Bachmann have posted some images of the new Southern Railway 12T Ventilated Van, which looks most impressive.

http://www.bachmann.co.uk/details.php?id=194

With all the recent debate about rising costs in China and whether the quest for perfection has gone a little too far, I would hold this model up as a prime example.

There seem to be multiple versions with or without vacuum cylinders or chassis tie-bars, presumably to cover versions of this wagon throughout its career.

I am probably going to be shot down in flames here but is this level of perfection needed for a small N Gauge wagon? The chassis is gorgeous, of course, with lots of separate components, which will need expensive manual assembly but is it necessary?

In future, something more generic could be produced to keep costs down and, perhaps, this may be a feature of future models. We are seeing detail now equivalent to some of the finest 2mm finescale and variations that would probably only be appreciated by a select few. Would it really be missed?

I'm not suggesting a return to the old Peco-style 10' chassis but something in between. After all, there are plenty of after-market suppliers to cater for the more dedicated modeller who craves 100% perfection.

The rise of internet forums is a problem for manufacturers, with certain "experts" only too happy to pounce on any perceived error or omission, which may be driving the recent trend for more and more detail.

For a high-profile release, like a locomotive, this may be a good thing but for freight stock, I would rather the costs were reduced, as customers would probably want more than one.

It's probably worth giving this model the benefit of the doubt, as the long development time may have started in happier times before the current crisis with Chinese manufacturing.

Hi Adam,
You make a good point. The hand assembly will push the price up and if you want a whole rake, then the extra quid a wagon adds up. It does come down to price though, as that detail is very appealing to me.
But it certainly makes you realize how awful the coupling is. If we go to detailed models like this, a different, less obtrusive coupling is a must.
Mark

I'd argue that if N Gauge is going to grow its share of the market then we need the current level of details not a return to the Poole era of shared chassis and compromises.

Happy modelling.

Steven B.

Quote from: Steven B on August 08, 2014, 12:33:20 PM
I'd argue that if N Gauge is going to grow its share of the market then we need the current level of details not a return to the Poole era of shared chassis and compromises.

Happy modelling.

Steven B.

Hi

I would agree.

Cheers

Paul

I'm with Mark on this one.  This level of detailing really does show how awful the standard coupling is.  Could costs be reduced slightly by including a small bag of detailing parts, rather than have them factory fitted?

Brian.

If labour costs are the problem they're meant to be, then presumably the availability of various versions/detail configurations won't impact this?  The assembly line operative will be fitting one set of parts, as ever.

Quote from: B P on August 08, 2014, 12:40:58 PM
Could costs be reduced slightly by including a small bag of detailing parts, rather than have them factory fitted?

Be careful what you wish for! ViTrains took this approach with their Class 47. There were over a dozen sprues of parts that needed to be glued on. Not everyone appreciated this approach, to say the least.

That said, I've read online that sprues of detailing parts are pretty standard on continental and US H0 model locomotives. I guess it depends on how essential these parts are. I don't mind adding optional extras like bufferbeam details, but adding ubiquitous parts like handrails would be annoying, in N scale at least.

Cheers, NeMo

Hello  Adam

I agree with you completely on this. Most of the detail is too small to be noticed once it is on a layout. Some simplification and reduced cost would be nice. I'll still be running my Parkwood/Peco versions.

Dodger

I am all in favour of more detailed models and I agree, we don't want to slip back here. If a particular vehicle gained a piece of underframe equipment (for example) at a particular time then I think it is great that different liveries correctly depict the "before" and "after" versions.

There is a point to be made about separately fitted details though. I remember Dapol reflecting that the presence of so many small parts (which had to be manually assembled in the factory) was one of the reasons for the high cost of the Gresley coaches. With hindsight, some of the components on the ends and undersides could have been molded to reduce cost without seriously compromising the quality of the product.

Just beware of taking this too far though. Look at the pasting Hornby have taken over "design clever". 

Quote from: captainelectra on August 08, 2014, 10:32:05 AM
Bachmann have posted some images of the new Southern Railway 12T Ventilated Van, which looks most impressive.

http://www.bachmann.co.uk/details.php?id=194

Typical, just as I've finished a complete rake of them from NGS kits!! 

Pictures also in the latest "Bachmann Times", a copy of which I received yesterday along with a copy of the 2014 catalogue...

There already is a simpler and lower cost alternative where some of the assembly is performed by yourself. Peco van kits.

I'm quite happy to have highly detailed models on offer, especially van kits like this with NEM pockets. I try not to buy anything which doesn't have exquisite detail out of the box anyway (pretty much all of the Poole era Farish stuff.)

Quote from: Karhedron on August 08, 2014, 01:48:37 PM

Just beware of taking this too far though. Look at the pasting Hornby have taken over "design clever". 

To be fair, the compromises of 'design clever' in OO are going to be a lot more noticeable than in N, where some of the more intricate underframe detail is going to be completely hidden at normal viewing distances. I'm all for adding noticeable detail (vacuum brake pipes, brake reservoirs, chassis tie bars, battery boxes, etc), but all the rodding and pipework under the chassis? I don't know... 

The standard of detail on the blue riband range is excellent and I don't think it needs any great further changes.. I think I would how ever be prepared to pay a bit more on locos that were more reliable out of the box and this is where bachmann should focus a bit more and not tiny bags of detailing

I agree. While no one can deny that detail has come in leaps and bounds over the last 10 years, quality control at both Bachmann and Dapol still leaves something to be desired. Dapol's 2-year warranty helps in this regard but I wouldn't mind paying a bit more for more reliable motors and an end to dry-soldered joints.

With all due respect to all the  far more experienced modellers than myself on this forum it seems to me from the above that the manufacturers are damned if they do and damned if thy don't superdetail their models.

Guess the old saying is true 'You can't please all of the people all of the time'