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Author Topic: DIY Controller circuit  (Read 708 times)

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Online Dorsetmike

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DIY Controller circuit
« on: June 26, 2020, 12:05:37 PM »
I've made a few of this design over the years excellent slow running control even locos like the Dapol M7 and some Union Mills, I've had locos take 5 minutes to cover 12 inches, but also get normal running speeds. Overload protection included.
See attached PDF.
 Components are still available from places like Farnell
https://uk.farnell.com/texas-instruments/cd4093be/ic-4000-cmos-4093-dip14-18v/dp/3120154?gross_price=true




« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 12:11:50 PM by Dorsetmike »
Cheers MIKE
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Online Bealman

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2020, 12:26:33 PM »
That's a good circuit for us straight down the line DC enthusiasts who deal with the real world rather than the digital one  ;)
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Offline ntpntpntp

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2020, 12:27:17 PM »
From memory that's not dissimilar to one I built back in the 70s as a 6th-form student.  I remember using it to run my little N gauge layout at a school event.
Nick.   2016 celebrating the 20th anniversary of "Königshafen" exhibition layout!
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=50050.0

Offline ronp849

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2020, 06:43:08 PM »
That's a good circuit for us straight down the line DC enthusiasts who deal with the real world rather than the digital one  ;)

Aha yes, but is that a real digital CMOS logic chip I see in the middle of it!!  :laugh:

Ron

Online Dorsetmike

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2020, 10:47:35 PM »
That's a good circuit for us straight down the line DC enthusiasts who deal with the real world rather than the digital one  ;)

Aha yes, but is that a real digital CMOS logic chip I see in the middle of it!!  :laugh:

Ron

Yup a 4093 quad nand schmitt, one part used as a pulse generator, but I would class the use of the CMOS chip as more a switching and logic function than true digital
Cheers MIKE
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Offline jpendle

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2020, 11:20:32 PM »
Yup a 4093 quad nand schmitt, one part used as a pulse generator, but I would class the use of the CMOS chip as more a switching and logic function than true digital

 ??? What do you mean by true digital? As far as I'm concerned a NAND gate is digital logic.

John P
Check out my layout thread.

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https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=39501.msg476247#msg476247

Online Snowwolflair

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2020, 11:26:01 PM »
Strictly digital is a special case of analogue, and you don't get much more analogue than a schmitt trigger.

the entire 4000 series were unstable at the best of times and only improved a little when they put anti static safety circuits on the pins about 1975.   We used to make touch switches with them

Offline jpendle

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2020, 11:35:50 PM »
Strictly digital is a special case of analogue, and you don't get much more analogue than a schmitt trigger.

the entire 4000 series were unstable at the best of times and only improved a little when they put anti static safety circuits on the pins about 1975.   We used to make touch switches with them

I agree, fundamentally everything is analogue, and if you forget that when designing "digital" circuits you're in for a whole world of pain.

I was really wondering what distinction was being made between switching and logic function and true digital.

And more in the context of a chat over a pint in the pub, rather than as a confrontational statement  :beers:

Regards,

John P
Check out my layout thread.

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https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=39501.msg476247#msg476247

Online Snowwolflair

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2020, 11:46:08 PM »
Strictly digital is a special case of analogue, and you don't get much more analogue than a schmitt trigger.

the entire 4000 series were unstable at the best of times and only improved a little when they put anti static safety circuits on the pins about 1975.   We used to make touch switches with them

I agree, fundamentally everything is analogue, and if you forget that when designing "digital" circuits you're in for a whole world of pain.

I was really wondering what distinction was being made between switching and logic function and true digital.

And more in the context of a chat over a pint in the pub, rather than as a confrontational statement  :beers:

Regards,

John P

I'm happy to buy  :)

The only real digital or digital switching I guess I have seen is probably integrated optics where optical paths were "switched" by electro optical effects at an atomic level not electronics.  That's the technology they use to multiplex the signals for the transatlantic optical fibres at speeds way beyond what electronics can achieve.

Offline jpendle

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2020, 11:51:47 PM »
But as @Dorsetmike was talking about a distinctly low speed CMOS part then I guess you'll have to buy him a pint as well :D

John P
Check out my layout thread.

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https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=39501.msg476247#msg476247

Offline themadhippy

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2020, 12:33:23 AM »
funnily enough ive just been playing with a  digital circuit,were the output can only be 1 (on) or 0 (off) i call it my living room light,it  contains 2 digital flip flops,or   2 way light switches.
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Online Snowwolflair

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2020, 12:37:31 AM »
funnily enough ive just been playing with a  digital circuit,were the output can only be 1 (on) or 0 (off) i call it my living room light,it  contains 2 digital flip flops,or   2 way light switches.

Apart from the Nanoseconds it takes for the resistance of the switch contact to go from no resistance to infinite resistance as the contacts separate atom by atom, that time period is analogue.  :D

Offline Platy767

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2020, 04:07:06 AM »
Ok. The 4093 is in stock at Jaycar, so being a controller junkie, (and you can never have too many controllers!) I will have to give it a go.

Thanks.
Mark

@Dorsetmike
Is the speed pot a Log Taper (A) or Linear Taper (B) ?
Thanks.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2020, 07:10:24 AM by Platy767 »

Online Dorsetmike

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2020, 12:24:46 PM »
@Platy767 linear,

@jpendle
Quote
I was really wondering what distinction was being made between switching and logic function and true digital.

Maybe splitting hairs, but to my way of thinking the overall function of the circuit is analogue, the 4093 conveniently reduces the component count, its functions could be done with discrete components but at increased cost, increased power consumption and space

« Last Edit: June 30, 2020, 12:26:07 PM by Dorsetmike »
Cheers MIKE
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Offline ronp849

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Re: DIY Controller circuit
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2020, 03:10:49 PM »
So what sort of Digital system would it be if the CMOS chip was replaced by a Micrcontroller.   :laugh3:

Whatever it is, I am going to build one.

Ron
 

 

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