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Author Topic: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)  (Read 7209 times)

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Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #120 on: April 08, 2019, 10:13:42 PM »
Well plans are made for changing.

I went out to the shed with some full size plan prints and straight away saw that the existing layout position bore no relation to my original plan. I forgot that I had to move some boards around to get clearance for my belly and to incorporate a lifting section that I hadn't planned on.

So after taking many careful measurements on strategic points on the existing trackwork I was able to fix my Scarm plan so that it did represent fairly accurately what actually exists in the shed.

I was then able to redo the plan, and I took the opportunity to make sure I have at least 2 foot clearance between the walls of the shed and the baseboards.

So here's the revised plan.



The Atherton line is now much closer to the mainline but will be hidden as it is on a 2% down grade, the line from the fiddle yard will eventually pass over the Atherton line to rejoin the mainline in a large loop filled with track.

The Atherton line will also loop around the shed to join up with the Kirkby line, so I shall have continuous running on both the lines through Wigan NW and Wallgate.

I still have to check these plans for size but I am a lot more confident that they will fit, next up is to construct some baseboards to carry all of this.

Regards,

John P

Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #121 on: April 21, 2019, 05:03:09 PM »
Hi,

Time for an update.

In preparation for building the extension through Wigan South I decided that everything already built should be finished and thoroughly tested, otherwise laying more track and points would be a bit of a waste of time.

This turned out to be a good plan as finishing off the storage yard highlighted a bunch of issues that had to be sorted.

I added a couple more sidings and then tried to get all my Pendolinos to run into them, so that they were out of the way of the main line.

Disaster! There were issues with the lifting section and with them getting stuck on track pins in the sidings.

The lifting section was my first attempt and it has been rebuilt once already, but I could see that the hinged section wasn't true, which caused problems with both horizontal and vertical alignment, and when I jiggled the baseboards around to get it true this happened.



The soldered track sections were fractionally too long, so I decided to rebuild it for a third time. The tracks on the baseboard along with the PCB were lifted and trimmed and realigned. The hinged bit got 2 screws so that its height could be accurately adjusted and I ended up with this.



All 4 of my Pendos were then, slowly, driven out of the sidings and around the layout to test out the new section, 2 in each direction.
The new lifting section works much better and all 4 Pendos can manage it at speed with no issues. Putting them back in the sidings resulted in various issues with track pins standing proud so these were removed and all was well.

I now have around 6 more sidings to do and the storage yards will be finished.

As I said earlier I had to redo the plans for the tracks south of Wigan but now they look to be OK. Here they are laid out on the layout and on the floor to make sure that they join up with what's already there and that I can get around them.





And finally a 156 posed in the bay at NorthWestern.



This week I'll be finishing up the storage sidings and then I can get cracking on the extension. Although I also have 4 loco's to chip, and another half dozen that need fixed. I'm also planning on starting the platforms at North Western.

Regards,

John P

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #122 on: April 21, 2019, 06:37:43 PM »
looking good thank you for the progress reports and an interesting project being a warrington lad.
blue / grey era diesels / electrics and suitable stock

Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #123 on: April 27, 2019, 01:18:02 AM »
I managed a few hours in the train shed this week, and things have gone reasonably well.

I added two more sidings to my storage yards, leaving just 2 sets if points to create 4 more sidings, but that will have to wait as I have run out of wire and baseboard. I'll pick up some more wire over the weekend and if I get time I'll add some small baseboard extensions so that I can finish the sidings.

Today I decided on a change of tack, and decided to revisit some non runners and other locos that needed attention, all of these locos are Farish 66's with the older style hard wire DCC decoder PCB.

First I the body of a Colas 66 whose lights were always on, it tuned out to be the common return on a Zimo Decoder that was hardwired in, the wire was protruding just a little too far at the bottom of the PCB and it was touching the chassis, the wire was trimmed and the chassis covered in that area with Kapton tape just to be sure.

