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Author Topic: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’  (Read 3655 times)

njee20, railsquid, JonHarbour and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline honk843

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #45 on: February 14, 2020, 09:39:21 AM »
Method of funding and the man.

Sadly the DJM collapse has left a lot of modellers very wary of investing their money upfront, especially with a relatively new supplier. My feeling is that unless some of the model shops stock KR Models products then both the Shark and the King will struggle to get enough pre-orders to make the projects cover their costs.

Steven B.
It is not only the King and Shark. I feel that over the years N gauge modellers have been promised a lot from Dapol's 205 Thumper to Hattons' Garrett and KRs own GT3. I had two Kings on order from DJM but as I have two Garretts as well and now don't know if and when they will come but have to keep £400 to one side for them in case. I really have had enough of wishful thinking. I operate an N gauge layout, with some others, none of whom have any interest in anything unless they can get it now.

I built my own Sharks from the excellent NGS kits.

Online Newportnobby

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #46 on: February 14, 2020, 09:56:41 AM »
Method of funding and the man.

Sadly the DJM collapse has left a lot of modellers very wary of investing their money upfront, especially with a relatively new supplier. My feeling is that unless some of the model shops stock KR Models products then both the Shark and the King will struggle to get enough pre-orders to make the projects cover their costs.

Steven B.
It is not only the King and Shark. I feel that over the years N gauge modellers have been promised a lot from Dapol's 205 Thumper to Hattons' Garrett and KRs own GT3.

I think the main problem lies with the choice of model. I'm sorry to mention RevolutioN Trains again (especially after Ben's post) but they have shown the market is there for the right model.
A 'Thumper', Garratt and GT3 are niche models and not mainstream so are pretty much doomed to not reach required numbers. Much can be learned from the annual wishlist polls from RMWeb. The King is a decent choice for GW fans but not all locations  on the GW would have ever seen one. A much better and larger class would be the 43xx or 72xx but that would involve starting from scratch, although maybe a simpler starter. It's tricky as no one knows who is going to announce what and retooling of older models could upstage a new manufacturer's choice.
I salute KR for trying to keep some of us N Gaugers happy, though.

Offline NinOz

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #47 on: February 14, 2020, 11:40:16 AM »
Firstly there clearly were some who have been unable to recover funds paid by debit card and Paypal.
There were also those who paid by credit card and didn't get a refund.  I know because I am one of them.  Lots of discussion on various fora on who did and didn't get a refund, there was a spread sheet somewhere to log this.  The most problematic was the time between payment and the time of claim.

So credit cards are not a sure fire protection when  problems occur for any prepayment.
To be called pompous and arrogant - hell of a come down.
I tried so hard to be snobbish and haughty.

| Carpe Jugulum |

Offline tunneroner61

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #48 on: February 14, 2020, 11:46:25 AM »
Of the dozen or so N gauge modellers in either my club or NGS area group I was the only one to order a DJM King (I did get my money back). None of them seem interested in a KR Models King either. As others have already posted the demise of DJM seems to have put people off crowd funding/pre-ordering to the extent that they want to see the model in the shops - touchy feely - before they buy. A proven track record seems to be a pre requisite but that is a chicken and egg situation. To my mind KR Models offering first a GT3, then replacing that with a Fell, both oddities as has been said, is the wrong approach. Why not get into the N gauge market with a simple and reliable small model such as a simple 0-6-0 tank loco that has not been done already. There are plenty to go at particularly for LNER and Southern modellers. (Take a look at the annual poll results). Get it to market, in model shops as well as online, get a good reputation, then come along with the more esoteric prototypes.

I would still like a King but I shall be watching developments/deliveries from KR before I part with money. If that means I don't get a King because you have to put money up front so be it, it's not the end of the world.

Norman

Offline honk843

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #49 on: February 14, 2020, 12:07:41 PM »
Why not get into the N gauge market with a simple and reliable small model such as a simple 0-6-0 tank loco that has not been done already. There are plenty to go at particularly for LNER and Southern modellers.

Norman

I totally agree and it seems as if Revolution/Sonic think that way too. For me either a J72 (another product promised and not delivered) or a J50 which were made in very limited numbers before (both kits and RtR) and seem very popular by the amount they fetch second hand.

