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Author Topic: Bachfar New Mark 2F Coaches  (Read 4643 times)

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Online crewearpley40

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Re: Bachfar New Mark 2F Coaches
« Reply #45 on: December 03, 2019, 06:47:12 PM »
If interested in detail differences  google, type in Mk2d and Mk2e differences. Mk 2 Air conditioned coaches - detail- differences  see rmweb. Lengthy article from 25 / 2 / 2013. Photos http://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/Coaches/Mk2-coaching-Stock. See michael harris BR Mk2 coaches book ISBN 978-1-898-43-48-7 .type that google link, will place later in week. Talks about air con systems, where to spot vents, interior seats, toilets where they were located, colours of gangway doors, where to locate different  motor alternators,  pressure ventilators ,  locating  roof vents, . Good luck. I digress off topic so am keeping to the bare info for interested parties to read any links. I cant put the link at the moment here sorry laptop in works

Online railsquid

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Re: Bachfar New Mark 2F Coaches
« Reply #46 on: December 03, 2019, 11:58:15 PM »
That is an interesting question - clearly in OO there is space in the market for multiple versions of the same coaches as well as the different variants of Mk2.

I wonder whether there is sufficient demand in N to do say the Mk2 b/c/d/e - I'd love to see them produced.

I keep seeing threads along the lines of "Revlex to produce ZQX wheelie bin wagons" and (being terribly ignorant of wagonny stuff) am like "eh? and they want how much for what's that?" but sign me up for anything which rolled past during my mid-1980s spotting days at Birmingham New Street. I could even be persuaded to work out the difference(s) between Mk2 d/e/f variants. What's that? You're offering a Class 87/85/81 to go with them? Here, take my credit card. Sorry? A 116/117 DMU as well? Here, take my first-born.

Dunno whether that's enough to justify actually producing those things (especially when you've actually experienced my firstborn)...  :hmmm:

You have excellent taste in models - especially the DMUs. Do you have a layout thread?

Err yes, it's here and even has some EMUs on it,but the geographical location is not terribly relevant to the context of this thread. My British DMU/railcar collection is here.
Takahachikawa - Japanese and other trains

Birmingham Knotmore Street - (ex) GWR mainline through the Midlands

Online Chris Morris

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Re: Bachfar New Mark 2F Coaches
« Reply #47 on: December 04, 2019, 07:49:19 AM »
I like to run trains that are correct for era and location. I would like some air conditioned mk2s but I really don't care what sub type they are .
I did consider dropping some Dapol mk3s into a rake because they are better value but they are just wrong for my era and location. I'll wait and buy some overpriced Farish mk2s.

Online njee20

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Re: Bachfar New Mark 2F Coaches
« Reply #48 on: December 04, 2019, 07:51:18 AM »
Why are they overpriced?

Online crewearpley40

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Re: Bachfar New Mark 2F Coaches
« Reply #49 on: December 04, 2019, 11:22:52 AM »
know the difference between the MK2d, MK2e and MK2f coaches (1st and 2nd class


Mk.2d &e coaches had an air-conditioning system that was, effectively, added to the earlier pressure ventilation system. The Mk.2f coaches had a redesigned system that was simpler and more reliable and meant fewer boxes underneath; also slightly different vents on the roof. Most Mk.2fs had Mk.3 style seats (orange First and light blue Second), though some TSOs were fitted with the Mk.2 type (dark blue). Mk.2d coaches had the large toilets like Mk.2b & 2c coaches, Mk.2e & f had smaller toilets. Externally this only made a difference on the TSO where the toilet windows were either both on the same side for Mk.2d or diagonally opposite corners on Mk.2e & 2f. Blue/grey coaches probably would still have their original interior colours. Folding gangway doors in the corridor connections were orange/red on Mk.2d and cream on Mk.2e & 2f.



Mk2ds had wood panelled decor whilst Mk2e/f moved to (generally white or off-white) formica. The Mk2d variant also included first class vehicles with compartments as well as some with open saloons. Mk2e/f were all open saloons.


In case you were wondering why they changed the toilets, this was to enable two extra seats in the TSOs, or one in the case of BSOs. This brought them into line with the Mk.1, Mk.2 and Mk.2a coaches which made seat reservation easier for booking staff as there was a full compliment of seats.

Incidentally, the wood finish used up to Mk.2e coaches was genuine wood veneer, not wood patterned plastic while the white plastic panelling in the Mk.2fs had a stippled finish that used to get grubby looking around arm level quite quickly


To summarise the exterior differences:

 

First Open

 

All FO coaches have both the toilets on the motor alternator (m/a) side (the large cylinder by the left hand bogie).

