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Author Topic: The Closet Branch - A Low-Tech Layout.  (Read 61211 times)

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Offline maridunian

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #165 on: October 03, 2016, 11:27:04 AM »
This is a result of my third and half attempt.
After all that, still pretty bad looking.

I disagree with that assessment too!

In that photo, the car is double life size and cameras show things that the eye wouldn't normally notice at all.

I agree with TexHorse that the only real issue is how flat the decals are lying on the ribbed surface. To improve on that next time, I'd ensure the car has a high gloss finish before applying the decals, then careful pressing down with a wet cotton bud, rolled outwards from the centre of each decal, to get it to follow the shape of the surface. (Or only apply home-made decals on flat areas!)

I wouldn't recommend DecalFix or other softening solutions for home-made decals, as these can sometimes destroy them depending on the chemistry of the products.

The finished, weathered car looks fine to me!

Mike
My layout: Mwynwr Tryciau Colliery, the Many Tricks Mine.

My 3D Modelshop:  Maridunian's Models

Offline mr magnolia

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #166 on: October 11, 2016, 10:49:37 PM »
Hey dats
How's things?
I can't find the source just now on this phone. But I've been looking into SW1500s in CN livery, and turns out the only SW1500s came to CN from Wisconsin Central. Turns out further more that most (all?) of WC's 1500s came from Southern Pacific...

What running numbers have you in your fleet? It might be we are operating the same loco as each other, but in different times and spaces!

Cheerio

Donald

Offline texhorse

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #167 on: October 12, 2016, 07:52:34 AM »
That would be really neat Donald!

The loco would "sort of" have a history!

Andy
UK
Montrose and Highland Railroad



Offline dats475

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #168 on: October 12, 2016, 10:21:54 AM »
Hello, everyone!

My SW1500 is #2510, Donald.
I understand that SP had a lot of "graduates" from their roster.
I don't know 2510 is the CN loco though.
Any progress on your timeline decision? I'm looking forward to seeing the development.

I haven't been able to get some progress on my layout.
I'm still applying some decals. (Yes, I'm still doing it!)

Now it sits on ribs well thanks to Micro-sit but I don't know how to get rid of the thin film appearance even after painting Micro-sol several times. I can see it on certain angles.

(As you can see on the picture, I ripped the decal by pressing down too hard!)

If you guys know how get rid of the film, please let me know!!
When I get better at it, I'm planning to redo the M&HRR car. (Yes, I'm still thinking about it!)

Dats

Best regards with my annoying moving signature.
  :drool: Dats  https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxMwG2GNX3Va9AFLRaNH5xw

Offline maridunian

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #169 on: October 12, 2016, 11:11:23 AM »
If you guys know how get rid of the film, please let me know!!


Gloss varnish the surface before applying the decal - that's the best you can do, then matt varnish everything afterwards. I often use gloss paint on locos for this reason.

Mike
My layout: Mwynwr Tryciau Colliery, the Many Tricks Mine.

My 3D Modelshop:  Maridunian's Models

Offline texhorse

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #170 on: October 12, 2016, 08:09:57 PM »
Mike is right.  Gloss varnish is good.

Also, it seems to me that there may be some air trapped underneath perhaps?

Please remember that close up photos always exaggerate any "faults" on your model.  Imagine if you painted a thin line on a piece of paper.  If you look from a distance, it looks great.  If you took a magnifying glass, you'd see all sorts of imperfections.  It's the same with close up photography.

How often do we look at a box car on a layout from only 12 inches away?  Not too often.  More likely four to six feet away.  It looks fine.

Have another look at the car from the more realistic viewing distance on the layout Dats.  You'll be putting things more into perspective, I think!

Andy
UK
Montrose and Highland Railroad



Offline maridunian

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #171 on: October 12, 2016, 10:53:30 PM »


(As you can see on the picture, I ripped the decal by pressing down too hard!)

If you guys know how get rid of the film, please let me know!!
When I get better at it, I'm planning to redo the M&HRR car. (Yes, I'm still thinking about it!)


If this were mine,  I'd now run a scalpel along the side of each rib,  then brush on a little Microsol to get the decal to settle into the corners.  Add some weathering,  and as TexHorse says,  it will look just fine!

Mike
My layout: Mwynwr Tryciau Colliery, the Many Tricks Mine.

My 3D Modelshop:  Maridunian's Models

Offline Webbo

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #172 on: October 13, 2016, 12:15:59 AM »
Hi Dats

Here is a website that explains how to attach decals - why the surface should be glossy and how and why you should use Micro Set and Micro Sol. It adds to what Andy and Mike have to say.

http://incunabulum.co.uk/blog/2009/09/29/tutorial-decals-with-microsol-and-microset/comment-page-1/

I have just applied a homemade decal to my oil storage tank using Micro Set before and after decal application. It has worked very well. Even though the tank has ribs along its sides where plates have been welded together, the ribbed sides of a boxcar may be a bit trickier so I'm going to get myself a bottle of Micro Sol for that job when it comes.

Webbo

Offline texhorse

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #173 on: October 13, 2016, 09:14:33 AM »
Have you got a photo of the oil storage tank Webbo?

1.  I'd like to see it anyway.
2.  Perhaps it will give us more insight into how decals can be applied to an uneven surface.

Andy
UK
Montrose and Highland Railroad



Offline Webbo

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #174 on: October 13, 2016, 09:35:25 AM »
Yep, here it is Andy.



Webbo

Offline dats475

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #175 on: October 13, 2016, 10:21:12 AM »
Hello again, everyone.

