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Author Topic: Chinese Image N Gauge?  (Read 12189 times)

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Offline mathi

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2013, 11:20:47 AM »
Hi!

Here you have an update:
Yesterday I fitted decoder into this engine. It has no solderings points or marked spots for cutting connections on the pcb so you have to hardwire it completely. The manuf. claims it as "DCC-ready" but there is none except both motor contacts are potential free and can be used without any insulations.
The pcb is a real bear, tell you what!!!
Is ist totally covered with several diodes and caps but very hard to see or messure what they are good for. The pbc has three layers and this confuses much more.
First I had to find out which connections between rail power and pcb have been cut. Next step is to find right point for the white and yellow light switch wires.
Then I have to think over if there are so many diodes neccessary for DCC.
The loco comes with three LEDs on each side, two white and one red, which are parallel connected and have two resistors 670 Ohm in line to cut down power.
Actually I pore about it if it is a safe thing not to put LEDs in line but parallel.
Well, for me as someone who knows more than nothing about electronics is it a bull. Sometimes I thought I've seen the elefant!!!   :-)
This pcb is absolutely uncommon and new to me but relativized to the locos price I'm happy to kill the cat tonight.
I'm sure the next model is much easier to convert due to the experience I've earned :-)

BTW: chiping this engine is very worthwhile. I've put a DH10 decoder in it and the loco runs beautyful with it and creeps at throttle step 1 like slowmo!



« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 11:25:32 AM by mathi »
Best regards
Mathi

Lots of German, European and US Diesels and Steamers, a few worldwide exotics and a lot of UK stuff meanwhile most of them DCC.
In summary:
Everything has the right to run as long as I like it!

Offline OwL

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #31 on: November 24, 2013, 12:57:21 AM »
Excellent work Mathi and thank you for sharing your experiences
 :NGaugersRule: :thankyousign: :thumbsup:


Proud New Owner of Old Warren Traction Maintenance Depot Layout.

http://www.c58lg.co.uk/  http://www.c60pg.co.uk/

Offline mathi

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #32 on: November 26, 2013, 10:42:06 AM »
Hi!

I emailed the locos manufacturer and asking for some diagram or explanation how to convert the pcb to DCC and got the answer:
---Dear Mathias,
Thanks for your letter, we are currently doing DCC function tests for N scale DF4B, we will issue the DCC conversion parts.---
My other question was about a dealer in Europe:
---At present there is a German company is to communicate with us, maybe they can become our agent in germany.---

Well, lets wait and see......................!

OwL, did your check over your noisy loco and found something?
I have here a hint to make (any other loco as well) it much quieter:
After removing all the 4 skrews on the pcb you can lift it up (be careful about the bogies) together with the motor hanging on its wires out of the body. If the motor has a little, tiniest play in the pouch it will produce noise. So a small piece of glueing tape or kapton around the motor will let it sit tighter in the body slot and prevents of vibrancy while running.
If you can pull the motor easy out it is definitely to loose.


Best regards
Mathi

Lots of German, European and US Diesels and Steamers, a few worldwide exotics and a lot of UK stuff meanwhile most of them DCC.
In summary:
Everything has the right to run as long as I like it!

Offline OwL

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #33 on: November 26, 2013, 10:22:11 PM »
Thanks again Mathi :thumbsup:

This coming weekend I will look at dismantling the loco, following the great information you have provided and takinf photos of each stage to help other forum members.
I will also contact CMR direct and ask for a translated instruction leaflet.

I will keep you all updated,

Ta-a-bit, Dave :wave:


Proud New Owner of Old Warren Traction Maintenance Depot Layout.

http://www.c58lg.co.uk/  http://www.c60pg.co.uk/

Offline mathi

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #34 on: December 13, 2013, 02:44:14 PM »
Hello there!

Today came my latest order in and the locos are smooth and silent as the ones before either. I would compare them to my latest build GraFar Class 37's.

Best regards
Mathi
Best regards
Mathi

Lots of German, European and US Diesels and Steamers, a few worldwide exotics and a lot of UK stuff meanwhile most of them DCC.
In summary:
Everything has the right to run as long as I like it!

Offline scotsoft

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #35 on: December 13, 2013, 02:52:49 PM »
So an early Christmas present to yourself Mathi  :thumbsup:

cheers John.

Offline OwL

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #36 on: December 15, 2013, 09:46:06 PM »
A Bit poo :poop:........

I was having a fettle with the DF4B this afternoon. I oiled her up and ran her in, had the body off, all in order. Have discovered a different problem though.....

The couplings on the model are set 'higher' than the normal UK/euro/North American standard, meaning after changing couplers for the standard ones, I cannot couple up to any of my rolling stock as it is set too high. The bottom of the Chinese coupler only just skims the top of any other rolling stock I have tried including euro/UK/US outline rolling stock. I either have to 'butcher' the nice red port on the red cow catcher thingy at the front of the Chinese diesel (which I cannot bring myself to do!)or modify rolling stock to the height of the Chinese coupler, this will then limit what I can run.......

Only other option is fine gauge wire with its own obvious draw backs......


Proud New Owner of Old Warren Traction Maintenance Depot Layout.

http://www.c58lg.co.uk/  http://www.c60pg.co.uk/

Offline scotsoft

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #37 on: December 15, 2013, 10:06:49 PM »
You would just have to fettle one wagon at one end then use that as an adapter to attach the rest  ;)

Just like having a buckeye at one end and Rapido at the other, saves a lot of work  :angel:

cheers John.

