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Author Topic: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model  (Read 38794 times)

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Offline red_death

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #390 on: May 17, 2018, 04:00:10 PM »
Rails asked if they could order 92s, I said yes but we haven't given them a price yet. 

Their customers might well be able to order them at those prices but whether Rails would get any from us at a price that makes them any money (or stops them losing money) is another matter!

So as I said - it was just someone at Rails being a bit keen to get them on their site.

Cheers, Mike



Offline monkey_brains

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #391 on: May 17, 2018, 05:13:22 PM »
Thanks for explaining Mike - not sure why but I was feeling a little put out earlier when I saw Rails were advertising them for that price having previously put my hand in my pocket and coughed up for a number of them through yourselves

Cheers

Richard

Offline mika

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #392 on: May 17, 2018, 08:52:06 PM »
That's probaly not the RevolutioN one, but DJM's version. IIRC he offered his 92 to retailers...

Oh, well...
I stand corrected... :confused1:

Offline Rabbitaway

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #393 on: May 23, 2018, 08:47:43 PM »
Mike

Thanks for your answer.

As said a number of times establishing the trust of the crowd funding supporters is key. Can we please have assurance that retailers will not be supplied models at a lower cost than those supporters paying up front. Therefore if Rails are willing to sell pre orders at cost that is their call. Your answer is not clear on this. I would suggest this is only fair as it is supporters that are funding the model and if retailers are given a margin below this we could even have models sold at a cost below the figure supporters have paid

 


Offline red_death

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #394 on: May 24, 2018, 01:14:16 AM »
I think that I've already answered when I said that we haven't set any price for retailers - higher or lower. 

I think that you can see the evidence from our other projects that we do not price for retailers at a lower price than crowdfunders nor would we want to.

However what is clear is that we can recommend a retail price to retailers but we can't force anyone to stick to it. Ultimately if a retailer chooses to take a loss e.g. as a loss leader we can't prevent that (though we can assess whether we want to supply further products).

As I said previously I think it is a slight mistake from Rails (which we've told them about) with someone just being over eager.



Offline Cape Town Trev

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #395 on: May 24, 2018, 04:47:00 AM »
I think that I've already answered when I said that we haven't set any price for retailers - higher or lower. 

I think that you can see the evidence from our other projects that we do not price for retailers at a lower price than crowdfunders nor would we want to.

However what is clear is that we can recommend a retail price to retailers but we can't force anyone to stick to it. Ultimately if a retailer chooses to take a loss e.g. as a loss leader we can't prevent that (though we can assess whether we want to supply further products).

As I said previously I think it is a slight mistake from Rails (which we've told them about) with someone just being over eager.

The question would be is the price sold to a retailer at least the crowd funder price?  Yes the retailer can sell at any price even below his cost price as any crowd funder could if they so wished. Would be nice if the retailer paid at a price above crowd funder but what would stop a retailer buying  in their own name and not that of the business (though this may be an issue for the business trading accounts).

Regards,

Offline njee20

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #396 on: May 24, 2018, 06:14:40 AM »
Why would they sell to retailers above the crowdfunders price? That would be very odd.

If they buy at the crowdfunder price they could obviously sell for the same, and make no money (or rather a small loss by the time you factor in their handling time etc), or they can add a mark up. If they want to sell as a loss leader (undercutting the crowdfunder price) thatís their prerogative, although that would also be very odd.

As I interpret it Mike is saying theyíve bought some at the standard price (as youíd expect) and currently have just stuck them on the website at the same price. As weíve seen with all retailers on other products this will likely increase so they make some money, otherwise itís a pointless activity for them.

Offline Ben A

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #397 on: May 24, 2018, 07:58:25 AM »
Hello all,

From the start we have made our models available to retailers who approached us - with the N TEAs it was just C&M in Carlisle and Collett's in Exmouth and since then more have been in touch.

If you look at the Rails listing for the Class B tanker the crowdfunder price was £19.50, they are selling for £26.95.  The Cargowaggon twins were £36 before we closed the order book; Rails ordered and though they don't have the models yet they are listing them for £49.50.

