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Author Topic: The end of DJ Models?  (Read 24613 times)

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Offline Thorpe Parva

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #45 on: June 04, 2019, 04:09:05 PM »
Such a shame. I was looking forward to additional Mermaids plus the Sharks. Maybe these can be resurrected? I'll have to dig out the NGS Shark kits I had put on hold.

David

Offline acko22

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #46 on: June 04, 2019, 04:25:35 PM »
Hi All,

Well this is a bolt out of the blue, even after his ill advised announcement last month I wasn't expecting this!
While everyone tries to dissect the future I see no point as it could still go a number of ways and we need to see how CG and CO feel is the most viable solution and go from there.

He was offering a few models I would have liked some of the models he was offering and suggesting he was planning to do but, given previous history unless I could see it in the flesh and it was positive reviews I wasn't going to give him any monies.

Given past events with Mr Jones, I shouldn't be shocked by this really with him blaming everything and everyone else despite the only common factor been him and him alone! It was a matter of time before things came to ahead in my honest opinion!







Offline Bartercode

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #47 on: June 04, 2019, 04:29:29 PM »
Even if something can be recovered from this mess, confidence in DJM and its owner must surely be totally dead forever.

Just wondering how this affects Digitrains after their agreement to buy Kings - lets hope they didn't give DJM lots of money up front

Offline Snowwolflair

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #48 on: June 04, 2019, 04:31:57 PM »
Random thought.

Does anyone think this might be a pre-pack (an insolvency with a buyer in the wings).

This would explain the fuss over IP, as no buyer would step in until this was secure.

We shall see.

Offline Roy L S

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #49 on: June 04, 2019, 05:36:10 PM »

It'll be more interesting to see what happens to the tooling that does exist - Mermaids and the disputed class 17.

Steven B

And the Shark

Offline joe cassidy

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #50 on: June 04, 2019, 05:38:08 PM »
I don't know how things work in the UK but in France redundant staff get priority over other creditors.

Hopefully Dave was salaried by DJM so he will not be totally wiped out financially by the bankruptcy of DJM.

Offline Roy L S

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #51 on: June 04, 2019, 06:01:02 PM »
If a company is insolvent it cannot legally continue to trade, definition of "insolvent" being to be unable to meet their debts as they fall due. If this is the case here, unless there is an external injection of cash to provide liquidity (unlikely?) it looks to me as though the company is destined to be liquidated. Realisation of assets will depend on a number of factors, not least whether a Liquidator is in funds sufficient to pursue them. I suspect it will be very costly to pursue ownership of tooling in China.


Personally I am gutted for all those who appear likely to lose money, in some cases doubtless a not insignificant portion of their modelling budgets.

However, as has been mentioned elsewhere and I agree, it is not Crowdfunding that is the issue here, it is how professionally and diligently the process is managed that is the issue and if done well as it is with the likes of RevolutioN it is a great way to bring particularly niche products to Market.


Roy



Offline idlemoor

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #52 on: June 04, 2019, 08:30:02 PM »
Random thought.

Does anyone think this might be a pre-pack (an insolvency with a buyer in the wings).

This would explain the fuss over IP, as no buyer would step in until this was secure.


Those design registrations are complete moonshine, and anybody daft enough to look on them with envy and avarice is unlikely to be more successful in business than Mr Jones.
It's almost peaceful. No need to believe in either side, or any side. There is no cause. There's only yourself. The belief is in your own precision.

Offline Snowwolflair

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #53 on: June 04, 2019, 08:41:07 PM »
Random thought.

Does anyone think this might be a pre-pack (an insolvency with a buyer in the wings).

This would explain the fuss over IP, as no buyer would step in until this was secure.


Those design registrations are complete moonshine, and anybody daft enough to look on them with envy and avarice is unlikely to be more successful in business than Mr Jones.

Agreed, but if there is also a complete set of CAD to go with it (forget tooling),  a buyer (like a Mr Bachman) might offer 1 and guarantee to honer the customer deposits, a liquidator would look at it seriously as that could eliminate the majority of the creditor position.   I have seen worse positions than this work out.

