N Gauge Forum

Your Layout and Models => Layout Construction => Topic started by: jpendle on November 23, 2017, 07:26:00 PM

Title: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 23, 2017, 07:26:00 PM
OK

The first phase of the plan is done. So now I have the task of getting something up and running by December 21st!!

First some essentials:

A workbench with a kettle!

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/3871-231117184508.jpeg)


A fridge for milk and, who knows, maybe some adult beverages, as the Americans would say.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/3871-231117184553.jpeg)


Then I need to get all this tidied up and on to shelves and out of the way

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/3871-231117184654.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/3871-231117184820.jpeg)


I plan on re-using my baseboard frames, but not necessarily the MDF boards themselves.

All the points and will be salvaged for re-use. The track will be put to use when the fiddle yards are built. All the new track will be Peco Code 55 Concrete.

All points are long radius Electrofrog with Tortoise Point motors.

DCC control with a Z21 and NCE Switch 8's for point control. Frog Juicers will be used for crossings and any reverse loops. (I know there aren't any reverse loops in the plan yet).

I'm looking at alternative baseboard surface material instead of MDF. There are some, fairly rigid, insulation sheets that look like they might work. They can be cut with a Stanley knife and don't break up like polystyrene. I have bought a small piece to work with. The main question is how much support is needed and do they take screws to mount point motors.

It's Thanksgiving today, so I have a long weekend to work on this,

Next tasks, apart from tidying up, are to get an inventory of existing points and motors and then order what I need from Hattons or local suppliers (for the Tortoises).

I also need a heater and I got one on order at Amazon that should be here tomorrow. The shop is well insulated and when I'm lugging things around It's warm enough, but to do detailed work with gloves on wouldn't be a good idea!

Hattons are my cheapest source for Peco track, even when shipping to the US.

I am very lucky in that my wife bought me an HP T120 large format printer as an early Christmas present, so I can print my plan out from Scarm 1:1 on sheets up to 6'x2'.
This cost $700 reduced from $1200! I looked at printing out my plan at Fedex Office and they charge $0.40 per square foot. My plan needs 400 sq ft on 4' x 2' paper. So to print it once would cost $160, I would also have to print it from PDF rather than from Scarm. So if I print this 4 times I've got my money back. In addition it's a colour printer so backscenes come to mind as well!

The downside is there aren't any trains on my list this year!

I don't need any more rolling stock, let's face it, we never NEED rolling stock, but it would be nice if the Elves at Santa's workshop can get everyone's Pendolino's delivered!

But if they can't they'll look just as good in the New Year. (Thanks Ben and Mike)

And I still need a proper name for the layout.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Train Waiting on November 23, 2017, 07:35:10 PM
That looks very impressive, John.

I know the location fairly well, having attended many meetings in Wigan in my time.  I look forward with interest to see your plans become reality.

Happy Thanksgiving.

John
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 03, 2017, 06:37:17 PM
The Thanksgiving weekend ended up being very busy so not a lot was done.

I have managed to tidy up and start to clear space. I also experimented with some XPS to see if it would hold a point motor in place and it seems to be fine.

So after tidying I printed out some of my plan from Scarm 1:! and laid it out

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/3871-031217044336.jpeg)

It looked so big that I had to put some track on it to convince myself that it was still N Gauge.

Once the plans were in position, I started to remove my old baseboards from their frames and set the frames out to take the new baseboard tops.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/3871-031217044547.jpeg)

I still have 2 or three more frames to salvage and after that it's off to town to purchase sheets of 8' x 4' XPS plus more timber.

Oh, and in case you have seen the plan in the layout planning section, here it is again.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/3871-201117204613.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Branchie on December 03, 2017, 07:33:32 PM
Wow!

Looks like a great start. What era will it be?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 03, 2017, 08:51:53 PM
I hate to point out the obvious, but it does say contemporary in the title.   :D :D :D :D :D

So Pendolino's, CL350's, CL319's, 66's, etc,etc,etc.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 10, 2017, 10:14:47 PM
Significant progress has been made over the last 2 weeks.

First I got all my existing baseboards stripped down so that the frames could be re-used

I then built one more frame which completes the baseboard structure for the scenic section of te layout.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-101217193211.jpeg)

As there is so much room in the workshop, and as I have no intention of moving the layout, this last frame was built as 8' x 2' rather than two 4' x 2' sections.

Next XPS baseboard material was laid down temporarily and the plan was then laid on top of the boards.

XPS

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-101217193429.jpeg)

Looking 'north'

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-101217193525.jpeg)

Looking 'south'

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-101217193614.jpeg)

Once I'd done this it was obvious that everything was missaligned compared to the master plan so I spent some time moving the baseboards around so that everything lined up properly.

Next task is to secure all the baseboards in place and then start the 'superstructure' which will support the elevated sections of the layout (which is all of the WCML through Wigan).

I now have 10 days until the Grandkids arrive, so I've decided to use up some of my accrued vacation time and take the rest of the year off ;D I already had 2 weeks booked, so that's just one more week.

Will trains be running by Christmas?

Watch this space!

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Pjlons83 on December 10, 2017, 10:20:37 PM
Nothing like a deadline to motivate you! Great way to spend a few weeks holiday! Good luck!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on December 11, 2017, 08:37:16 AM
Taking annual leave in the US?! Surely not!

Looks awesome, looking forward to watching it develop!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 11, 2017, 08:26:02 PM
 :hellosign: Excellent progress, good luck with the deadline
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 13, 2017, 04:15:28 AM
Made some good progress today.

Made a start on the upper level for Wigan North Western.

I decided to use a Woodland Scenics glue gun. The gun and glue are low temp for bonding foam, so I thought it would be good on the XPS.

The first riser was held in place and to a slight curve immediately, so I went pretty fast. BUT, the glue needs time to heat up and I found that trying to deposit too much glue too quickly caused the glue to set before I had a chance to place the next riser. Anyway, lesson learned I forced myself to go a little slower between sections to allow the glue
to flow properly.

First put in the incline from Wallgate

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-131217022132.jpeg)

Then started the Upper Level.

First I used 1" risers to support the upper level.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-131217022256.jpeg)

The single 2" riser will form an embankment.

Then added another piece of 1" inch thick XPS.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-131217022423.jpeg)

At this point I ran out of 1" risers so I decided to play around mounting a Tortoise point motor.

I'm wondering if this will work, I'll find out tomorrow!

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-131217023004.jpeg)

BTW sorry for the blur on some of my photos.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 14, 2017, 02:58:46 AM
Not much visible progress today as I have spent most of my time searching for stuff.

I found my soldering iron and all my adhesives. Lots of screwdrivers and craft knives, and even my press punch. But I can't find my pin vice or the drill bits that go in it. I use this for drilling holes in track so that it can be pinned down before it is ballasted.

If any of you have seen my pin vice, please let me know!!

I was able to prove out that my point motor would work being mounted flush, I now need to assemble a short length of track at either end, wire it up and make sure a loco runs over it without problems.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-141217025014.jpeg)

I also salvaged some 2" risers from my old layout and was able to complete more of the embankment north of North Western.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-141217025106.jpeg)

Tomorrow its back to the shops to buy some Plaster bandage and more 1" risers. I already have plaster bandage, but it's just one more thing that I can't find.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on December 14, 2017, 11:07:55 AM
I bet everything is in that 'safe place', John.
Have you checked all 'man drawers'? (where all the old mobile phones, fuses, batteries, keys to Lord knows what etc are retained)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 16, 2017, 03:10:44 AM
Pin vice was found for $9.99 at local Hobby shop.

Anyway, more progress to report.

First much needed refreshment was delivered by those kind people at Amazon.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025422.jpeg)

Suitably refreshed, I then excavated the upper boards to make room for the Wallgate over bridge. (Wallgate is the name of the street as well as one of the stations)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025506.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025545.jpeg)

Then I formed the embankment north of North Western using strips of balsa set at an angle.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025630.jpeg)

Plaster bandage was added.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025721.jpeg)

And then the lot was given a coat of brown primer

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025804.jpeg)

Finally I was also able to finish off the incline out of Wallgate station with plaster bandage.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025850.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-161217025933.jpeg)

In real life there is no embankment just a slow rise in the ground level.

I also discovered that the solvent in the primer I am using eats the XPS foam board if too much is used!

Over the weekend I'll finish priming the incline and get cracking on laying track.

This will be quite slow as I plan on adding dropper wires first to any pieces of flex track used, within reason.

By Sunday I might even have a loco doing a test run.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on December 16, 2017, 04:02:55 AM
Just took my first look at this. A very impressive project indeed.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on December 16, 2017, 07:41:00 AM
Incredible progress.  You are really steaming along!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Ben A on December 16, 2017, 11:45:54 AM

Hi John,

Great project!  Thanks for posting. Do you have a track plan for the whole thing? 

Cheers

Ben A.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 16, 2017, 04:02:58 PM
Thanks all.

Ben, the track plan is at the beginning of the post. Thereís  also a couple of entries in the layout planning section.

Oh and with any luck Iíll have track laid before my Pendolinos arrive.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 18, 2017, 03:47:51 AM
Track laying commenced today.

First spent a couple of hours looking for my wire strippers.

Once they were found I started laying track only to realise that yet again all of my plans were missaligned.

I started again with my track drawings lined up at the south end of the layout and pinned everything down as I moved north.

Once this was done I was able to get my first piece of flex track and my first point and point motor in position.

More track and one more point with motor followed. All flex track is having holes pre-drilled for track pins and 2 wires soldered to the bottom of the rails. All points get 3 holes drilled, the spring removed (for slow action),plus one wire added to the frog, for polarity switching. In my experience Peco points with the spring removed don't conduct very well.

BTW all track is Code 55, and all points are Electrofrog with Tortoise point motors. Insulating rail joiners are used on all point rails except for those at the toe end.

Both the point motors installed have been tested and they work. Tomorrow, after adding a bit more track, I'll be wiring up my Z21 and trying out a loco to make sure that all the track is smooth.

Here's few pictures.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-181217033236.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-181217033315.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-181217033349.jpeg)

The first point motor got repositioned about 3 times so it's in a hole which is too big, later on I'll be packing it out a little and adding some balsa or plastic card to cover the enormous hole, currently hidden under the paper plan.

I now have 3.5 days until the grandchildren arrive.

Regards,

John
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on December 18, 2017, 07:01:22 AM
Looks good. Nice sweeping curves. Tempted to do any sort of superelevation? I just put strips of 1mmcard under mine, subtle, but it works.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Ben A on December 18, 2017, 10:16:54 AM
Ben, the track plan is at the beginning of the post. Thereís  also a couple of entries in the layout planning section.

Oh and with any luck Iíll have track laid before my Pendolinos arrive.

Regards,

John P

D'oh - not sure how I missed that!  Interesting concept and as others have said, some lovely graceful curves...

Progress looking good - Pendolinos will look great sweeping through there!

Cheers

Ben A.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 18, 2017, 02:31:55 PM
Looks good. Nice sweeping curves. Tempted to do any sort of superelevation? I just put strips of 1mmcard under mine, subtle, but it works.

Yes I did plan on superelevation and then promptly forgot about it.

Thanks for the reminder.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 18, 2017, 09:07:29 PM
 :hellosign: Thanks for the updates John, your off to a great start
        regards Derek.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 19, 2017, 03:00:28 AM
A little more progress today

4 more points were added and a little more track.

I refined my technique for soldering to track and to point vees.

I also worked a little more on fitting the point motors.

Hereís the cutout. I cut two rebates to support the tortoise.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-191217024421.jpeg)

Hereís the mess under the baseboards.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-191217024511.jpeg)

This is the piercing saw used to make the cuts

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-191217024616.jpeg)

Hereís the latest track work

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-191217024714.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-191217024813.jpeg)

Regards,

John P

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-191217024511.jpeg)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on December 19, 2017, 09:48:33 AM
Good grief! Those tortoises are monstrous :goggleeyes: Are you sure they're not turtles?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: tutenkhamunsleeping on December 19, 2017, 12:54:23 PM
Good grief! Those tortoises are monstrous :goggleeyes: Are you sure they're not turtles?

Great A'Tuin?

Still the best point motors on the market, as far as my money is concerned :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 19, 2017, 02:34:37 PM
Tortoises are pretty big so you have to plan carefully when you add them to a complex area of point work. But they can be offset either side of the track and turned around, so there is generally a way to get things done.

Normally they are mounted under the baseboard, so you can't see them. Mine will be covered before I start on ballasting.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on December 19, 2017, 06:53:32 PM
How do you fit them if you have a lot close together? Surely the footprint they need is prohibitive?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: port perran on December 19, 2017, 07:06:51 PM
So...Iím new to these tortoise point motors.
They are now in place but exactly how do I wire these up?

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/230-191217190618.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59489)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 19, 2017, 08:00:35 PM
How do you fit them if you have a lot close together? Surely the footprint they need is prohibitive?

They aren't mounted directly underneath the point, they are offset to one side, they also be used with the body of the tortoise behind the point, or in front of it. There is also the provision to offset the wire even more as they are guided through a small plastic part that has 3 holes for the wire, on in the middle and the other two to either side.

For a ladder of points in a fiddle yard there's no issue. I also used them on a single slip on my old layout.

Like I said, with a bit of thought you can arrange them to fit almost anywhere.

I expect that they wouldn't be quite as useful for a 'Z' Gauge fiddle yard.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 19, 2017, 08:01:38 PM
So...Iím new to point motors.
They are now in place but exactly how do I wire these up?

([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/230-191217190618.jpeg[/url]) ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59489[/url])


I could explain, but those animal rights people would be after me again!!

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on December 19, 2017, 08:12:28 PM
For a ladder of points in a fiddle yard there's no issue. I also used them on a single slip on my old layout.

Was thinking more of parallel tracks with crossovers, I found it hard to fit all my servos in on a 4-track line with a few consecutive or parallel crossovers, but sounds like theyíre probably sufficiently versatile you can make it work.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 20, 2017, 02:33:39 AM
Good progress today as I had all morning to concentrate on trains.

Got the North end of North Western finished apart from one headshunt, and got as far as making a start on the bay platforms before I finished for the day.

I ran out of insulating joiners, so I salvaged quite a few from the old layout to keep me going until my next goodie bag arrives from Hattons.

Here's a few pictures.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-201217022355.jpeg)

Eventually more of the XPS shown above will be cut away and a road overbridge slid underneath the tracks.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-201217022442.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-201217022516.jpeg)

Just 1.5 days to get trains running.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 21, 2017, 03:34:30 AM
So just half a day left to get some teains running.

Hereís the latest track work.

Bay platform tracks in place.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-211217032750.jpeg)

Almost done with the southern station approach tracks

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-211217032830.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 22, 2017, 06:57:45 PM
Trains are running for my grandson!!!!

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-221217185517.jpeg)

OK so I cheated.

This one is fun as well.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/3871-221217185130.jpeg)

Merry Christmas everyone.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 21, 2018, 11:49:51 PM
Finally managed to get back to the shop this weekend.

There was far too much other stuff to do, mainly playing with the grandkids toys, and my sons new drone, to get anything done over Christmas.

Today I made a lot of progress with the tracks down to Wallgate.

Hereís some pics.

Junction with WCML
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/60/3871-210118233035.jpeg)

Tracks heading under Wallgate.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/60/3871-210118233250.jpeg)

Tracks through station area

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/60/3871-210118233336.jpeg)

Regards,

John P





Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 07, 2018, 03:26:18 AM
I have finally got around to finishing all the trackwork on the scenic section.

Here are a few pictures.

Wallgate Bay platform

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/61/3871-060218023302.jpeg)

Looking towards Kirby/Southport

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/61/3871-060218023411.jpeg)

A little more work done on the WCML so that a bridge deck can be put in place. Once that is done I can make a start on superelevating the curve here.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/61/3871-060218023539.jpeg)

Of course now I've got to this stage I have realised that some key features are missing.

First there is no way for Wigan bound trains to access the bay at Wallgate as there is no crossover. In real life there is a crossover on the Kriby line just West of the WCML bridge and after the junction with the Southport line. I'm just going to add a crossover.

At North Western there is a similar issue with the bay platforms and the pointwork allowing trDDown slowains to leave the WCML and access the old L&Y at Wallgate.
Currently the only access is from the Up slow line (ie towards London). This correct as the ladder crossing which gets trains from the down slow across the fast lines and to the Up slow is much further south. I assume that this ladder was originally used by the Liverpool Wigan trains which used to terminate in the bay. Nowadays after some resignalling these trains terminate at Platform 6 which is on the down slow line, thus avoiding crossing the main line.

I have just looked closer and there is also a burrowing junction just south of Springs branch which freights can use.

There is one freight path, which is a binliner from Wilton to the Knowsley Freight terminal, which is a spur off the Kirkby line.

These trains run through Man Oxford Rd, and then on the Old L&M as far as Parkside Junction where they join the WCML and then cross over to take the line through Wallgate to Kirkby.

So I also need to add the provision for freights to get across the main line to access the line to Kirkby.

But before I do that I plan on doing some extensive test running, on the track already laid. Next tasks are to wire up all the power feeds and to get some locos running.

Once I'm happy with all the track then more baseboards can be constructed to give me a continuous run and a fiddle yard.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: keithbythe sea on February 07, 2018, 07:59:20 AM
Just caught up with is thread. Very impressive space John and cracking pace with progress to date. You will have a lot of scenery to create, need a very big terraforming team!  :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Train Waiting on February 07, 2018, 08:39:35 AM
This is looking fabulous, John.  I have travelled to Wigan (on business!) on many occasions and this is all starting to look very familiar.  I have used both stations, but, mostly, North Western.

All best wishes.

John
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on February 07, 2018, 09:28:36 AM
Looking good John - did you get any answers on your junction layout question on RMWeb?

Not sure if you're familiar with Raildar, but it has some fairly user friendly diagrams which at least show direction, and some annotation on fast/slow lines: Here (http://raildar.co.uk/map/WGN), also shows where all the passenger trains are.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 07, 2018, 02:55:05 PM
I got loads of useful info from the various train drivers on RMWEB. The sectional appendix is the business. It makes modelling a real location much easier.
I haven't tried Raildar yet but there is another website they recommended called opentraintimes, which looks pretty good.

Thanks,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 07, 2018, 03:08:09 PM
These websites are the business!!!

Looking at the Wigan section of the opentraintimes map showed 660Y approaching Wallgate from the Hindley line.

Hurrah! The Wilton binliner is now using the Man Vic to Atherton line to get to Wallgate rather than the old L&M and then the WCML.

I wonder if driver route learning was the issue, because AFAIK there have been no freights on the old L&Y main between Manchester and Wigan for a number of years.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 26, 2018, 07:35:19 PM
Testing has started!

It's been a bit cold here recently so a second heater had been installed in the shed.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/62/3871-260218193156.jpeg)

I've wired up[ my Z21 and tested out some track with 2 loco's.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/62/3871-260218155256.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/62/3871-260218155335.jpeg)

I'm going to slowly work round all the track sections and point motors to ensure that everything is working well. After that I'll need more baseboards to put in a continuous run plus storage sidings.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 03, 2018, 03:03:18 AM
Got an hour in the shop today.

Wired up my first point to an NCE Switch 8 and got it working. Used the Tortoise switch to switch the polarity of the frog.

