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Author Topic: 3D Class 92  (Read 41314 times)

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Offline RussellH

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #75 on: August 03, 2012, 11:21:37 PM »
Hi Guys

As promised a few pics of it in primer at the paint shop....
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

Regards
Russ
Repairs - not everything has to be sent away - you can fix most thing's yourself. Ask and help will be provided.

Waiting for the RTR version? - why not try a kit?

My layout, Bridgebury Gate now has its own website...
www.bridgeburygate.com

and the 3DR shop where you'll also find the NGF MPV, assorted cabs etc...
http://www.shapeways.com/shops/3dr_designs_for_n_gauge

Offline Pengi

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #76 on: August 04, 2012, 05:52:24 AM »
This is exciting!
Just one Pendolino, give it to me, a beautiful train, from Italy

Online njee20

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #77 on: August 04, 2012, 09:02:06 AM »
**rubs hands together excitedly**

Looks great!

Offline alibuchan

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #78 on: August 20, 2012, 03:59:50 PM »
Hi Russ,

The 92 is looking good, any pictures of it fully painted?

Also when will it be available to order as I have a new class 60 chassis waiting for a body or 2!

Alistair

Offline RussellH

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #79 on: August 21, 2012, 09:10:18 PM »
Hi Alistair and all watching this thread,

The 16 micron print is progressing to full painted at my mates paint shop and as soon as theres any photos I'll post them on here same day.

Meanwhile...
Shapeways WSF arrived and went off to the paint shop for checking -  the words are "very powdery material to touch, slight concerned on the lack of detail already there and what will be left afterwards, needs alot of sanding and after a brief go with wet and dry its not going to be overly easy to sand, holds it shape well.
3D print (UK firm) shell arrived as requested uncleaned still in its block of support wax - very odd but surprisingly easy to crumble it away.
This is what it looked like when it arrived...
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

the words from the paint shop are...This is the better one out of the 2, moulding holds better detail and I think it will be easier to sand, bit concerned about the 'bowing' body. --- This is easily sorted with hot water and is my fav so far.

Next were waiting for a Shapeways print in WD to see what that material works out like. Then were out of options - any suggestions welcome!

Its so frustrating to get this good a 3d render and find it so hard to get it printed at the quality we want, thats workable to a good standard of finish at a price thats sensible and reasonable.  So far its the Uk based 3D print that I think will be the most popular but cant wait to see what shapways WD is like.

Regards
Russ
Repairs - not everything has to be sent away - you can fix most thing's yourself. Ask and help will be provided.

Waiting for the RTR version? - why not try a kit?

My layout, Bridgebury Gate now has its own website...
www.bridgeburygate.com

and the 3DR shop where you'll also find the NGF MPV, assorted cabs etc...
http://www.shapeways.com/shops/3dr_designs_for_n_gauge

Offline NTrain

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #80 on: August 21, 2012, 10:10:44 PM »
I find the same frustrations. The technology is nearly there, but we are still waiting for the strength and price of WSF, with the detail of FUD.

My research suggests that we are there in all but price, for a reasonable level of detail. At the moment, I am sticking to WSF as I do not feel that the additional cost for other materials is justifiable.

I have been following this thread with interest.

Offline red_death

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #81 on: August 22, 2012, 10:19:31 AM »
My research suggests that we are there in all but price, for a reasonable level of detail. At the moment, I am sticking to WSF as I do not feel that the additional cost for other materials is justifiable.

I disagree I'm afraid.  Detail/finish is key and WSF doesn't do it for me.  It is fine for internal structures.  For small items FUD is the best I have seen (short of Finelines which is much, much more expensive) and if the cost is becoming prohibitive for a large chunk of FUD then print and cast it.

Cheers, Mike



Offline EtchedPixels

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #82 on: August 22, 2012, 11:33:06 AM »
There is an old saying that "perfection is the enemy of success"

IMHO Resin and white metal both have their problems and limits too but modellers use them. Selling a model as something it's not is one thing, selling a model that is sold with its limits (looking slightly frosty on the surface from 3" or less) expected is another.

The alternative is to use etched overlays but while its easy for coaches some of the 92 is a bit interestingly shaped.
"Knowledge has no value or use for the solitary owner: to be enjoyed it must be communicated" -- Charles Pratt, 1st Earl Camden

Offline RussellH

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #83 on: August 25, 2012, 09:22:21 AM »
Hi Guys

Bit of disappointment - the 3D print (wax block) material is evidently too soft for this particular application as it is, so were thinking about increasing wall thickness and having a go later on. Its still a good material and travels well as a solid lump. The battery box for the 92 is printed in this material and is superb.

FUD - too much layering and nearly impossible to sand but strong and detailed so has its uses - but not the body for this 92.
WSF - just too rough
16 micron - £'ouch but lovely in all respects.

Meanwhile were still waiting for the WD articles to arrive as Shapeways have has some sort of software upgrade issue and its all got a bit mixed up. maybe next week?

