Import Duty etc On Goods From UK After 1 January 2021

[njee20]

For UK imports from the horse's mouth:-

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/notice-143-a-guide-for-international-post-users/notice-143-a-guide-for-international-post-users

I love all the references to "toilet waters" in there. Are we going to translate all french phrases and names now?!

[Jim Easterbrook]

For UK imports from the horse's mouth:-

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/notice-143-a-guide-for-international-post-users/notice-143-a-guide-for-international-post-users

I love all the references to "toilet waters" in there. Are we going to translate all french phrases and names now?!

Looks like a fait accompli.

(Actually, I think customs and excise have used the English for a long time, trying to think back to what it said on the "nothing to declare" allowances posters.)

[carlmt]

As a small trader - admittedly not of model railway items but R/C scale ships - this is going to hit us with EU customers.

We dont charge VAT as we are under the threshold and it is not worth the hassle.  To date, our EU customers have paid the same price for their kits as UK customers.  No longer going forward - EU customers are going to be clobbered by their own VAT plus other charges on import into their own country, thereby increasing the real price of our kits by circa 20% (anything from £100 to £150 extra!!).

Might as well shut up shop - EU customers were over 60% of our business...........

[Paul J]

I have taken a look at DM Toys this morning.

When you switch to UK delivery, the VAT at 19% is removed from the listing but the price stays the same. So, unless I am missing something, I presume that I will effectively be charged VAT twice with compounding when I pay import VAT.

[Adam1701D]

I am concerned about the impact this will have on our hobby. Luckily the majority of my products count as "Printed Material" and can be sent as letters. Buying items from European suppliers, such as Shapeways is a worry, particularly as I intend to branch out into more continental items in 2021.

Hopefully, level heads will prevail on both sides and we can move to a more beneficial trading relationship down the line.

[Paul J]

I tested the Modelbahnshoplippe website. It looks like they knock off the VAT properly at checkout.

Trains160 does not knock off VAT, but I know that Lionel Barbier is more of a one man band so I would not expect that facility on that site just yet. I can ask him about it in due course if needed as he is a good guy.

The reason we have to do this is because the UK did not ask to be included in the customs union and single market in order to end freedom of movement which is an indivisible part of the single market. This is a simple statement of fact; whether it is worth it or not is entirely down to the UK government and electorate. But no point in arguing about it here.

[Paul J]

I checked DMToys before Brexit and this seems to be their normal procedure for non-EU/EEA countries. I don't see how it is not a straightforward rip-off on their part and not part of a transitional policy. Knocking off VAT properly should not be difficult with propriety website software.

If there is no VAT charged as it is part of the price charged, then there is nothing to reclaim when importing surely?

I agree that we should not judge smaller operators yet, as I hope I made clear! 😊

[woodbury22uk]

I think the DMToys position will become the default position for many EU hobby retailers selling (in the past) to the UK, so effectively a 20% price increase and a higher shipping charge, in line with their previous policy for selling outside the EU. It will probably affect their trade to a  small extent especially if one or two like Modelbahnshop Lippe break ranks. It could also help some of the UK retailers of continental items who will find themselves with a 15% price advantage over the EU sellers.

To some extent it will depend on the size of the order, whether it exceeds the free threshold for VAT/Duty, and the extent to which VAT is charged on imports from the EU. Choice of carrier might also influence whether VAT is charged.

[ntpntpntp]

Starting to see ebay listings from Europe with "20% VAT will apply" especially those for one or two French sellers, whilst others saying the 20% VAT is included in the price.  The "Postage and Payments" tab gives the info.

[edit] Also seen the 20% will apply on a few listings from Russian Federation.

[njee20]

Yes, I've seen "20% VAT will apply" on eBay listings too.

Not sure I understand the DM Toys position - are you saying they remove the 19% VAT, and then conveniently charge 19% 'fees' to cover the additional admin...? That seems ludicrous.

[jpendle]

Not sure I understand the DM Toys position - are you saying they remove the 19% VAT, and then conveniently charge 19% 'fees' to cover the additional admin...? That seems ludicrous.

No, they list an item at 100 euros (for example) and say that this includes German VAT at 19%, if you then set the delivery country to a non EU/EEA destination then the price remains the same with no mention of VAT. So either, they are paying too much VAT to the German VAT man, or they don't have any competitive pressure to deduct VAT for non EU customers.

All the retailers I use in the UK have always deducted VAT for non EU purchases, I have come across one or two small shops that don't, so I don't use them. The 16.66% discount on my purchases more than covers the shipping to the US.

Regards,

John P

[woodbury22uk]

Starting to see ebay listings from Europe with "20% VAT will apply" especially those for one or two French sellers, whilst others saying the 20% VAT is included in the price.  The "Postage and Payments" tab gives the info.

[edit] Also seen the 20% will apply on a few listings from Russian Federation.

I think the 20% VAT feature will apply to Ebay purchases from outside the UK. It has appeared on Far Eastern listings from today.

[Paul J]

It looks like the story about HMRC forcing international sellers to register for UK VAT is true for transactions below £135.

Can't see many sellers doing that and continuing to sell small quantities to the UK...or that policy lasting long politically. But who knows?

[woodbury22uk]

It looks like the story about HMRC forcing international sellers to register for UK VAT is true for transactions below £135.

Can't see many sellers doing that and continuing to sell small quantities to the UK...or that policy lasting long politically. But who knows?

In the Ebay case they are probably acting as a registered agent, to embrace all sellers without their own UK registration.

[jpendle]

It looks like the story about HMRC forcing international sellers to register for UK VAT is true for transactions below £135.

Can't see many sellers doing that and continuing to sell small quantities to the UK...or that policy lasting long politically. But who knows?

This one really puzzles me. How on earth can HMRC enforce that?

E.g.  Fred's Trains in the US have a website and a UK resident decides to buy something from them. Fred duly sends the goods with a properly filled out customs form from the US Post Office.

What happens when the goods arrive in the UK? Does RM return the item as no VAT has been paid, do they contact the seller for the VAT, or do they contact the buyer?
Has anyone actually broken any law?

Regards,

John P