!!

Not Registered?

Welcome!  Please register to view all of the new posts and forum boards - some of which are hidden to guests.  After registering and gaining 10 posts you will be able to sell and buy items on our N'porium.

If you have any problems registering, then please check your spam filter before emailing us.  Hotmail users seem to find their emails in the Junk folder.


Thanks for reading,
The NGF Staff.

Author Topic: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche  (Read 153259 times)

jpendle and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline keithbythe sea

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 970
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2130 on: March 21, 2018, 07:16:15 AM »
Definitely a case of KBO Laurence. I wish you success in sorting out the running problems. I share your concerns regarding loco chip performance but my progress in checking this out methodically is slower than a snail. You progress much faster than I do!  :beers:

Offline Train Waiting

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1664
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
  • The Table-Top Railway.
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2131 on: March 21, 2018, 08:04:58 AM »
Definitely a case of KBO Laurence. I wish you success in sorting out the running problems. I share your concerns regarding loco chip performance but my progress in checking this out methodically is slower than a snail. You progress much faster than I do!  :beers:

Laurence, I completely agree with this from Keith and Dave's comments as well.  You regular posts with detailed descriptions and, most importantly, "Warts and all"* approach to describing problems encountered along the way makes your thread an important resource for the 'N' Gauge/Scale community.  Personally, I continue to find it of absorbing interest.  Even although I am Captain Analogue, I still find it fascinating to read about the practicalities of DCC.

Many thanks for your contributions and, yes, please KBO**.

* I think it was 70013 who said that.  This one's easier: 34051!

All best wishes.

John
'Why does the Disney Castle work so well?  Because it borrows from reality without ever slipping into it.'

(Acknowledgement: John Goodall Esq, Architectural Editor, 'Country Life'.)


The Table-Top Railway is a train set trying and failing to be a model railway.

I believe that train sets and model railways are fun.

Offline Innovationgame

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26531
  • Posts: 2286
  • Country: gb
    • The innovationgame
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2132 on: March 21, 2018, 08:37:47 PM »
I had a really good early session in the Train Shed this morning.  My first instinct was to connect up the tracks, but I decided that the first job would be to screw down the large board.  There is no positioning problem with re-fixing it because there are screws about every five inches or so around the perimeter.  By locating one of the corner screws into its original fixing hole in the frame and doing the same at the diagonally opposite corner, all the others lined up exactly.  So it wasnít long before they were all in place.  Then I set about connecting the tracks.

I decided that, rather than locate the IRJs at the further end of the connecting sections, I would lift each connecting section of track and relocate it by connecting it first to the point and then springing it into the connection at the far end.  This worked for all the tracks except Track 11, Royal Ulster Riflemanís track, where the section was too short.  So I had to resort to moving the IRJ to the other end of the section.  I also found that the two short sections linking the in-bound throat to the subsequent points, which I had remove before lifting the board, were a fraction of a millimetre too long.  This is probably because I had an impact with the braced legs, which shifted the board frame slightly.  However, I was able to manoeuvre them back into place.  Here are all the tracks ready for drilling and pinning.



After the gym, I had more work to do in the garden, now that the weather has become more spring-like once again.  I made two more barriers to divide the conservatory border and fixed them into place with a lump hammer.  This leaves only one and a bit to make.  However, I need to add an extra layer to each, so I will have to buy some more timber to finish the job.

Later, I returned to the Train Shed and, before I started to fix the track, I thought I would check the operation of all sixteen points on the DOWN loops.  Itís a good job I did because, when I switched on, there was a permanent short circuit.  It was the result of my fitting the IRJ on Track 11 to the wrong rail.  Fortunately, because I hadnít started to fix the tracks, it was easy to lift the track section again and swap the IRJ to the other rail.  I switched on again and every one of the sixteen points worked perfectly, apart from Point 30.  The problem was not with the Cobalt, but because the operating rod somehow jumped out of the hole in the tie bar, which was a little odd.  I relocated it and retested it and it seemed OK.  Itís possible that, because the tracks were not yet fixed, that the track twisted slightly, causing the tie bar to lift off the operating rod.

I then pinned each section of track into position in turn and drilled sleepers at regular intervals, ready for fitting the track pins.  I fitted the track pins using my well tried and tested method of knocking them in with the hammer head of a cross peen hammer until level with the rails and then using the peen to seat the pins flush with the sleepers.  There were twelve track sections to pin altogether and here is the peen hammer in its final position, after seating the final track pin.