Next up was a DRS Malcolm 66 that has a decoder wired in. This didn't work out to well. It was easy enough to get the loco running again, first on DC and then on DCC, but whenever I put the body back on it would stop working, I also tried taping the wires in pace using Kapton tape and this had exactly the same effect. I messed around with this for an hour or so before I gave up to try something else.

I started work on EWS 66098 which had been working fine with a hardwired decoder and had suddenly stopped working.I had already removed the decoder to get it back to running on DC but it still didn't work. So back to basics, I removed the PCB and the bogies and ran 2 wires from my DC controller straight to the motor terminals, it worked. Then I replaced the PCB and checked that I had contact between the chassis and the motor terminals with a multimeter, I did. Then I put the loco upside down in a cradle and applied DC to the chassis pickups and again the motor worked. After checking that the bogie pickups had good contact I put it together and it ran fine on my DC test track. Then I hardwired the decoder back in, it didn't work, after a bit of head scratching and testing I began to suspect the two 'fingers' that are soldered under the PCB and make sprung contact with the motor terminals, on this model they had quite long insulating sleeves, I removed the sleeves and everything worked on DC and DCC, so 66098 went back onto the layout.

I then fiddled around with 2 very old chassis, whose locos had died a while ago. Both motors run fine but I only had enough working bogies to get one chassis up and running. The first chassis was from an EWS 66 that I had abused on a 3% gradient hauling 20 HTA's up hill. The bogies are toast as the wheels spin freely on their axles even though the gears don't move, I set this one aside for a later date. The second was from a GBRF 66, this one took a bit of TLC but I was able to get the motor running and then the PCB contact fingers fettled and finally added a pair of bogies and got it running pretty well, even though it is a bit noisy. I decided to use the body for 66701 in the plain blue and yellow GBRF livery, rather than the body for Sunderland FC as that is is the much older First/GBRF livery. The main cosmetic issue with this loco is that one of its bogies is from 'Sunderland FC' and the wheels have white tyres, the other bogie has the steps in the wrong place. When I have the time and patience I shall build up some alternative bogies using some spare frames and wheels that I have to make things more accurate.

So all in all not bad for an afternoon. I now have 3 locos running that had issues before. Over the weekend I'll put a decoder into GBRF 66701 and get that onto the layout, I'll leave the Malcolm liveried loco for another day.

Regards,

John P


Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #124 on: April 28, 2019, 02:47:59 AM »
So the loco resurrection continues! with pictures.

Here's the Colas 66 with its lights OFF.



And EWS 66098



I also fiddled around with bogie frames and got GBRF 66701 with steps that line up properly on the bogies and body sides.





66701 has yet to be converted to DCC, but it may well get a decoder from Malcolm the Naughty Engine!

Works fine like this (minus lights)



But refuses to move like this



And before you all start , I know it needs to be on the track to move!

Pulling the lighting wires from the chassis was one of many unsuccessful experiments.

If it doesn't behave, the bogies may be donated to another EWS 66 to get it running again.

Regards,

John P


Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #125 on: April 30, 2019, 12:38:55 AM »
So updates coming thick and fast now.

I added decoders to my Dapol Pacer today, the Next18 format allows manufacturers to build in more flexibility but that also means programming more than just an address to get things going. The driving car is a simple drop in and change the address, then its lights are controlled by F0, pretty standard. The trailer however uses the AUX1 and AUX2 outputs to control the white and red lights independently, so by default F1 and F2 control the white and red lights independently. In order to get just F1 controlling the lights means setting CV's to do some Function mapping and also to set directional behaviour on the AUX1 and AUX2 outputs.

Here it is in all its glory.



And 66701 on a cement train, I have yet to add its nameplates cos I only just found them.



Next I have a couple of Grey 86's to use as chassis donors to fix green one's that are broken.

Regards,

John P

Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #126 on: May 05, 2019, 08:54:05 PM »
Well my loco repair mojo hasn't quite worked out as I hoped.

Both my Freightliner plain green 86''s have lights issues. The culprit is this incredibly naff way of connecting the chassis to the LED's in the cab



These wires come of the cab pcb very easily as there is no strain relief and the wires are not very long, meaning that the first time you remove the body to chip the loco there's a 50/50 chance that you'll lift the body too high and pull the wires from the PCB.