I also tested out my 2 new Cl68ís on DC, and they are superb.

Finally I added some storage sidings to my plan, these will be added once Iíve finished testing the app existing track.

Hereís the revised plan

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/62/3871-030318025142.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on March 03, 2018, 03:19:28 AM
A mammoth project which is coming along splendidly.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: amsie on March 03, 2018, 12:17:18 PM
wow that trackwork looks impressive. 
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 04, 2018, 11:56:55 PM
Thanks Amsie.

Even though it feels like more than enough space to do anything I have found that using Scarm is a real benefit.

I decided to have 20 storage loops with the smallest one 6 foot long. This did not fit by a long way! I redid the plan with 16 loops and got it to fit in the available space.

Today I wired up to more track sections and ran a test train. I came across 2 issues. The first was that one of my conducting rail joiners had slid under the rail which caused a wagion to derail.

I also found an uneven piece of trackwork which caused my TEA tanks to come uncoupled. I also managed to break a wire when I fixed these issues.

Anyway by being slow and methodical I hope to get excellent running once this beast is complete, it's easier to fix things now rather than after ballast and scenery have been added.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Geoff on March 05, 2018, 05:25:30 AM
Nice work John just jealous of the space you have.

I shall follow this thread with respect.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 26, 2018, 12:21:08 AM
Just got back from 2 weeks in sunny Manchester, our third grandchild was born on March 9th!

Managed to get some train time and was able to ride the Parliamentary service from Reddish South to Stalybridge.

We also acquired a Ďrealí camera courtesy of our banks credit card points scheme, so hopefully picture quality will improve.

This weekend I finished wiring up the points and track at the north end of Wigan NW. There are a couple of rough spots to file down (excess solder).

I also received 2 Zimo Next18 chips for my 68ís.

Next task is to wire the south side of NW before wiring up Wallgate.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 31, 2018, 02:40:18 AM
I decided to get serious about my track laying. This means making sure my Megafrets run well even when unloaded. So far they can be pulled and propelled on my Up main line without any issues. But I do need to get a loop of track done so that I can run them a little faster.

Hereís some pics

CL56 with Megafrets

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/63/3871-310318021758.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/63/3871-310318021643.jpeg)

Full size plans for loop and fiddle yards

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/63/3871-310318021616.jpeg)

More to follow as I should have plenty of time over the Easter weekend.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 02, 2018, 04:50:31 AM
I got a new baseboard built today. This one is 8ft x 1ft, amd it may need a little more bracing of the legs.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/63/3871-020418013144.jpeg)

I also laid out some of my plans on top of my last piece of XPS. I spent a good hour getting my maths hopelessly wrong, until I realised that if each sheet of my plan is 2' wide then sheet number 5 starts 8' from the left hand wall of the shed, not 10'!

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/63/3871-020418013215.jpeg)

Next week should be a quiet work week so I'll be getting more timber and building more baseboards.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on April 02, 2018, 07:20:12 AM
At risk of highlighting something rather too late - have you considered a Ďparallelogramí shaped fiddle yard, having the exit at the opposite side to the entrance, rather than a Ďdiamondí with a through route and diverging sidings? Your outer most roads are obviously pretty short, a parallelogram does reduce your longest siding length, but means theyíre all very similar length.

Looking great though, no mean feat to get Megafrets to run smoothly unloaded, theyíre just so light!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 02, 2018, 05:31:33 PM
Plans are made to be changed.

I have thought about a parallelogram fiddle yard(s). I'm undecided as I want to minimize the number of turnouts on my main running lines, so I may stick to my 'trapezoid' scheme.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 09, 2018, 01:03:14 AM
Managed a bit more time in the shed this weekend.

Finished off the first new baseboard and levelled it out to the old ones.

Put my plans back and cut them to a better size.

This is where the old baseboard meets the new one, my plan is slightly out of kilter, but that is easily fixed.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-090418005742.jpeg)

Then its down the new baseboard to where it curves away to what will be the fiddle yards.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-090418005716.jpeg)

The crossovers are to allow trains that terminate in the yards to change direction on the main.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-090418005649.jpeg)

I'm going to try to get all the baseboards done for this side of the layout before I lay much more track.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 14, 2018, 11:38:55 PM
So today, I decided to price up my 18 road fiddle yard.

9 pounds per point, 11 per Tortoise motor. I printed a parts list from Scarm and luckily I over estimated the number of points needed. For example Scarm said 25 Small Radius LH points but actually I 'only' need 17! Even so I will need 42 points and motors which is 840 quid!!!, not counting any additional track. I do have around 8 short radius points on hand plus plenty of track from my previous layout but still that's going to hurt!

I suspect my fiddle yard will be completed in stages, with the running lines plus perhaps 4 sidings as this will minimise my initial outlay.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on April 14, 2018, 11:56:38 PM
..
 840 quid!!!, not counting any additional track.
...

 :sweat:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on April 15, 2018, 09:39:14 AM
Even so I will need 42 points and motors which is 840 quid!!!, not counting any additional track.

Might be worth looking into a Nelevator ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAPD5bakW5o (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAPD5bakW5o)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on April 15, 2018, 09:50:41 AM
Makes the classic single track GWR terminus to fiddle yard seem inviting!  ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 15, 2018, 03:36:30 PM
So far Iíve got away with using and reusing points and track from my previous layout. I had unused points for a proposed extension and plenty of Tortoise motors.

I have around a dozen small radius points from my previous layoutís storage yard. But after that its going to get expensive.

At least the other scenic section, which doesnít exist yet, will have less points, even if I do go ahead with a compressed 6 track line based around Springs Branch!

I think Iíll have to review insurance on the shed contents before much longer.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 18, 2018, 12:25:31 AM
Got done early with work today, I should have watered the new trees we planted over the weekend but it is far too windy.

So off to the train shed to get some baseboard construction done.

I have built a new 8'x2' section and needed to add the baseboard top and then line it up, as it is at an angle to its adjacent board.

For the baseboard surface I used 1" XPS again, for those of you outside the US, this is used for wall insulation, I can get an 8' x 4' 1 inch thick sheet for around $20.

This is what it looks like in the shop (albeit already snapped in two)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-180418001451.jpeg)

The real thing is twice as wide.

The same piece mounted upside down on the frame.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-180418000747-643251790.jpeg)

The start of the storage yards laid out on the new board

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-180418000743-642862039.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-180418000743-642861266.jpeg)

I then cut up a piece of XPS to join up the embankment out of Wigan NW to the new base boards. I cut out a section so that my Woodland Scenics risers would fit snugly.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-180418000745-64323184.jpeg)

And finally put the plans back on top

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-180418000746-64324126.jpeg)

I then spent an hour salvaging (finding) my old fiddle yard track and points so that they can be re-used.

I need to get some 2" wide balsa to finish off my embankment. I can then cover it with plaster bandage and get started on some serious track laying.

I'll be super-elevating the tracks around the curve, and I need to put together a bridge kit for where the main line crosses over the old L&YR to Southport/Kirkby.

The BIG question remains, can I build a layout faster than either Rapido or Revolution can dispatch parcels? I have a City of Brum on order direct from Revolution as well as my original order from Rapido.

Regards,

John P





Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on April 18, 2018, 07:32:59 AM
Whichever gets there first itíll look great with trains sweeping around those curves!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on April 18, 2018, 07:35:57 AM
Are they going to be superelevated?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on April 18, 2018, 08:29:15 AM
2 posts ago... ;)

I'll be super-elevating the tracks around the curve, and I need to put together a bridge kit for where the main line crosses over the old L&YR to Southport/Kirkby.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 20, 2018, 01:05:10 AM
Today I put together a KS Laser Designs bridge. This is a model of one at Manchester Oxford Rd, so it is relatively contemporary to the bridge over the L&Y at Wigan, I have a second kit which I'm going to bash to create the bridge over Wallgate (street).

Here it is

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418004754-64368514.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418004751-64365781.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418004756-64369711.jpeg)

There isn't quite enough clearance for the L&YR tracks so I'll be curving them under the bridge, rather than having them straight as currently seen

I then finished up the embankment.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418004750-643381042.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418004751-643662360.jpeg)

I thought about priming the bridge, but that would obscure the detail of the brickwork, etc. I'll try some washes of acrylic paint to see how that turns out.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on April 20, 2018, 07:41:36 AM
The bridge looks really good.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 20, 2018, 02:40:20 PM
The bridge looks really good.

I hope I donít ruin it with paint!!!

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 20, 2018, 11:27:49 PM
I got the embankment finished today with my first attempt at superelevation.

I created the superelevation using 1/32" balsa, for the track base, which I then packed on one side with another thin strip of 1/32 balsa.

The effect may be exaggerated, but I can always pack up the other side to reduce the cant, if necessary.

I would appreciate people's criticism on the curves, as I would like to do it 'right'.

Here's the down line with a wagon for perspective

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418231529-643911660.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418231528-643902207.jpeg)

And a very blurred close up showing the worst,steepest cant.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418231531-64392272.jpeg)

Here's the up line under construction.

First the strips of balsa to create the cant.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418231532-643931988.jpeg)

More balsa is then used to create a canted track bed and the track laid on top.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418231527-643891075.jpeg)

I the laid conventional curved track on the approach to the storage yard crossovers.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-200418231524-643774.jpeg)

Over the weekend I have one more long radius point to salvage off my old layout, then I'll clean up all 4 points and lay them, not forgetting the tortoise motors underneath.

After that I can make a start on the storage yards proper.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on April 21, 2018, 06:31:08 AM
The curves look fine.  The embankment is a bit steep but I think we all need to compress things a bit to get everything into a model.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 23, 2018, 02:39:00 AM
Over the weekend I started to install the crossovers that will allow trains to cross from up to down and vice versa as they enter or exit the storage yards heading from the north end of Wigan NW.

I thought I'd show some detail on how I install the Tortoise motors that I am using.

First I mark the center of the tie bar and then mark out around a point motor.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-230418021718-644731961.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-230418021719-64474668.jpeg)

I then cut out the paper and double check that I've got the outline correct

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-230418021719-644751743.jpeg)

I then cut out a hole in the XPS and check that the motor is an interference fit.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-230418021720-644761803.jpeg)

I then cut out rebates so that the motor will sit below the track level.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-230418021716-644582035.jpeg)

Once everything is working the whole thing can be covered using thin balsa wood.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/64/3871-230418021717-644711720.jpeg)

I'm now using points that were in place on my last layout, so they need cleaned up a little and any soldered rail joiners removed.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 30, 2018, 01:41:35 AM
We finally got some warm weather here, so very little time was to be had in the train shed. I managed an hour on Saturday morning and decided to fix my 8 x 1 baseboard to its adjacent boards as it was far too wobbly and prone to move.

Once that was done I spent a happy hour and a half with a friend trying to figure out how to attach the mower deck back on to my lawn tractor.

Once attached the rest of the weekend was spent mowing our 5 acres of pasture.

Our 1/2 acre of lawn, on the other hand, is still dormant as we haven't got our water turned on yet.

I also had to water the 31 trees that we planted, I say trees, a more accurate description would be saplings, or even more accurate would be twigs!

Hopefully Iíll get some time in the evenings this week.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: DaveGlew on April 30, 2018, 06:58:49 AM
Sounds like a few sheep would mean you had more time for railway business. As a bonus, selling the mower could provide funds for more stock  :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on April 30, 2018, 10:39:55 AM
I like your style/thinking, Dave :thumbsup: :D
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 08, 2018, 01:26:38 AM
So this week I was able to get the crossovers at the approach to the fiddle yards wired up to an NCE Switch8 and tested. They needed a bit of fettling but I got them all working.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-080518011422-65070783.jpeg)

I then laid out my plans on the floor and realised that I would hit the fridge before  I started the curve back round to the main Wigan boards.

So new baseboards were constructed and things were move around until I arrived at this solution.

First a tighter curve from the existing boards to the fiddle yard.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-080518011420-65066694.jpeg)

A view looking down the yard.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-080518011421-650681084.jpeg)

The gap where I'll need a removable section so that I don't have to crawl underneath the layout to get into the middle.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-080518011421-65068910.jpeg)

I also ordered some of these after seeing them on RMWEB.

They are Wago splicing connectors and IMHO are ideal for wiring up a DCC bus to droppers.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-080518011416-650641223.jpeg)

All 3 connections are shorted together, so you have a guzinter, a guzouter, and a third terminal for a power dropper. Two are needed for each DCC bus power drop.

No screwdrivers are needed.

Here's the box

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-080518011419-650661390.jpeg)

I can't believe that its taken me 4 years to discover these things.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: GreyWolf on May 08, 2018, 06:58:36 AM

I also ordered some of these after seeing them on RMWEB.

They are Wago splicing connectors and IMHO are ideal for wiring up a DCC bus to droppers.

([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-080518011416-650641223.jpeg[/url])

All 3 connections are shorted together, so you have a guzinter, a guzouter, and a third terminal for a power dropper. Two are needed for each DCC bus power drop.

No screwdrivers are needed.

I can't believe that its taken me 4 years to discover these things.

Regards,

John P


Hi John - yup I spotted these on 'tin 'ternrt too ... SOOO easy to use! They come in "fives'ers" too, but the three'sers are fine for conecting droppers to the bus wires.

Cheers  :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 20, 2018, 04:37:49 AM
Very little has been done over the past week because this arrived.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-200518042707-6552797.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-200518042221-655151691.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-200518042233-655231597.jpeg)

Anyway I finished playing and got some work done on the layout.

I'm making a lift up section so that I can get to the 1st operating well.

The hinged section is made out of ply.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-200518042633-6552599.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-200518042635-655261944.jpeg)

I also built up the baseboard so that all the tracks will be level.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/65/3871-200518042708-65528519.jpeg)

Next I need to add the first track, I plan on  soldering the tracks to screws mounted flush in the ply.

This is the first time I've tried this so we'll see how it goes.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 06, 2018, 07:52:43 PM
So after a very prolonged hiatus, I've managed to get back to work on the layout.

I found that managing 6 acres is a bit harder than looking after our old garden.

I also had a Kidney Transplant in the middle of July, I've been waiting for 4 years, so not a moment too soon.

I am now fully fit and back in the trainshed!

First I had to dismantle the lifting section as it didn't work.

I should have done what Railway Modeller suggested many years ago, and raised the hinges above the baseboard so that the hinged track moves away and up from the fixed track.

I rebuilt it with raised hinges and Veroboard to solder the track, and this is the result.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-061118194051.jpeg)

This works very well.

I then isolated between the tracks using a small drill bit to remove the copper from the strip board.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-061118194119.jpeg)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-061118194139.jpeg)

Of course as soon as I looked at the pictures, I realised that I hadn't isolated the two running lines from each other!

More to come soon.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: paulprice on November 06, 2018, 08:12:38 PM
Good to see you back on here, keep the updates coming
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on November 06, 2018, 09:08:10 PM
Yes, very good to see you posting again John. Really happy for you getting the transplant, but mind you don't over do it in the garden. :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on November 07, 2018, 07:44:14 AM
That looks like a nice lift-out section.  :)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 20, 2018, 04:24:16 PM
A bit more progress over the weekend and a 4 day weekend coming up here for Thanksgiving.

Connected the lifting section to the existing tracks

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-201118160913.jpeg)

The curves are tighter than I would like (12" on the inner curve). I may need to rebuild the lifting section to accommodate a larger curve radius.

A view of the first part of the storage yards with my push along test train

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-201118160954.jpeg)

A view down the storage area

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-201118161030.jpeg)

I'm reusing wooden sleepered track from my old layout in this section

And finally the gap between the storage section and the existing layout

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-201118161105.jpeg)

Here I'll be adding a temporary section so that my grandchildren can see trains running around

You can see that at the south end of Wigan NW there are 6 running lines, The 2 rightmost lines are the old L&Y to Manchester, the 4 on the left are down slow, down fast, up fast, and up slow. For now the fast lines will be connected to the storage yard. After the holidays the 4 lines from Wigan NW will actually swing away to the left and the Manchester lines will run to the storage yards. I have yet to plan out what happens to the main lines and the Southport/Kirkby line as they run into the last bit of unused space in the shed.

At the moment nothing is wired up so once the track is done all the droppers will need to be connected to my DCC bus.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on November 20, 2018, 04:33:58 PM
Hi John. In the 3rd pic it looks like there are a couple of tracks in the fiddle yard against the LH side of the table :goggleeyes:
That's going to be very interesting, to say the least! ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 20, 2018, 05:56:54 PM
Hi John. In the 3rd pic it looks like there are a couple of tracks in the fiddle yard against the LH side of the table :goggleeyes:
That's going to be very interesting, to say the least! ;)

That's cos the table isn't finished yet, it will be wider.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 26, 2018, 07:43:56 PM
I made good use of the 4 day weekend here to get a lot done on the layout.

I finished all the track laying needed to get a double track continuous run ready for the Grandchildren at Christmas.

I have temporarily connected the up and down fast to the storage yard

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-261118192039.jpeg)

I also finished the through lines in the storage yard.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-261118192437.jpeg)

After a little bit of testing by pushing wagons around I have started to wire it all up to my Z21.

All the track sections have droppers so this fairly easy.

I redid the wiring on the lifting section as it wasn't long enough to allow the lifting section to work!!

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-261118192723.jpeg)

I then started working my way back down the layout.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-261118192837.jpeg)

The test train is a Farish 66 plus 3 TEAs and a Cargowaggon.

I'm using Wago 3 way connectors for the dropper feeds, also I not worryng about aesthetics yet, it just has to be working by Christmas.

Once the Pendo below can run around the layout I'll be happy.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-261118191714.jpeg)

And finally, as I haven't used a first class Pendo carriage yet, here are the lights.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/71/3871-261118191915.jpeg)

I've got light bars for my other carriages but they can wait.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on November 26, 2018, 09:20:53 PM
Has your camera/phone got a video function, John? (Nudge nudge, wink wink)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 26, 2018, 09:44:14 PM
Yes, but as nothing is moving yet, apart from the test train, I think a video might be a bit boring.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 03, 2018, 03:10:24 AM
So this weekend things have really started to come together.

Warning, no pictures or videos as visually not much has changed.

First I got all of the twin track continuous run wired up.

As a result of the wiring I replaced one complete length of track that I had laid and wired last year as one wire fell off and there were melted sleepers and solder blobs everywhere. This old track will get used in my storage yard. I also pulled and rewired a couple of other lengths that had dry joints and so on.

Next I ran a test train to find any dead spots and imperfections in the track.

I have a set of 4 points that were not wired to my Z21, so the frog switching wasn't working, I connected up an accessory bus around the layout and got the points plus the frog polarity wiring sorted. I had the forsesight to wire my DCC track bus with 4 wires rather than 2 so that setting up an accessory bus would not be difficult.

Once that was sorted it was time for Alsthom Pendolino. Ran it at low speed and resolved all the issues when it suddenly came to a dead stop, typically track pins standing too proud or point motor actuator wires too high, occasionally track wiring got in the way as well.

Once that was done it was time for speed trials!!!

I started a 40mph and worked my way up from there. Straight away I found a number of track joins where one side of the track had ridden high of the joiner, these all got fixed.

