Hi Guys,

Looks like Hattons and I guess other suppliers have got some Intercity Swallow Loco Hauled Mk3s in, priced at £19.

•2P-005-221 - 1st Class #11065
•2P-005-222 - 1st Class #11073
•2P-005-231 - 2nd Class #12004
•2P-005-232 - 2nd Class #12019
•2P-005-233 - 2nd Class #12037

Cheers, Mark.

Good spot, but no Brake Van listed surely they ran with one does anyone know?

I wonder are these the right era to have been hauled by the Farish Titan? Could be interested if they were.

Ray

Quote from: REGP on December 08, 2013, 11:34:52 AM
I wonder are these the right era to have been hauled by the Farish Titan? Could be interested if they were.

Couple photos on Google (here and here) seem to suggest pretty much anything goes!

I've already bought 47612 'Titan' and it's a lovely model. But I was a bit disappointed by the height difference between the Farish Mk1s and Mk2s. Jumbling the two models in the same train looks odd. I wonder how well the Dapol Mk3s match the Farish Mk2s in height? Alternatively, any quick fixes for making the Farish Mk2s a millimetre taller than they are?

Cheers, NeMo

Hi Ray,

I'm no expert on coaching configurations, but I've seen some West Coast traffic video taken from the era with an 86/87 at one end and either a DBSO or DVT at the other. I'm pretty sure they sometimes dragged a Mk1 GUV with modified bogies too.

As the Titan is in the correct livery, I would assume it's good to go. It will be for me anyway 

Dapol has also produced their 86 in Swallow livery along with a DVT.

Cheers, Mark.

Thanks for that link NeMo, certainly a mixture of liveries there, but don't know enough to work out which Mark carriages they might be, but will keep looking.

Like you I hope the new Dapol Mk 3's will match the Titan.

Ray

The first picture seems to have a mixture of Mk1 and Mk2 stock, the second looks to be Mk2. I've just been 'Googling' but can't find any evidence of a 47 pulling Mk3 stock in that era yet.

Not conclusive for me as you can't see the underframes, but the interior looks like Mk3 stock (at 4:14 in the video)- http://youtu.be/zqVyfE7-SMY?t=4m14s

Loco hauled Mk3 sets ran with Mk1 (NEA or NHA on WCML) or Mk2 (on WCML often Mk2D BSOs) brakes until the DVTs were built.  IIRC there were 3 x Mk3B BFOs built, but they were an exception rather than the norm.

Cheers

Mike

Quote from: Vonzack on December 08, 2013, 12:17:30 PM
Not conclusive for me as you can't see the underframes, but the interior looks like Mk3 stock (at 4:14 in the video)- http://youtu.be/zqVyfE7-SMY?t=4m14s

Yes that's definitely mk3 stock the 47 is pulling. The fact that it was coupled to a DVT would suggest this was a "drag" which often happened when there were engineering works on the WCML which meant diverting over non-electrified routes. Usually the 86/87 would be taken off and the 47 put on.

For some odd reason Farish have always made the mk2s ride too low, and the new tooling coaches are no different. The way I have got round this is to take the bogies off and insert spacers made from hole-punched plasticard offcuts.

Thanks for your help guys.

That a very useful video Vonzack, Mike and Chris thanks for your observations the are a big help

Have just been comparing the height of the Farish Titan against a Dapol HST MK3 SO and they look OK to me.

So if the tooling for the loco hauled is the same I could go for a few.

Ray

The mkiii coaches had all the equipment between the bogies covered the same as hst coaches

Steve

HST trailers are also Mk3 coaches. The loco hauled version are Mk3a.

The main differences for modellers are the buffers (not fitted to HST Mk3s), slightly different roof detail. They also had different electrical wiring - HSTs I think have three phase electrics and use a different multiple working system.



Happy modelling.

Steven B.

Hi All,

Thought I'd bump this thread up rather than starting a new one. Just posted this on another forum but it's certainly bound to be of interest here so I thought I'd share it for others modelling the same era.

I've just been on the phone to Dapol regarding a couple of Intercity Swallow items which I pre-ordered from Rails of Sheffield a couple of weeks ago. The DVT in this livery (the corrected livery, that is) is unfortunately still 3 to 4 months away, however the following items, which the Dapol website lists either as "Awaiting Production" or "In Transit", have actually arrived and should be in the process of being shipped out to suppliers. I already have the buffet coach but I'm tempted to add another 1st and two more standards to the order to get myself a full rake in one sweep:

2P-005-221 MK 3 I/CITY SWALLOW  1st  CLASS # 11065 loco hauled
2P-005-222 MK 3 I/CITY SWALLOW  1st CLASS  # 11073 loco hauled
2P-005-231 MK 3 I/CITY SWALLOW 2nd CLASS # 12004 loco hauled
2P-005-232 MK 3 I/CITY SWALLOW 2nd CLASS # 12019 loco hauled
2P-005-233 MK 3 I/CITY SWALLOW 2nd CLASS # 12037 loco hauled

Cheers,

JB

Edit: Hang on, I've just noticed these reference numbers are exactly the same as those in the first post... What's going on here then? Have these been released or not? How is it that the Rails of Sheffield website lists them as pre-order items, the Dapol website lists them as in transit, and yet Hattons seem to have been selling them since December?

What constitutes a 'correct livery' for Dapol 

They're getting there, gradually. Just a shame so many of us have bought stock only to find out on arrival that there are errors which can't always be seen in photographs... I called Rails earlier on to find out why these were on pre-order when other suppliers have been selling them since December; I've just had an e-mail from them to say their order wasn't shipped by Dapol at the time but that it's apparently now on its way to them, which means I'll get my coaches at some point next week I'd imagine (overseas shipping).

Now if I can just find an excuse to buy one of those lovely C&M sets and run a Glasgow-Chester-Edinburgh service then I'll be a happy man 

JB

Quote from: Vonzack on December 08, 2013, 12:17:30 PMThe first picture seems to have a mixture of Mk1 and Mk2 stock, the second looks to be Mk2. I've just been 'Googling' but can't find any evidence of a 47 pulling Mk3 stock in that era yet

Sunday only between Glasgow Central and Carlisle, prior to 1996
Although from 1992 several of these services had swapped to HST
Southbound all departures before 13:00 were hauled by Class 47 and routed via Kilmarnock
This included at least one ECS working as well
Northbound there would be one working, typically arriving into Glasgow Central around 17:00