I obtained a couple of cheap Freight sector 86's thinking (mistakenly), that I could do a simple body swap to get lights working again.

This isn't possible as the whole CAB and light molding appears to be glued into the bodyshell.

Anyhow I got the big hammer out and managed to prise the lighting PCB away from the rest of the cab moulding to see if I could reattach the wires.

This is what the light PCB looks like

Front (facing the cab) with a white and red LED



and back, where the wires are soldered



Now, underneath all that black paint? are the solder pads for the 3 wires needed for the LEDs. I tried to solder these in situ but all I managed to do was to slightly damage the bodyshell of one of the 86's with my hot iron.

Once the LED PCB is out of the body it is relatively easy to clean up the wire side and solder the wires back on.

Once this was done I attached both PCB's to a dummy chassis and both worked fine.

Then it just a case of gluing it back on here



Like this



Now as soon as I put the body shell back on the chassis the wires fell off again.

I've been through this process 3 times now and I'm beginning to get annoyed!

I put the 86's to one side and decided to take a look at my 2 Dapol Voyagers.

One, a XC CL221 Voyager has worked intermittently since I got it. I tried it on my DC test track and the power car seemed to work quite well, it also performed OK on DCC on my layout, but on further examination I could see that there was something wrong on one of the powered bogies.

I took the power car apart and could see that the wheels were so close together that the gear mechanism could disengage from the main gear train, I adjusted the back to back on this axle and things got a lot better, although there is still a fair amount of squealing which I hope to get to the bottom of today.

On a much happier note, my second Voyager, a Virgin CL220, which was perhaps the 2nd modern loco that I purchased around 10 years ago, came good.

It hasn't run well since I got it. I took the power car apart and applied DC straight to the motor and everything worked fine, the motor ran and all the wheels on the motor bogies turned without any issues. I took a closer look and the reason that it wouldn't run on the track is that the wheels were filthy, I mean black. I used an old blade on a craft knife to get rid of the thickest grunge and then cleaned the wheels using IPA. Once this was done the motor car ran around my DC test track with no issues.

The only problem is that I now need to buy 3 decoders to get it prepared for running on the main layout.

I shall persevere with the other Voyager and the 86's and hopefully have better news next week.

Getting back to the layout my fiddle yard board sprouted a bump so that I can get the last 2 sidings laid, the yard is slightly off centre so the other side shouldn't need the same treatment,



Regards,

John P

Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #127 on: May 07, 2019, 05:27:19 PM »
So I thought I would demonstrate my new and improved point motor installation process.

I'm using XPS as a baseboard so cutting it is pretty easy.

I started out mounting my Tortoise motors like this.



It worked, but it means there is a job to be done patching the holes before ballasting and scenery can be done.

Then I tried this



Here I cut a hole and glued the motor to the bottom of the XPS and then glued it back in place.
This didn't work as the XPS is an inch thick and the Tortoise internal switch changes polarity before the point blades have started to move causing a temporary short.

So I refined my method.

First I use the template that comes with the motor to mark out the 4 locating holes and the tie bar hole on the baseboard, along with the front edge of the hole to be cut.



Then I line up the motor over the locating hole marks and finish drawing the outline of the hole. I deliberately leave no room at the back and sides as that makes it easier to line up the motor later.





I then cut out the XPS piece and carefully slice it in half, so that it is now 1/2" thick.



The knife shown is specifically designed to cut through the XPS, it isn't serrated.

I then widen the hole for the tie bar pin into a small rectangular slot and glue the assembled motor to the bottom of the XPS using a hot glue gun.





The assembled piece is then glued back into the baseboard, but not until connectors are added to the 5 wires that I shall be using.



And here's the finished result.



I wire up the motor and make sure all is well before I cut the tie bar wire down.

This works very well with no shorts occurring so I shall be doing this for all future point motor installations.

And here are a couple of videos of very noisy, but not sound equipped, Dapol Voyagers.

