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Author Topic: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]  (Read 4065 times)

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Offline jamespetts

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #120 on: May 24, 2019, 12:12:47 PM »
looks good

hope the videos helped

The videos are based on jig use, which is part of why I was asking about the jigs - are those American jigs actually suitable for producing UK flatbottom geometry curved turnouts?

If not, then I will have to make them (if I decide to do this at all) without jigs, which presumably would be significantly different to much of what is shown in the videos.

Online crewearpley40

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #121 on: May 24, 2019, 12:21:27 PM »
unsure.sorry was just being helpful, im looking into a problem of my own with track at the time, but have resolved
blue / grey era diesels / electrics and suitable stock

Offline njee20

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #122 on: May 24, 2019, 12:29:23 PM »
US track is all flat bottom, so ignoring things like sleeper spacing then yes, the content is relevant. I see they're actually using the Fast Tracks jigs too.

My first efforts are totally acceptable, marginally better running than Peco, but not exceptional - I've got a small vertical bump in one, which is annoying. I did have a video of stock running through my first effort, but can't now find it, maybe I didn't actually upload it. Will try and do so in due course. I'm about to relay another 4 crossovers with handbuilt ones, replacing two Peco scissors that have never worked properly, particularly in a ladder formation where stuff always derails. Not prototypical for the location either.

I found filing the angles fine, I tended to do them approximately, then put some double sided tape on a Templot template and solder them 'in situ' - using a reasonable amount of solder and then filing back to ensure the angle matches. It's a probably a bit heath robinson, and using a jig would probably give a better result, but they work fine for me.

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #123 on: May 24, 2019, 12:32:27 PM »
US track is all flat bottom, so ignoring things like sleeper spacing then yes, the content is relevant. I see they're actually using the Fast Tracks jigs too.

My first efforts are totally acceptable, marginally better running than Peco, but not exceptional - I've got a small vertical bump in one, which is annoying. I did have a video of stock running through my first effort, but can't now find it, maybe I didn't actually upload it. Will try and do so in due course. I'm about to relay another 4 crossovers with handbuilt ones, replacing two Peco scissors that have never worked properly, particularly in a ladder formation where stuff always derails. Not prototypical for the location either.

I found filing the angles fine, I tended to do them approximately, then put some double sided tape on a Templot template and solder them 'in situ' - using a reasonable amount of solder and then filing back to ensure the angle matches. It's a probably a bit heath robinson, and using a jig would probably give a better result, but they work fine for me.

That is very helpful - thank you.

May I ask where you managed to obtain the correct width of copper clad?

Offline njee20

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #124 on: May 24, 2019, 12:37:00 PM »
2mm Scale Association - you just cut down the 50mm bearers, they cut easily with a Stanley knife.

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #125 on: May 24, 2019, 12:46:52 PM »
2mm Scale Association - you just cut down the 50mm bearers, they cut easily with a Stanley knife.

Splendid, thank you.

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #126 on: May 26, 2019, 10:12:28 PM »
I had a very interesting afternoon to-day at the Model Railway Club's points building workshop. Although this was aimed at EM gauge, most of the techniques would be applicable to N gauge. It was a partial course, in that we did not have the opportunity to build a whole set of points, but we were taught the theory of construction and given an opportunity to file the switch blades and produce the crossing Vs, which, the instructor said, were the most difficult parts.

We did this with EM Gauge Society jigs, and, using these jigs, this was not too hard at all, and I was able to produce in the course of the afternoon a serviceable set of switch rails and a serviceable V.

This does suggest that it might well be feasible to use the copperclad method to produce the main line points for this layout.

However, there is a possible issue: it is difficult to find a full range of jigs, and I have doubts about whether it would be feasible for me to make these without jigs. The 2mm Scale Association sell rail filing jigs in:
  • 1:5
  • 1:6
  • 1:7
  • 1:8
  • 1:10



Although these are from the 2mm Scale Association, if I have understood correctly, these jigs should in principle work with any code 40 track, as the switch blade and crossing filing/soldering is not gauge specific. This does not, of course, apply to the turnout assembly jigs, which are a different thing entirely.

Unfortunately, the 2mm Scale Association is missing 1:9, 1:11 and 1:12 jigs, which sizes I am likely to find useful (judging from what I have done in Templot so far). I am not likely to find it feasible to build these without jigs.

