!!

Not Registered?

Welcome!  Please register to view all of the new posts and forum boards - some of which are hidden to guests.  After registering and gaining 10 posts you will be able to sell and buy items on our N'porium.

If you have any problems registering, then please check your spam filter before emailing us.  Hotmail users seem to find their emails in the Junk folder.


Thanks for reading,
The NGF Staff.

Author Topic: Dr Al's workbench - clearing the backlog, and adding some Zs  (Read 73317 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline R Marshall

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 24052
  • Posts: 201
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #495 on: July 03, 2019, 10:18:39 AM »
I look forward to following the gradual transition - it's going to be a great model.

I'm not the biggest fan of the GWR, but the "Night Owls" were (and will be again, in time) muscly looking attractive beasts.

Offline Chris in Prague

  • Trade Count: (+14)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 24400
  • Posts: 12840
  • Country: cz
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #496 on: July 03, 2019, 11:23:24 AM »
I'm sure that what was already a fine example of model engineering will look even better when you have finished upgrading it, Alan. I look forward to admiring the work done. I've never seen an N Gauge 47xx model before. An absolute gem for sure.

Online w greatbatch

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 14199
  • Posts: 123
  • Country: england
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #497 on: July 03, 2019, 11:47:15 AM »
Yep, can't wait to see a bit of Dr. Al magic, by the way,did the Ivatt mogul get finished ?

Online Dr Al

  • Trade Count: (+52)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5213
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #498 on: July 03, 2019, 12:23:52 PM »
did the Ivatt mogul get finished ?

Well remembered. No, not yet.

The tender is finished, painted and boxed away, but the loco needs completion.  Other things have tempted my interest (like this 47xx) at the moment, but I will get back to it in time. I still have many others to do including a second V1, a second D49 a second Garratt (with ideas of a conversion), a Gresley Quad-Art set and a Dynamometer car (to go with 46236 and 35017 in loco-exchanges guise).

So lots to do! Is why I'd like the 47xx to be a swift job, and given the lack of need for major works, it hopefully should be.

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Offline trkilliman

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 733
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #499 on: July 03, 2019, 01:23:08 PM »
I'm sure that what was already a fine example of model engineering will look even better when you have finished upgrading it, Alan. I look forward to admiring the work done. I've never seen an N Gauge 47xx model before. An absolute gem for sure.

I will also follow this with interest !

Online Dr Al

  • Trade Count: (+52)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5213
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #500 on: July 05, 2019, 12:41:35 AM »
In the next step forward, I've cleaned off 90% of the original paint with acetone to unveil how this was made.

Instead of being a Hall; it looks to be a Farish Castle bodyshell, heavily modified with all detail removed, cab and front and read footplates cut and re-sited, and various brass details including handrails, splashers. The details on the tops of the front splashers, and the safety valve bonnet look to have been fabricated from scratch in whitemetal. I had initially thought to replace the bonnet with an N-brass one, but I'm thinking now of keeping it and doing minor detailing to it only instead.

The right side boiler handrail needs some repair work as it was fairly heavily glued to hold, and trying to pare this back has let it come free. Solder may be the answer. The smokebox door dart is fairly poor original on the plastic Castle smokebox, so this will be replaced. Buffers will be replaced as the Farish originals look a tad too small in head diameter. Loco tender gap looks a little large, so I'll need to see if there's scope and clearance to close this a bit.

There is a bit of filler, but a respectably small and well executed amount. Overall, this is still a very tidy build. We'll need to see after the detailing and refurb is primered to see if I continue to say that though!





The tender has had the remaining lining removed, and the rear details painted. It needs a few front details and then it can get glossed ready for replacement lining. I intend to keep the Bachfarish printed crests as they are nice and fine.



Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Offline Garyf

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: Yes
  • 2mm Association Number: Yes
  • Posts: 102
  • Country: gb
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #501 on: July 05, 2019, 08:12:26 AM »
Hi Alan, looking forward to see how you get on with the quad art set. Are you using the Shapeways set as your start point?  It's a particular favourite of mine having had a close up look at the set at the North Norfolk Railway on one of their behind the scenes visits, hopefully the set will be in use during their vintage travel gala 11-14th July. I will be there to ride them again.

Gary

Online Dr Al

  • Trade Count: (+52)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5213
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #502 on: July 05, 2019, 08:59:05 AM »
Hi Alan, looking forward to see how you get on with the quad art set. Are you using the Shapeways set as your start point?  It's a particular favourite of mine having had a close up look at the set at the North Norfolk Railway on one of their behind the scenes visits, hopefully the set will be in use during their vintage travel gala 11-14th July. I will be there to ride them again.

Gary

Yes, I have a set from Shapeways. It'll need quite a bit of work, and I believe from @Stevie DC (formerly Atso) that there are some inaccuracies in the planking, so it'll need some consideration as to what (if anything) may warrant correction.

If you have any photos from the behind the scenes, please do post them, as prototype pics are always infinitely useful when building a model like that.

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Offline Stevie DC

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2129
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #503 on: July 05, 2019, 09:05:14 AM »
Yes, I have a set from Shapeways. It'll need quite a bit of work, and I believe from @Stevie DC (formerly Atso) that there are some inaccuracies in the planking, so it'll need some consideration as to what (if anything) may warrant correction.

There were some issues with the paneling when I was shown a set. However, this was some time ago and I do know that the designer was made aware of this. It may have been corrected since then.

