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Author Topic: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18  (Read 247 times)

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Offline alangdance

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Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« on: February 08, 2019, 11:34:29 AM »
I have a Dapol Class 121 and would like to fit a Zimo MX618N18,
Dapol stated that I need 5 Function outputs if I want to use the light bar.
The Zimo MX618N18 states 4 Function outputs and 2 logic outputs.
I have not use a Next 18 before and can I use the 2 logic outputs for the last function output.
Are their any CVs I will need to change.

Any help would be most grateful.

Alan

Offline jpendle

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2019, 02:57:16 PM »
I believe you can but there are others here who can confirm this.

Regards,

John P

Offline Nigel Cliffe

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2019, 03:05:59 PM »
The NeXT18 specification for the socket in the loco is:
four normal functions
two logic level functions

The NeXT18S (sound) specification for the socket is:
four normal functions
two wires for speaker


So, IF Dapol have wired the 121 correctly, and already used up four light outputs (ie. they've separately wired various front/rear lights, rather than the usual N convention of connecting the front at one end to the rear of the other), then the only things left are the logic pins.   

So, IF Dapol want you to use those logic outputs, then it depends what they've done with the circuit board in the loco, and any connections to the light bar.   IF Dapol have wired it correctly, to use the 5th (and/or 6th) output of a NeXT socket, then Dapol should have included the necessary transistors (etc) to connect the logic-level 5th output of a NeXT decoder to the lights.     Then, its just plug&play and a matter of programming which function key you want to operate the fifth output.   They'll already be programmed to something from factory in the decoder - probably the F3 key for the fifth output and F4 for the sixth.

IF Dapol haven't done the wiring for the extra outputs on the NeXt socket, then I'd argue they've not fully implemented the NeXT18 scheme in their loco.



Offline Fardap

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2019, 03:18:01 PM »
There is a topic on this exact question from 2016 in the changes required on the Dapol Digest Forum - sadly the link to the PDF is broken, best bet would be call or drop them a line.

File named was [class 121-2 lighting guide_v1-0.pdf]

https://digest.dapol.co.uk/forum/n-gauge-models/class-121-122/8335-new-next18-class-121-lights-issue

Steve

Offline Fardap

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2019, 03:23:13 PM »
Both these may help with working out what changes between the Imperium (or Imperial if you believe the Dapol website :no:) and the ZIMO

https://www.dapol.co.uk/pdfs/imperium%20cvlist_1-0D.pdf

https://www.dapol.co.uk/pdfs/Imperium_instructions.pdf

Offline Nigel Cliffe

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2019, 04:42:21 PM »

The implication of the thread Fardap provides is that Dapol are using the first four outputs for the lights (which will be fine, once someone programs their decoder function mapping to do what they want, see below).   But it would be really nice to have the documentation for which there is no link.....

Then the other implications are that the light bar connects through a currently un-detailed method to the NeXT18 socket board, to use the fifth output.  Again that is fine, IF Dapol have correctly wired their loco board to allow connection of fifth output to the lighting bar. 

So, back to, IF Dapol have done the wiring correctly, then plug in the NeXT decoder from Zimo and it will work.  By default, FnKey0 will control lights at one end (directionally),  F1 will be one set of lights at the other, F2, the next light,  and F3 should be the fifth output, and thus the light bar.   


Sensible function mapping:   Decide what's needed (eg. should either headlights or tail-lights be directional,   Or should one type need independed (so reds at both ends).   Decide which function keys are wanted for each combination.   Bear in mind that a Zimo can have a global "all lights off" key, in addition to the individual lights.    Then do the function mapping - there's unlikely to be a combination of keys which isn't permitted on the Zimo decoder. 


- Nigel

Offline nookfield

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2019, 04:53:09 PM »
Dapol have used the following pins

F0F No.1 end white lamps
F0R No. 2 end red lamps
Aux 1 No. 2 end white lamps
Aux 2 No. 2 end red lamps
Aux 4 interior light control

Online Paul-H

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2019, 06:39:57 PM »
Hi

I used the LaisDCC Next18 decoder in mine as it was the only 6 function decoder I could find, it didn't work too well out of the packet but once I was pointed to the instructions Dapol posted for the 21 pin version and changed the following CV's to these values  CV33 = 5 CV34 = 6 CV35 = 10 CV36 = 9 CV51 = 24 CV52 = 0 it seemed to work fine.

Obviously those CV's are for the Dapol Imperium Decoders and as the LaisDCC decoder is the same decoder they worked.  They may not work with other makes of Decoder, but as the LaisDCC decoder is only 10 its worth a punt if all else fails, and the Next18 LaisDCC decoder is not that bad a decoder unlike the 6pin version which is only good enough to use as a function decoder.

Paul
Please excuse any poor spelling, I am Dyslexic, just think yourself lucky if you can actually read what I typed.

All tiepin as bean spell chequed on mi Pea Sea

Offline alangdance

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2019, 11:17:55 PM »
Dapol have used the following pins

F0F No.1 end white lamps
F0R No. 2 end red lamps
Aux 1 No. 2 end white lamps
Aux 2 No. 2 end red lamps
Aux 4 interior light control

Even through Dapol state these and what function they are map to the MX618 did not display the same as the manual (F0R brought on both forward white and red lamps).
I am not sure why Dapol has put all four lights on different Function. With a bit of playing around with the CVs in the function map I now have them working all correctly on F0 for both forward and reverse. Have not fitted a LED light bar at the moment so not sure how his will work.


Alan

Alan

Online Paul-H

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Re: Dapol Class 121 and Zimo MX618N18
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2019, 07:03:06 AM »
One thing to be aware of regarding the light bar.  Be prepared to paint over all the LED's as it's far too bright.and needs toning down to be more realistic.

Paul
Please excuse any poor spelling, I am Dyslexic, just think yourself lucky if you can actually read what I typed.

All tiepin as bean spell chequed on mi Pea Sea

 

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