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #50 on: February 14, 2020, 12:10:57 PM »
I would love an N2 as well.

Paddy
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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #51 on: February 16, 2020, 03:14:22 PM »
Afternoon all,

Very interesting read this article. Whilst I had put an order in for a DJM King (thankfully got my money back) I'm unlikely to put money up front for one again without having seen something brought to market first. It was a rule one purchase anyway so not at the top of my wanta list.

However a few Sharks would definitely be on my radar so very happy to read these are on the horizon. I look forward to seeing how things progress.

Cheers

Ollie

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Online longbow

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #52 on: February 16, 2020, 11:34:53 PM »
Given the marginal economics of N Gauge, I doubt that KR will offer anything in that scale unless it leverages existing CADs.

Online Dr Al

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #53 on: February 18, 2020, 12:35:47 AM »
KR Models - constructive criticism on the DJM King - scrap the proposed mechanism! The CAD for it looked, frankly, bloody awful.

Using two driving wheel sets driven off gears, and one off the rods (meaning all need to be toleranced and adjusted spot on) is just asking for trouble - this is taking two methods of drive and trying to bring them together, with no obvious point, and a lot of risk it will work badly. It slapped of a lack of mechanical feel or nouse.

I'd strongly urge this to be dropped and a more conventional and proven drive considered - either all drivers geared together and rods that are only cosmetic (as Dapol do); or rods that drive the outer wheels with no between-wheel gearing (as Farish do).

Cheers,
Alan
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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #54 on: February 18, 2020, 12:38:14 AM »
KR Models - constructive criticism on the DJM King - scrap the proposed mechanism! The CAD for it looked, frankly, bloody awful.

Using two driving wheel sets driven off gears, and one off the rods (meaning all need to be toleranced and adjusted spot on) is just asking for trouble - this is taking two methods of drive and trying to bring them together, with no obvious point, and a lot of risk it will work badly. It slapped of a lack of mechanical feel or nouse.

I'd strongly urge this to be dropped and a more conventional and proven drive considered - either all drivers geared together and rods that are only cosmetic (as Dapol do); or rods that drive the outer wheels with no between-wheel gearing (as Farish do).

Cheers,
Alan

I completely agree.

Offline bluedepot

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #55 on: February 18, 2020, 02:29:21 PM »
if the cad looks good i will be ordering some sharks

i won't be paying up front though!

new manufacturers got to start somewhere so best of luck to them!


tim


Offline crepello

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #56 on: February 18, 2020, 02:39:17 PM »
KR just want expressions of interest at the moment. Check their website to see if it's ready to allow this. I expect they'll want deposits at some stage. If you don't pay up front, you may never get them.

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #57 on: February 18, 2020, 02:55:55 PM »
All I can find is the N gauge Fell expression of interest and everything else is OO.
We cant express interest if there is no form.
And please dont say there is a Facebook page, as many of us here, including me, dont use that medium.

Best
Bob

Offline tunneroner61

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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #58 on: February 18, 2020, 05:15:33 PM »
If you don't pay up front, you may never get them.

I paid up front for a DJM King - I never got it. So that doesn't always work then.

I find the concept of paying up front, or you won't get it, to an unknown manufacturer rather worrying, it's almost a threat to get your money. I've learnt my lesson and I certainly won't be doing it again in the model world. I'll only order models from established suppliers with a good track record from now on.



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Re: KR Models resurrects DJM ‘King’ and ‘Shark’
« Reply #59 on: February 18, 2020, 09:30:10 PM »
It definitely isn't a threat, it's not like the manufacturer said that in this instance, and ultimately it's kinda true; it's how a lot of models are being funded now. That's not the same as "pay, and you'll definitely get it", so don't conflate the two.

It is of course entirely the buyer's choice whether they do that or not. But the reality is that if people don't, even if for the most genuine reasons, then there's every chance that models won't come to fruition.

I've been happy backing Revolution from the start. I'd also happily give money to Cavalex. I refused to pay DJM anything. I wouldn't rush to give KR Models money personally. Everyone needs to just make their decision on each project/manufacturer and their merits. It's undeniable that DJM has done untold damage to the reputation of crowdfunding among modellers, and N gauge just doesn't have the market size to start cannibalising it.

 

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