N Gauge Forum

General Category => Real Railway Discussion => Topic started by: Newportnobby on May 15, 2019, 11:46:23 AM

Title: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Newportnobby on May 15, 2019, 11:46:23 AM
Let me start out by stating I have no concerns about anyone committing suicide. It's their choice (although not always in the right frame of mind to make such a decision) but all I would say is find a way to do it which affects no one else's life. A truly sad tale.......

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/train-driver-killed-himself-spiralling-203740175.html
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 15, 2019, 01:16:53 PM
Interesting article. Apparently at train driver / guard training school the trainees and indeed refresher classes mindnumbing videos are shown. You have to feel for those affected by what they have experienced / seen. And the affect which it may have on their lives
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Chris Morris on May 15, 2019, 02:24:13 PM
You have to feel sorry for all concerned. Unfortunately jumping in front of a train is a very effective way of doing away with yourself but it will have a terrible effect on drivers even though there is absolutely nothing they can do about it.
I have heard those in the business refer to suicides as a splat. This is not disrespectful;  I think it helps them to be able to cope with what has happened.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: stevewalker on May 15, 2019, 02:52:02 PM
To be fair, suicidal people are often beyond thinking of the consequences for others and may even think that it is relieving others from their burden. A friend of ours suffered psychosis and was convinced that he was being watched and that if he met up with any of his friends, they'd be harmed. He even called in a police stations a number of times, convinced that our 2-year old son had been kidnapped. In the end, probably to protect those he thought at risk, he managed to get out of the hospital (through staff failures) and head (we think) straight to the tram lines to kill himself. There happened to be no trams passing at that moment and so he threw himself under an HGV instead and was killed. Luckily he missed the tractor unit and went under the trailer, so the driver didn't see it - indeed the driver didn't know it had happened and it was only another driver following him and stopping him that alerted him. The ones that mean it don't hang around and I can only sympathise with them - the ones wanting attention (even if rightly for help that they deserve) and standing on motorway bridges for hours before "giving in" to being talked down, I can get quite angry with.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Intercity on May 15, 2019, 03:27:51 PM
Fatalities are very difficult to deal with, as a driver myself and having to go through the ordeal twice I can say it is never easy.

If it is unfolding in front of you the best advice I can give is once you know it is inevitable plug the train (place it in emergency) and look away, either down or behind you, you will know the moment of impact, the one thing you donít want to do is make eye contact, those last images will haunt you day and night for the rest of your life, let alone the nightmares and bad dreams that are almost inevitable after the event.

The company will have a counselor service/assistance program set up to help you through it, sometimes it helps, sometimes it doesnít, more advice, it doesnít cost anything if they offer it, take it, talk to colleagues many will have been through it and can offer compassion if nothing else.

When you return to work try to keep in mind itís a new day and you have a trainload of passengers that need you to be on your A game, even when running through the area of the incident (we get a management ride on our return to duty to ensure we arenít going to melt down).

Talk to family, they may not understand, but to talk and not bottle it up really does help, you went to work to do a job, you were doing that job as you were trained to do, keep that at the forefront of your mind through the whole process.

We are told when we go the class/training itís really not a matter of if you get one, itís when you get one, my biggest fear and one shared by many drivers is hitting a school bus full of kids or a tanker truck full of fuel.

IC
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: bridgiesimon on May 15, 2019, 04:55:36 PM
Superb advice there not just for train drivers but for any of us dealing with difficult situations!!

Thank you for posting this, you may never know or realise it but your post may make the difference of someone out there.

Best wishes
Simon
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: AlexanderJesse on May 15, 2019, 04:59:44 PM
If it is unfolding in front of you the best advice I can give is once you know it is inevitable plug the train (place it in emergency) and look away, either down or behind you, you will know the moment of impact, the one thing you donít want to do is make eye contact, those last images will haunt you day and night for the rest of your life, let alone the nightmares and bad dreams that are almost inevitable after the event.
On the Swiss trains the driver is instructed to pull the plug and then pull down the sunshade so that it covers the window completely (sort of blindfold himself).
But according to some colleague who experienced it as a passenger the rumple is noticeably as well. Eventhough that is difficult to imagine given the weight of train rolling stock.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Jerry Howlett on May 15, 2019, 06:24:28 PM
It is now 45 years since I was on duty one night at Swindon Train crew depot.