Eventually I got to what my Z21 alleges is a scale 160mph and the fourth coach in the Pendo would be physically lifted from the track when the train went over my superelevated curves, it would then derail spectacularly when it dropped back on to the track. BTW this wasn't a speed issue, it would happen at low speed as well.

But on the plus side the Pendo was quite happy belting at full speed over my lifting section and then negotiating the 12" radius curve that follows.

The result of this is that the superelevation is gone (temporarily) and the Lenz BM2 that I got for 60% off list in a fire sale may well not be needed (I thought I would have to automatically slow trains down as they passed over the lifting section).

The Pendo now runs like a dream, so now I need to program it's address and sort out all the functions on my Z21 app.

Now that my Christmas obligations are done (at least as far as the layout goes), I can now start to get more loco's running and make a start on the storage yards so that I can begin to get the rest of my stock out of boxes.

And next week, fingers crossed, I'll post a video, and some more pictures.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on December 03, 2018, 10:48:08 AM
It's one of the great wonders of our hobby that someone in the U.S. of A. is modelling something just 15 miles or so down the road from me :D
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 03, 2018, 02:34:28 PM
That's because I spent the first 40 years of my life living about 15 miles down the road from you!

I'm a keaw yed.

If you live further south than the Mersey don'y worry about it. :):):)

And the mainline action in my current neck of the woods is single track, no signals!, max speed around 60mph, and mile long trains with at least 3 loco's.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on December 03, 2018, 02:36:18 PM
Sounds awesome! Better than my mainline action of homogenous 4-car EMUs plodding up and down all day long, even if it is 4-track and has signals ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on December 03, 2018, 02:41:10 PM
..
I'm a keaw yed.
...

Westhoughton?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 03, 2018, 02:51:28 PM
Without turning this into a 'my trains are worse than yours thread' although maybe we could start one :):)

When you are in town (Fort Collins) and the crossing barriers go down, you get a lot of good spotting action, but you aren't going nowhere for at least 10 minutes. The City of Fort Collins does not have a single bridge or tunnel to get you from the West Side of town to the East side, not a big deal unless you've had a heart attack and have to wait for the train to pass before you can get to the hospital(s).

I also had the pleasure of waiting 30 minutes at a branch line crossing waiting for a stationary freight to get going again (there were just 4 wagons to go). Eventually I gave up, did a 3 mile diversion, did my errands and had to do the same diversion on the way back as the train was still there!

There's also a spot in Fort Collins where a branch splits in two and if you time it just right you can get stuck between two level crossings 25 yards apart.

To paraphrase. 'the US is a foreign country, they do things differently there'

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 03, 2018, 02:52:30 PM
..
I'm a keaw yed.
...

Westhoughton?

Give the man a prize!!!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on December 03, 2018, 03:02:02 PM
..
I'm a keaw yed.
...

Westhoughton?

Give the man a prize!!!

Yay, small world John! Lived in Daisy Hill from '69 (ish) to '79. Attended Westhoughton Comp' High. :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on December 03, 2018, 03:15:28 PM
Yeah, but you get Dash-9s running down the street!

I'd still sooner model the WCML though!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 16, 2018, 10:18:59 PM
This update is actually from last weekend but as the board was being upgraded it has had to wait.

After more testing with 2 Pendo's I decided that the crossovers and curves just past the lifting section had to go as I was getting derailments with Northbound (clockwise) Pendos.

I lifted all the track and points from the lifting section up until the embankment north of Wigan NW.

I then lifted the baseboard and rotated it through 180 degrees as the points and point motors were not aligned properly, this allowed me to cut new holes for the point motors.

First I relayed the curves from the lifting section out to make them smoother and larger radius.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-161218220159.jpeg)

I then started to relay the points and point motors.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-161218220419.jpeg)

I also packed and levelled out the track at the far end of the baseboard.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-161218220452.jpeg)

I can now run 2 Pendos at speed without them derailing

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-161218220624.jpeg)

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on December 16, 2018, 10:31:40 PM
Lovely models as they are, I find my Pendos very intolerant of poor track - so a good barometer for sure!

Looks great though, very envious of your space!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on December 18, 2018, 03:03:15 AM
OK so I lied.

No sooner had the clockwise track been fixed that the anti-clockwise track started playing up again, or maybe it was the other way around.

I found a couple of areas that needed attention, including the transition from the fixed baseboard to the lifting section.

First I carefully undercut the fixed end of the lifting section as there was a slight crown where the tracks met.

This allowed me to lower the track and then pack it so that both sides of the track are now level.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-181218025202.jpeg)

I also had to fix issues around a point motor that had been recessed too far into the baseboard.

This is before

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-181218025136.jpeg)

Trains passing over would cause the track to flex downwards and bogies could derail.

I packed under the track with ply which stops it flexing and has the added benefit of making the point motors less obtrusive.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-181218025104.jpeg)

At least they will be less obtrusive once some scenery has been done.

I now really do have Pendos running in both directions at speed.

I've also been adding the various sound functions to City of Manchester in my Z21 app.

Grandchildren arrive Friday so its just playing trains from now until January 7th.

Regards,

John P


Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 08, 2019, 04:27:57 PM
Happy New Year!!!

Lots of test running (playing with trains) was accomplished with the help of my grandson over the holidays.

This did highlight some track and wiring issues which have now been rectified.

I was also able to chip my Dapol CL67 and a Dapol CL68 Defiant, both last years pressies, plus a Dapol CL66 GBRF Lesia, one of this years pressies.

Getting the lights to work on the 68 would have been nigh on impossible without help from Julian (jthjth) to whom I owe many thanks.

I still have 2 68's plus the Farish CL66 Evening Star to chip but I'm running out of storage sidings.

I was able to do more work on the storage sidings, but have now used almost all the outputs on my NCE Switch 8's so I have had to order some more!

Here's a couple of pictures of the work so far.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-080119161755.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/72/3871-080119161824.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on January 09, 2019, 02:26:34 PM
Presume there are more fiddle yard roads to come? You can never have too many storage roads, and with a large layout with a variety of traffic I'd have as many as conceivably possible!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 09, 2019, 04:09:07 PM
I've planned on 8 roads on each side.

I may also add more storage once I've planned out the layout south of Wigan.

I'm also considering setting up the route through Wallgate as an end to end rather than being part of a figure of eight as per my original plan.

That way I could set up some computer controlled DMU's to shuttle through Wallgate and I could also add the Waste Terminal at Knowsley plus the end on connection to Merseyrail at Kirkby, or as there are no MerseyRail electrics available I might use a bit of modellers licence here.

It would also make it much easier to setup the line through WNW as a continuous run.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 27, 2019, 11:46:59 PM
I havenít been able to get much time in the shed recently as work has got in the way. I have managed to get 6 storage sidings laid and have started to get more stock out of storage.
This weekend I got a Dapol EWS CL66 sorted and a Northern Rail CL156. I wasnít so lucky with a CL86 and a Farish CL60 which have both been consigned to the workbench.
I also ran in 2 CL86ís on DC. These are Freightliner Grey versions and may get a body swap if I canít get my Freightliner Green 86ís fettled.
I also spent a happy hour sorting through unpacked boxes to find the rest of my locos.
Before I get too much more stock running Iíll need to get some more points, so that I can lay out more sidings.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 05, 2019, 04:35:25 PM
This weekend was spent getting more loco's and MU's out of boxes and testing them out.

I've ended up with 4 loco's needing attention ( 2 Farish & 2 Dapol). I've got another half a dozen awaiting decoders but all run fine on DC.

The rest are in the storage yards.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/73/3871-050219162210.jpeg)

The through roads are in the middle, with 3 storage roads either side, that consumed all the outputs on 2 NCE Switch 8 accessoy decoders.

Loco's waiting for something to do.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/73/3871-050219162543-738641977.jpeg)

Plus all my Pendolinos are on the layout and running well.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/73/3871-050219162537-738631389.jpeg)

I can just about get 2 Pendolinos end to end in the first storage roads. So next up is to buy more points and build more storage. There is a bit of space but virtually none of my rolling stock is on the layout yet.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 19, 2019, 02:04:03 AM
Ok let's see if this works.

My first video

Pendolino's at Wigan


Not sure how to embed it yet.

The inane whistling will be dealt with most severely!!

John P

Moderator Comment If you put the link in "youtube" tags it displays an image embedded in the post. Use the "youtube" button on the menu above the where you type your text, you can either click the button first and then past the link between the tags or paste the link, highlight it and then click the youtube button to put the tags around the link
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on February 19, 2019, 07:03:36 AM
I'm afraid the video is unavailable, according to YouTube.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: GreyWolf on February 19, 2019, 07:40:50 AM
Same issue for me ...

When you click Reply you will see a YouTube button ...

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/74/5843-190219073534.png) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=74243)

Click the button and it adds YouTube tags:

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/74/5843-190219073921.png) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=74244)

Cheers  :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 19, 2019, 02:26:54 PM
OK Here goes.

I'd made it private so perhaps that was the issue.



Let me know if this works.

Thanks,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: squit13 on February 19, 2019, 02:34:35 PM
Works a treat, makes me somewhat jealous!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: GreyWolf on February 19, 2019, 02:40:00 PM
Nine seconds of excellence John!

 :envy: Envious of the space you have there.

Cheers  :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on February 19, 2019, 03:17:40 PM
Great snippet but I really do hope you deal with the inane whistling very severely :D
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on February 19, 2019, 03:21:31 PM
Agreed, that looks superb!

My only comment is that there looks to be a bit of vertical movement most noticeable in the last 2 seconds, presumably at the transition of the gradient. I'd make sure that's as smooth as possible to minimise risk of uncoupling, things like Dapol IKAs (which I imagine you may well have) are very prone to it.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Delboy on February 19, 2019, 03:29:09 PM
..
I'm a keaw yed.
...

Westhoughton?

Give the man a prize!!!

Yay, small world John! Lived in Daisy Hill from '69 (ish) to '79. Attended Westhoughton Comp' High. :beers:
It is a small world. I lived in Westhoughton until I was 15

Oh and John,
Just noticed your layout thread. Will have a good read through it asap. From a quick skip througjh for now, your layout is progressing really well.
Delboy.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 19, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
Agreed, that looks superb!

My only comment is that there looks to be a bit of vertical movement most noticeable in the last 2 seconds, presumably at the transition of the gradient. I'd make sure that's as smooth as possible to minimise risk of uncoupling, things like Dapol IKAs (which I imagine you may well have) are very prone to it.

I disagree, I think that's a lot of vertical movement, especially as there is no gradient there (at least not any intentional one)!!!!

It shall be sorted as I have yet to reinstate super elevation on the curve north of the station and I have yet to fully wire and fettle all the tracks in the station itself.

Isn't it great how well a video can show up flaws in our track laying that can go unnoticed when looked at from above?

Thanks,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on February 19, 2019, 04:17:18 PM
Ha, well I didn't want to say...

I don't doubt it's magnified in the video, but would be a real shame to find you can't get reliable running, so you're right to try and resolve it. Gradient must just be parallax error or my dodgy eyes!  :confused1:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 13, 2019, 03:11:51 AM
Well progress has been slow over the past couple of weeks as everything I have touched has turned to dust.

I decided to take a break from track laying to get more stock out of storage and to try to fix some non-runners.

AAARRGGGGHHHHHHHH

I got my Revolution IZA twins out and they wouldn't move, on a 2% gradient only one set would roll down the track, I eventually had to resort to removing the brake gear from half the sets to get them to run well enough for a loco to haul them around a curve or up a hill. (I posted on the IZA thread about this)

I tried to fix a couple of non running loco's. Long story short I think I have some duff Zimo MX622 wired decoders which may have burnt out the motors on 2 of the non-runners. (I created a new post about this)

Tonight I put a Zimo Next18 decoder in a second CL68, the cab lights came on immediately and I cannot get them to turn off. They will turn off, cos when I program a CV they flash, and when I reset the loco they stayed off the whole time that the programming light was lit on my Z21, BUT as soon as I went back to 'normal' mode the d**n lights came back on. (Might have to create a post about this as well). I might be able to use this decoder in my Pacer as I don't think that all the function outputs are used.

I can't send anything back as most of this stuff has been sitting around for over a year while I got the layout off the ground.

Anyway, I'll probably revert to some more track laying this week and try to post a couple more videos.

To cap it all, I ordered 4 more Zimo Next 18 decoders only to find out after my money had been taken that they are on back order!

Oh, and we had a burst pipe in the basement last week and will have to replace all of the flooring, and we broke our washing machine as well, but that got fixed yesterday.

At least the railway shed stayed dry  :D :D

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on March 13, 2019, 06:52:54 AM
Not your week...
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 14, 2019, 08:11:50 PM
We're having a really bad winter storm here, so driving is very limited, but I get more time in the shed  :)

I found a couple of Digitrax decoders lying around plus a Zimo MX621N in my electronics box of bits. So I decided to chip a second Dapol CL156, the S&C special edition.

I ran in on my DC test track first and it was really bad, I then had the brainwave of cleaning the wheels, out came the IPA and a cotton bud and after a few seconds work the driving car was buzzing round the track quite happily, I did the same with the trailing car and let both run around in both directions for 20 minutes or so.

Next I put the Zimo in the driving car and the Digitrax in the trailer, popped both on the programming track and set the DCC address.

Put it on my layout and it runs really well, so I know have two of these up and running, plus a dummy set.

I also tried to use DCC commands to tell my DCC Specialties PSX-1 to turn track power on and off. This was less successful. The instructions say that you can turn track power on and off by writing to address 2042, but they don't give any hint as to what should be written to this address. Anyhow I tried it and it sent the rest of my accessory decoders haywire, AND IT CAUSED A SHORT!

After disconnecting substantial parts of the layout I finally tracked the short down to a point where the tortoise motor had moved but the actuating wire had sprung out of the tie bar so the frog switch had changed polarity but the point blades hadn't. The point had moved due to the accessory decoders being affected by the PSX-1 DCC command.

Next up will be reconnecting everything, but at least it means I can tidy up the wiring at the same time.

I have to keep telling myself that. The only good news in this is that I am using Wago Levernuts to connect all my droppers and frog wires, so disconnecting and reconnecting them doesn't need any soldering or any other tools.

You never know I might even have trains running again before the weekend.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Yet_Another on March 14, 2019, 11:56:53 PM
Regarding the PSX, I wrote a little guide here:

https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=32318.msg370777#msg370777 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=32318.msg370777#msg370777)

But it doesn't cover programming, which is in the instructions. I can't remember the details, but essentially, you assign it a DCC accessory address, and then you can turn it off and on as if you are operating a point.

When I was using NCE kit, addresses above 2000 were ok, but since swapping to Uhlenbrock, I had to use lower addresses, because those over 2000 are used for route definitions. Just something to consider.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 15, 2019, 01:36:32 AM
Thanks Tony.

The address information about routes may be the issue. I am using a Z21 which supports route setting. Iíll try programming a lower address and see what happens.

Thanks,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on March 15, 2019, 07:57:20 AM
Iíve always found programming the PSX a bit of a messy affair!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 31, 2019, 06:35:19 PM
Well a lot of work has ensued since tracking down the short circuit on the layout, unfortunately as it was all wiring there's not a lot to see.

I have successfully hooked up all the trackwork in Wigan Northwestern and got all the points working, I've also lifted and relaid some track that either had terrible soldering or wasn't flat. I've shocked myself seeing how many mistakes I've made with wiring and track laying when I was working to a deadline before Christmas 2 years ago.

Anyway all that's left to wire up, and fix, is the trackwork for Wallgate and it's junction with the mainline.

I have made another, rather blurry, video. It's my CargoWaggon Twins with some Dapol Cargowaggons interspersed to make a long rake. No whistling this time, but a lot of noise from the fan heaters in the shed.



Now a number of the Twins have had their brake gear removed as it was fouling the wheels and I have yet to reattach them, can anyone see which wagons don't have brakes?

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 07, 2019, 12:11:14 AM
I've spent some time this week clearing space in the workshop and planning out what to do at the southern throat of Wigan NW and beyond.

I've decided to go a little crazy and to try to model the railway as far as Golborne junction but in a very compressed form. So most of the junctions will be modelled but they will be rather close together. I'n ignoring the triangle around Ince Moss Junction and the lines to Liverpool, but I have left room for something at Springs Branch and also for the Hanson Aggregate traffic to Haydock and the Manchester line at Golborne itself.

In addition the Atherton(Westhoughton) line will curve around clockwise adjacent to the line from the main storage yards, it will then drop under the mainline and join up with the Kirkby line to the West of Wallgate station.

The plan is now so big that I can't upload all of it, so here is the first bit, track in green is already laid.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-060419234154.jpeg).

I have had to move some stuff around and had a bit of a clear out to get more space for the curves.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-060419234630.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-060419234729.jpeg)

And with some more shelving moved around

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-060419234756.jpeg)

But to do this I will have to remove the temporary tracks that currently allow me to have a continuous run by connecting the storage yard to the main line.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-060419234542.jpeg)

I've also had a play with reusing some scenic bits from my old layout to see how they would fit on this one.

This row of terraced houses will sit a little higher than the track to hide the crossovers before the entrance to the storage yard, it will also get more houses added, and the track will sit in a cutting.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-060419234937.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-060419235003.jpeg)

Regards,

John P



Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 08, 2019, 10:13:42 PM
Well plans are made for changing.

I went out to the shed with some full size plan prints and straight away saw that the existing layout position bore no relation to my original plan. I forgot that I had to move some boards around to get clearance for my belly and to incorporate a lifting section that I hadn't planned on.

So after taking many careful measurements on strategic points on the existing trackwork I was able to fix my Scarm plan so that it did represent fairly accurately what actually exists in the shed.

I was then able to redo the plan, and I took the opportunity to make sure I have at least 2 foot clearance between the walls of the shed and the baseboards.

So here's the revised plan.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/75/3871-080419215746.jpeg)

The Atherton line is now much closer to the mainline but will be hidden as it is on a 2% down grade, the line from the fiddle yard will eventually pass over the Atherton line to rejoin the mainline in a large loop filled with track.

The Atherton line will also loop around the shed to join up with the Kirkby line, so I shall have continuous running on both the lines through Wigan NW and Wallgate.

I still have to check these plans for size but I am a lot more confident that they will fit, next up is to construct some baseboards to carry all of this.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 21, 2019, 05:03:09 PM
Hi,

Time for an update.

In preparation for building the extension through Wigan South I decided that everything already built should be finished and thoroughly tested, otherwise laying more track and points would be a bit of a waste of time.

This turned out to be a good plan as finishing off the storage yard highlighted a bunch of issues that had to be sorted.

I added a couple more sidings and then tried to get all my Pendolinos to run into them, so that they were out of the way of the main line.

Disaster! There were issues with the lifting section and with them getting stuck on track pins in the sidings.

The lifting section was my first attempt and it has been rebuilt once already, but I could see that the hinged section wasn't true, which caused problems with both horizontal and vertical alignment, and when I jiggled the baseboards around to get it true this happened.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-210419163505-76402915.jpeg)

The soldered track sections were fractionally too long, so I decided to rebuild it for a third time. The tracks on the baseboard along with the PCB were lifted and trimmed and realigned. The hinged bit got 2 screws so that its height could be accurately adjusted and I ended up with this.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-210419163507-764181270.jpeg)

All 4 of my Pendos were then, slowly, driven out of the sidings and around the layout to test out the new section, 2 in each direction.
The new lifting section works much better and all 4 Pendos can manage it at speed with no issues. Putting them back in the sidings resulted in various issues with track pins standing proud so these were removed and all was well.