The US "Fast Tracks" manufacturer does seem to sell jigs for these sizes in code 40. Again, these are soldering jigs rather than the large assembly jigs; there also seem to be filing jigs in these sizes. Knowing now more about the process of producing points than I did when I last looked at this, these jigs would be geometry/scale agnostic: all that seems to be important is the crossing angle and rail size (e.g. code 40). They even seem to have jigs for filing the stock rail flat at the switches, which is likely to be useful especially for flatbottom rail.

As to the copper clad, Marcway seem to sell 2mm wide pre-cut copper clad strips, which seem to be the correct width for N gauge as well as 2mm finescale (measuring from my Templot printout).

Fast Tracks also seem to sell three point gauges for N gauge - I am not sure whether these are readily available anywhere else, but I have not had much success in finding them in the UK.

It does therefore seem at least potentially feasible, albeit requiring the purchase of a number of expensive jigs from the USA.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2019, 10:13:45 PM by jamespetts »

Online crewearpley40

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #127 on: May 26, 2019, 10:18:33 PM »
james glad it went well


look forward to locos /stock info

blue / grey era diesels / electrics and suitable stock

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #128 on: May 26, 2019, 10:32:16 PM »
james glad it went well


look forward to locos /stock info

What sort of information had you in mind? Apart from the yet to be released class 50s and some freight wagons, I have most of the rolling stock for this layout; did you want me to list what I have?

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #129 on: May 26, 2019, 10:38:20 PM »
Thanks for track update. No just into operations of trains including real life and will wait til the 50s arrive. Good luck and thanks for posting
blue / grey era diesels / electrics and suitable stock

Offline njee20

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #130 on: May 27, 2019, 09:15:13 PM »
Iíd just use the 2mm SA copper clad strip myself, rather than the Marcway stuff, whatís the logic there?

You canít use the 2mm Jigs for FB track without modification - you need to put the rails in orientated differently, and the groove doesnít take the foot of the FB rail.

The Fast tracks ones will work, but are very expensive. They do filing and assembly jigs though.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2019, 09:18:31 PM by njee20 »

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #131 on: May 27, 2019, 09:27:08 PM »
Iíd just use the 2mm SA copper clad strip myself, rather than the Marcway stuff, whatís the logic there?

You canít use the 2mm Jigs for FB track without modification - you need to put the rails in orientated differently, and the groove doesnít take the foot of the FB rail.

The Fast tracks ones will work, but are very expensive. They do filing and assembly jigs though.

Thank you for the information regarding the 2mm Scale Association jigs - that is very useful. May I ask what the disadvantage of the Marcway copperclad is?

Offline njee20

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #132 on: May 27, 2019, 09:58:04 PM »
No idea, but the obvious choice is the 2mm Scale Association, who do exactly the right product. You donít want 17mm sleepers, thatís for plain track, and the lack of a price may mean they no longer do them. You need much longer bearers for turnouts.

The products in other gauges Marcway sell are way more expensive than the 2mm SA too, who do 500 sleepers, correctly profiled for concrete and already gapped for £5 or so, and their packs of 75 50mm strips are about £3.

Before spending literally hundreds of pounds on Fast Tracks gauges why not have a go? I know people who have made excellent track without gauges.

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #133 on: May 30, 2019, 09:12:16 PM »
I have doubts that I will be able to make points without jigs: I am not good at freehand work generally.

As to copper clad strips, the difference in cost between Marcway and the 2mm Scale Association does not take into account the cost of joining the association; joining an entire association just to buy some copper clad seems a bit excessive.

Incidentally, I would not be wanting the copper clad to simulate concrete, but wooden sleepers, as points had wooden bearers in the 1980s even if the plain track was concrete. That began to change in the 1990s, I believe, but this model is set in 1989.



In any event, I have been making more progress in laying the fiddle yard track:

Track laying progress by James Petts, on Flickr

Track laying progress by James Petts, on Flickr

Offline njee20

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Re: Oxcott [Thames valley 1989/Network SouthEast]
« Reply #134 on: May 30, 2019, 09:53:01 PM »
Yes, sorry the packs of plain sleepers (for plain line) are available with (or without) the central 'depression' for concrete (and are available in a pack of 500). The bearers are just plain.

The Marcway ones you linked to aren't right, they're sleepers, not bearers. Marcway do do 2mm strip here, 6x36" is £11, presumably plus postage. So that's 5.5m for £11, or £2/m. The 2mm SA sells a pack of 75x50mm for £2.50, or 67p per metre. You don't need to order much to cover the cost of membership. Given you're talking about using the 2mm SA jigs I assumed you were going to join?

Fiddle yard looks good though, never have too much fiddle yard space!

 

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