I can still remember the name of the driver, the words he spoke to us as he came into the depot, and the look on his face after he had a suicide just after Gloucester in the middle of night.

I was 16 and just a booking on clerk.

Jerry
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 15, 2019, 06:56:55 PM
 :hellosign:
  My deepest sympathy for all who are affected, didn't realize it happens so often.
  As a bus driver I have had only one attempted in over 32 years, luckily slower speed, still scary.
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 15, 2019, 07:51:35 PM
8 years ago i was on the train behind  heading home

imagine the driver and the guard hearing about this

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-13063549 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-13063549)

https://www.itv.com/news/anglia/2012-04-20/passengers-relive-horror-of-woman-setting-herself-on-fire-on-a-train/ (https://www.itv.com/news/anglia/2012-04-20/passengers-relive-horror-of-woman-setting-herself-on-fire-on-a-train/)



truly one bad day and had to catch the bus home - just spare a thought
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: shanks522 on May 15, 2019, 08:31:42 PM
My dad was a driver years ago and thankfully never had anyone jump in front of him, however he told me of some other drivers, one fella pretty much had one every few months and took the attitude that it was there choice and not his fault, another through had one jump in front of him and it destroyed his life, never worked again, very sad.

Graham.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Newportnobby on May 15, 2019, 09:40:40 PM
One of my uncles was a sales guy, had driven many 1000s of miles but still knocked down and killed a 5 year old kid who just ran into the road from between parked cars. No one stood a chance and several lives were ruined that day. My uncle never drove again and had to seek a desk job.
It can be that easily done so go careful now.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Bealman on May 16, 2019, 12:59:01 AM
I have a drink on Friday evenings with a young guy who jumped in front of a train with his girlfriend. Nobody knows the exact story there, but the girlfriend was killed and he obviously survived.

If you can call it that.... no legs, half an arm. He has a wheelchair that looks like something out of a science fiction movie.

He seems ok at the moment, but I wonder if he expects to live until 70 like that.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Mr Sprue on May 16, 2019, 01:06:02 AM
"Jumpers" as they are commonly described here in the London area are sadly quite frequent, the c2c line from Southend to Fenchurch street according to a friend of mine gets its share as well!

They only experience I have had connected to this type of tragedy was I once had a customer whom I had known for many years jump into the path of a moving train at Stratford station.

If you had known the guy you would have never dreamed in a million years that he would be the type to do this, always an upbeat happy character.

The knock on effect and disruption this type of (dare I call it!) "selfish" suicide causes is quite staggering, those of course worse effected along with the poor driver are the witnesses and those involved with the clean up.

My eldest son remembers that day quite well when this person I knew committed suicide as it was chaos trying to get home from work that evening. As for the mans wife she ended up being a complete nervous wreck searching for answers she will never find!

To get some idea of the seriousness and the volume of this type of suicide the website AntiDepAware (http://antidepaware.co.uk/struck-by-a-train/) reveals some staggering numbers!


Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Bealman on May 16, 2019, 01:11:01 AM
On our Japanese adventure last year, Bealette was an hour and a half late to one of our meet-ups because someone had jumped in front of her train. A teenager, she reckoned.

It happens everywhere, unfortunately.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 16, 2019, 05:36:17 AM
george will remember that. the young man willhave it on his conscience for the remainder of his life !!!
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: njee20 on May 16, 2019, 09:20:50 AM
A friend of mine got hit by some of the Ďremainsí when someone jumped in front of a train at a busy station in rush hour. Truly horrific. As others have said, I know most people are not in a rational frame of mind, but itís a truly horrific way to kill yourself and grossly unfair on those it affects.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: stevewalker on May 16, 2019, 11:01:52 AM
I have a drink on Friday evenings with a young guy who jumped in front of a train with his girlfriend. Nobody knows the exact story there, but the girlfriend was killed and he obviously survived.