 

All Mk2d and Mk2e FO stock have a pressure ventilation cabinet under the fourth window from the right on the m/a side, MK2f FO stock do not have this cabinet. Mk2d 3170 - 90/3211 - 16, all of Mk2e and Mk2f 3276 - 3220/3357 - 81 have Stones air con equipment with 2 small fans on the non m/a side. Mk2d 3191 - 3210 and Mk2f 3321 - 3356/3382 - 3439 have Temperature Ltd air con equipment with one large fan on the non m/a side.

 

Second Open

 

All Mk2d TSO coaches have both the toilets on the motor alternator (m/a) side (the large cylinder by the left hand bogie). Mk2e and Mk2f TSO coaches have the toilet to the right of the passenger windows on both sides.

 

All Mk2d and Mk2e TSO stock have a pressure ventilation cabinet just to the left of the fourth window from the right on the m/a side, MK2f TSO stock do not have this cabinet. All Mk2d TSO stock (except 5653) and all the Mk2e TSO stock have Stones air con equipment with 2 small fans on the non m/a side. All Mk2f TSO stock (and Mk2d 5653) have Temperature Ltd air con equipment with one large fan on the non m/a side.

 

Brake Second Open

 

All Mk2d and Mk2e BSO stock have a pressure ventilation cabinet just to the left of the fourth window from the right on the m/a side, MK2f BSO stock do not have this cabinet. All Mk2d BSO stock and all the Mk2e BSO stock have Stones air con equipment with 1 small fan on the non m/a side. All Mk2f BSO stock have Temperature Ltd air con equipment with one large fan on the non m/a side.

 

First Corridor

 

Only Mk2d FK stock was made therefore they have a pressure ventilation cabinet under the fourth window from the right on the m/a side and Stones air con equipment with 2 small fans on the non m/a side.

 

Brake First Corridor

 

Only Mk2d BFK stock was made therefore they have a pressure ventilation cabinet under the fourth window from the right on the m/a side and Stones air con equipment with 1 small fan on the non m/a side.

 

 

Mk2d FO and FK stock have two roof vents at the non roof panel end and one vent on the non toilet side (and a water tank filler) at the roof panel end. All other FO stock have two vents at the non roof panel end and one vent at the roof panel end on the non toilet side.

 

Mk2d TSO stock have two roof vents at the non roof panel end and one vent on the non m/a side (and a water tank filler) at the roof panel end. Mk2e and Mk2f TSO stock have one vent at the roof panel end on the non m/a side and at the non roof panel end they have one vent offset nearest to the m/a side and another vent on the centre line and nearer to the centre of the coach. Mk2e TSO stock up to 5804 had water fillers at each end on the roof.

 

Mk2d BFK and the Mk2d and Mk2e BSO stock stock have one roof vent at the roof panel end on the non toilet side and a water tank filler where the other vent would be. Mk2f BSO stock have one vent at the roof panel end on the non toilet side.

 

Mk2d FO stock before 3189, all Mk2d TSO stock, all Mk2d BSO stock, Mk2d FK stock before 13585 and Mk2d BFK stock before 14162 had bump stops on the doors, all other air con stock had no bump stops. Mk2d stock, Mk2e BSO and Mk2e TSO stock up to 5852 had door windows deeper than the passenger windows. Mk2e FO, Mk2e TSO stock from 5853 and Mk2f stock had door windows the same depth as the passenger windows (but door swaps did occur!).

 

Finally! Mk2d and Mk2e stock have friction dampers on the bogies, Mk2f stock have hydraulic dampers.


The first problem is trying to identify what the existing body shells represent
One of the batches Farish made was completely incorrect, so I use these for revinyling
You can recognise this from the complete lack of windows for the toilets

Basically, a TSO has eight windows and a FO (or FK) has seven windows, and in each case (apart from the FK) the tables line up with the windows
Ignore the BSO and BFK for just now (I will explain later why)

The next stage is to line up the coach so that you are viewing each side
I use the heating extractor, which in the below photo is on the left hand side and appears on all three versions :
This is a Mark 2D
http://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/Coaches/Mk2-Coaching-Stock/Mk2D-TSO-5616-5740/i-Q9rSHg6/0/M/05737_ExeterSD_010406-M.jpg
Note that the toilet windows are on the same side, and at each end
On the other side there are no such windows

http://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/Coaches/Mk2-Coaching-Stock/Mk2E-TSO-5744-5906-AC2E/i-qBp7Cw2/0/M/05792_Exeter_140804-M.jpg
Note that the toilet windows have now moved to the same end, and the roof has been modified to match this

http://www.flickr.com/photos/60854097@N06/7726870008/
Again in the same view, counting the windows shows this was originally a FO
This is a Mark 2F, there is less equipment on the underframe