Offline Roy L S

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #54 on: June 04, 2019, 08:52:40 PM »
Random thought.

Does anyone think this might be a pre-pack (an insolvency with a buyer in the wings).

This would explain the fuss over IP, as no buyer would step in until this was secure.


Those design registrations are complete moonshine, and anybody daft enough to look on them with envy and avarice is unlikely to be more successful in business than Mr Jones.

Agreed, but if there is also a complete set of CAD to go with it (forget tooling),  a buyer (like a Mr Bachman) might offer 1 and guarantee to honer the customer deposits, a liquidator would look at it seriously as that could eliminate the majority of the creditor position.   I have seen worse positions than this work out.

But the value of the CAD is negligible in the grand scheme of things and companies like Bachmann and Dapol will want to do their own development work from scratch. I'm also not sure why any company would take the risk of guaranteeing deposits with no assets of significant value on offer?



Offline Snowwolflair

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #55 on: June 04, 2019, 09:08:28 PM »
Random thought.

Does anyone think this might be a pre-pack (an insolvency with a buyer in the wings).

This would explain the fuss over IP, as no buyer would step in until this was secure.


Those design registrations are complete moonshine, and anybody daft enough to look on them with envy and avarice is unlikely to be more successful in business than Mr Jones.

Agreed, but if there is also a complete set of CAD to go with it (forget tooling),  a buyer (like a Mr Bachman) might offer 1 and guarantee to honer the customer deposits, a liquidator would look at it seriously as that could eliminate the majority of the creditor position.   I have seen worse positions than this work out.

But the value of the CAD is negligible in the grand scheme of things and companies like Bachmann and Dapol will want to do their own development work from scratch. I'm also not sure why any company would take the risk of guaranteeing deposits with no assets of significant value on offer?

Don't take "negligible" as no value, it's worth a lot especially if you own your own factories and have in house tooling.  DJ's portfolio of designs is larger than a years new  model releases for Farish and/or Dapol and to get that for the value of the deposits 67,500 (say 1000 models at 67.50) equal to two relatively junior staff salaries including NI, would be a good deal especially if you get a class 92 and a King, possibly a class 17 and so on.  Also the balance payments will be equivalent to the factory cost so it's a nil sum gain.

We just have to wait and see.



Offline Bartercode

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #56 on: June 04, 2019, 09:10:04 PM »
I get the impression that Dave was struggling to find customers for many of his proposed models, even under crowdfunding. That suggests to me that a manufacturer might do well to steer clear of such models funded in a conventional way - there just wouldn't be the sales for them.

Offline njee20

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #57 on: June 04, 2019, 09:39:56 PM »
I can't see a pre-pack working, I'm just not sure there would be enough of interest and taking on liabilities of disgruntled customers who risk being out of pocket isn't a compelling prospect. People are clearly pursuing methods to withdraw their funds, arguably you'd get an established customer base, but it's not one I'd be keen to take on.

The 92 is a white elephant because you've got Hornby doing the "trainset" model and Accurscale stealing a march on the high end one in OO, and obviously Revolution in N. It's also just some CAD drawings. Dave has a big portfolio for sure, but much of it is the same stage as my portfolio of models. There's zero value to a manufacturer of one man's intention to deliver a product at some indeterminate point in the future!

Offline Fardap

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #58 on: June 04, 2019, 10:30:48 PM »
One of the first steps they would take would be to put a holding page or message on the website.
Currently it is still live as are the pre orders on the dcc site. Maybe dcc are taking it on?
Shame it has happened but there seem to be a lot of models in the pipeline but not a lot being finished other companies have got each model to production before starting another.

Offline njee20

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Re: The end of DJ Models?
« Reply #59 on: June 04, 2019, 10:36:38 PM »
Nope, you can't actually place orders apparently, it says "no payment methods available" once you try to check out.

I imagine a holding message will go up shortly once the administrators are appointed.

 

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