I now have around 6 more sidings to do and the storage yards will be finished.

As I said earlier I had to redo the plans for the tracks south of Wigan but now they look to be OK. Here they are laid out on the layout and on the floor to make sure that they join up with what's already there and that I can get around them.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-210419163511-764231872.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-210419163510-76421432.jpeg)

And finally a 156 posed in the bay at NorthWestern.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-210419163509-764201369.jpeg)

This week I'll be finishing up the storage sidings and then I can get cracking on the extension. Although I also have 4 loco's to chip, and another half dozen that need fixed. I'm also planning on starting the platforms at North Western.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on April 21, 2019, 06:37:43 PM
looking good thank you for the progress reports and an interesting project being a warrington lad.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 27, 2019, 01:18:02 AM
I managed a few hours in the train shed this week, and things have gone reasonably well.

I added two more sidings to my storage yards, leaving just 2 sets if points to create 4 more sidings, but that will have to wait as I have run out of wire and baseboard. I'll pick up some more wire over the weekend and if I get time I'll add some small baseboard extensions so that I can finish the sidings.

Today I decided on a change of tack, and decided to revisit some non runners and other locos that needed attention, all of these locos are Farish 66's with the older style hard wire DCC decoder PCB.

First I the body of a Colas 66 whose lights were always on, it tuned out to be the common return on a Zimo Decoder that was hardwired in, the wire was protruding just a little too far at the bottom of the PCB and it was touching the chassis, the wire was trimmed and the chassis covered in that area with Kapton tape just to be sure.

Next up was a DRS Malcolm 66 that has a decoder wired in. This didn't work out to well. It was easy enough to get the loco running again, first on DC and then on DCC, but whenever I put the body back on it would stop working, I also tried taping the wires in pace using Kapton tape and this had exactly the same effect. I messed around with this for an hour or so before I gave up to try something else.

I started work on EWS 66098 which had been working fine with a hardwired decoder and had suddenly stopped working.I had already removed the decoder to get it back to running on DC but it still didn't work. So back to basics, I removed the PCB and the bogies and ran 2 wires from my DC controller straight to the motor terminals, it worked. Then I replaced the PCB and checked that I had contact between the chassis and the motor terminals with a multimeter, I did. Then I put the loco upside down in a cradle and applied DC to the chassis pickups and again the motor worked. After checking that the bogie pickups had good contact I put it together and it ran fine on my DC test track. Then I hardwired the decoder back in, it didn't work, after a bit of head scratching and testing I began to suspect the two 'fingers' that are soldered under the PCB and make sprung contact with the motor terminals, on this model they had quite long insulating sleeves, I removed the sleeves and everything worked on DC and DCC, so 66098 went back onto the layout.

I then fiddled around with 2 very old chassis, whose locos had died a while ago. Both motors run fine but I only had enough working bogies to get one chassis up and running. The first chassis was from an EWS 66 that I had abused on a 3% gradient hauling 20 HTA's up hill. The bogies are toast as the wheels spin freely on their axles even though the gears don't move, I set this one aside for a later date. The second was from a GBRF 66, this one took a bit of TLC but I was able to get the motor running and then the PCB contact fingers fettled and finally added a pair of bogies and got it running pretty well, even though it is a bit noisy. I decided to use the body for 66701 in the plain blue and yellow GBRF livery, rather than the body for Sunderland FC as that is is the much older First/GBRF livery. The main cosmetic issue with this loco is that one of its bogies is from 'Sunderland FC' and the wheels have white tyres, the other bogie has the steps in the wrong place. When I have the time and patience I shall build up some alternative bogies using some spare frames and wheels that I have to make things more accurate.

So all in all not bad for an afternoon. I now have 3 locos running that had issues before. Over the weekend I'll put a decoder into GBRF 66701 and get that onto the layout, I'll leave the Malcolm liveried loco for another day.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 28, 2019, 02:47:59 AM
So the loco resurrection continues! with pictures.

Here's the Colas 66 with its lights OFF.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-280419023910-767141699.jpeg)

And EWS 66098

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-280419023910-76714725.jpeg)

I also fiddled around with bogie frames and got GBRF 66701 with steps that line up properly on the bogies and body sides.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-280419023905-76709446.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-280419023905-767091985.jpeg)

66701 has yet to be converted to DCC, but it may well get a decoder from Malcolm the Naughty Engine!

Works fine like this (minus lights)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-280419023908-767121399.jpeg)

But refuses to move like this

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/76/3871-280419023908-767122287.jpeg)

And before you all start , I know it needs to be on the track to move!

Pulling the lighting wires from the chassis was one of many unsuccessful experiments.

If it doesn't behave, the bogies may be donated to another EWS 66 to get it running again.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 30, 2019, 12:38:55 AM
So updates coming thick and fast now.

I added decoders to my Dapol Pacer today, the Next18 format allows manufacturers to build in more flexibility but that also means programming more than just an address to get things going. The driving car is a simple drop in and change the address, then its lights are controlled by F0, pretty standard. The trailer however uses the AUX1 and AUX2 outputs to control the white and red lights independently, so by default F1 and F2 control the white and red lights independently. In order to get just F1 controlling the lights means setting CV's to do some Function mapping and also to set directional behaviour on the AUX1 and AUX2 outputs.

Here it is in all its glory.



And 66701 on a cement train, I have yet to add its nameplates cos I only just found them.



Next I have a couple of Grey 86's to use as chassis donors to fix green one's that are broken.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 05, 2019, 08:54:05 PM
Well my loco repair mojo hasn't quite worked out as I hoped.

Both my Freightliner plain green 86''s have lights issues. The culprit is this incredibly naff way of connecting the chassis to the LED's in the cab

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-050519202312-770352398.jpeg)

These wires come of the cab pcb very easily as there is no strain relief and the wires are not very long, meaning that the first time you remove the body to chip the loco there's a 50/50 chance that you'll lift the body too high and pull the wires from the PCB.

I obtained a couple of cheap Freight sector 86's thinking (mistakenly), that I could do a simple body swap to get lights working again.

This isn't possible as the whole CAB and light molding appears to be glued into the bodyshell.

Anyhow I got the big hammer out and managed to prise the lighting PCB away from the rest of the cab moulding to see if I could reattach the wires.

This is what the light PCB looks like

Front (facing the cab) with a white and red LED

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-050519202307-77028475.jpeg)

and back, where the wires are soldered

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-050519202307-770281299.jpeg)

Now, underneath all that black paint? are the solder pads for the 3 wires needed for the LEDs. I tried to solder these in situ but all I managed to do was to slightly damage the bodyshell of one of the 86's with my hot iron.

Once the LED PCB is out of the body it is relatively easy to clean up the wire side and solder the wires back on.

Once this was done I attached both PCB's to a dummy chassis and both worked fine.

Then it just a case of gluing it back on here

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-050519202312-770362281.jpeg)

Like this

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-050519202309-77033226.jpeg)

Now as soon as I put the body shell back on the chassis the wires fell off again.

I've been through this process 3 times now and I'm beginning to get annoyed!

I put the 86's to one side and decided to take a look at my 2 Dapol Voyagers.

One, a XC CL221 Voyager has worked intermittently since I got it. I tried it on my DC test track and the power car seemed to work quite well, it also performed OK on DCC on my layout, but on further examination I could see that there was something wrong on one of the powered bogies.

I took the power car apart and could see that the wheels were so close together that the gear mechanism could disengage from the main gear train, I adjusted the back to back on this axle and things got a lot better, although there is still a fair amount of squealing which I hope to get to the bottom of today.

On a much happier note, my second Voyager, a Virgin CL220, which was perhaps the 2nd modern loco that I purchased around 10 years ago, came good.

It hasn't run well since I got it. I took the power car apart and applied DC straight to the motor and everything worked fine, the motor ran and all the wheels on the motor bogies turned without any issues. I took a closer look and the reason that it wouldn't run on the track is that the wheels were filthy, I mean black. I used an old blade on a craft knife to get rid of the thickest grunge and then cleaned the wheels using IPA. Once this was done the motor car ran around my DC test track with no issues.

The only problem is that I now need to buy 3 decoders to get it prepared for running on the main layout.

I shall persevere with the other Voyager and the 86's and hopefully have better news next week.

Getting back to the layout my fiddle yard board sprouted a bump so that I can get the last 2 sidings laid, the yard is slightly off centre so the other side shouldn't need the same treatment,

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-050519202311-77034194.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 07, 2019, 05:27:19 PM
So I thought I would demonstrate my new and improved point motor installation process.

I'm using XPS as a baseboard so cutting it is pretty easy.

I started out mounting my Tortoise motors like this.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170255-771101744.jpeg)

It worked, but it means there is a job to be done patching the holes before ballasting and scenery can be done.

Then I tried this

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170257-771291888.jpeg)

Here I cut a hole and glued the motor to the bottom of the XPS and then glued it back in place.
This didn't work as the XPS is an inch thick and the Tortoise internal switch changes polarity before the point blades have started to move causing a temporary short.

So I refined my method.

First I use the template that comes with the motor to mark out the 4 locating holes and the tie bar hole on the baseboard, along with the front edge of the hole to be cut.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170306-7713634.jpeg)

Then I line up the motor over the locating hole marks and finish drawing the outline of the hole. I deliberately leave no room at the back and sides as that makes it easier to line up the motor later.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170311-77138845.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170307-771361247.jpeg)

I then cut out the XPS piece and carefully slice it in half, so that it is now 1/2" thick.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170259-771301186.jpeg)

The knife shown is specifically designed to cut through the XPS, it isn't serrated.

I then widen the hole for the tie bar pin into a small rectangular slot and glue the assembled motor to the bottom of the XPS using a hot glue gun.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170301-771322292.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170301-77132646.jpeg)

The assembled piece is then glued back into the baseboard, but not until connectors are added to the 5 wires that I shall be using.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170304-771341451.jpeg)

And here's the finished result.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-070519170304-771341932.jpeg)

I wire up the motor and make sure all is well before I cut the tie bar wire down.

This works very well with no shorts occurring so I shall be doing this for all future point motor installations.

And here are a couple of videos of very noisy, but not sound equipped, Dapol Voyagers.

First my Virgin Voyager power car resurrected after 10 years, still DC only.



and then my XC Voyager, I had to loosen the screws holding the bogies in place and work on the back to back of the troublesome axle to get this running better.



I should be getting decoders for the Virgin Voyager in the post today, and then I'll be finishing my storage yard before I commence on the extension for Wigan South.

Regards,

John P


Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 13, 2019, 06:05:10 PM
I have now finished the storage yards, not big enough!, and got most of my loco's and mu's running.

Having run out of excuses it is time to start extending the layout.

First I had to clear some space by moving shelf units and a bookcase out of the way.

The shelves are now tucked away beside my workbench

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-130519174721-773822058.jpeg)

The layout won't ever come near here so they shouldn't need moved again.

I also moved a bookcase full of Railway Modellers to the space where the shelves were.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-130519174720-773811573.jpeg)

You can see in the shot above, that I already made two 4'x2' baseboard frames and have started to position them with the full size plan.

This area is the trickiest as I have new baseboards running horizontal to the wall, plus two more coming in at different angles and different heights. The height difference (1/2 inch) is caused by me being a numpty and forgetting that the railway shed was intended to double up as a garage and has a sloping floor.

I laid the plans out over the new baseboards to see where they would best fit and to figure out where to leave space for my and my belly to reach all the tracks.

These are the lines out of Wigan, the Westhoughton line on the right hand side will be dropping two inches on a 2% slope to get it under the main lines further down.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-130519174714-773711961.jpeg)

BTW, I know it's technically the Atherton line, but I'm from Westhoughton.  :D

This next one shows how the line from the storage yard joins the pack, along with a fifth line appearing as part of the complex junctions south of Wigan where the 4 track DS, DF, UF, US becomes the 6 track DS, US, DF, UF, D Freight, U Freight. Lots of points will be needed for this.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-130519174718-77379942.jpeg)

I've started fixing the baseboards in place and adding a mixture of 1" XPS (the pink stuff) and Woodland Scenics risers and inclines to get all the tracks level and the gradient sorted for the Westhoughton line.

More to come.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 25, 2019, 03:35:33 AM
So more baseboards were made last weekend and plans laid out.

Here's the gradient taking shape for the Westhoughton line

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-250519031046-777701958.jpeg)

And the plans laid out for the mess of tracks and points leading up to Springs Branch

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-250519031044-777511529.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-250519031044-777511945.jpeg)

But then, disaster!

I'd forgot to plan for one critical dimension, my waist size.

It was pretty obvious that the baseboards would be too close together to get between them for access.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/77/3871-250519031045-77770200.jpeg)

So I had to get back to my laptop and redo my plans.

Luckily I was able to realign the baseboards without having to make any drastic changes to the plan, so this weekend there should be more progress.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 25, 2019, 05:52:30 AM
Looking good. Especially the gradient 
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on May 25, 2019, 07:55:59 AM
That looks like a very thorough planning and construction job. :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 25, 2019, 08:17:50 AM
Agree. What did you use to construct the incline please
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 25, 2019, 03:10:12 PM
Agree. What did you use to construct the incline please

I use Woddland SCenics, or Woodland Scenics if you prefer  :D, risers and inclines.

The risers are 2' long and come in a variety of heights, I use 1/2", 1", and 2". They are flexible so they can be glued in place around curves.
The inclines come as various different gradients, again they are 2' long and I use the 2% inclines, so each incline adjusts the track height by 1/2", again they are flexible and can be used on curves. They are relatively expensive even here in the US, so as the XPS baseboard material I am using is also 1" thick, I can also use that and mix and match it with the Woodland Scenics stuff.

BUT IMHO if you need elevated or inclined track on a curve, or are forming an embankment, it is good value for money.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 25, 2019, 03:19:03 PM
Looking good. That was a well written tutorial and i remember the area in the late 80s /90s
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 25, 2019, 03:22:09 PM
That was an excellent tutorial. I remember the area in the 80s / 90s
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on June 13, 2019, 03:15:05 AM
Work has been progressing on the track to the south of Wigan. Five points have been added, giving access from Wallgate to the main line and from the mainline to the Atherton line, plus one to form the crossover from Down Fast to Down Slow.

I've started to add in the curved tracks for the mainline and have been test running as I go with a CL68, a Pacer, and a Pendolino.

Here are some pics.

Looking south at the crossover from Wallgate to the mainline.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/78/3871-130619030441-784491408.jpeg)

And the crossover from the main to the Atherton line

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/78/3871-130619030441-78449285.jpeg)

And the curves taking shape before the next sets of points.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/78/3871-130619030443-784522231.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/78/3871-130619030438-784481519.jpeg)

Once the main is finished it will be out with the plaster bandage to form a surface on the Woodland Scenics risers used for the incline on the Atherton line
and on the line leading from the fiddle yard.

Regards,

John P



Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on June 13, 2019, 05:25:15 AM
looking good ,and well researched !!  protototypical
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on June 13, 2019, 11:24:18 AM
Gotta love those curves :heart2:
(Oops - Liz Hurley's just sprung to mind..................again) :-[
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on July 01, 2019, 04:15:57 AM
So time for another update.

I've now laid the track for the Westhoughton/Atherton line round the curves and also for the track leading from the storage yard.

First everything was covered in plaster bandage and then given a coat of brown primer, I have to be careful here as too much primer will cause the XPS baseboard surface to disintegrate.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/79/3871-010719014657-79031589.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/79/3871-010719014701-790351522.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/79/3871-010719014658-79033390.jpeg)

I also masked all the existing track as the paint from those rattle cans seems to get everywhere.

This is the track leading from the storage yard.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/79/3871-010719014654-790291629.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/79/3871-010719014654-79029464.jpeg)

I was then able to complete the curves on the mainline and make a start on the complex point work around Springs Branch.
Getting 2 Tortoise motors positioned underneath the adjacent points was a bit of a challenge because, as you can see on the plan, they are followed immediately by 2 more adjacent points. I ended up cutting a section of baseboard out for both points as a single piece and then instead of halving the depth on the whole piece I stepped it so that the mounting rails on the 2 Tortoises could overlap. In this way, and by mounting the motors on the outside of the points, I was able to get them to fit, and. more importantly, to work.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/79/3871-010719014656-790311266.jpeg)

At this point, forgive the pun, I have had to stop as I only have 1 RH and 1 LH point left and I have had to order more points from Hattons so that I can get the track laid in some kind of logical fashion. I have also decided to simplify the layout here by abandoning the various points associated with Springs Branch itself. This will create a "simple" 6 track main, as I am also ignoring the Liverpool line.

As we have a four day weekend coming up over here, I hope the points arrive, otherwise I might have to start ballasting :(

Once I have the full main line in place then I'll review things to see where I have space for more storage sidings and potentially some rail served industry.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on July 01, 2019, 07:03:05 AM
Wow. To able to finish both westhoughton. Atherton and springs branch looks good. Thank you for the scenics update. This too looking good. Pleased with the result?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on September 08, 2019, 02:14:30 AM
I don't know.

Get a kidney transplant and my boss thinks I should start working all hours again!

Summer has been hectic, working weekends and trying to mow the grass, so no time in the train shed.

But things are settling down again and I've been able to get some quality time out in the shed to continue work on Springs Branch Junction.

After some careful consideration I decided to abandon Springs Branch depot itself. This saved a couple of feet on the layout ans eliminated 5 points. The space saving allowed me to re-plan the freight fly-under so that it drops and rises again on the straight, rather than on a curve.

Another half dozen or so points have been laid and tested with just 4 left to go before I can get on to some simple straight track laying.

Here are a few photos on progress so far.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-080919020207-81158387.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-080919020211-811802004.jpeg)

Looking south.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-080919020207-81158678.jpeg)

Making a start on the gradient for the fly-under.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-080919020211-811801958.jpeg)

I'm hoping to get this finished this weekend so that I can run a few trains.

Next I have to get rid of some junk in the shed and build more baseboards, but I may also build a temporary link so that I can get trains running around and around again.

Regards,

John P



Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on September 08, 2019, 06:31:52 AM
looking good,maybe not a bad move abandoning the depot, but a shame !!!  look forward to scenics/ structures and some locos
running
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on September 08, 2019, 10:33:34 PM
 :hellosign:
 Nice track work John, looking forward to seeing trains running
     regards Derek
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on September 08, 2019, 11:20:04 PM
..
 I may also build a temporary link so that I can get trains running around and around again.
...

A well deserved reward for your labours John. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on September 24, 2019, 12:01:45 AM
Thanks for all the comments.

I've managed to get quite a bit more done, and am now faced with building more baseboards. As the garage has a sloping floor, that's not quite as straightforward as it could be.