If you look carefully between the rails, you can see the heads of the track pins.  One disadvantage of using track pins with a 9mm ply baseboard is that the points of the pins protrude a little below the reverse surface of the board, leaving potential scratch hazards for the unwitting.  So, if ever I do get around to rebuilding the whole layout, I will probably go for a 12mm baseboard.  Back in the day, we used softboard, which appears to be unobtainable today.  That was more like 18mm thick, so track pins were not a problem.

Tomorrow, its moving the trains back and testing the loops.
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash
www.innovationgame.com

Offline keithbythe sea

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 970
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2133 on: March 22, 2018, 07:14:39 AM »
Definitely a case of KBO Laurence.


* I think it was 70013 who said that.  This one's easier: 34051!


John

Interesting. I always attribute to 34051. No idea that it pre-dated him by some margin.

Offline Pete Smith

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 74
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2134 on: March 22, 2018, 07:32:58 AM »
Quote
One disadvantage of using track pins with a 9mm ply baseboard is that the points of the pins protrude a little below the reverse surface of the board, leaving potential scratch hazards for the unwitting.

dremmel with cutting disc will sort that

Offline Innovationgame

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26531
  • Posts: 2286
  • Country: gb
    • The innovationgame
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2135 on: March 22, 2018, 07:52:52 AM »
Quote
One disadvantage of using track pins with a 9mm ply baseboard is that the points of the pins protrude a little below the reverse surface of the board, leaving potential scratch hazards for the unwitting.

dremmel with cutting disc will sort that
Thanks Keith

I have a little cutting disc so, if I ever have to lift the boards again, I will cut off the points.
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash
www.innovationgame.com

Offline Innovationgame

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26531
  • Posts: 2286
  • Country: gb
    • The innovationgame
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2136 on: March 22, 2018, 08:21:43 PM »
I had an early session this morning.  I began by putting away all the tools used for the Cobalt installation and using my Dustbuster to clean up all the debris.  I then needed to test all the tracks on the DOWN loops.  I decided that the best way to do this was to run all the trains back into their Ďhomeí loops.  One or two were a bit rusty to start with, after the long layoff.  To allow passage through the station through Platform 2, I first moved Royal Ulster Rifleman into its home loop. 

In order to clear UP lines in the station, I needed to free up a track in the UP loops so that they could run through it and back along the DOWN line into the DOWN loops.  I achieved this by moving Tiverton Castle with its express train into its reserved Loop 12.  Then the three trains stored in the station were moved back into their Ďhomeí loops.  The milk train, hauled by 45206 followed from the goods loop.  Then it was the turn of 46443 with the local passenger to move back.  Finally, I moved 9744 back to the Shipton loops.  It didnít run very well, but later runs suggest that it runs better forwards that bunker first.  Here are the DOWN loops fully populated again.



Once all the trains were safely stowed, we went off to our caravan in Knaresborough to do some post-winter gardening.  When we returned, I was able to spend another hour in the Train Shed.  First, I had to return Tiverton Castle to its Ďhomeí in UP Loop 1.  It seemed to falter on the way out of the DOWN loops, so I gave it another circuit, with the same result.  That was a point to be remembered for later.  Then I reattached the facias and screening panels.  I also checked (but not thoroughly enough, as it turned out) that all the point settings were correct for the start of a full timetable operation.

After that, I decided that a good test would be to start the next timetable cycle.  There were some problems.  First, 80119 became difficult again.  In the end, I set its acceleration factor to zero, which helped enormously.  On the second sub-cycle, I realised that I had manged to park Cranmore Hall in the wrong loop on the first sub-cycle, which must have been because I didnít check the points thoroughly enough.  So I had to back it out and set the points correctly to send it into its correct loop. 

When I came to move Royal Ulster Rifleman, it stopped in the same place that Tiverton Castle had encountered problems.  It turned out that one rain joiner connecting the stock rail Point 30 to the track feeding it had become loose and was not conducting.  A little tightening manoeuvre was carried out and that cured the problem.  6417 ran fairly well forward but, running bunker first, it kept stopping and sat there making a funny buzzing noise.  It definitely sounds like a decoder problem.  So I am having to resort to turning it at the same time as running round, which is not very realistic.  Class 5, 45206, was a little loathe to start, but after that ran OK.  The local goods, hauled by 64960, is still running with its acceleration set to zero, but seemed fairly happy.  Hereís a picture of a busy scene at Marton Hinmarche, with 64960 entering the goods loop from the DOWN main.