First my Virgin Voyager power car resurrected after 10 years, still DC only.



and then my XC Voyager, I had to loosen the screws holding the bogies in place and work on the back to back of the troublesome axle to get this running better.



I should be getting decoders for the Virgin Voyager in the post today, and then I'll be finishing my storage yard before I commence on the extension for Wigan South.

Regards,

John P



Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #128 on: May 13, 2019, 06:05:10 PM »
I have now finished the storage yards, not big enough!, and got most of my loco's and mu's running.

Having run out of excuses it is time to start extending the layout.

First I had to clear some space by moving shelf units and a bookcase out of the way.

The shelves are now tucked away beside my workbench



The layout won't ever come near here so they shouldn't need moved again.

I also moved a bookcase full of Railway Modellers to the space where the shelves were.



You can see in the shot above, that I already made two 4'x2' baseboard frames and have started to position them with the full size plan.

This area is the trickiest as I have new baseboards running horizontal to the wall, plus two more coming in at different angles and different heights. The height difference (1/2 inch) is caused by me being a numpty and forgetting that the railway shed was intended to double up as a garage and has a sloping floor.

I laid the plans out over the new baseboards to see where they would best fit and to figure out where to leave space for my and my belly to reach all the tracks.

These are the lines out of Wigan, the Westhoughton line on the right hand side will be dropping two inches on a 2% slope to get it under the main lines further down.



BTW, I know it's technically the Atherton line, but I'm from Westhoughton.  :D

This next one shows how the line from the storage yard joins the pack, along with a fifth line appearing as part of the complex junctions south of Wigan where the 4 track DS, DF, UF, US becomes the 6 track DS, US, DF, UF, D Freight, U Freight. Lots of points will be needed for this.



I've started fixing the baseboards in place and adding a mixture of 1" XPS (the pink stuff) and Woodland Scenics risers and inclines to get all the tracks level and the gradient sorted for the Westhoughton line.

More to come.

John P

Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #129 on: May 25, 2019, 03:35:33 AM »
So more baseboards were made last weekend and plans laid out.

Here's the gradient taking shape for the Westhoughton line



And the plans laid out for the mess of tracks and points leading up to Springs Branch





But then, disaster!

I'd forgot to plan for one critical dimension, my waist size.

It was pretty obvious that the baseboards would be too close together to get between them for access.



So I had to get back to my laptop and redo my plans.

Luckily I was able to realign the baseboards without having to make any drastic changes to the plan, so this weekend there should be more progress.

Regards,

John P

Online crewearpley40

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #130 on: May 25, 2019, 05:52:30 AM »
Looking good. Especially the gradient 
blue / grey era diesels / electrics and suitable stock

Offline Innovationgame

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #131 on: May 25, 2019, 07:55:59 AM »
That looks like a very thorough planning and construction job. :beers:
With kind regards
Laurence
My personal website is a bit of a mish mash: www.innovationgame.com
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Online crewearpley40

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #132 on: May 25, 2019, 08:17:50 AM »
Agree. What did you use to construct the incline please
blue / grey era diesels / electrics and suitable stock

Offline jpendle

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #133 on: May 25, 2019, 03:10:12 PM »
Agree. What did you use to construct the incline please

I use Woddland SCenics, or Woodland Scenics if you prefer  :D, risers and inclines.

The risers are 2' long and come in a variety of heights, I use 1/2", 1", and 2". They are flexible so they can be glued in place around curves.
The inclines come as various different gradients, again they are 2' long and I use the 2% inclines, so each incline adjusts the track height by 1/2", again they are flexible and can be used on curves. They are relatively expensive even here in the US, so as the XPS baseboard material I am using is also 1" thick, I can also use that and mix and match it with the Woodland Scenics stuff.

BUT IMHO if you need elevated or inclined track on a curve, or are forming an embankment, it is good value for money.

Regards,

John P

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Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
« Reply #134 on: May 25, 2019, 03:19:03 PM »
Looking good. That was a well written tutorial and i remember the area in the late 80s /90s
blue / grey era diesels / electrics and suitable stock

 

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