First I finished off all the point work for my version of Springs Branch Junction.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-230919234743-818742366.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-230919234749-818802277.jpeg)

I ran a test train and got a short. After a happy hour sorting that out all was well and I made more progress on the freight underpass.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-230919234746-818771091.jpeg)

What with the trees and a test fit of some Metcalfe retaining walls you'd think I was doing scenery  :D

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-230919234743-818741094.jpeg)

I also built a small add on baseboard and laid out a little more of the plan.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-230919234746-8187791.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/81/3871-230919234748-818791751.jpeg)

One obvious issue is that although on my plan I should be able to get between the curves on the main and the Southport/Kirkby line for access, I forgot to allow for the baseboards. So a bit of crawling will be required!

Next I'm going to complete all the baseboards for the mainline, but then I'll complete the tracks as far as the next junction and then probably run some temporary track to give me a loop to run trains again.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: acko22 on September 24, 2019, 04:16:36 AM
Looking awesome John if only I had the room you have to build such a big layout!

Are you tempted to build springs branch itself? I was there on friday and with the new EMU sidings its starting to look a lot different even though the engine shed still retains its vintage character!

Gareth
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on September 24, 2019, 05:26:43 AM
john.

your version of springs branch Junction. looking good. i echo what gareth has just stated - please keep the updates heading this way
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on September 24, 2019, 09:01:24 AM
Very envious of that space! It's just crying out for some Finetrax EV15 crossovers ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: port perran on September 24, 2019, 09:56:18 AM
Looking extremely good and yes, I echo the sentiments re space.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on September 24, 2019, 02:45:10 PM
Thanks for the comments.

Even with 'all that space' I'm still constrained as to what can be done. If I'd left the points in the plan to allow access to Springs Branch depot then that would have added 2 or 3 feet more to that part of the plan. Then the far side of the flyunder would have emerged on the curve at the end of the run and the various junctions that make up the ladder that reduces the 6 tracks back to two would have all had to be on the 'return stretch' back down the shed. I would also have needed a bigger space between adjacent baseboards to allow for the depot itself. So I've opted for less stuff to give longer mainline runs.

The golden rule seems to be that no matter how much space you have, it is never enough to fit everything in that you want!

Now Springs Branch depot may re-appear but in a different location, but that depends on Revolution or someone bring out some CL331's and CL195's as I think the 331's will be serviced at the 'new' depot. I'm not sure how Springs Branch would work otherwise.

But it's all about compromise and I'm sure I'll work something out.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on September 24, 2019, 03:17:33 PM
no class 08, 25, 31, 40, 47 were all seen on that depot in my day. good luck with this exciting project !!!!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on September 24, 2019, 11:55:50 PM
just caught up on this, looking good.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: acko22 on September 25, 2019, 12:10:51 AM
The golden rule seems to be that no matter how much space you have, it is never enough to fit everything in that you want!

Well there is truth about modelling, never enough space  :laughabovepost:

Now Springs Branch depot may re-appear but in a different location, but that depends on Revolution or someone bring out some CL331's and CL195's as I think the 331's will be serviced at the 'new' depot. I'm not sure how Springs Branch would work otherwise.

I know that while the depot has been built for the widespread introduction of the CAF units but it isn't finished yet, however "should" be by late November, but they have ran in as trails 319s and 150 sets to check the rail alignments and that the curves in the sidings don't cause issues when it is opened.
As to the DB side if you after ready to run items that could be a lot more problematic! There are 3 working departments on site, the Wagon Maintenance section who will repair the DB wagon fleet including heavy maintenance.
The  break down section who man and maintain the emergency crane (Network Rail owned 75t Cowdons Sheldon rail crane) based at Wigan in addition it is where all 4 of the in service cranes undergo heavy maintenance and annual winch testing (I was there in June and saw 2 of the cranes undergoing these tests.
The final section is the MPV section with Wigan being one of the dedicated sites to maintain and prepare the sets including swapping over the modules for each season.

So to truly replicate Springs Branch in its current incarnation will honestly require a good few models not currently on the market  :confused1: unless you just sided with depicting the DB section with only the Wagon Maintenance section then its just a question, can you short term at least get away with units like the 150, 156, 158, 319 (eventually) while hoping the 195 and 331 appear?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 06, 2019, 04:40:54 PM
I've been cracking on with baseboards and some more track laying.

I added an 8 foot board to allow me to continue with the tracks from the storage yards and the Westhoughton line. At this point I'll be using a RH point and a single slip to allow trains to access the single line that in reality connects the Liverpool Manchester Chat Moss line to the WCML at Golborne junction. The plan has 3 points in a ladder but as I have a redundant single slip I thought I'd save some money and space and reuse it. Then a couple of feet later the tracks swing to the right over the Westhoughton line to form the 2 track WCML approaching Golborne Junction.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-061019161815-82394446.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-061019161813-823921175.jpeg)

Then I finished off the freight flyunder gradients and covered them with plaster bandage and gave them a coat of brown primer, it's more red/brown but it'll do.
I added the track as well as I didn't want to continue the main line without getting this done first.

I then started a scratch build of the bridge that takes the fast and slow lines over the freight lines. As far as I can tell from a drivers eye view and Google Earth this is a plain concrete deck. The sides seem to be a low (1 foot high) concrete base with metal railings. The freight lines themselves seem to run through a concrete box structure which extends either side of the bridge deck. I've started off with a balsa deck and sides and given it a coat of grey primer. I'll probably build the concrete box substructure out of plastic card and then source some suitable metal railings to finish off the bridge deck.

I've also been testing track with a Pendolino. A Class68 was used to check clearances on the flyunder.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-061019161816-823942272.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-061019161811-823701148.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-061019161817-82396568.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-061019161811-823701704.jpeg)

Now I've got the dreaded 4 track lifting section to build. cos, as you might have noticed, I've been painting myself into a corner. Based on my previous two track lifting section this one will be on baseboards constructed specifically to take all the bits and pieces needed.

I've also ordered more points and a box of track from Hattons as I'm down to my last 8 pieces.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on October 06, 2019, 04:44:08 PM
looking very impressive john, sure railgooner will be impressed as much as i am. i remember Golborne from a long time ago though south of dallam towards warrington, arpley is my territory. how did you create the westhoughton flyover please john ?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on October 06, 2019, 04:52:31 PM
Do love a good flyover, thatíll look great with stuff zooming through! 
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on October 06, 2019, 04:56:47 PM
mainly pacers, 150s, 156s but i have heard of class 20 and class 31 hauling a 1P06 0827 Birmingham New Street to Blackpool diverted service, trundling over the Pendelinos speeding on the WCML , sorry Ac electrics in my day !
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 06, 2019, 05:20:50 PM
Thanks guys.

It'll mainly be freight going under as they are the freight lines. The whole thing was made using Woodland Scenics 2% inclines, which I have found are the steepest you can get away with, with long trains, the bridge is balsa.

Now that I've done away with Springs Branch depot the freight lines are redundant, so I'm having a rethink about the plan to add some justification for the flyunder. The aggregate terminal on the old Kelbit sidings, or maybe a repositioned depot are some ideas.

I plan on finishing the Fast lines and then looking at what space is available for extras.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on October 06, 2019, 05:26:24 PM
sounds good


there was / is  a rail connected freight terminal on this section, serving the Potter Logistics depot at the Knowsley Industrial Park near Kirkby line if interested, also

https://www.derbysulzers.com/97405horwich86.jpg (https://www.derbysulzers.com/97405horwich86.jpg)


97405 and its train of vans makes a colourful view at Horwich Works on October 3rd 1986 whilst working the 6P82. The job had started at Warrington and headed up to Wigan, running round here then on to Metal Box at Westhoughton, on to Lostock Junction for a run round, then on to Horwich Works. From here it was on to Chorley ROF, then a run round at Preston and back to Springs Branch where the crew were relieved, with the train heading back to Warrington - an all day job.   great if fancy the VEAs


Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on October 06, 2019, 05:38:14 PM
Impossible not to be impressed by such an opus, even unfinished. :heart2:

Your description of the freight line flyover/underpass John, sounds like a reasonably modern construction. NR's preferred method these days is to drop precast concrete box sections into a cut, to form the underpass. Then drop precast concrete deck sections on top. Sort of modern take on cut-and-cover which drastically reduces the length of possessions.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on October 06, 2019, 05:45:39 PM
..
 Metal Box at Westhoughton,
...

Ahh yes, I remember that, next to Franny Lee's loo roll factory. :moony:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on October 06, 2019, 05:47:28 PM
How long are your freights going to be? Every time I open the thread Iím disgustingly jealous of your space and picture monstrous container rakes!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 06, 2019, 08:32:47 PM
Unfortunately the Metal Box siding, along with the factory has long gone and is now houses.

I plan on adding a waste terminal based on the current one at Knowsley and I plan on running the Knowsley to Wilton BinLiner. I have a rake of KFA's on order, but I will have to make the 30' blue boxes myself though.

This train is the first freight in many years to use the Atherton line, it runs daily with empties from Man Vic through Wallgate to Knowsley. On the loaded return working, it heads through Wallgate and then south on the WCML through Warrington and then works it's way around the south side of Manchester.

I asked why has this routing on RMWEB and got just two responses, saying that perhaps the climb up at Miles Platting bank was being avoided.

If anyone here has any ideas I'd like to hear them.

Course if I'd asked about freight at Wigan Central in 1928 I would have got at least a hundred answers!!!!!!!

As far as train length goes it will depend on the loco, A Farish 66 or 60 can handle 18 HTA's on a 2% gradient, so I'm thinking a max of around 20 bogie wagons. Of course if I confine the longest trains to the flat then I can probably make up a larger formation.

I think the longest train that I will run with a single engine will probably be the Caledonian sleeper, 16 MK5a coaches and a CL92. But I'm still saving my pennies for the MK5a's.

I had thought about turning the lights off and pretending that a 60 with 16 TEA's was the sleeper, in the dark I don't think anyone would notice  :D

It also begs the question as to why do I need the sleeper coaches at all?? It's always dark when they run through Wigan, so they'll be really hard to see.

Anyway I'm off to the shed to make the first baseboard for the lifting section.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on October 06, 2019, 08:36:25 PM
re :

the service running via WCML through Warrington and then works it's way around the south side of Manchester.

I asked why has this routing on RMWEB and got just two responses, saying that perhaps the climb up at Miles Platting bank was being avoided. im pretty sure this is the reason. However,


by spring 2017 nine weekly trains were scheduled to run from Knowsley (two on Mondays to Thursdays and one on Friday) using DB Cargo Class 66 haulage and formed of up to 20 FCA wagons.

The loaded trains out of Knowsley are routed south along the West Coast Main Line from Wigan as far as Hartford LNW Junction, before they also traverse the mid-Cheshire line and the eastern environs of Manchester to join the Calder Valley route at Brewery Junction, thus avoiding the steep climb up Miles Platting bank from Manchester Victoria.

However, the empty trains take the more direct route down the bank and through Manchester Victoria station before heading along either the former L&Y line via Swinton, Atherton and Crow Nest Junction to reach Wigan, or else continuing from Victoria along the old LNW line through Eccles to join the WCML via Parkside Junction and Golborne Junction.

The early morning empties have to be sent via Eccles as the signal boxes on the former L&Y route do not open until 06.00.

https://www.therailwayhub.co.uk/3643/freight-focus-fragrant-world-of-the-binliner/ (https://www.therailwayhub.co.uk/3643/freight-focus-fragrant-world-of-the-binliner/)



but you have some pretty solid plans john


look forward to seeing / hearing more on this lovely project
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on October 06, 2019, 08:52:30 PM
The Caledonian Sleeper is delayed so often I think it can be seen just about everywhere in daylight at sometime or other!

Pairs of 86s on FL workings, so no excuses for not running at least 30 flats. I can vicariously enjoy full length trains on your layout! ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on October 06, 2019, 08:59:23 PM
..
 I will have to make the 30' blue boxes myself though.
...

Maybe time to invest in a 3D printer John? You could download the .STL files for 20' bins from here (https://www.shapeways.com/product/GVADZ5LC3/20-waste-container-manchester-80s-n-gauge-1-148?optionId=59485910&li=marketplace) and here (https://www.shapeways.com/product/69TAUGPPV/20-waste-container-manchester-n-gauge-1-148?optionId=59485586&li=marketplace).
 :beers:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on October 06, 2019, 09:07:38 PM
You can't download STLs from Shapeways, merely buy prints. Those are designed by Vonzack of this parish, I've got some of his KTAs, KFAs and FEAs and they're very nice models though. Not a cheap way to fill an entire train however!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on October 06, 2019, 09:11:16 PM
You can't download STLs from Shapeways, merely buy prints. Those are designed by Vonzack of this parish, I've got some of his KTAs, KFAs and FEAs and they're very nice models though. Not a cheap way to fill an entire train however!

Without any fanfare that I've seen, Shapeways seem to have introduced the option of purchasing .STL files:
Quote
Download the .STL file
Looking to print on your own printers? Purchase a digital version of this file instead.
Download now for $9.99
Source (https://www.shapeways.com/product/GVADZ5LC3/20-waste-container-manchester-80s-n-gauge-1-148?optionId=59485910&li=marketplace)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on October 06, 2019, 09:11:57 PM
Oops, sorry! That's new I think! Obviously you can choose to make your designs available. Mea culpa!

Edit: although where are you seeing that? "STL" doesn't seem to appear on either of the pages you linked to? Could be really interested in that if it's a common feature!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 06, 2019, 11:57:43 PM
..
 I will have to make the 30' blue boxes myself though.
...

Maybe time to invest in a 3D printer John? You could download the .STL files for 20' bins from here (https://www.shapeways.com/product/GVADZ5LC3/20-waste-container-manchester-80s-n-gauge-1-148?optionId=59485910&li=marketplace) and here (https://www.shapeways.com/product/69TAUGPPV/20-waste-container-manchester-n-gauge-1-148?optionId=59485586&li=marketplace).
 :beers:



Yes, thanks for the links.

The only trouble is that the containers used have subtle differences. The Manc ones have the V shape at the end, some of the others have a panel for a logo, and the Edinburgh ones aren't quite the same on the sides and possibly the ends.

We'll be back in Manchester over Christmas to see my son's family and I've already made sure that I have permission for a train day all by myself. Mainly to take detailed photos of Wallgate and North Western, but I also intend to time it right to get some shots of the binliner containers.

I do have a Silhouette cutter and I'm thinking that I could cut out the ribbing from plastic card and overlay it on a plain 20' box. I'm also thinking of commissioning someone to do a 3D model but as a kit, maybe that would be cheaper. Even through Shapeways in the US they still work out at almost $10 per box.

Maybe Arran could do a kit with 3 or 4 different sets of overlays so that the buyer could do Manchester, Edinburgh, Bristol, or Knowsley.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on October 07, 2019, 12:09:54 AM
..
Yes, thanks for the links.
...

The notion of downloading the .STL file is a bust now John, turns out it was just a trial of possible future features (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=46777.msg594030#msg594030).


..
Maybe Arran could do a kit with 3 or 4 different sets of overlays so that the buyer could do Manchester, Edinburgh, Bristol
...

You had me at Bristol. I'm in! :D But let's not distract Arran from the FTA/FSA container wagons! :no:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on October 07, 2019, 12:28:08 AM
john


there are selections of knowsley wilton binliner train close up on google search if clicks the images once typed in the search bar
and also type flickr after knowsley wilton binliner train
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on October 07, 2019, 07:40:53 AM
I'm also thinking of commissioning someone to do a 3D model but as a kit, maybe that would be cheaper. Even through Shapeways in the US they still work out at almost $10 per box.

A 3D kit would be markedly harder to make than a full box with virtually no advantages. Should be easy enough to draw one up though! What are you doing about the wagons though, as they use FCAs, which arenít available.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 07, 2019, 02:34:12 PM
I was planning on using the Revs KFA's. But the Dapol Spines may be more appropriate.

I may have to resort to rule 1.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 13, 2019, 09:41:53 PM
I've made a start on my 4 track lifting section. I ordered some PCB strip board and some adjustable feet for my baseboard legs and once they arrived I started work.

The adjustable feet.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212245-827301515.jpeg)

I wish I'd thought of these when I was building the rest of the baseboards as it would have made dealing with the sloping floor much easier.

First I made a 4' by 8" baseboard frame, with adjustable feet at the end where the lifting section will be. My first task was to line it up at the correct angle to get the track laid properly for the 2 track mainline to widen out to 6 tracks.

I lined up the frame and used a cross piece of 2x1 timber to hold it in place at the correct angle.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212250-827321422.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212247-827311075.jpeg)

Then I cut out the XPS on the adjacent board so that I could lay a piece of 8" wide XPS across the gap between the baseboards.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212252-827331917.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212233-82726310.jpeg)

I also left a gap at the other end so that the track at this end can be supported on the strip board attached to MDF.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212232-827261817.jpeg)

So far so good.

I then added a piece of 2x1 and 4x1 to the frame to support the MDF top. The 4x1 piece was made to overhang to support the lifting section.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212239-8272818.jpeg)

Then the MDF top was added and the adjustable feet used to ensure all was level at this end.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/82/3871-131019212240-827282236.jpeg).

Next I'll build another 4' x 8" frame with adjustable feet at both ends, this will be semi permanently attached to this board so that I can get the lifting section to work.

I'll leave it attached until I get to connect the rest of the new boards to the existing layout, hopefully by then there won't be much movement of baseboards to deal with.

I also got another box of track and more large radius code 55 points so that I can complete the mainline run.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 25, 2019, 11:01:28 PM
All my baseboards for the mainline are now complete. I decided that it would be better to get everything in place before I tried to line up the lifting section. This was just as well as even though I thought I'd stuck to my plan there's a big gap where the two ends don't meet.

Here's the lifting section.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-251019224856-832012080.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-251019224854-83200686.jpeg)

I've yet to add the PCB strip board.

And with the plan laid out on top.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-251019224857-83202945.jpeg)

The gap.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-251019224846-83189816.jpeg)

This is a section of plane line so adjusting the track won't be an issue.

And finally some shots of the overall view from this corner of the layout.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-251019224853-83200697.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-251019224852-831991703.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-251019224847-831891170.jpeg)

Next I'm laying track on the mainline to make a start on Golborne Junction. This will allow the main to go from 2 to 4 tracks, before it hits the lifting section.

I have all the points I need but I've had to order more point motors and another NCE Switch 8 to control them all.

They'll take longer to get here from US retailers than my points did from Hattons  ???

It won't be long now before trains are running again :claphappy:

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on October 25, 2019, 11:17:51 PM
Look forward to seeing golborne junction. Even the best layouts take time. Look forward to your progress
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on October 26, 2019, 02:09:04 AM
wow this is going to be some layout.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on October 26, 2019, 03:38:02 AM
wow this is going to be some layout.

Thanks,

Iím not looking forward to the ballasting though. :doh:

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on October 26, 2019, 04:37:38 AM
Yes, you're going to have your work cut out for you there!

As a documented hater of ballasting, Good luck with that one, buddy!  ;)

But Graham is right - it's going to be a corker of a layout.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 04, 2019, 12:09:40 AM
Work is slowly progressing as the mainline is getting ever closer to being finished.

I've completed the area which allows the 2 track main to spin off a single track branch, as both then cross over the Westhoughton line and head towards Golborne Junction.

