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Poll

Which container wagon would you get?

Graham Farish Intermodal Bogie Wagons With Two 45ft Containers
11 (73.3%)
Dapol Model Railways Megafret Wagon
4 (26.7%)

Total Members Voted: 15

Author Topic: Which container wagons  (Read 9614 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline red_death

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #30 on: October 27, 2016, 04:45:44 PM »
I strongly suggest people keep pestering Dapol at shows and on their Digest site to do the KTA/KQA pocket wagon in N (they've already done it in OO)!

Fingers crossed that our KFA sample will be with us for Warley.

We could really do with an FSA/FTA.

Cheers, Mike



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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #31 on: October 27, 2016, 07:02:01 PM »

Hi Brooksy,

On the prototype, the original concept was for containers in 20', 30' or 40' lengths, and the original Freightliner wagons (FFA inners, FGA outers) had 60' decks with spigots at the ISO standard positions.

The original Freightliner wagons are available as inners from Farish, but are rather dated now with generic bogies and relatively low detailing, but with some work can be made passable.

In the 1980s more wagons were built with 60' decks by Standard Wagon and Rautaruukki of Finland.  These were coded PFA initially, now KFA, and the Finnish versions (of which there were far more) are being offered by Revolution Trains.  It is hoped that first samples will be on show at this year's Warley show. For more information there is a thread in the crowdfunding section of the forum, with CAD images.  KFAs are still in use.

Over time, intermodal traffic increased and diversified.  New containers and swap-bodies (like containers but with canvas sides) were introduced at 45' length.

By the early 1990s, the railways needed wagons more appropriate to these, and the Arbel FIA multi-fret twins were built.  These are the wagons made by Farish, and feature 50' decks.

The AAE-built megafrets as offered by Dapol are of a similar vintage and fill a similar role, but have the advantage of an ultra-low deck height, so they can carry taller containers.

A batch of the same wagons, but with 60' decks, were built for Railfreight Distribution (subsequently Freightliner) and coded FSA/FTA depending on whether they are inners or outers.  These are not available RTR or as kits but would be *incredibly* useful.

Also in the early 90s containers started to get taller - and the so called "hi-cube" arrived.  (These are also in development with Revolution Trains and C-Rail intermodal.) The taller containers were out of gauge on most wagons, apart from the megafrets, so "pocket" wagons were introduced, coded KQA, that allowed high cubes to be transported in a well between the bogies.  These were available RTR from ATM in about 2004-6 but are long defunct.  Dapol offer this model in OO and I have had a long-running campaign to get them to shrink it to N, as in my view they are a very attractive wagon!

In the late 90s and 2000s, as intermodal traffic exploded, other new designs appeared.

EWS had their own version of a pocket wagon - the FAA - built with flat centre well.  This is not available RTR.

They also built the FKA "Euro-frets" designed for swap bodies and high cubes.

Others included the spine wagons for EWS coded FCA and not available, the FEA-B twin wagons available from Dapol and in use with Freightliner, GBRf and, briefly, Fastline freight; these ones are now with DB.

Although 45'containers and swap bodies are important for internal or rail/road intermodal traffic, the vast majority of containers are the 40' hi cube.  Transporting these on 50' or 60' length wagons can be inefficient, with large gaps of empty air.

And for rail companies struggling to cope with demands and find new freight paths on a busy railway this can be a problem.  The length of a freight train is usually defined by the shortest loop it may need to use on any chosen route.  And operators want to squeeze as much payload into this maximum length as possible.

For this reason, VTG recently introduced the "Eco-fret" which is a twin or triple wagon with a 40' deck and can carry the optimum number of 40 containers in a standard train length.  These are in service with Freightliner, GBRf and DB.  WH Davis also introduced some similar wagons, for DRS,  but I understand they are out of service at the moment due to deck vibration issues that led to a derailment.   Both of these are very new design and not available RTR yet, though Dapol have the Davis version in development in OO.

Apologies for the essay, but wagons interest me more than anything else!

HTH

Cheers

Ben A.



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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #32 on: October 27, 2016, 07:12:55 PM »
Are you getting all this @brooksy?