Still seeking a sensible/economic way forward thoughts then turn to resin casting from a 16 micron print. There are a few obvious issues. Thereís no way the buffers and probably the roof insulators are going to pull out of a resin cast so....
options...
1) leave the buffer beam attached to the shell and leave it bare (source your own detail bits?)
or
2) supplied complete with all detail as a separate 16 micron printed part.

What are your thoughts?

And a question...
Does anyone know of a supply of suitable insulators for use on the roof?

Regards
Russ
Repairs - not everything has to be sent away - you can fix most thing's yourself. Ask and help will be provided.

Waiting for the RTR version? - why not try a kit?

My layout, Bridgebury Gate now has its own website...
www.bridgeburygate.com

and the 3DR shop where you'll also find the NGF MPV, assorted cabs etc...
http://www.shapeways.com/shops/3dr_designs_for_n_gauge

Offline EtchedPixels

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #84 on: August 25, 2012, 03:48:51 PM »
Still seeking a sensible/economic way forward thoughts then turn to resin casting from a 16 micron print. There are a few obvious issues. Thereís no way the buffers and probably the roof insulators are going to pull out of a resin cast so....
options...
1) leave the buffer beam attached to the shell and leave it bare (source your own detail bits?)
or
2) supplied complete with all detail as a separate 16 micron printed part.

I intentionally made the buffers on the coaches a separate part so that if they ever get damaged its trivial to replace them. Things like buffers do work in FUD and come out at an acceptable price.

For insulators you can get very fine screw rod  which works well or you could just print some !

"Knowledge has no value or use for the solitary owner: to be enjoyed it must be communicated" -- Charles Pratt, 1st Earl Camden

Offline moogle

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #85 on: August 25, 2012, 05:00:24 PM »
TBH IMHO you will probably end up with using a 16 micron master to make a mould from to cast.
That's probably the only way you will get the ultra smooth finish you're looking for.
Do the buffers separately like EP says and you'll be ok.  :thumbsup:
Most people who want one will happily glue bits on.
 :hmmm: ok, maybe the 'I want everything rtr out the box' brigade won't but then you can't please everybody!  :laugh:
Personal motto: You don't have to be mad to be a modeller, but I find it helps!

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Offline Greybeema

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #86 on: August 25, 2012, 08:01:16 PM »
Must say I'm with Moogle here.  We are N Gauge Modellers after all. 

So if the best way to produce it is as a kit of parts - so be it, we all have the skills, to a greater or lesser extent - its better than no locomotive at all...
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Offline alibuchan

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #87 on: August 25, 2012, 08:20:23 PM »
You could always offer it twice, Just to see how it takes off. A FUD or similar printed version and one that is a kit of parts to make it a good one.

As you will find that there are modellers who can produce a cracking painted job but can't detail an n gauge loco due to the fat finger syndrome (this is where I fit in). And those who can do this detailing.

This is of course my opinion but hope that you come to some solution soon as I would still be having one even if I have to ask someone else to put it together!

Alistair

Offline Stevie DC

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #88 on: August 26, 2012, 12:10:48 AM »
Hi, the class 92 looks good.

For FUD I've found in the past that a primer layer followed by a couple of thin coats of Halfords clear lacquer and another primer layer hides much of the stepping. You can sand the paint layers to get a better finish (leave at least 48hours before trying this) as you're not trying to sand the FUD directly. The results are still not perfect but much easier than sanding the model directly...

Have you considered Prime Grey? http://imaterialize.com/materials/prime-gray

Offline RussellH

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Re: 3D Class 92
« Reply #89 on: August 26, 2012, 06:09:21 PM »
Hi Guys

Thanks for all the good stuff you've added here.

We did a complete first shell in FUD and with the complex shapes it wasnít deemed suitable to sand back to a decent finish (but was very strong). The 3dprint-uk shell was a good material but just a bit too soft at the wall thickness we specified. Works well for other things though.
 
As for Imateralise - David tried them and found their customer service about as responsive as a brick so we wont be using them.

Going back to 3D print -uk. If you want good stuff in a real hurry were currently getting very good service from them and get prototype prints out very quickly in their glorious waxy blocks - thatís where the battery boxes for the 92 will be coming from. Crumble the wax away, soak overnight in caustic (oven cleaner) and its ready.

Buffer beams and insulators are likely to be in 16mic (thatís Sabre), or shapeways WD (if the bits ever turn up to see what the stuff is like).

Regards
Russ

Repairs - not everything has to be sent away - you can fix most thing's yourself. Ask and help will be provided.

Waiting for the RTR version? - why not try a kit?

My layout, Bridgebury Gate now has its own website...
www.bridgeburygate.com

and the 3DR shop where you'll also find the NGF MPV, assorted cabs etc...
http://www.shapeways.com/shops/3dr_designs_for_n_gauge

 

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