZ Command just to have the pretty SDJR Jinty (no matter how much I want it!), so acquiring one is thorny.

Quote from: N-Gauge-US on January 30, 2016, 06:45:26 PM
And I assumed that they simply left it in black because it did more goods than passenger work, mixed designation or not. You are probably more on the money (excuse the pun) with the cost saving measures though, as I remember reading that at the turn of the century the LBSCR was famous for having immaculate paint jobs and livery work, implying that the cost of such maintenance was probably higher than was justifiable for S&DJR locomotives relegated primarily to goods duties.

Actually I think it was more the post-Great War shortage of manpower and the Great Recession. Income from goods traffic was hit pretty badly during the late 1920s/early 1930s, and the railways needed to make savings. The S&DJR was an easy target because it was joint owned by two big companies. The 4Fs were pretty much maids-of-all-work, everything from piloting duties to goods runs. But if you're modelling the S&DJR at this time, you need many, many 2Ps and 4Fs!

Quote from: Pete33 on January 30, 2016, 08:55:42 PM

Quote from: N-Gauge-US on January 30, 2016, 06:45:26 PM
And I assumed that they simply left it in black because it did more goods than passenger work, mixed designation or not. You are probably more on the money (excuse the pun) with the cost saving measures though, as I remember reading that at the turn of the century the LBSCR was famous for having immaculate paint jobs and livery work, implying that the cost of such maintenance was probably higher than was justifiable for S&DJR locomotives relegated primarily to goods duties.

Actually I think it was more the post-Great War shortage of manpower and the Great Recession. Income from goods traffic was hit pretty badly during the late 1920s/early 1930s, and the railways needed to make savings. The S&DJR was an easy target because it was joint owned by two big companies. The 4Fs were pretty much maids-of-all-work, everything from piloting duties to goods runs. But if you're modelling the S&DJR at this time, you need many, many 2Ps and 4Fs!

I thought the S&DJR had only 5 4Fs/Class 3835s and only 3 2Ps. Is that just in the pre-LMS era? (I'm really sorry if we are hijacking your thread in a way that doesn't interest you, @FourWheelCoach . If so, please tell us to stop and we will do the obvious and start a new thread )

Now that I am at home, I have my UM price list in front of me. I went through it when I got it and marked the dates of production and original companies of each currently available model. Please note that the following locos are almost all only available presently in Grouping and BR liveries.

In the following list, the UM name of the model (usually the Groupig company designation) comes first, then the original company and its designation, then the production dates:

J11/GCR 9J 0-6-0  (1901-1910)
J25/NER P1 0-6-0 (1898-1902)
J26/NER P2 0-6-0 (1904-1905)
J27/NER P3 0-6-0 (1906-1909;1921-1922)
(J38 LNER 0-6-0 1926)
(J39 LNER 0-6-0 1926)
B12/GER 569 4-6-0 (1911-1928)
D20/NER D20 4-4-0 (1899-1907)
Q2/GNR K1 0-8-0 (1901-1909)
2P/MR 483 4-4-0 (1882-1901; SDJR 1914-1921)
(7F LMS 0-8-0 1929-1932)
2F and 3F/MR Johnson 0-6-0 (1875-1908)
Cauliflower/LNWR 2F Cauliflower 0-6-0 (1900???)
T9/LSWR T9 4-4-0 (1899-1901)
700/LSWR 700 0-6-0 (1897?)
Adams 0395/LSWR 395 0-6-0 (1881-1886)
Prince of Wales/LNWR Prince of Wales 4-6-0 (1911-1921;1924)
D11/GCR 11F 4-4-0 (1919-1924)
D16/3 "Super Claud"/GER 546 & D56 (1900-1923)

Some of these are later rebuilds of the classes listed and some were simply renamed for easy of sorting after grouping.

I am SURE I have made some errors/oversights above, so someone please point them out!

Union Mills also make a dean goods but it may not be available at the moment



Regards,

Alex

Quote from: Hailstone on January 30, 2016, 10:58:40 PM
Union Mills also make a dean goods but it may not be available at the moment



Regards,

Alex

It is sold out presently but a new run will be released in late February or early March in 3 GWR liveries and in BR black

Quote from: N-Gauge-US on January 30, 2016, 09:34:59 PM
I thought the S&DJR had only 5 4Fs/Class 3835s and only 3 2Ps. Is that just in the pre-LMS era? (I'm really sorry if we are hijacking your thread in a way that doesn't interest you, @FourWheelCoach . If so, please tell us to stop and we will do the obvious and start a new thread )

Well, there were also Scotties (Class G 0-6-0s), 483s (pre-Grouping 2Ps), and Bulldogs (Class H 0-6-0s), but I'm modelling 1930, so I have the LMS in charge of motive power alongside S&D locos that haven't yet been renumbered or repainted (or withdrawn). Complete (hopefully) list of S&D locos here: http://www.ngauge.historyfiles.co.uk/FeaturesS&D/locomotives.htm