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Author Topic: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society  (Read 200880 times)

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Offline Milton Rail

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #885 on: December 07, 2016, 09:48:34 AM »

The Class 04s are very nice models. It's a pity, though, that there are no kits (as far as I know) for an Andrew Barclay or North British diesel shunter as one of those would be more appropriate, Class 04s not being allocated to Scotland.


One of the PRPS early members happened to be in the right place at the right time (Neville Hill shed) when D2264 was withdrawn from service in 1969 and was able to save it from the scrapyard - it is on permanent loan to PRPS, but makes lots of guest appearances around the country on other railways, the member in question having his own haulage company and can easily move it around the country :D  Coming from an Ex LNER depot, the PRPS membership are very fond of this wee shunter

I didn't intend to get any more of the Thompson BG's... liked the teak one to create a bit of variation on the early LNER teak coaches I have (many) of.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2016, 10:02:01 AM by Milton Rail, Reason: Update »

Offline Webbo

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #886 on: December 07, 2016, 10:07:15 AM »
Yes, it should be the other rail that you cut through. As an example of what happens with the outer rail cut as shown in your second sketch, suppose you are an electron passing from the lower left black dropper along the lower rail from left to right. With the turnout switched as shown, you go round the turnout blade to the left and connect with a rail running to the upper rail on the bottom right hand branch which connects directly to the red dropper and hence a fizz, smoke and short circuit. So, you need to cut the rail opposite to where you have indicated green. Same thing on the upper branch.

Webbo

Offline Milton Rail

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #887 on: December 07, 2016, 10:54:58 AM »
Thanks Webbo... I almost feel like I understand it now :)

Offline Milton Rail

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #888 on: December 07, 2016, 04:27:00 PM »
While I had all my multi-coloured pens out.. I sketched out what I have done so far on the refinery sidings...... and think I have spotted some mistakes in my understanding... hopefully you agree

Same notation as before, except empty red & black markers are droppers I have not yet fitted, but show the intended position of them - green lines are the IRJ's currently fitted... blue lines are where I think I need more based on the earlier tutorial from Webbo.......


Offline PeterA

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #889 on: December 07, 2016, 04:27:23 PM »
Looking at the pic I think you've missed a IRJ on one of the rails for at least one of the frogs... But it is hard to see.




Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #890 on: December 07, 2016, 04:33:12 PM »
I can't remember whether you are going DC or DCC, Andrew, but it looks a bit like a hammer to crack a nut if you don't mind me saying.
Bear in mind if you are going for frog polarity changing then you'll need a lot more IRJ's as every frog rail on every point will need one, I believe. :hmmm:

Offline Mito

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #891 on: December 07, 2016, 05:41:10 PM »
The rails from the frog always need IRJ's when using electrofrog points. :thumbsup:
You know you're getting older when your mind makes commitments your body can't meet.
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=40567.0 125x60 and a bit.
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=24101.0 Off on a journey

Offline Milton Rail

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #892 on: December 07, 2016, 06:07:22 PM »
Thanks for the advice guys :)

Mick, it will be DCC, hence why I was going a bit overboard with the droppers.....

I think the penny has dropped now regarding the frogs... will need to go back to the info I gleaned from DCC concepts and see what I missed!

Now I just have to figure out how to retrofit without doing too much damage

Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #893 on: December 07, 2016, 08:04:08 PM »
The rails from the frog always need IRJ's when using electrofrog points. :thumbsup:


@Mito
Sorry, but that's just not true in all cases. As long as the feed is to the toe of the point I have many sidings without IRJs

Offline Mito

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #894 on: December 07, 2016, 08:42:47 PM »
The rails from the frog always need IRJs when using electrofrog points. :thumbsup:


@Mito
Sorry, but that's just not true in all cases. As long as the feed is to the toe of the point I have many sidings without IRJs


Agreed if the points lead only to sidings as in DC the rails will become the same polarity but if there is a loop or facing points IRJs are necessary. That said I was always advised to use IRJ on the frog rails. DCC is a thing apart and I know little or nothing about.
You know you're getting older when your mind makes commitments your body can't meet.
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=40567.0 125x60 and a bit.
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=24101.0 Off on a journey

Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #895 on: December 07, 2016, 08:51:57 PM »
DCC is a thing apart and I know little or nothing about.

'Tis the devil's work and a black art to me as well :uneasy:

Offline Webbo

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #896 on: December 08, 2016, 01:17:10 AM »
I don't think you are there yet, Andrew.

Here is a site that explains the difference between insulfrog, electrofrog and 'live frog' and nicely shows how the polarity routes through the points depending on which direction they are turned.

http://www.pls-layouts.co.uk/html/frog_types.htm

What they really mean by 'live frog' there is separate switching of the frog polarity to enable better electrical connectivity through the point (i.e. frog juicers and all that sort of thing). Electrofrog actually has a live frog and has identical polarity on the outlet rails as shown by the 'live frog' option on the website so I'll just call all electrofrog points with or without the frog switching mods. The locations of IRJs required are the same.

The fundamental notion that needs to be borne in mind is that when the points are turned left then the two outlet rails on the right branch have the same polarity i.e. they are shorted and vice versa if the points are turned to the right. If there are power feeds on both the sidings downstream of the points then these need to be protected with IRJs on BOTH rails connected to the frog.

I've added a few IRJs to your diagram where I think they are necessary. Also, I'm wondering about the two sets of IRJs that cut both tracks (circled with a question mark). Is this for some sort of block control? They shouldn't be necessary if you intend to run DCC.

Webbo's suggested mods:


All this stuff is not very profound once you see the light. A bit like learning to back up a utility trailer behind a car.

Webbo 


Offline Milton Rail

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #897 on: December 08, 2016, 05:56:53 AM »
Thanks Webbo.. I will take a look at the article... the two sets of IRJ's you were referring to were there because I thought I effectively had a passing loop, and read that this was a way of avoiding trouble with two sets of points facing each other.... Clearly not :)   the penny I thought had dropped is obviously levitating just a few feet from the floor :)


Offline Milton Rail

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #898 on: December 08, 2016, 06:15:58 AM »
D2264 takes the older 4 wheel carriages back to Muthill, the Thompson BG can be seen sitting in the passing loop and S&DJR 3F Jinty No 23 sits at rest in the refinery pilot road.



I started to work on the cutting between the tunnel & Tullibardine, initially just building up the profile with polystyrene chips and some offcuts of insulation foam



at the other end of the cutting now as it approaches the station, will put a small culvert you can see on the right hand edge of the picture in this area



My first adventure in mod-rok .... (note to self, stop wiping hands on backside between placing strips of plaster)



Quite pleased with the way it turned out, though I need to be more careful around the backscene to prevent damage





The golf course area is looking a bit flat... need to introduce a few more undulations






Offline Webbo

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Re: Perthshire Railway Preservation Society - Construction
« Reply #899 on: December 08, 2016, 06:58:15 AM »
Modroc is great stuff. With my backdrop which is just blue paper, I covered it with a strip of aluminium foil 10 cm high or so to keep the plaster and moisture off. With foil there I could plaster right up to it with impunity. Any waterproof thin material would do this job I'm sure. Not a bad idea to cover your track as well as plaster blobs can get into the grain of the sleepers and are a bit of a devil to clean off completely. Here, I used blue painter's tape on the basis of some forgotten modelling website's recommendation as it is supposed to leave less gooey residue on the rails than regular masking tape.

Webbo

 

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