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Your Layout and Models => Scenery/Landscaping => Water => Topic started by: dannyboy on January 21, 2017, 08:14:03 PM

Title: Cheap water effects
Post by: dannyboy on January 21, 2017, 08:14:03 PM
I have had a quick search and can find no reference to the following - if I have duplicated another post, my apologies.

The latest 'Model Railway Scenery' newsletter makes reference to a way of making water effects on the cheap, certainly compared to 'Woodland Scenics' stuff!  Having had a look at the video, I thought it was quite informative.

http://www.railwaymodellers.com/m/vchannels/view/588/?mc_cid=9f384e72db&mc_eid=8fc05184f9 (http://www.railwaymodellers.com/m/vchannels/view/588/?mc_cid=9f384e72db&mc_eid=8fc05184f9)
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: port perran on January 21, 2017, 08:24:08 PM
Is it a river, canal, lake or sea you want to create.
My methos for a river/canal is a layer of thick paint, then 3-4 coats yacht varnish. Then more paint but not uniform in colour. Then another 3-4 coats of varnish.
Sea can be done the same but a thin coat of grouting to give a wave effect first before the initial coat of paint.
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: dannyboy on January 21, 2017, 09:11:42 PM
At this stage, none of the above. I was just bringing the link to the attention of anyone who might be interested.  :beers:
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: JasonBz on January 21, 2017, 09:27:51 PM
Use a lot of thin layers of PVA glue - its even cheaper :)
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: NeMo on January 21, 2017, 09:47:49 PM
I used this method on Quantoxhead Harbour, and it worked very well. It was also relatively quick (a few days) and really good fun to do. All you need is loo paper, suitable colour paint for the type of water being modelled*, and gloss acrylic varnish.

Cheers, NeMo

*Which for me was the Bristol Channel, so mostly shades of green-brown

Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: dannyboy on January 21, 2017, 11:05:51 PM
Use a lot of thin layers of PVA glue - its even cheaper :)

I used that method for the pond in the Station Masters garden on my coffee table layout, but as PVA is 'runny', I would think it would level itself before drying, therefore being no good for making ripples or waves  ???. The video linked to by NeMo shows an excellent way to make waves.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: JasonBz on January 21, 2017, 11:12:02 PM
Use a lot of thin layers of PVA glue - its even cheaper :)

I used that method for the pond in the Station Masters garden on my coffee table layout, but as PVA is 'runny', I would think it would level itself before drying, therefore being no good for making ripples or waves  ???. The video linked to by NeMo shows an excellent way to make waves.  :thumbsup:

Not all PVA is runny, some is quite firm - and if you sculpt it slightly when its going off you get good ripples.
I wouldn't want waves - they are the same as running people....they look wrong when static.

Ill grab you a picture of some estuarine water I did some years ago with PVA paint and gloss varnish tomorrow.

Here is a link to Chris Nevard's somerset rhyne done the same way.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/nevardmedia/7374640024/in/album-72157630070179725/ (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nevardmedia/7374640024/in/album-72157630070179725/)
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: silly moo on January 22, 2017, 07:19:13 AM
I've used the toilet paper method mentioned in the YouTube video and sealed it with decoupage varnish which is gloss and water based. In fact decoupage varnish products are worth investigating, here they are less expensive than Woodland Scenics equivalents. There is an adhesive called Modge Podge which can be diluted and used as an alternative to WS Scenic Cement.
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: NeMo on January 22, 2017, 08:26:53 AM
In fact decoupage varnish products are worth investigating, here they are less expensive than Woodland Scenics equivalents. There is an adhesive called Modge Podge which can be diluted and used as an alternative to WS Scenic Cement.

Interesting. My wife does a lot of decoupage, and has a number of products for that including Modge Podge. Will have to try some out!

Cheers, NeMo
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: MKP on January 22, 2017, 08:31:36 AM



Here is one using 2 part epoxy  skip to about 14 minutes in for the water part
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: daveg on January 22, 2017, 08:42:53 AM
Thanks Michael.