Andy, Mike and Webbo, thank you very much for your advice!!
As Mike's suggestion,
I pushed decals to those ribs by using back of a xacto knife and applied the micro Sol then pushed it more by blade of the knife again.
I think I actually cut the decals along the ribs.
It looks much better.

Now, I have to do the other side of boxcar.
I'll buy a model gloss clear coat at hobby store this coming weekend.(I have a bottle of micro-set and micro-sol already, yay!)
Any clear gloss coat for models would be fine right?
Or any specific one I should get?

So, process would be...  
I'll paint the gloss coat where I apply a decal then dry
and apply micro-set
and apply a decal and more micro-set(push as much as I can with wet paper towel)  (or repeat if necessary)
And apply micro-sol following by xacto knife push then dry
And if everything is good(I hope), apply dull coat.
Am I right?

If I'm missing something please let me know before I start applying the decals again!

Mike, thank you for the link. I want my decals to look like that!! What a wonderful job you did on the engine!!

Webbo,
The oil tank looks great!!
No decal film showing!!
How did you do that?!
Did you apply clear coat? And cut the decal exactly where the shell picture so, no excess decal film?
You said that "homemade" decal, did you use white decal for it?
Please show me the way!!
Thank you for the link too. I read through the article.
I didn't know a lot of stuff he is taking about! (No wonder!!)
You guys gave me a hope of the decal adventure!


Dats
Best regards with my annoying moving signature.
  :drool: Dats  https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxMwG2GNX3Va9AFLRaNH5xw

Offline texhorse

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #176 on: October 13, 2016, 10:28:57 AM »
Hi Dats!

Your method is spot on, but use a damp towel to blot the water and air out.  Don't use a wet one.  Also, when you are putting the Micro Set on at this stage, put it around the edge of the decal, not all over it.

Good Luck!  Let's see the new and improved box car!  As I'm off work today, I am going to do some scenery on the layout now!

Andy
UK
Montrose and Highland Railroad



Offline mr bachmann

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #177 on: October 13, 2016, 02:18:46 PM »
hobo in camp  :D ,

the box van is looking ok .

 suggestion , when using a scalpel use a curved blade then it can be rolled to cut , rather than a straight blade that could buckle the wet decal whilst cutting .

(some years ago  :sleep: we would make transfers by using , example - suitable adverts etc. from magazines , varnish (oil or polyurethane) over the print , allow to dry , then immerse in water to remove the paper backing - then hopefully  you would be left with a slip of varnish with type face under the gloss . the finished item was then applied to the model )
 

Offline maridunian

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #178 on: October 13, 2016, 02:22:59 PM »
Any clear gloss coat for models would be fine right?
Personally I'd use enamel rather than acrylic (just in-case the solvents/mattcote react?? Not sure if that's a real risk), something that gives a thin coat - eg airbrush/model spray.

So, process would be...   

I'll paint the gloss coat where I apply a decal
Yes - You might want to extend the gloss area to the whole panel, perhaps masked off, so any 'step' or tone/colour change at the edge of your varnished patch isn't obvious.

then (let it) dry

apply micro-set and apply a decal and more micro-set
(push as much as I can with wet paper towel)  (or repeat if necessary)

And apply micro-sol following by xacto knife push then dry

And if everything is good(I hope), apply dull coat.

Am I right?

Sounds fine to me!

Mike, thank you for the link. I want my decals to look like that!! What a wonderful job you did on the engine!!

Thank you - these are commercial decals, but I plan to experiment on another example, adding home-made coloured panels with lined edges to a loco to speed things up!

Mike
My layout: Mwynwr Tryciau Colliery, the Many Tricks Mine.

My 3D Modelshop:  Maridunian's Models

Offline Webbo

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Re: The Closet Branch - A layout in my closet.
« Reply #179 on: October 13, 2016, 10:59:37 PM »
Webbo,
The oil tank looks great!!
No decal film showing!!
How did you do that?!
Did you apply clear coat? And cut the decal exactly where the shell picture so, no excess decal film?
You said that "homemade" decal, did you use white decal for it?
Please show me the way!!
Thank you for the link too. I read through the article.
I didn't know a lot of stuff he is taking about! (No wonder!!)
You guys gave me a hope of the decal adventure!


Dats

The decal was cut within about 0.5 mm of the image, and if you look closely at the real thing you can see the edge of the decal line. It's hard to see so not a problem for me. I didn't apply a gloss surface before hand - the tank had been spray painted with acrylic matt white. Even so, the decal seems to have stuck to the surface very nicely. Basically I followed the micro-set instructions: apply micro-set to the area of the decal, slide on the decal, brush out any air bubbles with a brush (hardly any), apply more micro-set, then dab the whole lot with paper towel. I didn't need to press the towel. There is a little bit of bridging of the decal across the tank ribs, but I don't think I'll bother trying to fix this as it's not obvious at all even at close range. However the strategy of cutting the decals into the corners using a rounded blade is worth remembering for future decal jobs.

No, I didn't use white decal paper. The stuff I used was Micro-Mark. At $2 a sheet not particularly cheap. I do wonder how important the quality of the decal paper is to the results. Very likely I would think.

Here's a question for you decal people. I used a Canon inkjet printer with its gloss setting. The Micro-Mark instructions recommend that immediately after the page is printed that it be sprayed with a fixer - in my case I used Dullcote. It would seem to me that the Dullcote would interfere with the penetration of the micro-set applied on top of the decal. Can anyone tell me whether applying Dullcote is really necessary at the printing stage or would letting the decal paint dry thoroughly be enough to prevent it running? Certainly applying Dullcote at the end of the decal application process seems to be recommended practice.

Webbo

 

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