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Author Topic: Greetings!  (Read 600 times)

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Offline Granite

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2020, 08:55:00 PM »
Did someone say helix?

I'm going to cheat and buy a kit.

Welcome to the forum!

I need to start a build thread, but the Helix is coming along quite nicely 😎

« Last Edit: February 26, 2020, 10:17:19 PM by Granite »
Today, I will mostly be "doing the Hustle"

Offline Ted

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2020, 09:01:08 PM »
Looking good, what's the height between levels and what radius did you use?
Just call me Ted, or Edward... or Ed.

Just not Eddie.

Offline Granite

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2020, 09:08:23 PM »
Space is always going to be a constraint so I had to keep it tight, so Iíve used 1st and 2nd radius set track, so have a diameter of about 600mm with a 45mm lift on each circle.

Iím running analogue for the moment but the loco pulls a rake of six carriages without breaking a sweat so Iím confident that the helix will work for what I need 😁
Today, I will mostly be "doing the Hustle"

Offline Ted

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2020, 09:13:58 PM »
Space is always going to be a constraint so I had to keep it tight, so Iíve used 1st and 2nd radius set track, so have a diameter of about 600mm with a 45mm lift on each circle.

Iím running analogue for the moment but the loco pulls a rake of six carriages without breaking a sweat so Iím confident that the helix will work for what I need 😁

I'm not 100% sure of the maths but I think a 1st radius at 45mm would put you around 2.5% gradient.

To play it safe I'm going for 2nd degree and <2%, but I want to run loooong freight of 20+ wagons.

Have you tested your carriages on that 1st degree to make sure they're happy and don't kick each other off?
Just call me Ted, or Edward... or Ed.

Just not Eddie.

Offline Granite

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2020, 09:35:45 PM »
Yeah, itís as tight as you would want it, but I have good ascent and decent speeds in both directions without any derailments 👍
Today, I will mostly be "doing the Hustle"

Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2020, 09:47:16 PM »
I wouldn't fancy being the driver as I got quite queasy just watching it!
Hope you don't run any buffet/restaurant carriages :no: :sick2: ;)

Offline Granite

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2020, 09:49:56 PM »
Haha, yeah, a pretty good chance youíll lose your soup, probably in more than one way 🤢
Today, I will mostly be "doing the Hustle"

Online Merrylee

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #22 on: March 01, 2020, 09:48:01 AM »
Like the idea of the male / female hex stand-offs / pillars to support it rather than the screwed rod and loads of nuts and washers.

Ron

Offline Granite

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #23 on: March 01, 2020, 11:50:34 AM »
Like the idea of the male / female hex stand-offs / pillars to support it rather than the screwed rod and loads of nuts and washers.

Ron

Hi Ron,

I used 25mm long M5 grub screws too, they were cheap as chips and you dont have to spend an age threading nuts up and down every time you assembled and disassembled it.

Today, I will mostly be "doing the Hustle"

Offline impinabox

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #24 on: March 06, 2020, 06:06:10 PM »
Will you be running any steam locos up the helix or are you all diesel?  I've had problems with a Graham Farish Hall Class and an old Mallard where I found that 2.5% was about the point where they ground to a halt with just 4 coaches.  A Fairburn Tank and Class 108 DMU had no problems tho.
Mike

If it's worth doing, it's worth doing badly.

Current layout project: Halfway - https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=48537.0

Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #25 on: March 06, 2020, 09:17:06 PM »
As has been said the radius of the curves in the helix could have a huge bearing on what gradient can be OK. Any curve on a gradient has an effect

Offline Granite

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #26 on: March 07, 2020, 12:59:19 PM »
As has been said the radius of the curves in the helix could have a huge bearing on what gradient can be OK. Any curve on a gradient has an effect
Will you be running any steam locos up the helix or are you all diesel?  I've had problems with a Graham Farish Hall Class and an old Mallard where I found that 2.5% was about the point where they ground to a halt with just 4 coaches.  A Fairburn Tank and Class 108 DMU had no problems tho.

It is true that there are a million variables to how well the helix functions in my limited experience, for example i have a little class 08 that use as a sacrifical test loco ( just in case i get a little over zealous and lanuch a brand new 57 off the end of the track ) and that can struggle a little under loading going up the helix.

If i consider the differences between the class 57 and the class 08, it does start to paint a more interesting picture.

The Class 08 is an older loco with a five pole motor, technically a single set of driving wheels and very short wheelbase and quite light, all these things have proven that wheel slip is not uncommon.

The Class 57 on the other hand is brand new, has a much smother power delivery with its modern electric motor, there are two bogies driving 6 wheels each, the logo is considerably longer and nearly twice the weight, and the difference is chalk and cheese with the loco pulling a rake of 10 MK1 carriages uphill without much effort.

Steam loco's, im guessing, again in my limited experience would suffer the same issues as the little class 08, in that the driving sets of wheels are technically packed close together even the the loco and tender are quite long, so all the driving power is being applied to the rails in quite a small footprint. Do tenders drive also?

With that all being said  ( and again i could be wrong as these are my own personal observations ) i seriously intend to have some steam loco's on the layout. I love newer trains but to have a steam loco or two is an opportunity not to be missed.

I really do need to start a build thread...

Cheers!

Colin
« Last Edit: March 07, 2020, 01:02:38 PM by Granite »
Today, I will mostly be "doing the Hustle"

Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #27 on: March 07, 2020, 04:07:08 PM »

Steam loco's, im guessing, again in my limited experience would suffer the same issues as the little class 08, in that the driving sets of wheels are technically packed close together even the the loco and tender are quite long, so all the driving power is being applied to the rails in quite a small footprint. Do tenders drive also?

With that all being said  ( and again i could be wrong as these are my own personal observations ) i seriously intend to have some steam loco's on the layout. I love newer trains but to have a steam loco or two is an opportunity not to be missed.


Steam locos tend to have larger driving wheels than more modern motive power and some have traction tyres fitted to loco and/or tender for added haulage power, and the motor is either in the loco body or the tender (not both). When you have decided on which steam loco just ask the collective for confirmation of configuration.

Offline Granite

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #28 on: March 07, 2020, 05:16:36 PM »

Steam loco's, im guessing, again in my limited experience would suffer the same issues as the little class 08, in that the driving sets of wheels are technically packed close together even the the loco and tender are quite long, so all the driving power is being applied to the rails in quite a small footprint. Do tenders drive also?

With that all being said  ( and again i could be wrong as these are my own personal observations ) i seriously intend to have some steam loco's on the layout. I love newer trains but to have a steam loco or two is an opportunity not to be missed.




Steam locos tend to have larger driving wheels than more modern motive power and some have traction tyres fitted to loco and/or tender for added haulage power, and the motor is either in the loco body or the tender (not both). When you have decided on which steam loco just ask the collective for confirmation of configuration.

I knew there would be things that i hadn't even contemplated, traction tyres, eh? Thats worth a google  :thumbsup:
« Last Edit: March 07, 2020, 09:41:58 PM by Granite »
Today, I will mostly be "doing the Hustle"

Online Bealman

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Re: Greetings!
« Reply #29 on: March 07, 2020, 11:40:58 PM »
I find traction tyres a mixed blessing. If a loco throws one, it's a curse. The old Minitrix large steamers had them, and removing all the motion rods and linkages to replace them is the stuff nightmares are made of.
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

 

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