There are three basic types of Quad set (more if you include some of the Howlden rebuilds but they weren't used in the same way). The basic differences as I understand them are:

- 1921 GN Builds: Opening door toplights, recessed guards ends, duckets and mounted on Fox bogies. Rebuilds of earlier coaches and, in later life, the toplights were sealed or paneled over.
- 1923-24 Early LNER Builds: Similar to the above but mounted on Gresley bogies.
- 1925-28 LNER Builds: No recessed guards end, no duckets, ventilators on the doors and mounted on Gresley bogies.

Personally, I'm going to get mine etched eventually, but I know that isn't everyone's cut of tea. It'll be awhile though as I've got several other coaches for Hadley Wood to design first.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2019, 09:13:12 AM by Stevie DC (formerly Atso) »

Offline Garyf

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: Yes
  • 2mm Association Number: Yes
  • Posts: 102
  • Country: gb
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #504 on: July 05, 2019, 10:34:01 AM »
Hi Alan, I'll have a look to see what I've got, I don't think I took many behind the scenes but I have a few more from when they were in use at the NNR. If you have anything specific you'd like I'll try to get some shots next week, assuming the set will be in use,

Gary

Twelve pictures added to my gallery of the quad art set
« Last Edit: July 05, 2019, 10:29:20 PM by Garyf, Reason: Note added »

Online icairns

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 6662
  • Posts: 19
  • Country: us
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #505 on: July 06, 2019, 03:58:41 PM »
Congratulations on a great looking model.  I think refurbishing/upgrading scratch-built and kit-built models is a very good modelling activity.

For those that are interested, the July 2019 Steam World (issue #385) has an article and 9 photos (colour and black and white) of the 47XX locos in action including one large colour photo of 4704 that shows a lot of detail for the modeller.

Ian 

Online Dr Al

  • Trade Count: (+52)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5213
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #506 on: July 07, 2019, 06:50:49 PM »
A public thanks to Gary for sending and uploading his Quad-Art pics, very useful indeed as reference material.

It's a lovely looking set.

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Online Dr Al

  • Trade Count: (+52)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5213
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #507 on: July 08, 2019, 12:44:42 AM »
After the archaeology, I've now turned to starting the refurbishment on the 47xx body.

The chimney was scratchbuilt with a Farish top, but I've chosen to replace it as the prototypes seemed to have had a pronounced capuchon that the original did not have. A N Brass King chimney has been substituted. I've also replaced the buffers and the smokebox door dart with one made of handrail knobs.

The big task was refurbishing the right side boiler handrail. The rail needed a replacement knob at top of smokebox, and came apart on the right side where it had come away from the pipe on the boiler side. All this had originally been glued, but was all nickel silver. I therefore was able to replace all the knobs on that side, tidy up the shape of the rail and re-solder it all back together. It's not perfect, but this is a particularly awkward and difficult rail to deal with since it runs concurrently with the boilers-side pipe.







There is some quite deep scratching and pitting on the base body casting, particularly on top of the firebox - presumably from the re-shaping of the shell, but it possibly explains the heavy paint job. Hopefully this will be ok with primer and sanding during preparation for paint.

Loco still needs replacement lamp irons, the reverser replaced (it was plasticard which just disintegrated with age), and would benefit from rear sandboxes. I may replace the rear cab handrails also, depending on whether I think I can improve them.

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Online Dr Al

  • Trade Count: (+52)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5213
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #508 on: July 09, 2019, 09:54:15 PM »
Progress on 47xx has been swift, mainly because the original builder did such a decent job, that it's really just minor changes and details that are already being added.

I've finished the front end with lamp irons, also removing the top iron which wasn't in place on smokebox top in BR late era (reminds me...I need to put that one on the smokebox....)

I've improved the safety valve bonnet, reaming the top and adding some representation of the valve tops on top. It remains to be seen how this will look when actually primed and painted.

I've added the reverser rod and other rodding on the right hand side. Originally I was just going to add a basic straight rod, but ambition got the better of me and I managed to pull off adding the mounting bar and slide at the firebox base. I'm fairly happy with the result.

I also added front handrails to the tender. This does make me feel that I might have to remove the cab rails and replace to match - thoughts?

We are now very close to paint - those handrails need considered, the front lamp iron and a fall plate (I may add this after paint if I choose to), and tender brake standards.









As one works on such some inaccuracies do crop up - I've noticed that the loco and tender don't quite line up - this will have to stay - something isn't quite perfect, but to change it would be basically impossible.

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

“We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.” – Dr. Carl Sagan

Online Train Waiting

  • Larger Gallery
  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2799
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
  • The Table-Top Railway.
    • Awards
Re: Dr Al's workbench - 47xx
« Reply #509 on: July 10, 2019, 07:40:13 AM »
Hello Alan

What a terrific model!  Thank you very much for your posts about it.

I think the existing cabside handrail is actually a good representation of what was fitted to these locomotives.

With best wishes.

John
'Why does the Disney Castle work so well?  Because it borrows from reality without ever slipping into it.'

(Acknowledgement: John Goodall Esq, Architectural Editor, 'Country Life'.)

The Table-Top Railway is an attempt to create, in British 'N' gauge,  a 'semi-scenic' railway in the old-fashioned style, reminiscent of the layouts of the 1920s to the 1950s.

For the made-up background to the railway and list of characters, please see here: https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=38281.msg607991#msg607991

 

Please Support Us!
January Goal: £60.00
Due Date: Jan 31
Total Receipts: £85.00
Above Goal: £25.00
Site Currency: GBP
142% 
January Donations


Advertise Here
SimplePortal 2.3.5 © 2008-2012, SimplePortal