As I found last time around, getting the frog switching right on the single slip took at least half an hour. In order for the frogs to be at the correct polarity you MUST select the correct combination of point motor settings in order to select the correct route. I suppose I could have cheated and use Frog Juicers but I decided to do it the hard way  :doh:

Here's a pic.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-031119235648-835212349.jpeg)

I also had to complete the Westhoughton line track laying as it would be hard to do that after the main line tracks were put in.

The 'flyover' bits are just plasticard painted black on the bottom and with a covering of plaster bandage on top with a brown base coat.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-031119235700-83527108.jpeg)

Here's view of the whole thing.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-031119235648-83521961.jpeg)

A loco has been test run up and down on all the routes.

The only thing stopping me from finishing this off quickly is that I've almost run out of rail joiners, and even though I bought a box of track 2 weeks ago, I've almost run out of track as well. Serves me right for doing a 6 track mainline.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 04, 2019, 12:35:28 AM
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign:
  Looking good John, great progress   :thumbsup:
       regards Derek.
       
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 04, 2019, 01:12:56 AM
Thanks john. Its an exciting project worth waiting to view and must be pleased so far. Flyover looks good
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on November 04, 2019, 10:03:25 AM

A loco has been test run up and down on all the routes.


I think we're in need of a vid of that please ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 04, 2019, 01:43:03 PM

A loco has been test run up and down on all the routes.


I think we're in need of a vid of that please ;)

Yeah, the said loco already came off the rails at the end because I wasn't looking. So doing a video will have to wait.

It won't be long, honest.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: chrispearce on November 04, 2019, 08:43:20 PM
Apologies for being dim or if I have missed something but has the track plan evolved or changed since the start of this thread? I seem to have lost the ability to relate your pics to the original 'fiqure 8' plan.

It is, as everyone rightly says, looking increasingly impressive.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 04, 2019, 09:13:20 PM
Apologies for being dim or if I have missed something but has the track plan evolved or changed since the start of this thread? I seem to have lost the ability to relate your pics to the original 'fiqure 8' plan.

It is, as everyone rightly says, looking increasingly impressive.  :thumbsup:

The plan has changed from the figure of 8 as I realised that I would have ended up with Pendolinos running through Wallgate as well as North Western. The WCML now follows more of the outline of a letter U. From the fiddle yard it goes up, then down through Wigan, then round the bottom of the U and up through Springs Branch and then down again through Golborne Junction and back to the yard. The lines from Wallgate are tucked in the middle and I haven't got any definitive plans for them yet.

My SCARM plan is to big to post, but I may have a go at splitting it up and posting multiple plans to help make sense of it all.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: chrispearce on November 04, 2019, 09:51:12 PM

My SCARM plan is to big to post, but I may have a go at splitting it up and posting multiple plans to help make sense of it all.


That, Sir, is showing off. ;) However, should it be possible to post the plan in segments, it would be really interesting. The room is large and the layout makes full use of the space so I find it hard to see what the plan is. Even a hand-drawn schematic would help.

Just a thought. The layout is obviously going to be an excellent model mainline and I look forward to seeing your progress. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: lil chris on November 04, 2019, 11:54:00 PM
Hi John, just been catching up on your post's. That is one impressive railway, I wish I had that much room. My new layout will be about 9' x 4'-6", I have managed to gain a extra foot in width, but overall the layout will take less room than my previous layout. You have some good ideas on there, I like the wago connectors for instance. I too seem to have a uneven floor in my loft. My fiddle yard had castors and tended to lean a bit on one side, the front was ok I had like you used height correctors. Over here you can buy height adjusters to fit to the side of a leg you could perhaps get some of those to correct your layout if needed.
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/1784-041119235305.jpeg)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Ensign Elliott on November 05, 2019, 12:07:47 PM
This will be an excellent layout!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 05, 2019, 03:11:08 PM
I had an idle half hour, so here's the current plan.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-051119150756.jpeg)

Except that there is now a lifting section in the 4 track section after Golborne junction, and the Westhoughton and Southport/Krkby lines may or may not join up.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on November 05, 2019, 03:16:39 PM
Wow!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 05, 2019, 04:02:39 PM
thanks for that are you using OS maps / google maps to make a rough idea of the layout and its plan john ?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 05, 2019, 05:09:21 PM
thanks for that are you using OS maps / google maps to make a rough idea of the layout and its plan john ?

I used Google maps satellite view to get all the dimensions right around the 2 stations, but when it came to doing the main line south of Wigan I failed miserably as on the satellite view at least one track was always in shadow and totally obscured.

I knew that at Wigan NW the lines are from West to East, Down Slow, Down Fast, Up Fast, and Up Slow, but how they then got to be 6 tracks and then at Golborne Junction ended up with Down Freight, Up Freight, Down Slow, Up Slow, Down Fast, Up Fast baffled me.

But after asking on RMWEB I was given the Sectional Appendix for the area and I was then able to figure out all the junctions and just relied on Google maps for a few critical distance measurements. So the lines from Wigan Station Junction to Golborne Junction have been compressed significantly, and Springs Branch depot has been omitted completely.

I know, I know, missing out Springs Branch was a big blow, I should have bought a house with a bigger shed!

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 05, 2019, 05:24:49 PM
Could you not incorporate a scenic break with a photo of springs branch and the surrounding area!? Worth a thought
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 05, 2019, 05:29:27 PM
Could you not incorporate a scenic break with a photo of springs branch and the surrounding area!? Worth a thought

Now that I'm done printing plans, for now, on my large format printer. I have been planning to do some backscenes to see how they turn out.
The printer is an HP T120 and was got as a Christmas present a couple of years ago and has more than paid for itself when compared to having a local print shop print out the plan, especially as it has been revised at least 6 times. It will do photo quality stuff, but I don't want to think about the price of the ink!

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: chrispearce on November 05, 2019, 08:17:31 PM
Thanks for the updated track plan. It is REALLY helpful and the pics now make perfect sense. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 07, 2019, 08:51:29 PM
Thanks for the updated track plan. It is REALLY helpful and the pics now make perfect sense. :thumbsup:
:hellosign:
Totally agree, impressive plan John
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: dmck123 on November 11, 2019, 06:17:50 PM
Hi John

Just found your layout "on the other channel". Looks like a giant and very very interesting project. I will be following along and when I get a quiet moment I will read it through from page1.

All the best
Dave
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: chrispearce on November 11, 2019, 07:11:16 PM
Hi John

Just found your layout "on the other channel". Looks like a giant and very very interesting project. I will be following along and when I get a quiet moment I will read it through from page1.

All the best
Dave

"The other channel"???
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 11, 2019, 07:56:34 PM
Hi John

Just found your layout "on the other channel". Looks like a giant and very very interesting project. I will be following along and when I get a quiet moment I will read it through from page1.

All the best
Dave

"The other channel"???

RMWEB,  I mention the layout in my signature.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 14, 2019, 03:26:10 PM
So it's getting very exciting, well I'm excited.

I have finished laying track and testing the 4 track lifting section. I'm less than 6 pieces of flextrack away from having the Up and Down Fast Mainline done, which means I'll have a continuous run and I might even do some videos.

Here's the lifting section.

Hinges

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-141119151813-839132016.jpeg)

At this end I forgot to securely fix the two boards together so the first track I laid had to be shuffled sideways to get it to line up properly, this was a fairly slow job as it was all soldered down, and it wasn't until I cut the track that everything went sideways.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-141119151815-83913872.jpeg)

Here's the whole thing

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-141119151807-8390646.jpeg)

And with the hand of God.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/83/3871-141119151807-839061487.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: chrispearce on November 14, 2019, 03:56:23 PM
Neat!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on November 14, 2019, 04:26:25 PM
Looks great!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 14, 2019, 04:33:35 PM
john

that's pretty professional woodwork / carpentry
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 14, 2019, 05:40:06 PM
john

that's pretty professional woodwork / carpentry

Trust me. It really isn't. It's more like a swan, you don't want to see what's happening beneath the surface.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 15, 2019, 06:56:27 PM
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign:
Very impressive John.  :thumbsup:
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 17, 2019, 09:08:50 PM
TIME FOR THE BIG REVEAL!!!!!!

I have now got the Down and Up Fast lines done and have been test running Pendolinos. Lots of minor niggles found, mainly Tortoise actuation wires standing too tall and a couple of track feeds that were getting in the way.

But two issues took a while to sort. All my Northbound Pendolinos derailed the last bogie of car 4 on the curves approaching Wigan, this was fascinating because it happened with multiple Penodlinos and it was always the same bogie on all of them. Finally traced to a bit of reverse cant on the curve which was easily fix by packing the outer rail a little.

The second issue was that the last powered bogie on the rear car of my Southbound Pendolinos would derail running through the single slip that I has used as it was lying around doing nothing. This slip is used to allow Northbound trains to leave the storage sidings and cross from the Down Fast over the Up Fast and onto the "Chat Moss line", all one foot of it before it appears as a single track chord at Golborne Junction. The Pendos would across it quite happily from Down Fast to Chat Moss, or in the other direction from Chat Moss to Up Fast, but they always derailed when running straight through on the Up Fast. I messed around with it yesterday for an hour or so and finally gave up and ordered 2 large radius right hand points from Hattons. All I had managed to figure out was that the trailing power car would only derail if it was actively pushing the rest of the train, but it would run through quite happily on its own.

However this morning I had another fiddle around with thin bits of plasticard, trying to close up flangeways and gaps, and although I ended up having apparently done NOTHING AT ALL, the Pendos can now negotiate the straight route through the slip without derailing.

So here goes.



I didn't have the sound functions turned on but at least I managed to keep from whistling this time.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: chrispearce on November 17, 2019, 09:19:23 PM
Congratulations to you! Lovely curves and perfect running. :thumbsup:

It's huge! :goggleeyes:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: lil chris on November 17, 2019, 09:28:29 PM
Nice running there John, pleased for you that your sorted the problems. That is a large layout, even better being in N- Gauge.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on November 17, 2019, 09:33:56 PM
Incredible! Well done.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: RailGooner on November 17, 2019, 09:38:17 PM
Lovely smooth running - straight and level. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 17, 2019, 11:48:31 PM
Pleasant video. Must admit having that space allows running trains that effectively. Look forward to progress john
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 18, 2019, 12:07:38 AM
Thanks everyone.

I'm still a novice when it comes to taking videos but I'm sure with practice I'll be able to change the focus and remember to block out the afternoon sun!

Some freight next I think!

Thanks once again.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on November 18, 2019, 05:02:00 AM
brilliant, looking forward to seeing more as you progress.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on November 18, 2019, 05:53:58 AM
They certainly are belting along!

But I guess they do in real life!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on November 18, 2019, 09:48:24 AM
Very, very impressive, John. Out of curiosity what is the map at 1.11 of please?

Lovely curves and perfect running. :thumbsup:


A perfect description.........................of Jessica Ennis-Hill :)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 18, 2019, 02:22:03 PM
Very, very impressive, John. Out of curiosity what is the map at 1.11 of please?

Lovely curves and perfect running. :thumbsup:


A perfect description.........................of Jessica Ennis-Hill :)

It's a Railway Clearing House map of pre-grouping railways around Wigan, downloaded and printed out on my large format printer, which, when it isn't printing 1:1 Scarm plans, doesn't do much.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 18, 2019, 02:24:21 PM
They certainly are belting along!

But I guess they do in real life!  :thumbsup:

Well they are on the Fast lines after all :bounce:

Once the slow and freight lines are done some things will have a more leisurely pace(r)!

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 19, 2019, 01:34:28 AM
 :hellosign:
  Excellent video John, Pendo's look superb
        regards Derek.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 19, 2019, 03:40:02 AM
As promised, some freight.



Pity that 5 of the tankers decided to have a rest just out of shot! Fixed with some canopy glue, but only after I'd done the video.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on November 19, 2019, 03:44:56 AM
Another cool video  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 19, 2019, 05:56:17 AM
Maybe a vid with an a c electric or a unit slowing for the wigan nw stop and then easing out on the right of way be good. Im not a racetrack fan.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on November 19, 2019, 06:07:00 AM
lovely
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on November 19, 2019, 10:06:51 AM
Oh no! He's started whistling again! :whistle:

at least I managed to keep from whistling this time.

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on November 19, 2019, 12:53:07 PM
Looking great! Always good to see long trains really stretching their legs, rather than having the two ends bent through 180 degrees!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 19, 2019, 02:33:30 PM
Maybe a vid with an a c electric or a unit slowing for the wigan nw stop and then easing out on the right of way be good. Im not a racetrack fan.

Give me a break  :D

It's baby steps as far as the videos go. Once I've worked out how to hold the camera and operate trains at the same time you might get lucky.

And in any case the videos are for my grandson you lot are an afterthought.  :P

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 19, 2019, 02:36:08 PM
We love them really oh and yor layout john.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 29, 2019, 12:40:16 AM
Well I'm very pleased to report that the Up & Down Slow and Freight lines are now finished, which means I'm done with track laying and electrics for a while.

I did a test run on the Slow lines but have yet to test the freight lines.

Here's the final bits of the jigsaw and my version of Bamfurlong Junction.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/84/3871-291119002932-84502612.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/84/3871-291119002933-84502380.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/84/3871-291119002938-845041531.jpeg)

I can now run 6 trains at a time  :D

Or I could if, I had enough hands, eyes, and iPads.

So either I wait for my grandchildren to get a little older, or I start to think about some form of automation.

But for now I'll content myself with driving no more than 2 trains at a time.

Next up will be starting to do ballasting and adding some scenery.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 29, 2019, 12:54:29 AM
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign:
   Thanks for the updates John, looking good   :thumbsup:
        regards Derek.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on November 30, 2019, 04:24:42 AM
Here's couple of videos of test runs on the freight lines.

The second is best viewed with the sound muted.





Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on November 30, 2019, 04:47:33 AM
Very smooth running indeed.  :thumbsup:

Not the catchiest of tunes, though.  ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on November 30, 2019, 06:36:55 AM
Super work on bamfurlong and those freight lines john. Algree with george there on the tune
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on November 30, 2019, 07:54:35 AM
this is seriously making me consider taking everything else out of the garage and just filling the garage with the layout.

looks amazing.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 16, 2020, 06:23:04 PM
So after a long break over Christmas, I finally got back into the train shed this week.

Hmmmm, where do I start?

I received a number of Oxford vehicles and Metcalfe kits for Christmas and had put some together in the warmth of the house. I went out to the shed over the weekend and decided to clear some space at the end of Wallgate station, this involved pulling the paper plan from the baseboards and sweeping up lots of junk. It also, apparently, involved creating short circuit.

Finished tidying, got various goodies out of the box, including a Dapol 'Biffa' CL66 and after chipping decided to run it in. That's when I found the short.

Three days later, and having unwired a lot of sections and having lifted track to isolate the short, I had finally got it fixed and everything wired back up.  :veryangry:

So time to run a train.

I ran a Pendolino out of the storage yards to make space for running in the new CL66, it ran fine until it hit the 4 track lifting section.
Here I could see each carriage lift off the baseboard and then derail once it got to the first curve.  :'(

On taking a look, the one track on the lifting section that doesn't have a rail joiner in the middle had lifted and was bowing upwards. Now the shed has been unused for a month and it's been very cold so expansion can't have been the issue. BUT I did have the lifting section open, and therefore upside down for a month, so I can only assume that the track sagged. Anyhow it was easily fixed with a soldering iron and a track pin to firmly hold it against the baseboard.

Next I got the Pendo running again and then gave the CL66 a run in.

I took a load of pictures and when I checked them there was a little message saying "No SD card"  :doh:

So here's one I took earlier of the new loco with some new wagons.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-150120003926-861122263.jpeg)

I've also decided to start ballasting, painting track, and adding some scenery. There will be pictures.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 19, 2020, 01:16:32 AM
So, it's what we've all been waiting for!

Ballasting and scenics.

My Pendolinos might race round my layout like true thoroughbreds, but the ballasting will be mind numbingly slow :)

I'm starting on the freight flyunder at Springs Branch first, mainly to get some practice before I try any of the station areas, and also because there does need to be some structure building. I've decided to use Metcalfe retaining walls to divide the Fast lines from the gradient, here are a few pics to show the general idea,

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004716-8635037.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004718-86351279.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004723-86352625.jpeg)

None of this is stuck down, and as you'll see later I've already moved the walls a bit to give more clearance for trains using the freight lines.

Today I removed the walls and then cut away some of the plaster bandage and polystyrene to give a better transition to the gradient.

I added a thin sheet of balsa to cover the gap between the risers that I had used and the rest of the baseboard.

Next I painted the rail sides grey, and ballasted the track, I soaked the ballast with dilute PVA and have left it to set over night.

I also glued the first piece of retaining wall in place butted up against the balsa.

Here are some more pics.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004657-863461785.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004655-8634428.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004711-86349172.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004707-863481435.jpeg)

And an overview

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/86/3871-190120004705-863471317.jpeg)

I have pulled all the track pins, since I took the photos. I'm also going to let everything dry thoroughly before test running a loco. Wet paint, glue, and ballast probably wouldn't do the gears any good.

BTW after studying lots of pictures, my running lines will be grey and anything that isn't used very often will be rusty.

All comments, criticism, and advice welcome.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on January 19, 2020, 06:20:18 AM
Looking good. Take your time and work bit by bit. Those retaining walls look good.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on January 19, 2020, 07:50:40 AM
with the size of your layout I am sure you will be tempted to rush it, but as @crewearpley40 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=3894) said, take your time, I know I rushed in my early attempts and regretted it.
cheers
Graham
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on January 19, 2020, 07:59:16 AM
Ballasting around points surely is tricky. But even the best layouts have been achieved by time spent . There are many methods of and for ballasting.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 19, 2020, 02:38:53 PM
with the size of your layout I am sure you will be tempted to rush it, but as @crewearpley40 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=3894) said, take your time, I know I rushed in my early attempts and regretted it.
cheers
Graham

You know, 10 years ago I would have been tempted. But now, and as it is so large, rushing it would still take months. So I'm going to take my time, and when I get bored there's plenty more to be doing. Finishing the line through Wallgate, making station platforms, fixing non runners, doing general scenery, and working out where and how to fit in more storage sidings.

Thanks everyone,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on January 19, 2020, 09:17:36 PM
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign:
    Thanks for the latest updates John, nice steady progress
        regards Derek
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: ptopo on January 20, 2020, 10:38:13 PM
Hiya, what a super layout with loads of potential. Thereís some great lessons shared too, thank-you.

Regarding ballasting thereís lots of good guides and I include what I learned here...

https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=20056.30 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=20056.30)

Pages 3-4 cover the subject - thereís plenty around ballasting points but the best tip I ever came across was to add a drop of plastic oil on the sides of the bit of plastic that joins the end of the switch rails (far end  from frog). This stops it jamming.

The only major tip I have is painting the rails first, it makes keeping them distinct from the ballast painting pretty easy with an airbrush.

On a less practical note I have to save some of the jobs I love (track laying, electronics) and switch into those I donít (scenery) to keep variety on a long project.

Good luck!

PT

Good luck
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 29, 2020, 08:47:00 PM
Today I decided to make a virtue out of necessity.

I have two Dapol CL86 locos, one powered, one dummy, in the old Freightliner Green livery. On both of them the wires for the lights have broken and I have spent a few frustrating hours trying to get them to work.