Turning to the other side now
(I am unable to find a photo of a TSO just now, but this is suitable for the underframe
http://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/Coaches/Mk2-Coaching-Stock/Mk2D-FO-3174-3188-AD1D/i-x7gD872/0/M/03182_ExeterSD_160607-M.jpg
You will note how similar this is to the Graham Farish underframe
Also note the lack of toilet windows on this side

http://www.railwayscene.co.uk/photo/8169
This is a Mark 2E, note the location of the toilets
You will now note this looks almost identical to the Graham Farish underframe

Finally is this one :

http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/2206508593/
This is a Mark 2F, note the location of the toilets
Note the single larger fan

Moving on to the BSO and BFK
Due to the handbrake some of the electrical equipment has had to be moved
It is very subtle, but refer to photos for each version

Here is a Mark 2E BSO, and note this only has the single fan, where the earlier photo above has two
http://www.railwayscene.co.uk/photo/4215

Online crewearpley40

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Re: Bachfar New Mark 2F Coaches
« Reply #50 on: December 04, 2019, 11:28:36 AM »
I also have notes re WR allocated 1980 stock :


n Jan 1980 the Western had the following:

 

Mk1 RBR 1644-59, 74, 1741, 5-8, 50, 2, 5, 1923-4, 44-8, 53, 4, 6

Mk2e FO 3242 - 3263

Mk2f FO 3278, 80-1, 4, 87, 3387-88, 3395-3417

Mk2d TSO 5619, 27, 41, 44, 56, 61, 77, 89, 95, 5702-4, 7-8, 17, 20-1, 25, 33-7

Mk2e TSO 5819-79

Mk2f TSO 6068-6099, 6101-6107, 6115-33

Mk2d FK 13562, 4-6, 79

Mk2d BFK 14140, 7, 52, 59

 

Only the Cornish Riviera and Golden Hind were HST services in the West Country at this time. It must be remembered that different cross country trains came from different Regions. Manchester and Liverpool to Plymouth and Penzance trains were Midland, the Edinburgh to Plymouth was Western, Newcastle to Bristol and Cardiff trains were Eastern as were the Newcastle to Poole trains.

 

By 1983 all the cross country HSTs had been delivered so the allocation on the Western was:

 

Mk1 RBR 1644-50, 71, 84, 95, 1923-4, 47-8, 53

Mk2f FO 3384, 3396, 3405-3417

Mk2d TSO 5619, 61, 77, 89, 95, 5703-4, 7-8, 17, 34-5, 7

Mk2e TSO 5751, 9, 63, 5-6, 70, 3-4, 7, 9, 82-3, 5, 97-9, 5803, 9, 11, 7, 46-79, 81-2, 5-6, 95, 5902

Mk2f TSO 6068-6099, 6125-32

Mk2d TSOT 6610-2, 5-8

Mk2d FK 13562, 4-6, 76, 9, 83, 7, 90-2, 13609-10

Mk2d BFK 14140, 59



for those on the EC and ECML note :


The 1979 Platform 5 Coaching Stock Pocket Book lists the following air-con stock on the Eastern Region:

 

Mk2D FO 3170-88

Mk2F FO 3278-81, 84, 87, 92, 3382-90, 3424

 

Mk2D TSO 5616-8, 20-6, 28-43, 45-58, 60-62, 64-76, 79-88, 90-3, 96-5702, 4-7, 9-16, 18-20, 22-25, 27-33, 37-39, 41-43

Mk2F TSO 5912, 26, 46, 55, 56, 6139-43, 54, 61, 69, 70

 

Mk2D BSO 9479, 81-83, 85-89, 92-95

Mk2F BSO 9511, 12, 14, 15

 

Mk2D FK 13562-84

 

Mk2D BFK 14139-61

 
With the arrival of more HSTs the 1980 Platform 5 Coaching Stock Pocket Book lists the following air-con stock on the Eastern Region:

 

Mk2D FO 3170, 71, 73-82, 84-8

Mk2F FO 3279, 92

 

Mk2D TSO 5616-8, 20-6, 28-40, 42, 43, 45-54, 56-58, 60, 62, 64-76, 79-88, 90-3, 96-5701, 5, 6, 9-16, 18, 19, 22-24, 27-32, 38, 39, 41-43

 

Mk2D BSO 9479, 83, 85-89, 92-95

 

Mk2D FK 13563, 67, 69-78, 80-84

 

Mk2D BFK 14143-46, 48-50, 53-55, 57, 58, 61


I also can post links for later years on LM region stock : Wembley, manchester longsight and wolverhampto Oxley plus Glasgow polmadie based mk2s

 

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