If you can call it that.... no legs, half an arm.

My wife was a nurse in A&E many years ago when the call came in of a "one under." He too lost both legs, but survived.

She actually found another one more upsetting, after she'd retrained as a mental health nurse. A guy in his 40s took a paracetamol overdose, but woke up from it. He ended up in hospital, where he decided that he really wanted to live and be with his family, but it was too late for the antidote to work. The paracetamol destroyed his liver and he died over a period of days.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: moogle on May 16, 2019, 12:16:39 PM
Sadly with modern life getting more and more pressurised this will only happen more often. The reasons people commit suicide are numerous. Jobs getting replaced by machines, benefit sanctions, relationship breakdowns are just a few I can think of without any mental health issues coming into the equation. It is sad that someone commits suicide, but I suppose its better than them going 'Postal' somewhere...
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: njee20 on May 16, 2019, 12:18:21 PM
Actually suicide rates have shown a general downward trend in the last 40 years.

(http://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-7749/assets/9baa7d19-20ab-4401-abf7-bcab473a73e6.png)

I'm not really sure 'modern life' is more pressurised, just different pressures.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: NeMo on May 16, 2019, 12:25:13 PM
Sadly with modern life getting more and more pressurised this will only happen more often.

Except this isn't what's happening.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/suicidesintheunitedkingdom/2017registrations (https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/suicidesintheunitedkingdom/2017registrations)

Cheers, NeMo

@njee20 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=1147) beat me to it!

@moogle (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=155) makes a valid point about life being stressful, but I think it always has been. The nature of the stress factors have changed though. Is being out of work for 6 months the same level of stress as living through a world war? Do teenagers struggling with social media have the same level of stress as 7-year-old children that were pushed up chimneys instead of sent to school?

Not sure these things are comparable, and what we should be asking ourselves is do we recognise and treat mental health issues correctly and fairly?

Cheers, NeMo
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: moogle on May 16, 2019, 12:29:27 PM
I think it depends where you live. I wasn't just referring to the UK. Should have made it clearer.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: njee20 on May 16, 2019, 12:35:15 PM
Which obviously led me to Google global suicide rates, and it's interesting that they're declining more or less everywhere. Sure there are exceptions, but that's got to be a good thing!

(https://cdn.static-economist.com/sites/default/files/images/print-edition/20181124_IRC811.png)
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: moogle on May 16, 2019, 12:42:20 PM

Not sure these things are comparable, and what we should be asking ourselves is do we recognise and treat mental health issues correctly and fairly?

Cheers, NeMo

Spot on NeMo. Stress, anxiety and excessive worrying caused by 'modern' versions of pressurised life are all factors that can affect someones mental health. Sadly not everyone notices that their mental health is suffering and not everyone gets help. There's often little or no help available and when there is there is often a waiting list because of the demand for the service.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Malc on May 17, 2019, 02:58:54 PM
I was chatting to a taxi driver on a journey from Canterbury to Birmingham, part of a Titan holiday. He said he used to be an Underground train driver, but after the fifth suicide he decided to quit. I think things must really be bad to want to do it, I canít really imagine being in that situation.
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Newportnobby on May 17, 2019, 03:24:11 PM
That must have been one helluva taxi bill, Malc :goggleeyes: :worried:
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Snowwolflair on May 17, 2019, 03:36:44 PM
Which obviously led me to Google global suicide rates, and it's interesting that they're declining more or less everywhere. Sure there are exceptions, but that's got to be a good thing!

(https://cdn.static-economist.com/sites/default/files/images/print-edition/20181124_IRC811.png)

Looks like the GRU changed their policy on death certificates  :D
Title: Re: Who'd be a train driver?
Post by: Malc on May 17, 2019, 04:25:07 PM
That must have been one helluva taxi bill, Malc :goggleeyes: :worried:
It was a Titan holiday where they offer door to door service, so I wasnít paying.