Just to be clear, we cannot dictate to any retailer what price they sell our models for.

But Rails are in business to make money.  I am certain, as Mike is, that this is a data-input issue at their end that will be corrected in due course.

And so far I am not aware of a single instance of anyone, via any retailer, eBay or anywhere else, buying *a single one* of our models for less than the original crowdfunded price.  This is a very clear principle for us - it's how we drive people to our projects in the first place and get them going.

It's is also worth bearing in mind that developing mutually beneficial sales with retailers can have advantages for we enthusiasts: we know there are some projects that have struggled (or may struggle in the future) where a commitment from a retailer to take, say, 250 models could be enough to make it happen.

Cheers

Ben A.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2018, 08:00:43 AM by Ben A »



Offline Karhedron

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #398 on: May 24, 2018, 09:39:15 AM »
It seems to me that the involvement of retailers is a good thing. It provides Ben and Mike with extra sales to help projects reach their targets and it provides an alternative purchase route for buyers who (for one reason or another) may not be comfortable with the idea of crowd-funding.

As long as crowd funders are not loosing out by purchasing directly from RevolutioN (and Mike has made it clear they are not), it seems like a win-win scenario.
Well, that's just not good enough. Some fount of all knowledge you are!  :no:  ;)

Offline longbow

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #399 on: May 24, 2018, 01:01:03 PM »
A good thing if retail sales are part of the marketing strategy and done in moderation so that there is minimal risk of crowdfunders feeling hard done by.

Offline njee20

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #400 on: May 24, 2018, 01:16:31 PM »
You obviously can't legislate against retailers selling at a loss (and undercutting the crowdfunded price) but why on earth would they do that? Particularly given the historic resale value of Revolution's products. Pretty unlikely that while you're on the RoS website you're going to buy more stuff to offset their loss.

It's clearly just enthusiasm to get them onto the site, I suspect someone's pressed the button by accident and the price will jump up in due course.

Online Intercity

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #401 on: May 24, 2018, 03:45:04 PM »
I would worry that the potential crowdfunders will step back and not put a pledge in if retailers are considered to be in the same group, people may be inclined to think ďI donít need to back this as ROS or Hattons will put in for 200 eachĒ

This isnít to say a retailer can not put in for said amount, but the target amount really needs to be achieved by crowdfunding as thatís the point of it.

Did the 92s reach their target goal before this ROS stuff was noticed?

I ask as a project such as the 320/321 being in jeapordy risks being hurt further if people start to think a retailer will pick up the slack
Support crowdfunding - itís the way forward

Revolutions class 321 needs your help, letís make it happen.

Offline njee20

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #402 on: May 24, 2018, 03:50:39 PM »
Yes, by about 18 months!

Online Nighthawk

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #403 on: May 24, 2018, 04:43:42 PM »
I've just found that Colletts are also listing the DCC ready variants, headlining the same crowdfunding price BUT, in their instance they include the statement "Pre-order date & price TBC".

That seems more reasonable.

John D

Offline Ben A

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Re: Revolution offers Class 92 electric in N as next powered model
« Reply #404 on: May 24, 2018, 09:17:02 PM »
I would worry that the potential crowdfunders will step back and not put a pledge in if retailers are considered to be in the same group, people may be inclined to think ďI donít need to back this as ROS or Hattons will put in for 200 eachĒ

This isnít to say a retailer can not put in for said amount, but the target amount really needs to be achieved by crowdfunding as thatís the point of it.

Did the 92s reach their target goal before this ROS stuff was noticed?

Hi all,

As has been pointed out repeatedly so I am not quite sure why it isn't getting through, in EVERY SINGLE CASE that a retailer actually has our models in stock the sale price is significantly higher than the crowdfunded price.  Just look at the websites and check for yourself!

And once the retailers run out the Ebay prices go crazy - someone told me the other week that a triple pack of our TEA tankers (original price £78) sold for £220.

So what if Rails come in with 200 orders for, say, 321s?  It means that those who missed out can still obtain the model, but it'll cost them around 30-50% more.

And those who stepped up and got the model over the line still got the best price.

Cheers

Ben A.



 

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