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Author Topic: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems  (Read 10003 times)

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Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #45 on: November 19, 2015, 05:34:03 PM »
Ok have accessed an fully cleaned commutator.
Unfortunately the orange and grey wires broke off
PCB board....can any one tell me where to reconnect (photo)
Or advise how to bypass board since I don't use DCC.

Offline grahame

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Offline Only Me

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #47 on: November 19, 2015, 05:45:58 PM »
If you dont want lights then all you have to do is connect one wire to one side of chassis and one to the other... If you want lights you need to solder them back to the pcb board.. Look on your other hst for the correct solder mounts marked M+ and M- ... If you find after soldering the train runs in reverse then just reverse your soldering
« Last Edit: November 19, 2015, 05:47:05 PM by Only Me »



Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #48 on: November 19, 2015, 05:52:14 PM »
Thanks..jumping wires on the the split chassis..then jumping battery to split chassis..voila!! Runs nicely. Great info!

Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #49 on: November 19, 2015, 08:11:02 PM »
Talking about the old, HST power car here. Ok jumping wires to chassis I just measured 60 mA at 9 volts.
That's one whole hell of a lot better than it was (see above).
I do not have the skill or equipment to solder back on to M+/M- of the PCB board so I guess it's running without lights.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2015, 08:12:17 PM by grahame »

Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #50 on: November 19, 2015, 09:35:44 PM »
Many thanks to RusselH...I followed his method of milling out the black plastic cover to find below the commutator. I can see no reason why Dapol cannot manufacture this part
with a circular hole for access?

Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #51 on: November 19, 2015, 09:39:12 PM »
Thanks also for all other suggestions..this one seems the easiest..and it wasn't that easy...problem is lots of wires get in the way...due to being soldered in place.
I did inevitably pull some out. Very hard to avoid. My suggestion to others wishing to try this..unsolder the orange and grey wires from the bottom of the motor
where it is connected to resistors etc...this is pretty easy to solder back on and will prevent you from ripping them off the PCB board like i did.

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #52 on: November 21, 2015, 12:32:21 AM »
Here is the story so far..the old power car is running very nicely and very COOL at 68 mA @ 9 volts...now why did it have to be so hard to clean the commutator Dapol?

***********************************************************************************************

1: Using fine tissue pads dipped in n-pentane (very clean hydrocarbon solvent – I work in a Chemistry lab..this solvent is ideal for small locos) I cleaned the commutator over and over until the tissue picked up no black colour at all.
2. I cut a very thin strip of really really fine emery paper, made a pad and with forceps jammed it on to the commutator. I then rotated the armature over and over for a long time. After this is was bright and shiny.
3. Raked out the gaps with very fine needle.

There are two other things of interest that I wanted to highlight:

a)   I had tested it over and over..all good. Put the whole thing back together and..NOTHING..totally dead. Now what..plus bad words says I. It turns out that one of the green cylindrical components under the motor had burnt out (resistor??..see photos above). If I jumped power over that..hey presto back in business. So I moved the cable and resolder on the other side of this bad component. What the ****..can anything else go wrong.

b)   I have NO IDEA why..but the lights work..only they are reversed..red forwards, white backwards…I did not solder motors wires back on to M+/M- of PCB board…I soldered to copper contact strips on split chassis. I thought the lights would not work. How can I reverse the colours? Any ideas.

So what an adventure. ...but she is running nicely as I type..and I am using the Virgin trains body..that came with the new power car, this has the Executive livery body of the main train.

Offline Only Me

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #53 on: November 21, 2015, 01:02:17 AM »
You need to reverse the dcc planking plate ornre solder your motor wires to the alternate side.

Ps the resistors are not resistors but smoothing capacitors..



Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #54 on: November 21, 2015, 03:26:09 AM »
Ps the resistors are not resistors but smoothing capacitors..

Thanks for clarification...OK so one of the capacitors blew out...


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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #55 on: November 21, 2015, 03:28:46 AM »
You need to reverse the dcc planking plate ornre solder your motor wires to the alternate side.

OK so pull out the DCC blank plate and put it back in upside down?


Offline CliveH

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #56 on: November 21, 2015, 07:32:35 AM »
Them capacitors ain't capacitors, them's inductors!!

Sorry to be an electronic anorak but it's the brown disc things that are capacitors. Basically two metal plates separated by an insulator. They don't let direct current through, but do let alternating current pass. They are fitted between the brushes and the chassis to supply an easier route for the high frequency alternating current created by the sparks at the commutator (always there, albeit maybe small) to earth, and so reduce potential interference to radios, TVs etc. The ones on the HST are 10 nanoFarad (103 = 10 plus three noughts =10,000 picoFarads = 10nF)
The green cylinder things are inductors - coils of wire which do let direct current through, but present a resistance to alternating current. They are fitted between the motor and the pcb to stop any high voltage spikes from the sparks reaching the electronics of the loco where even at their extremely low power, they could cause damage - so don't short them out! The ones on the HST are 3.3 microHenry (orange, orange, gold  = 3,3, multiply by 0.1 = 3.3uH)

Cheers

Clive

Offline CliveH

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #57 on: November 21, 2015, 07:50:49 AM »
- so don't short them out!
If you've got DCC fitted

Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #58 on: November 21, 2015, 11:29:40 AM »
- so don't short them out!
If you've got DCC fitted

No DCC here..just simple DC soul..and I had to bypass it or the motor would not run..the thing was presenting an open circuit thus it must have blown...thanks for the correct electronic info...

Offline grahame

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Re: Dapol HST 125 power car - More problems
« Reply #59 on: November 21, 2015, 11:36:33 AM »
Them capacitors ain't capacitors, them's inductors!!

Sorry to be an electronic anorak but it's the brown disc things that are capacitors. Basically two metal plates separated by an insulator. They don't let direct current through, but do let alternating current pass. They are fitted between the brushes and the chassis to supply an easier route for the high frequency alternating current created by the sparks at the commutator (always there, albeit maybe small) to earth, and so reduce potential interference to radios, TVs etc. The ones on the HST are 10 nanoFarad (103 = 10 plus three noughts =10,000 picoFarads = 10nF)
The green cylinder things are inductors - coils of wire which do let direct current through, but present a resistance to alternating current. They are fitted between the motor and the pcb to stop any high voltage spikes from the sparks reaching the electronics of the loco where even at their extremely low power, they could cause damage - so don't short them out! The ones on the HST are 3.3 microHenry (orange, orange, gold  = 3,3, multiply by 0.1 = 3.3uH)

Cheers

Clive

I am thinking that the high current, overheating issue which really looks like a simple dirty commutator could have blown this inductor, yes? So if other have this problem try jumping over the inductor with power cables to see if motor runs. I am sure reaplcing this inducotr would be very inexpensive and just a simple soldering job.

 

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