I also have a CL86 in the Freightliner swoosh livery which has been chipped and still has working lights.

After reading @acko22 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=4166) 's thread regarding FL Intermodal trains I realised that to be accurate I would always need to double head any Intermodal that had CL86 haulage.

That's when the light bulb went off!

All of my freights run in semi permanent rakes, so that meant that I could put the swoosh CL86 at the head of the train with it's lights on, and then couple one of my lightless 86's between it and the rest of the train.

My layout is DCC using a Z21 system and double heading is very easy as it doesn't involve tweaking any CV's to create a 'consist'.

Here's what was needed.

1. Take the swoosh CL86 and and set its speed to be displayed in Speed Steps rather than MPH.
2. Run it 4 times over a fixed length of track and 4 different speed step settings and record the times taken.
3. Open the traction settings on the Z21 for that loco and enter the values just captured.
4. Change the speed displayed back to MPH
5. Chip the lightless CL86 and give it it's own address.
6. Do the same traction settings exercise.
7. Add a 'Train' on the Z21 rather than a loco and select the two CL86's that will be used in that train.
8. Set the locos apart and make sure that they run in the same default direction, in my case they didn't.
9. Go back to the Traction settings page and check the box which says 'reverse direction of travel for multitraction'
10. Try step 8 again and they are now running in the same direction and at roughly the same speed.
11. Couple them up together and then to the train and make a video.



BTW I decided not to deliberately break the swoosh CL86 to turn off its tail lights, and I have yet to work out how to add a flashing red light at the back of the rack.

In this case I won't ever run these two locos separately, but if I wanted to it's very simple. On the Z21 you just stop the consist and turn off its lights. Then uncouple the loco's. Next select either of the 2 individual locos on the Z21 and drive it away.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on January 29, 2020, 09:40:48 PM
Like you Iíll never run my FL 86s separately, so I just gave them the same address. Even easier.

Swoosh livery is called ďPowerhaulĒ FWIW.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: acko22 on January 29, 2020, 09:52:13 PM
Hi all,

Well @jpendle (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=3871) I am glad the thread is useful for you, Can I make one possible suggestion for the lone 86 if you want to get the lights playing.
86608 was part of an experiment between 2000 - 2016 and was numbered 86501 as part of this it ran as a lone locomotive, from what I understand (Before my rail working time) it ran rakes of around 20 wagons as a rule of thumb. thats if you want to get the lights working and maybe renumber it
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on January 29, 2020, 10:17:51 PM
86608  the former 501 was involved in a loco fire in 1975 at nuneaton on the then  1S26 Glasgow sleeper, suffered another in 2015 / 16 at Bletchley Skewbridge spending 2016 out of service then became 608 on 75mph / 80mph restricted presumably Crewe to Ipswich freightliners. The loco retained her more lighter yellow melony coloured shade at the front.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: acko22 on January 29, 2020, 10:24:02 PM
86608  the former 501 was involved in a loco fire in 1975 at nuneaton on the then  1S26 Glasgow sleeper, suffered another in 2015 / 16 at Bletchley Skewbridge spending 2016 out of service then became 608 on 75mph / 80mph restricted presumably Crewe to Ipswich freightliners. The loco retained her more lighter yellow melony coloured shade at the front.

Yeah just done some more digging and you are indeed correct it was until 2016! As I say before My rail employment time so going off what source info I had! As for the yellow well don't let the shade change fool you, it more a case of fading anda :censored: batch of paint been put on all them years ago rather than a different shade entirely
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on January 29, 2020, 10:32:01 PM
Sure. Google 86608 loco 2016 and theres Leighton logs , Flickr photos and some notes re 86608 and the gear work.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on January 29, 2020, 10:43:16 PM
Google 86501 locomotive. Click o n ac locomotive group. Plenty of info there
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on January 29, 2020, 11:40:44 PM
Like you Iíll never run my FL 86s separately, so I just gave them the same address. Even easier.

Swoosh livery is called ďPowerhaulĒ FWIW.

I thought about doing that, but the Powerhaul one isn't quite as fast as the other so I did the speed matching just to be safe.

FWIW I am slowly working through all my fleet doing the speed matching thing.

I am able to get 2 of my 68's running in top and tail mode with Nuclear Flask wagons, and it also allows me to run 'unlike' locos the same way.

I have just come a cropper on the layout though.

I had one of my KQA's running at the back of the rake of FEA's and it kept derailing, the problem is the body mounted couplings on the FEA's. They seem to run quite happily together but don't play well with the KQA's.

That led me to try to add the KQA's to my Farish FIA's. I set the points on my fiddle yard and backed out the train onto the mainline. Or rather I didn't, as all the FIA's derailed.
Turns out that the Tortoise point motor on one of the points isn't working. I checked the output of the NCE Switch8 that I'm using and all was fine there.
So next up is removing the Tortoise to see what's up. I do have a couple spare, but as I plan on redoing the fiddle yard to add more tracks and length I may not bother fixing that siding.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 02, 2020, 02:46:36 AM
So two new loco's and some Realtrack PCA's arrived in the post this week.

I bought a Freightliner Powerhaul CL66 and another EWS CL66, both Farish.

The EWS CL66 arrived as 66111, but I already have that one from Hattons/Dapol as a weathered version.

I decided to re-number it and here's the result.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-020220020313-87029165.jpeg)

Which I think looks pretty good for my first attempt at renumbering a loco.

And here's couple of videos.





And I have a confession to make.  :sorrysign:

66135 was the very first loco I bought when getting back into N Gauge around 15 years ago.
I trashed the motor trying to get it to haul 22 Farish HTA's up a 3% gradient on a curve, and the body has been sitting in my spares box since then.
So renumbering 66111 consisted of, removing the body, adding the decoder, and then putting the 66135 body on instead. :D

Regards,

John P



Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on February 02, 2020, 06:36:13 AM
66135 was the very first loco I bought when getting back into N Gauge around 15 years ago.
I trashed the motor trying to get it to haul 22 Farish HTA's up a 3% gradient on a curve, and the body has been sitting in my spares box since then.
So renumbering 66111 consisted of, removing the body, adding the decoder, and then putting the 66135 body on instead. :D
That's not only honest, but extremely sensible.  In general, we don't do sensible in this house.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 09, 2020, 10:31:38 PM
Another quick update.

A bit more track painting & ballasting has been done.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-090220221126-873052034.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-090220221129-873141446.jpeg)

Also I decided to get a booster for my DCC system. The Z21 is a 3A system but when you read between the lines it becomes apparent that it's maximum steady state current is somewhat less than 3A (between 2.5 & 3A). The Tortoise motors and their decoders take 1.6A, and then all my locos at rest take a further 1A, getting me close to the limit.
One other issue is that the NCE Switch8's that I am using to control the Tortoises do not play well with Railcom, so I've had to switch Railcom off on my Z21.
This got me to thinking that a booster just for the points, with the ability to turn Railcom off, might be a good idea.
I looked around and the Z21 10805 'light' Booster seemed to fit the bill. I looked at others, like Digikeijs and some US stuff but at just 80 euros the 10805 was one of the most competitively priced. It doesn't come with a power supply though. I decided against the Roco PSU (another 70 euros) and had a rummage in my box of redundant laptop PSU's and found one that would work. The 10805 was duly ordered and it arrived yesterday.

Got it out to have a look and found that the DC plug on my PSU was too big! Had another rummage in a different box and found another laptop PSU with a smaller DC plug that did fit.

Today I hooked it up to the Z21 and then disconnected the accessory bus from the Z21 and hooked it up to the booster, turned Railcom off on the booster and everything works as it should. So I now have an isolated accessory bus that can cope with more points, when I get around to adding to the layout, plus plenty of capacity on the main Z21 for more locos.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-090220221133-873151414.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: lil chris on February 09, 2020, 11:33:39 PM
Nice videos John, if I run trains that length I think they would probably catch up with them selves, wish I had so much room.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on February 10, 2020, 05:32:46 AM
And I have a confession to make.  :sorrysign:

66135 was the very first loco I bought when getting back into N Gauge around 15 years ago.
I trashed the motor trying to get it to haul 22 Farish HTA's up a 3% gradient on a curve, and the body has been sitting in my spares box since then.
So renumbering 66111 consisted of, removing the body, adding the decoder, and then putting the 66135 body on instead. :D

Regards,

John P

I did the same thing, but bought a new motor from Bob at BRLines  to get it back up and running, works better now than it did before.

cheers
Graham
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: tc4332 on February 12, 2020, 09:22:00 AM
Just found this thread and taken three days to read it all. Well done John. Jealous doesn't fit the bill fully.
I live ten minutes walk away from Wigan NW, across the road from Wigan Pier and been there for over 40 years.
Thank you for the descriptions and videos.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 19, 2020, 03:59:51 AM
As it was a 3 day weekend here, I decided to bite the bullet and redo my storage yard.

Originally I designed it with a gap between the tracks to allow space for my fingers to deal with derailed stock, but as I didn't concentrate I ended up with tracks spaced just far enough for my fingers not to fit!

I ran out of space a while ago, 4 Pendolinos take up a lot of room, so I decided to redo the yard with no additional space. This will give me longer storage sidings and allow me to add more in future.

Here's a few pics of the general demolition.

A very deep breath was taken before I started this  :D

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-190220033827-876542057.jpeg)

And everything stored neatly away!

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-190220033830-876551829.jpeg)

I bought a sheet of 8 x 4 XPS to redo the 16 x 2 baseboard surface.

This is the first new piece in place.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-190220033813-87649831.jpeg)

The lifting section was modified to make it easier to align.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-190220033815-876501816.jpeg)

The first points were laid and the first couple of sheets of the plan laid on the baseboard to make sure that everything was centered.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-190220033819-876511476.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-190220033820-87652583.jpeg)

As everything is spaced closer I don't even have enough points to get to the end of the first sheet, but it does allow me to add up to 10 more sidings in the future.

Hopefully this week I'll be able to make some significant progress on points and point motors.

On another note, I had been getting a flashing red LED on my Z21 if I left it switched on overnight. It was as if there had been a short, but I couldn't figure out the issue. Now that I've added the booster the Z21 has been on for the best part of a week with no flashing red LED. My working hypothesis is that, as the Z21 was almost at max capacity, the flashing led was caused by the Z21 detecting an over power condition.  This could be complete tosh, but as the problem has gone away I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on February 19, 2020, 05:20:23 AM
That is one big fiddle yard.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on February 19, 2020, 08:23:46 AM
Wouldnít you be better to separate the entrance roads so you can have two parallel Ďtreesí, rather than just a ladder, which takes up tonnes of space and gives some really short roads at the top.

Edit: like this glorious diagram which Iíve just squiggled on my phone


(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/1147-190220082853.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=87659)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on February 19, 2020, 08:41:20 AM
I guess it would take some serious slowing down though.

Pendolinos may suffer!  ;)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on February 19, 2020, 09:19:11 AM
Why? You still have a single straight through road, just it's the central one rather than offset to one side.

The only downside is that your absolute longest siding is slightly shorter, but it's far more space efficient. If halves the length of the pointwork at each end of the fiddle yard.

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Ben A on February 19, 2020, 09:25:52 AM

That was brave John!

Cheers

Ben A.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 19, 2020, 02:45:02 PM
Wouldnít you be better to separate the entrance roads so you can have two parallel Ďtreesí, rather than just a ladder, which takes up tonnes of space and gives some really short roads at the top.

Edit: like this glorious diagram which Iíve just squiggled on my phone


(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/1147-190220082853.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=87659)

Hmm I had looked at different geometries, like trapeziums, but hadn't thought of this one.

It does give me thought to consider a hybrid design. I've already started relaying track, but I don't have enough points to do the whole yard, and there are cross battens under the base board to deal with. Very conveniently these cross battens are just past where I shall run out of points.

I think I can turn necessity into a virtue and after the eighth point on each side running a track over the batten to the rough mid point of the remaining storage and then fanning out from either side as shown in your plan. This would mean that the last few sidings were longer on average.

Time to do a redraw on Scarm and see how it looks.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on February 19, 2020, 04:15:24 PM
To my mind the big saving is avoiding all that lost real estate in the corner of the board. Definitely worth plotting IMO.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on February 19, 2020, 08:34:36 PM
No brainer to me!

You lose the length of one point at each end of your longest siding, but the overall formation gives you vastly more siding space, with no really short roads. No additional points needed either - you just have a split of LH and RH on each half, as opposed to all one or the other.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/1147-190220203356.png) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=87689)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 20, 2020, 04:16:09 PM
Hi,

So I had a play around in Scarm and came across an issue with @njee20 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=1147) 's fiddle yard scheme.

While I agree that it does seem to provide a better use of space, I am constrained by the rest of the existing layout and as such it doesn't result in it being any more efficient.

Let me explain.

At one end of the yard there is a two track through line on a lifting section,

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-190220033819-876511476.jpeg)

at the other end there is also a two track through line which hugs the edge of the boards.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/78/3871-130619030438-784481519.jpeg)

This was the only pic I can find which was at the initial build, the line to the fiddle yard is the right most pair of tracks.

So, in order to spread out the through lines to allow sidings on either side, I would end up creating almost as much redundant space as in my current plan.

Because of this I've decided to stick with my original fan of sidings.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 22, 2020, 01:51:23 AM
Well it's been a quiet week at work, so progress has been brisk on the new storage yards.

The right hand side has had all its points laid and some track done as well. All the wiring is in place but I'm leaving connecting things up to the end. This is because the storage yards are going to be in a separate 'power district' to help isolate faults and also to prevent the runaways I get occasionally when a short occurs on the main layout.

Here's a couple of pics.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-220220014018-87772383.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-220220014023-87773509.jpeg)

At the left hand side the tracks leading up to the yard have been re-aligned because they were not central to the yard base boards. This involved widening the gradient so that the tracks could be slewed over.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-220220014014-877711800.jpeg)

And a start has been made on the points.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-220220014010-87751393.jpeg)

Hopefully I'll get this all finished over the next few days.

Once this is complete I'll have room for 4 more storage sidings on each side of the yard if needed, and the 14 sidings I started with will all be longer.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 25, 2020, 01:16:36 AM
Well I have managed to get all the points installed and wired up on the left hand side of the storage yards over the weekend.

Now its just a case of connecting all the sidings together and then wiring up the right hand sets of points and testing it all out.

I also received my Revolution KFA's and decided to pose them on the partially finished storage yard.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-250220011142-879021133.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-250220011144-87903885.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on February 27, 2020, 07:44:01 PM
All the track laying on the new storage yard is done. I've got about 1/3rd of it wired up so far.

Next it's finish the wiring and then test each road with a Pendolino. These have very little clearance, like the Dapol Megafrets, and therefore are ideal for making sure that track pins, wires, and point actuator rods won't be getting in the way.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/88/3871-270220193714-88000105.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/87/3871-270220193706-8799646.jpeg)

I'll be ordering some more track and points from Hattons, so that the yard can be expanded, 16 Small Radius points and a box of Flexitrack!

I'll worry about point motors and stuff later, it'll also spread the cost.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 02, 2020, 12:55:18 AM
Well the yard is wired up and has been thoroughly tested.

All the stock is back where it should be.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/88/3871-020320004828-881522054.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/88/3871-020320004830-88153102.jpeg)

Leaves plenty of room for all the Revolution stuff that's on order, or will be.

2 x TPE Nova 3 sets, 16 coach Caledonian sleeper, HOA's, IPA's, KUA's, 92's, Touax Holdalls, Ecofrets.

Plus my NGS timber carriers that I must get finished.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 14, 2020, 10:16:01 PM
It's been a quiet week with no layout construction being done.

I've been distracted trying to get two Dapol Class 86's to run at the same speed to get a double header Freightliner train going.
Turns out, even though I have Zimo decoders in both locos, one ran 3 times faster than the other, and when I swapped the decoders in the locos the speed difference moved with the decoder! One had an MX617N and the other had an MX621N, so I swapped out an MX621N from my CL70 into one of the 86's and got the double heading working.
I have detailed those woes on another thread here and on RMWEB.

Today I've been measuring the platforms at Wigan North Western on Google maps and making notes on my plans so that I can make a start on building some Metcalfe platforms.
I'm going to have to move some track a little as I got my original plan wrong.
Don't even ask about the platforms at Wallgate  :doh:

And if you all wait patiently a video of the double header might be forthcoming  :D

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on March 14, 2020, 10:44:41 PM
had a similar problem with a pair of 68's, both had Dapol decoders fitted, replaced with Zimo and all cam good.

Look forward to the video.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Intercity on March 15, 2020, 03:09:37 AM
Do tell about the Wallgate platforms, and will the old Pooles pie shop feature on the street?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 15, 2020, 03:31:27 PM
had a similar problem with a pair of 68's, both had Dapol decoders fitted, replaced with Zimo and all cam good.

Look forward to the video.

I have a pair of Zimo fitted 68's running top & tail on a flask train and they are well matched.

I will be experimenting more today but the Zimo MX617N and MX621N's do not perform the same even thought they have the same settings.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 15, 2020, 03:34:24 PM
Do tell about the Wallgate platforms, and will the old Pooles pie shop feature on the street?

They are far too wide, to many trips to the pie shop  :D, which these days is Galloways, if you mean the one opposite the station.
Greenhalgh's is my pie shop of choice when I'm back in the UK.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on March 15, 2020, 05:10:10 PM
Is the problem still there if you program the consist address (e.g.100) into CV19 for both locos and then set up the CVs for the consist address rather than for the two lcocs individually?  You may already be doing that of course.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 15, 2020, 06:14:41 PM
Hi Laurence,

I'm using what's called 'multi-traction' on my Z21 system.
No consisting is involved, you enter the speed characteristics of each loco into the app, create a 'train' in the app and then the app does the rest, no need for consist addressing etc.
BUT it definitely is the case that the locos used, need to run at roughly the same speed for any given speed step setting, for this too work.
When this works it's great, because you can just uncouple the locos and drive them individually and then couple them up again and drive them as a double header.

I have posted a VERY detailed question on here and RMWEB trying to find out why the two decoders have such different performance, and despite over 60 reads on both forums not a single response  :goggleeyes:

I didn't realise, but I must be at the cutting edge, DCC wise  :D

Now I am fortunate in that troubleshooting electronics problems is what I get paid for, and I enjoy it. I might just buy myself a decoder tester and do more experiments on this stuff.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 22, 2020, 12:48:05 AM
Well I've tried a couple of videos, but the first was very very blurry, the second was a bit better but has some REALLY annoying whistling.
I'll give it another try tomorrow.

Anyhow, I decided that I really needed to make a start on the station platforms at North Western, and picked the island platform for platforms 5 & 6 to make a start, as this is the simplest shape. I am using Metcalfe kits and spent a fair amount of time cutting out templates and trying to get the clearance right between the platform edge and the trains.

I finished up the platform today, and laid it in place to check the clearances. First I lined up the straight platform, platform 5, and then tweaked the track around platform 6, which is the down slow, to fit.

Clearances were checked with a dummy Dapol CL156.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000338-89309963.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000337-893091328.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000313-893041299.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000310-892961679.jpeg)

The platform doesn't sit flat on the baseboard as there are wires running underneath it, these will need to have recesses cut out in the platform walls.