Not seen since June 2015....in any event I'm learning something!!  Thanks Ben.  ;)

Cheers  Jon  :)
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Offline VoyagerBen

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #33 on: October 29, 2016, 10:15:24 AM »

Hi Brooksy,

On the prototype, the original concept was for containers in 20', 30' or 40' lengths, and the original Freightliner wagons (FFA inners, FGA outers) had 60' decks with spigots at the ISO standard positions.

The original Freightliner wagons are available as inners from Farish, but are rather dated now with generic bogies and relatively low detailing, but with some work can be made passable.

In the 1980s more wagons were built with 60' decks by Standard Wagon and Rautaruukki of Finland.  These were coded PFA initially, now KFA, and the Finnish versions (of which there were far more) are being offered by Revolution Trains.  It is hoped that first samples will be on show at this year's Warley show. For more information there is a thread in the crowdfunding section of the forum, with CAD images.  KFAs are still in use.

Over time, intermodal traffic increased and diversified.  New containers and swap-bodies (like containers but with canvas sides) were introduced at 45' length.

By the early 1990s, the railways needed wagons more appropriate to these, and the Arbel FIA multi-fret twins were built.  These are the wagons made by Farish, and feature 50' decks.

The AAE-built megafrets as offered by Dapol are of a similar vintage and fill a similar role, but have the advantage of an ultra-low deck height, so they can carry taller containers.

A batch of the same wagons, but with 60' decks, were built for Railfreight Distribution (subsequently Freightliner) and coded FSA/FTA depending on whether they are inners or outers.  These are not available RTR or as kits but would be *incredibly* useful.

Also in the early 90s containers started to get taller - and the so called "hi-cube" arrived.  (These are also in development with Revolution Trains and C-Rail intermodal.) The taller containers were out of gauge on most wagons, apart from the megafrets, so "pocket" wagons were introduced, coded KQA, that allowed high cubes to be transported in a well between the bogies.  These were available RTR from ATM in about 2004-6 but are long defunct.  Dapol offer this model in OO and I have had a long-running campaign to get them to shrink it to N, as in my view they are a very attractive wagon!

In the late 90s and 2000s, as intermodal traffic exploded, other new designs appeared.

EWS had their own version of a pocket wagon - the FAA - built with flat centre well.  This is not available RTR.

They also built the FKA "Euro-frets" designed for swap bodies and high cubes.

Others included the spine wagons for EWS coded FCA and not available, the FEA-B twin wagons available from Dapol and in use with Freightliner, GBRf and, briefly, Fastline freight; these ones are now with DB.

Although 45'containers and swap bodies are important for internal or rail/road intermodal traffic, the vast majority of containers are the 40' hi cube.  Transporting these on 50' or 60' length wagons can be inefficient, with large gaps of empty air.

And for rail companies struggling to cope with demands and find new freight paths on a busy railway this can be a problem.  The length of a freight train is usually defined by the shortest loop it may need to use on any chosen route.  And operators want to squeeze as much payload into this maximum length as possible.

For this reason, VTG recently introduced the "Eco-fret" which is a twin or triple wagon with a 40' deck and can carry the optimum number of 40 containers in a standard train length.  These are in service with Freightliner, GBRf and DB.  WH Davis also introduced some similar wagons, for DRS,  but I understand they are out of service at the moment due to deck vibration issues that led to a derailment.   Both of these are very new design and not available RTR yet, though Dapol have the Davis version in development in OO.

Apologies for the essay, but wagons interest me more than anything else!

HTH

Cheers

Ben A.

Fantastic knowledge Ben, really helpful.

In all honesty I don't know much about container freight and originally I wasn't going to model it on my layout. I was going to focus on passenger and aggregates. That is until recently when I saw container traffic on the line between Leeds and Sheffield which I am modelling. This is coming up from the south going to either Wakefield Europort or Leeds Freightliner Terminal.

From seeing this and looking on Youtube I have an idea of the "type" of wagon I need. I have, based on what is available and what looks similar to what I have seen, decided to preorder some KFA wagons from Revolution Trains and preorder some FIA wagons from Graham Farish (377-368). The latter come with 45ft Asda containers which I am hoping to swap.