Offline OwL

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #38 on: December 15, 2013, 10:48:02 PM »
Cheers John :thumbsup:

Luckily for me the Chinese Diesel will only be required to pull at most x3 wagons. I will explore adapting the coupling at one end of the wagon to be high enough to grap the rapido on the Loco.

My only criticism of this model is the couplers height and their housing. It is very basic/crude and does not allow alot of 'left/right' or 'round corners' give if that makes sense?

I'm planning a small layout for the sole purpose of showing these DF4B Chinese Loco's. Trouble is I have 1st radius curves. I think the rolling stock will come loose every time they are pulled round a bend through physically breaking links with the coupling of the DF4B!

I will just have to have a good old fettle until I find something that works........ :thankyousign:


Proud New Owner of Old Warren Traction Maintenance Depot Layout.

http://www.c58lg.co.uk/  http://www.c60pg.co.uk/

Offline mathi

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #39 on: December 19, 2013, 01:56:56 PM »
Hi!

A mate in my german forum fitted some couplers no. 04 made by the german manufacturer PEHO (http: www.peho-kkk.de) into this locos and he is very satisfied with them. I've no clou if and where they are available in UK but I'm sure there will be a way for you to get by 'em.
I fiddled with these absolutely not DCC-ready (just the motor contacts are insulated) locos a while to make the illuminations working properly. Although I'm not skilled in electronics I can handle a soldering iron and a multimeter-
So my way was to clean the whole pcb from everything like caps an diodes except the resistors. They can be used for the leds furthermore after measuring how they are connected I ignored almost all of the pcb traces (don't know the right words in english.
Since the blueish leds didn't find my delight I switched them to warm white 0603 which I had in my drawer and soldered new wiring onto them.
Then I grabbed my Dremel tool and cut the silver connections beside the copper pickup stripes at one side to insulate the board. The other side is the power source from one rail to the LEDs.
One end of the resistor chain is the solder point for the white, on the other side for the yellow decoder light switch. The other side is for the leds minus or cathode. The LEDs plus or anode come on the hot side track power. The red LED is connected via a long wire to the locos other end.
I hope you all can understand what I've done and I made it clear enough with my poor english.
After all the changing light works properly but if you don't the red light at the rear of a loco pulling some cars you can still pass on wiring the red LED.
If you can pass on lighting whatsoever the chipping is fast done. You just have to cut the described silver connectors on one side of the pcb, throw out the cap on pcb motor poles, remove wires from motor to pcb and solder orange and grey to motor and black and red to the copper pickups left and right and you are done!

Best regards
Mathi

Just forgotten: there is a lot of space under the locos hood, even a very thick decoder fits easily on top the motor.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 02:14:03 PM by mathi »
Best regards
Mathi

Lots of German, European and US Diesels and Steamers, a few worldwide exotics and a lot of UK stuff meanwhile most of them DCC.
In summary:
Everything has the right to run as long as I like it!

Offline Caz

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #40 on: December 19, 2013, 02:17:03 PM »
Thanks for posting Mathi, very informative, any chance of a couple of pictures of the finished modifications, seeing what has been done always helps.  Nothing wrong with your English Mathi, very good of you to join a forum not in your native language.
 :beers:

Offline mathi

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #41 on: December 19, 2013, 02:37:51 PM »
Thanks a lot for this tip of the hat!

I learned my few english words at the other side of the ocean and therfore I have to struggle with an english which is totally different in some parts.
Sorry but I must denie your quest for photos because I don't have a digicam no more and my cell phone makes awful photos particularly on small distances. Additionally my photo skills are more than below poor.
But if there are any questions please don't hesitate to ask me!

Best regards
Mathi
Best regards
Mathi

Lots of German, European and US Diesels and Steamers, a few worldwide exotics and a lot of UK stuff meanwhile most of them DCC.
In summary:
Everything has the right to run as long as I like it!

Offline mathi

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #42 on: December 19, 2013, 03:38:37 PM »
Hi!

For those who are interested in Peho couplers No. 4:

I send the producer (small business) an email and asked him for a retailer in the UK and he answered that there is none but he positively will send to UK premise is prepaid on his bank account and he will charge 4,50 Euro for a padded envelope (Maxibrief in German).

Best regards
Mathi
Best regards
Mathi

Lots of German, European and US Diesels and Steamers, a few worldwide exotics and a lot of UK stuff meanwhile most of them DCC.
In summary:
Everything has the right to run as long as I like it!

Offline OwL

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #43 on: December 19, 2013, 09:19:47 PM »
Excellent Mathi,

Many Thanks for sending the link to the retailer.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year for 2014 :beers:


Proud New Owner of Old Warren Traction Maintenance Depot Layout.

http://www.c58lg.co.uk/  http://www.c60pg.co.uk/

Offline mathi

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Re: Chinese Image N Gauge?
« Reply #44 on: December 20, 2013, 12:26:29 PM »
Hi!

Here is a link to the largest n-scale forum in Germany and the cmr-thread. In #37 are pictures of the new coupling. The originator claims no more decoupling not even in curves with them.
He just glued them in and carefully widened the slot in the shell at the lower edge down to the red paint in order to get more play for the coupler shaft:
http://www.1zu160.net/scripte/forum/forum_show.php?id=741116&start=1
In #29 you can find some photos of the genuine pcb, probably makes it easier to understand how I modified it for dcc lighting.

Best regards
Mathi
Best regards
Mathi

Lots of German, European and US Diesels and Steamers, a few worldwide exotics and a lot of UK stuff meanwhile most of them DCC.
In summary:
Everything has the right to run as long as I like it!

 

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