Happily, on its second run, I was able to set 80119ís acceleration back to its correct value.  So we are getting back to normal, after a long period with no trains running.  The temporary buses have all been returned to Coventry Corporation Transport.  I noticed that Point 32, one of the ones with a new Cobalt, still clicks when set to straight on and I first thought that the spring was still there.  But closer inspection revealed that it has been removed, so the sudden last thrust of the switch blade is a bit of a mystery.  But the main thing is that it all works.  Iíll have some more running tomorrow to check that there are no problems hanging over from the engineering works.
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash
www.innovationgame.com

Offline daveg

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 22509
  • Posts: 4955
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2137 on: March 23, 2018, 07:07:26 AM »
Looks like the engineering works' have been pretty much a success which I'm sure is a great relief.

Hopefully you can now go back to enjoying the rest of the build without further problems.

I'm glad I don't have the worry of decoder problems - just have challenges of which points have I remembered to set correctly  :doh:

Dave G

Offline Innovationgame

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26531
  • Posts: 2286
  • Country: gb
    • The innovationgame
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2138 on: March 23, 2018, 07:53:23 AM »
Looks like the engineering works' have been pretty much a success which I'm sure is a great relief.

Hopefully you can now go back to enjoying the rest of the build without further problems.

I'm glad I don't have the worry of decoder problems - just have challenges of which points have I remembered to set correctly  :doh:

Dave G
Thanks Dave

That's the DOWN loops sorted.  I will have one running session before embarking on the UP loops.  Then it's more running before tackling points in the station.  :hmmm:
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash
www.innovationgame.com

Offline lil chris

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 23889
  • Posts: 2864
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2139 on: March 23, 2018, 07:24:57 PM »
Your mystery clicking of one Cobalt motor,the only explanation I can think of is the rod catching on something and then freeing itself hence the sudden click.
Lil Chris
My layout here East Lancashire Lines
http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=29492.0

Offline Innovationgame

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26531
  • Posts: 2286
  • Country: gb
    • The innovationgame
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2140 on: March 23, 2018, 07:26:51 PM »
Today was another busy day.  I carried out most of my weekly tasks early and made the decision that, after carrying out the vehicle checks, I would spend a chunk of time in the Train Shed, prior to getting on with other jobs.  So I was able to run the remaining four sub-cycles of the first full timetable cycle and all ten of the those in the second full cycle.  There were some disappointments during the session.  80119 is having a bad phase again and seems run better in the forward direction than bunker first, but still wonít tolerate acceleration.  It had some really stuttering performances running bunker first, but seems a little less bad in the forward direction.  6417 ran quite well in the forwards direction, but again without acceleration.  The same was true of 9744.  Most other things ran normally, although both mainline slow goods locos, 3846 with the mineral train and 64960 with the local goods, needed a little bit of extra oomph to run a low speed.  Hereís a little scene with Royal Ulster Rifleman steaming through Platform 2 on the DOWN main while 9744 stands at Platform 4 with a branch passenger for Shipton, 46443 waits for the OFF at Platform 3 and 45206 waits patiently in the milk loop for its train of milk tankers to be filled.



That was the whole of my session today and I think that I will need to carry out a full cleaning cycle at the end of the complete timetable, after the engineering works on the DOWN loop boards.  I will leave the work on the UP loop boards in abeyance until after the following full timetable cycle.

The rest of the day was spent on garden duties.  I have to prepare the raised beds for the coming seasonís planting and there are many other things that need to be done before the Spring sets in properly.
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash
www.innovationgame.com

Offline dannyboy

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 25492
  • Posts: 2859
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2141 on: March 23, 2018, 07:31:40 PM »
there are many other things that need to be done before the Spring sets in properly.

So, having seen the forecast for next week, you have plenty of time then.  ;D
David.
I used to be indecisive - now I'm not - I don't think.
If a friend seems distant, catch up with him.

Offline Innovationgame

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26531
  • Posts: 2286
  • Country: gb
    • The innovationgame
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2142 on: March 24, 2018, 08:22:16 PM »
It was a busy day today.  But I did get to run the next three sub-cycles of the timetable before we walked into Hessle for our usual Saturday jaunt.  I had a brainwave over night and tried it out today.  It hasnít cured all my ills, but things certainly ran much better today.  For the last few months, I have been setting each loco to fourteen timesteps rather than the usual twenty-eight because my controller is sometimes uncooperative and doesnít set the speed to zero when I want to decelerate.  This allowed me to simply step quickly through fourteen steps using the minus button.  But I thought I would try reverting to twenty-eight today and that seemed to make a big difference.  Of course, I wonít know how successful the cunning plan has been until I have had a few daysí running.  80119 ran really well, with its acceleration restored and 5744 ran well, even in reverse, although I wasnít able to restore its acceleration successfully.