Here's another interesting vid:

https://youtu.be/GKxgdrpAXlw

Modge Podge is tested in this one.

Dave G
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: weave on January 22, 2017, 09:39:02 AM
Hi all,

Thanks for the topic and the links.

Can't watch them yet as 'er indoors is watching Columbo (can't interrupt Columbo on pain of death) but will later. Am sure will help for future projects.

Cheers weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: silly moo on January 22, 2017, 09:54:05 AM
I don't think the decoupage varnishes will be good for building up waves but they are good as an alternative to yacht varnish as a top coat as they dry quickly and clean up with water.
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: JasonBz on January 22, 2017, 12:32:02 PM
I don't think the decoupage varnishes will be good for building up waves but they are good as an alternative to yacht varnish as a top coat as they dry quickly and clean up with water.

Acrylic Medium would be good for small waves / ripples.

Virtually the whole "model railway scenic materials" market is just over priced artists materials - Most definitely get round an art shop (even Hobbycraft) and see what is available.
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: Sprintex on January 22, 2017, 12:38:58 PM
Just to help anyone who goes looking for it the stuff is called Mod Podge, not Modge Podge :thumbsup:


Paul
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: NeMo on January 22, 2017, 01:16:12 PM
Acrylic Medium would be good for small waves / ripples.

I tried this. 500 ml bottle cost about a tenner. "Golden" brand. Refused to set. Ever. Remained sticky. Gave up.

Perhaps I was unlucky, but I'd suggest trying a little bit from someone who already uses the stuff before going out and buying a bottle. It isn't cheap!

Cheers, NeMo
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: daveg on January 22, 2017, 01:20:12 PM
Thanks for the tip, Nemo.

I was in our local Hobbycraft (Wychbold) this morning but only found Mod Podge. No sign of clear cast resins or the like so will go hunting online.

Dave G
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: JasonBz on January 22, 2017, 01:33:13 PM
Acrylic Medium would be good for small waves / ripples.

I tried this. 500 ml bottle cost about a tenner. "Golden" brand. Refused to set. Ever. Remained sticky. Gave up.

Perhaps I was unlucky, but I'd suggest trying a little bit from someone who already uses the stuff before going out and buying a bottle. It isn't cheap!

Cheers, NeMo

I have used it lots, in its intended use....
What you describe sounds like the application of a too thick layer - it has to be thin; like 1.5mm or less thin.
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: JasonBz on January 22, 2017, 01:44:09 PM

There is some PVA / Paint / Gel Medium / Varnish water here...
its literally just snapped as it came out of storage, so could do with a new coat of varnish to look wetter.
Even so, it still looks something  like estuary water at slack tide

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/47/4585-220117134018.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=47742)
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: NeMo on January 22, 2017, 01:48:07 PM
I have used it lots, in its intended use....
What you describe sounds like the application of a too thick layer - it has to be thin; like 1.5mm or less thin.

Exactly my thoughts. But nope, literally putting it on with a brush. Just didn't set.

Maybe I had a bad batch or something.

Cheers, NeMo
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: silly moo on January 22, 2017, 03:30:24 PM
Modge Podge as opposed to Mod Podge is what we get here so I suspect it's some sort of trademark issue, so if you are looking for it online search for both.

I agree with JasonBz that some of the things we use are just more expensive versions of other craft materials. It's worth looking at artists materials, craft and wargaming materials for alternative products and techniques. As the YouTube clip shows you can even use nail products  :D I have a stock of cheap powder eyeshadows that I occasionally use for weathering.
Title: Re: Cheap water effects
Post by: dannyboy on January 22, 2017, 07:50:04 PM
In the video referred to in the OP, the bloke is doing a comparison of cheaper alternatives to Woodland Scenics stuff. One of the things he tests is Modge (?) Podge. His recommendation is 'Evo-Stick 007 Crystal', but each to his/her own. 
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