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Author Topic: Help with Signal Design.  (Read 232 times)

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Offline AlanK

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Help with Signal Design.
« on: March 23, 2020, 10:41:06 PM »
Hi,

I'm after some help/inspiration for my current layout in progress, yep its a fairly standard double loop a design I kinda regret 6 months down the line, but its my modelling test layout before I start something more realistic in a couple of years time.

Era is 5 - 1955 - 1965 (approx) and am looking for where would be the correct placement and types for signals.. Would it be semaphore still or could I get away with lights?. I doubt I'll having these as working signals just there for aesthetics.

The inner short half curve on the inside right is for a factory/mill.
To the left there is a hill.

I'm guessing there should be one at the station for up and down, but is this at both ends.. and I have space at the goods sidings as well for one.. Have done lots of research but still scratching my head as to how signals work correctly :)
Returnee to Model Railways after 38 years, last time I was 10 and OO Gauge, now 48 and N gauge.

Online Bealman

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2020, 12:23:15 AM »
I model the same period, and my layout is all coloured light signals. Of course there were still heaps of semaphores around in that period.

I went for coloured lights 100%  because I read somewhere that some respected modeller had said that working semaphores are not really noticeable in this scale, and at the time, the Dapol ones were not around.

However since then, things have changed and some of our very own members have produced brilliant working models.
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

Offline chrism

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2020, 06:43:24 AM »
Just my thoughts, whether they are "correct" I'm happy to be corrected.

Only one "starter" home signal for each line at the station at the "far" end of each platform, unless you are considering joining trains in the station in which case there would be a home outside the station with a calling on signal to allow the second train to advance up to the first after having come to a stand outside the station. Of course, that would only work with diesel or electric multiple units since there is no way to allow the second train loco to escape first.

Definitely a ground signal home for the exit from the engine shed road. Not sure if there would also be one for entry to that road off the running line since it's a trailing turnout, if so I'd have thought that would also be a ground signal.

Definitely a home signal controlling exit from the goods yard, either a ground or post signal. Again not sure if there would be one at the trailing turnout for entry into the yard.

I think there would be signals (probably ground ones) protecting the crossover since it's a facing one. Possibly one each side of each line, or two stacked ground signals, to indicate if the road is set for straight through or for the crossover. If you use post semaphore signals they'd probably be junction ones on a bracket post, the higher arm for the running line being on a taller post than that for the crossover.

Personally, due to the era I model, I prefer semaphore signals - however, although I have made several of my post signals work I do draw the line at trying to make working ground disc signals. They are simply far too small and far too easy to decapitate when cleaning the track. Guess how I know that  :-[

« Last Edit: March 24, 2020, 06:44:30 AM by chrism »

Offline longbow

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2020, 08:02:12 AM »
If you want to make it more prototypical for the period, reverse the crossover and move it to the tunnel side of the goods yard exit and provide a long headshunt and perhaps a loop for the yard.

Offline AlanK

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2020, 08:47:45 AM »
If you want to make it more prototypical for the period, reverse the crossover and move it to the tunnel side of the goods yard exit and provide a long headshunt and perhaps a loop for the yard.

Yep, so many things I would have done differently if I could start again... Next layout will be much more prototypical.. Unfortunately I've done too much to the layout to consider moving track now.. This forums been great for helping me understand how it should be.. For now I'm practising modelling skills on this layout until I can decide on a final plan for layout #2 :) thanks for the advice.
Returnee to Model Railways after 38 years, last time I was 10 and OO Gauge, now 48 and N gauge.

Offline AlanK

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2020, 08:49:42 AM »
Just my thoughts, whether they are "correct" I'm happy to be corrected.

Only one "starter" home signal for each line at the station at the "far" end of each platform, unless you are considering joining trains in the station in which case there would be a home outside the station with a calling on signal to allow the second train to advance up to the first after having come to a stand outside the station. Of course, that would only work with diesel or electric multiple units since there is no way to allow the second train loco to escape first.

Definitely a ground signal home for the exit from the engine shed road. Not sure if there would also be one for entry to that road off the running line since it's a trailing turnout, if so I'd have thought that would also be a ground signal.

Definitely a home signal controlling exit from the goods yard, either a ground or post signal. Again not sure if there would be one at the trailing turnout for entry into the yard.

I think there would be signals (probably ground ones) protecting the crossover since it's a facing one. Possibly one each side of each line, or two stacked ground signals, to indicate if the road is set for straight through or for the crossover. If you use post semaphore signals they'd probably be junction ones on a bracket post, the higher arm for the running line being on a taller post than that for the crossover.

Personally, due to the era I model, I prefer semaphore signals - however, although I have made several of my post signals work I do draw the line at trying to make working ground disc signals. They are simply far too small and far too easy to decapitate when cleaning the track. Guess how I know that  :-[

This is great, has given me a direction to work towards. On the fence as to semaphore or lights. The latter might give me scope if change my era...
Returnee to Model Railways after 38 years, last time I was 10 and OO Gauge, now 48 and N gauge.

Offline chrism

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2020, 08:56:02 AM »
This is great, has given me a direction to work towards.

You're welcome - as I said though, it's just my thoughts. whether or not they are 100% correct I can't be sure.

Quote
On the fence as to semaphore or lights. The latter might give me scope if change my era...

Depends where you are modelling. Sections of the Cumbrian Coast line around me are still using semaphores even now in 2020, I dare say some other lines still are too.
We've even still got some manually operated level crossings too!

Online LASteve

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2020, 08:35:03 PM »
This is great, has given me a direction to work towards. On the fence as to semaphore or lights. The latter might give me scope if change my era...

I recently got some lighted signals from CR Signals and they are excellent and you can get them with feathers also for the junctions. Paul did tell me recently that he's scaling back the operation as the guy that used to build his signals has moved on, so if you order from Paul the lead times will be longer than previously, just a heads-up.

Online Bealman

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2020, 09:30:03 PM »
That's a shame.... hope he doesn't stop completely, that's a good product.
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

Online LASteve

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2020, 03:53:05 AM »
That's a shame.... hope he doesn't stop completely, that's a good product.
From what he said, he's not stopping, but just slowing down. His sound engineer has also moved on - I bought a fantastic CL33 DCC sound-fitted Dapol from him last year, I think it was the Legomanbiffo sound file. It's amazing, but Paul said he has to cut back now that it's just him. He might be slow, but the products are excellent

Online Bealman

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2020, 04:36:18 AM »
Thanks, Steve, good to hear.

I can't speak for the sound, but you are obviously impressed.

The signals are excellent.  :thumbsup:
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

Online LASteve

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Re: Help with Signal Design.
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2020, 04:40:08 AM »
Thanks, Steve, good to hear.

I can't speak for the sound, but you are obviously impressed.


I'll see if I can make a little video of the Crompton on the WIP layout. Excuse the mess if I do, it's a construction zone, but I'm trying to keep the branch line open so that I can watch a train or two go by while I'm working on the mainline, goods yard and TMD.

 

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