I have also identified which shipping companies to model, and I am acquiring suitable 20ft and 40ft containers for the KFAs (Revolution and Farish). Just to double check, in the real world, KFA's can carry 40ft hi-cube containers?

I am also sourcing suitable containers for the FIA's. As mentioned, the FIA's from Farish come with 45ft containers so I am hoping that these can be swapped to 40ft containers. Also, in the real world would FIA's be used to haul 40 or 45ft hi-cube containers? I ask because I can only buy hi-cube containers for the shipping companies I would like to run.

Many thanks,
Ben.

Offline westie7

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #34 on: October 29, 2016, 11:08:07 PM »
Ben,

Can I pick your intermodal wagon knowledge and ask if you recognise this one. Looks like the Arbel FIA but a single with buffers both ends

https://www.flickr.com/photos/tutenkhamunsleeping/5123174548/in/album-72157624975532925/

rgds
Mark

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #35 on: October 30, 2016, 09:36:15 AM »
Out of interest what are 45' containers used for. When I used to drive HGVs many moons ago the maximum trailer length was 40' unless it was a STGO movement.

Geoff

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #36 on: October 30, 2016, 10:23:42 AM »
Geoff

The supermarket curtain side swap bodies (Tesco) are all 45's as well as a fair amount of the rigid containers  (Asda). The trailers are still 40' and the 45's either overhang a flat trailer or the spine trailers have an additional pair of rear twist locks that extend out

Rgds
Mark

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #37 on: October 31, 2016, 08:17:08 AM »
Ben,

Can I pick your intermodal wagon knowledge and ask if you recognise this one. Looks like the Arbel FIA but a single with buffers both ends

https://www.flickr.com/photos/tutenkhamunsleeping/5123174548/in/album-72157624975532925/

rgds
Mark

Hi Mark,

Good spot.  I haven't noticed one like that before.  Maybe a small number of single deck variants were built for flexibility?

My curiosity is piqued - I will see if I can find out more.

Cheers

Ben A.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2016, 09:04:19 AM by Ben A »



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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #38 on: October 31, 2016, 08:21:47 AM »
Ben

Yeah I've been having a look between doing real work :)

The ends do not appear to be the same, the opposite end to the 90 isn't flat like FSA FTA but also not as high as the locomotive end.

Puzzling

Rgds
Mark

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #39 on: November 01, 2016, 11:03:18 AM »

Found UIC wagon code Sfgmss for a Multifret single IFA
(As opposed to the twin Sfggmrrss)
but no sign of any photos

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #40 on: November 18, 2016, 07:32:27 AM »
Hi,

I was wondering if anyone can tell me if the Graham Farish 40ft containers (e.g. 379-350A) which are sold separately to wagons, fit on the Graham Farish Intermodal Bogie Wagons which come with 45ft wagons (377-352A)?

Also, do Dapol 45ft containers (e.g. NB-077E) fit on the Graham Farish Intermodal Bogie Wagons?

Many thanks,
Ben.

Hi all,

To answer this question, I have purchased a Farish Intermodal Bogie Wagon (377-366 to be exact) and have looked at fitting the 20ft and 40ft Farish containers (sold separately to the wagons).

The 20ft containers fit and can be easily secured onto the wagon, because they have pegs on each corner of the container, which lineup with securing holes on the wagon.

However, although the 40ft containers fit based on dimensions, they do not have pegs on the underside corners so cannot be secured to these wagons in this way. They do have some pegs on the underside, but these pegs do not lineup to the wagons in question, rather are for securing the containers to Farish 63ft Bogie wagons e.g. 373-457.

Out of interest how do you secure containers to wagons? Bluetac has already been mentioned, do people use double sided sticky tape? Superglue the containers onto the wagons? Or glue tiny pegs to the corners of the container?

Many thanks,
Ben.

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #41 on: November 19, 2016, 06:38:02 PM »
HI All

Tape or tacky wax is good for a semi permanent fixing onto the wagon.

Regards Arran

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Re: Which container wagons
« Reply #42 on: November 19, 2016, 08:16:55 PM »
Hi Arran,

Thanks for your reply, I'll buy some tacky wax!

Regards
Ben.

 

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