After we returned, I had to wait for a man to deliver the underlay for the kitchen flooring, which will be laid on Monday.  While I was waiting, I set about the wisteria on the front wall.  We have a ten feet high wall that is about two hundred years old, separating the front garden from the road, which is on the north side of the garden.  There is an ancient wisteria growing inside, facing south, and it has had little attention for years.  So I had a great time hacking it back, but it is wicked stuff to work with because it grows extremely long tendrils that bind round everything and cut into your hands when you try to pull the tendrils out from the matted mass.  Once done, there was the thankless job of chopping it all up and putting it in the recycling bin. 

After our mid-day snack, we went off to buy 20 bags of top soil to top up some of the raised beds, ready for planting.  Thereís plenty of compost on them, but they do need a bit of extra soil to bring up the level ensure good growth.  So, I was quite tired after lifting them into the car and then lifting them out onto a sack track, barrowing them round to the back garden and stacking them ready for action, so to speak.  But I did get back to the Train Shed afterwards.

One of the things I noticed during running was that, where I had re-joined the DOWN loops to the UP line, I hadnít quite seated one of the rails into the rail joiner.  It doesnít seem to affect the running, but I noticed a slight bump when locos passed over it.  So I will have to lift the section of track again, with all those pesky track pins. :thumbsdown:  Another problem I had was on UP Loop 3.  First, Forthampton Grange was loath to start from it and then, when 80119 reached the points at the entrance to the loop, it stopped.  I tracked down the problem to a poor connection between the power rail joiner and the rails.  It looks as though I might have to abandon the Peco power feed joiners and replace them with soldered droppers.

One disappointing feature of the dayís running was that 6417 would still only run in the forwards direction and then only with the acceleration disabled.  It did start running bunker first, but soon gave up, just sitting there making an odd noise.  The only other issue of note was when Stanier Class 5, 45206, brought the milk train round to goods loop to await a clear track home, it had difficulty starting and then ground to a halt on the bend approaching the station.  The grinding noise made me suspect a traction tyre and, sure enough, one of the rear traction tyres was shed and the other missing.  Fortunately, fitting tender traction tyres isnít too difficult and it was soon back in business again.

But, at the end of the day, things had run reasonable well.  Hereís a quick picture of the local goods and the milk train waiting for clear lines to run back to their home loops.



With things looking up again in the running stakes, I may be able to make another video again soon.  I have one more full cycle to run tomorrow and then I will set about a complete cleaning cycle.  I plan to run another full operational timetable after the cleaning session before setting about replacing the Seeps on the UP loops boards with Cobalts.
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash
www.innovationgame.com

Offline daveg

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 22509
  • Posts: 4955
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2143 on: March 24, 2018, 09:59:37 PM »
I know many have had a success with the Peco pre-wired joiners but not for me.

Taking advice to add soldered droppers to every length of track plus power to points has been a bonus for me but I'm DC.

I've certainly made mistakes but soldering the wires to the underside of the rails has been very close to 95% successful. Very few failures or dry joints and most of those fixed before final fixing.

Dave G

Offline Innovationgame

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26531
  • Posts: 2286
  • Country: gb
    • The innovationgame
    • Awards
Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2144 on: March 25, 2018, 08:30:42 PM »
I manged a short session in the Train Shed this morning before we went for our walk along the river.  I ran the first three sub-cycles of the final full cycle and everything worked pretty well.  We were a bit disappointed on our walk.  It was a beautiful sunny morning to walk along side the river, but when we reached the to benches where we usually are, they had been removed, so we just had to stand and admire the view.

After we returned, it was coffee and then off to buy some bags of potting compost for Celia to sow seeds and pot up seedlings.  In the afternoon, I had to complete the second half of clearing up the wisteria that I had started yesterday.  After that, there were some more garden jobs, followed by another session in the Train Shed.  I managed to run the rest of the sub-cycles to finish the entire timetable, all without too much of a problem.  Of course, I still canít run either of the paniers using acceleration and 6417 will not run bunker first.  But I did manage to make this video.  It is the first time I have tried using captions and music.

I have removed the YouTube version and reposted one that works in Post 2153.

http://www.innovationgame.com/ngf/Marton overview (1).mp4

The video is best viewed in full screen mode, because was filmed from a distance to take in as much of the station as possible.

Tomorrow, I will do a complete track clean ready for another timetable run before lifting the UP loop boards to install the Cobalts.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2018, 11:56:21 AM by Innovationgame »
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash
www.innovationgame.com

 

Please Support Us!
December Goal: £55.00
Due Date: Dec 31
Total Receipts: £347.00
Above Goal: £292.00
Site Currency: GBP
631% 
December Donations


Advertise Here
anything