But, I was happy with the result and decided to bring in a Pendolino to see how it looked.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000320-893052096.jpeg)

Definitely a bit of overhang at the back there so I took a closer look.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000322-893061349.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000329-89307916.jpeg)

What a numpty  :doh: :(

My platform is a scale 829ft 6" long, the real thing is 843ft 6", so I'm out by 14ft or over an inch in N Gauge!

The opposite platform is 890ft long and that's going to be too short on the model as well.

So I've decided that I'll need to redo the north end of the station to get the extra platform length needed for the Pendolinos.

Currently it looks like this

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-220320000329-893071921.jpeg)

and is a bit of a pig's ear.

I've refined my track laying and point motor mounting quite a bit since this was done so I'll lift the track, replace the top layer of XPS, shift the Wallgate road bridge north and then redo the track alignment to get the correct platform length.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Bealman on March 22, 2020, 01:29:37 AM
Gotta get it right!  :thumbsup:

Better now than later!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: tc4332 on March 22, 2020, 12:27:29 PM
In at least three of the photos I was looking for my house!!! :bounce:

Ray
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 23, 2020, 03:54:39 PM
Work has started on remodelling the station throat.

First I cleaned up and laid out the plans to make sure I had room for it all.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320154305-89393857.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320154309-89394658.jpeg)

Here you can see how much Wallgate will have to be moved.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320154247-893891874.jpeg)

Next I lifted all the track and retrieved the point motors.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320154248-893891212.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320154258-89392719.jpeg)

And finally removed the top layer of XPS so that I can redo the top surface.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320154254-893911102.jpeg)

I'll remove the polystyrene risers and use two layers of 1" thick XPS at this point. This will allow me to shape the elevated section to more closely follow the track alignment, as opposed to the original rectangle of XPS. I'll also cut out a section for the Wallgate road over bridge here. One thing I've just noticed is that access to the pub yard is by an alley between the pub and the railway BUT, that the first bit is under the railway bridge rather than adjacent to it.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 24, 2020, 12:05:41 AM
More working from home today, so after a trip to the Vet I was able to get more done.

XPS glued down and cut into shape.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320235912-894161979.jpeg)

Clearances for Wallgate checked with two of my wider vehicles.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320235905-89408705.jpeg)

And then checked again after Wallgate had been cut out.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320235910-894151591.jpeg)

The street level here will need to be raised up from baseboard level as it allows too much clearance under the (imaginary) bridge.

And then the plans cut and laid up to the existing tracks so that track laying can commence.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-230320235904-894081842.jpeg)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 24, 2020, 02:40:34 PM
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign:
 Nice one John, good to see you back on track.
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 25, 2020, 01:12:09 AM
Track laying has commenced.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-250320003338-894491563.jpeg)

After lifting the old track I was shocked at just how bad my soldering was two years ago, huge blobs of solder and melted sleepers, so I've put the old track to one side to re-use in the storage yard and am using new track as I relay it.
Course buying a smaller bit for my soldering iron, last year, probably helped as well :doh:

I also got the first two points down, one of these is right up against the baseboard frame so I had to use one of the offset holes on the Tortoise motor fulcrum, and it seems to work pretty well.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-250320003341-894742491.jpeg)

I might even get this finished tomorrow, we'll see.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 26, 2020, 12:33:52 AM
Needless to say work is very quiet at the moment so after getting done with conference calls all morning I got out to the train shed again.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-260320002820-895091757.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-260320002817-894932142.jpeg)

All the track is now laid for the station and a 3rd point has gone in. Just 3 more points to go and a couple of pieces of track and I'm done.

So hopefully by the weekend I'll be building a platform again. I'll keep the old one just in case any bits can be re-used, but I doubt it. I have at least 4 more of these Metcalfe kits and the platform only took one kit so I should be OK for a while.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on March 31, 2020, 12:33:07 AM
So all the track has been laid and wired and tested.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-310320002607-898631043.jpeg)

Over the weekend I built a new platform and was able to try it out for size today.

City of Birmingham at platform 5.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-310320002606-89863819.jpeg)

Same with a CL156 in platform 6

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-310320002559-898621142.jpeg)

Here the platform 5 extends by a further 25 feet or so, but platform 6 stops, so the XPS represents another piece of 2x1 platform that I need to add to this end.

And here's an overall view with the plan cut out to be a template for the second set of platforms.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/89/3871-310320002557-898601384.jpeg)

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on March 31, 2020, 01:08:08 AM
looking good
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 31, 2020, 01:32:28 PM
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign:
looking good
I'll second that
   stay safe regards Derek
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 01, 2020, 07:43:01 PM
So work has stopped on platforms 5&6 because, on the real railway, platform 5 is shorter than an 11 car Pendolino!

I've posted here and on RMWEB to find out how 11 car trains are handled, I've seen videos of them stopping at Wigan but no pictures of a full train stopped.

So next up is building the next set of platforms.

More to follow.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 12, 2020, 07:51:22 PM
What with the wife being home and the weather being nice (high 60's) not a lot got done last week as the garden took priority.
But, as luck would have it, it snowed last night so the trains will get more attention.

I was able to get platforms 1-4 substantially complete and have spent some time adjusting them and the tracks to make everything fit together.

I've deliberately left part of the bay to finish as there is some jiggery pokery around these platforms on the real thing.

For example the southern ends of platforms 3 & 4 are separated by a fence as platform 3 is lower than platform 4 because the tracks aren't level, and platform 2 has a bit of a kink halfway down as the track curves towards the point.

Here's the results so far, with a figure added to help with perspective, I must have measured the platform widths at the London end a dozen times as they always looked too narrow.

Looking South

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/90/3871-120420193130-908532299.jpeg)

Looking North

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/90/3871-120420193126-9085292.jpeg)

Looking south again with mores trains to check clearances

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/90/3871-120420193123-908511417.jpeg)

And looking north

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/90/3871-120420193118-90850133.jpeg)

The figure helps show that the platforms are wide enough

And a close up of the unfinished bay platforms.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/90/3871-120420193116-908442001.jpeg)

Now you all will, of course, know full well that Wigan NW doesn't have tarmac platforms, it has block paving.

So in addition to the steps leading down to the subway, plus the various buildings, plus the platform markings and signage, plus the signals, and the catenary, I'm also going to have to work up some suitable block paving to overlay onto the platforms. I'm thinking something printed onto self adhesive A4 paper might do the job.

Right around know we had been planning to be in the UK visiting our son and our 4th grandchild, and I would have been taking the eldest grandson to Wigan to watch trains, while I took copious photos. So progress from here will be slow, and I may just end up with some practice/mock up scratch built platform buildings.

Watch this space.

Hope you are all staying well.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on April 12, 2020, 07:56:35 PM
With the block pAving have you tried scalemodelscenery.co.uk, trainshop.co.uk ?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 12, 2020, 08:12:13 PM
With the block pAving have you tried scalemodelscenery.co.uk, trainshop.co.uk ?

Thanks for the links.

I haven't looked anywhere yet, I'll need to search for images on the Internet and then find something that looks right.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on April 12, 2020, 08:15:27 PM
Great job! Makes you realise quite how large platforms are in real life!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on April 12, 2020, 08:17:23 PM
They are reputable and worth a look at their ranges john
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 12, 2020, 10:32:44 PM
Well that didn't take long!

I took a quick look at some photos of the real thing and then at ScaleModelScenery.

They have Network Rail concrete platform edging, textured buff paving, and Flemish Bond red brick pavers. Thanks @crewearpley40 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=3894) .

I chucked in some fencing and a couple of skips for good measure.

So this lot might show up in a month or two!

Not a dig at the shop, but we've noticed that international mail is seems to be a LOT slower right now, understandable really with fewer international flights.

We have birthday cards sent from here to the UK, and I've got a couple of packages shipped about a month ago from the UK to here, none of which has been delivered yet.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on April 12, 2020, 10:36:41 PM
Happy modelling john. Problem sorted. Look forward to shots of your platforms
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on April 13, 2020, 06:35:27 AM
I have a print of 3'X2' paving slabs that I have also sent to Chris in Prague.  I can vary the colour if you wish.  Would that be of any use?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 13, 2020, 03:26:10 PM
I have a print of 3'X2' paving slabs that I have also sent to Chris in Prague.  I can vary the colour if you wish.  Would that be of any use?

Hi Lawrence,

Thanks for the offer. The pavers are actually red brick rather than slabs, so I think the bits I've ordered should do the job.

But I would like the print if that's OK, as I'm sure they'll come in useful.

Thanks once again.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Intercity on April 13, 2020, 05:12:51 PM
progress coming along nicely there, don't forget to run a Chinese gronk through the platforms as I think I remember people saying those were the widest and best at checking close clearances!!!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on April 13, 2020, 05:16:14 PM
You mean a class 08 ? Or your widest loco with outside frames to check clearances !
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on April 13, 2020, 07:56:06 PM
progress coming along nicely there, don't forget to run a Chinese gronk through the platforms as I think I remember people saying those were the widest and best at checking close clearances!!!

I don't have one of those, but it's a relevant point. I do need to run some freights through there to make sure all is well.

Means I can play with some trains instead of doing 'serious' modelling  :)

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Intercity on April 13, 2020, 08:12:54 PM
Yes we referred to the Class 08s as Gronks or a shunter, the new Chinese models are reputed to be a bit on the wide side with the outer cranks and rods, also worth doing is running your longest wagon/carriage through all tracks, but as JP has already run the Pendos he shouldn't have issues there.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 14, 2020, 11:38:31 AM
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign:
The platforms are progressing nicely, looking forward to more
    stay safe regards Derek
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 02, 2020, 01:25:53 AM
So much for this working from home malarkey! I've had a ton of paid work to do over the past couple of weeks and with the weather getting better no time for trains.

But this afternoon I finally got back out and did a few things.

I ordered some scenic papers and fences and stuff from Scale model scenery which arrived in from the UK in two weeks.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/92/3871-020520010857-92255502.jpeg)

This is so I can do the platform surfaces for Wigan North Western in a more realistic finish.

I started by cutting out the herringbone paver sheets to cover the platform surface.
I gave the platform a coat of 3M spray glue and pressed the pavers down on to the platform.
I then trimmed the excess with a sharp knife to define the platform edge and ended up with this.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/92/3871-020520010903-922562228.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/92/3871-020520010841-92252343.jpeg)

Then I started to do the platform edging, a quick online check and reference to some photos and I was able to get this done.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/92/3871-020520010847-922531602.jpeg)

By this time (about 1.5 hours work) my hands were seriously sticky and I decided to adjourn to the house for a beer. SWMBO had procured 3 large bottles of Duvel so it would have been churlish not to  :D

I hope over the weekend to get Platform 5 done, that's the one that has the edging and whatnot, and then do a quick clearance check before I edge platform 6.

Hope everyone is keeping well.

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: tc4332 on May 02, 2020, 02:44:30 AM
Hi,
Looking good.
I had to attend a funeral at Wigan Crematorium and after the service managed to park at the Crem gates and watch a couple of trains go by.
Wish it had been under better circumstances.
It's where we left my wife two years back.
At least the weather was very nice.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on May 02, 2020, 03:00:25 AM
that looks really good, it will be good to see one of your Pendolinos waiting alongside.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on May 02, 2020, 10:00:27 AM
So much for this working from home malarkey! I've had a ton of paid work to do over the past couple of weeks and with the weather getting better no time for trains.


What is the world coming to when work gets in the way of modelling time? ::) Pah!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 02, 2020, 10:05:27 AM
I'm pleased you have found the best surface texture and material for those platforms john
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 02, 2020, 04:03:46 PM
I'm pleased you have found the best surface texture and material for those platforms john

Thanks for your Scalemodelscenery recommendation.

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 02, 2020, 04:16:54 PM
Welcome john. Look forward to a shot or two of the platforms. And how useful the material is, a review in due course
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: acko22 on May 02, 2020, 09:19:27 PM
Hi @jpendle (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=3871)

Had a look as I thought it may be of interest to you for this lovely layout and detailing you asked what isolation magnets were used the track detailing thread:
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=49284.0 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=49284.0)

I had a inkling that there was an isolation point on part of the route you are depicting so I asked a driver who was doing one of our northbound (Coatsbridge) trains and there is indeed an isolation point, from what I was told and looking on google maps it appears it to be located just on the north side of the flyover for the freight lines (map reference - 53.521721, -2.610523).
I cannot say for 100% but it does look like the supporting infrastructure for an isolation section is there, and far enough away from signals to avoid electric trains from coming to mischief!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Intercity on May 02, 2020, 11:24:34 PM
Are these in reference to Neutral sections? They use AWS style magnets on the ends of the sleepers to cut traction power should the driver forget or react to late to put the engine in coast.

Railwaycodes.org has a list of all the neutral sections and their mileposts for most electric territory (including removed and repositioned ones)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 03, 2020, 12:50:19 AM
Hi @jpendle (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=3871)

Had a look as I thought it may be of interest to you for this lovely layout and detailing you asked what isolation magnets were used the track detailing thread:
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=49284.0 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=49284.0)

I had a inkling that there was an isolation point on part of the route you are depicting so I asked a driver who was doing one of our northbound (Coatsbridge) trains and there is indeed an isolation point, from what I was told and looking on google maps it appears it to be located just on the north side of the flyover for the freight lines (map reference - 53.521721, -2.610523).
I cannot say for 100% but it does look like the supporting infrastructure for an isolation section is there, and far enough away from signals to avoid electric trains from coming to mischief!

Thanks Gareth.

Yet more detail when the time comes, I hope I've not compressed that section too much!

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 06, 2020, 03:24:36 AM
So I've been out in the shed doing bits and pieces.

A bit more ballasting has been done around Springs Branch, that's drying before I test run some locos tomorrow.
I've also painted the track on Platform 6 at Wigan in preparation for securing the platform down, and I've got more of the platform edging done.

Here's the newly edged platform in place, a big contrast to the other untouched Metcalfe platform opposite.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/92/3871-060520030929-926511171.jpeg)

There's just the beige textured pavers to add now to Platform 6, the edging for Platform 5 is complete.

I also managed to get  my N Gauge Soc KSA timber carrier kits running. I started building these years ago and after finding issues with them running I put them to one side.
I've found that by replacing the supplied Rapido couplings with ones from my bag of Dapol spares I was able to get the couplings to lie flat and stay coupled together and to the loco hauling them.

Here's a video with them in action



Now that I've got them running I need to add the rest of the transfers and some more detail parts.

I also did a video showing my two CL86's double heading an intermodal train. Both these loco's are powered and run as a double header using the 'multi-traction' feature of the Z21 rather than a conventional 'consist'.



As you can see I'm struggling to figure out how to get my camera to focus when I do these videos, I can only hope that I'll get better with more practice.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 06, 2020, 07:02:29 AM
Impressive john. Scalemodelscenery used ?
 
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Ollie3440 on May 08, 2020, 11:17:01 PM
Evening all,

Well this is certainly one now on my 'watch list'. Looking great so far, nothing quite like making the most of n with full sized rakes. Watching with interest!

Cheers

Ollie

 :NGaugersRule:
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 14, 2020, 03:31:39 PM
Hi All,

A bit more work done on the layout this week.

More ballasting and track painting, plus some more work on the platforms.

Platforms 5 & 6 are done for now, and work has commenced on Platforms 1 - 4.

Here are some piccies.

North end

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/93/3871-140520151739-933051170.jpeg)

South end

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/93/3871-140520151747-933141903.jpeg)

Overall view

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/93/3871-140520151740-933052273.jpeg)

And a close up

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/93/3871-140520151748-933151562.jpeg)

Nothing is fixed in place yet because

   1) I haven't worked out the best way to do that yet  :doh:

   and

   2) I'm not happy with the bay platforms and they need a bit more work.

The bay platforms are slightly out of true so I'm going to have to force them a little to maintain clearances.

Next up would probably have been the platform buildings but as my research trip has been postponed indefinitely that's going to have to wait.

I did buy some fencing, so next up is to complete the ballasting on the mainline over the flyunder, so that I can do some work on the bridge.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 14, 2020, 04:02:06 PM
Looking good john. Did you use the platform materials recommended ?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on May 14, 2020, 04:50:54 PM
Looking good john. Did you use the platform materials recommended ?

Yep, I think you may have missed post #309 though  :D

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on May 14, 2020, 04:56:12 PM
I did notice. Would pva or wood glue be of use to fix those platforms
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: degsy_safc on May 14, 2020, 09:06:44 PM
Those platforms look really good to me John.

Very nice indeed..

Cheers Derek
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on June 23, 2020, 03:17:10 PM
Hi All,

I put aside scenic work for a while and have been repairing some trains.

I have a Dapol Virgin Voyager that has been lying around for a while, so I got that working after a thorough clean of the wheels, I also had to replace the diodes on the PCB in one of the trailer cars to get the lights working again.
That has all been completed and I have given it a test run around my layout using a Digitrax decoder that I had lying around. I had read reports that some of the early versions of this model couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding, but my 4 car unit seems to work OK.

I also have a CL150 with split gears so I emailed Bachmann and they can supply a new motor bogie, so I'll be getting up in the middle of the night to place an order for that.

I have two CL150's, one with end doors and one without which have both been re-vinyled into the old Northern Rail livery (purple ish).
I've ordered two sets of the new Northern livery vinyls from Electra Rail Graphics to bring these models more up to date.

And finally I have a CL350 in London Midland livery that I had earmarked for TPE vinyls, but as they no longer run in TPE colours I've decided to let it run around in its original livery instead.

As a result of all this I need 8 decoders to get them all working, I have 3 Digitrax decoders which will be used for lighting, and I've ordered 7 MX617N's from DCC Train Automation. That's two more than I need right now, but the postage is the same whether I buy 1 decoder or 7, so they are being sent by Fedex for 20 quid.
(I've got my eye on a revised CL70 or two)  :)
This is still cheaper than buying the same decoders over here, after VAT is deducted the decoders cost me $21, in the US they are $30 plus postage.

So once all this stuff starts to arrive there'll be 4 new-ish trains running on my layout.

Regards,

John P


Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on June 24, 2020, 06:00:21 AM
look forward to seeing those 70's running on Wigan Wallgate
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: njee20 on June 24, 2020, 08:36:55 AM
That is an absolute bargain, frankly! Seems a bit daft it's markedly cheaper to get them send thousands of miles than for us to buy them domestically!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on June 24, 2020, 02:34:48 PM
That is an absolute bargain, frankly! Seems a bit daft it's markedly cheaper to get them send thousands of miles than for us to buy them domestically!

I agree. The only things I buy here are Tortoise motors, NCE Switch 8 decoders, and scenic stuff.
It's even cheaper to buy a box of Peco flexi track from Hattons than it is to buy it over here.

I think the Zimo prices are a bit distorted by the fact that not many people here either use them or sell them, so there's no 'bargain prices'.

On another note, I woke up at 2:30am to call Bachmann and nobody picked up, so I tried again at 5:15am and they picked up straight away so the replacement bogie for my CL150 should be on its way soon.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on July 05, 2020, 01:06:56 AM
As my new decoders are stuck 8 miles down the road waiting for customs clearance, I decided to make a start on adding more sidings to my storage yard.
I bought the track ages ago, but I held off buying the point motors and decoders that I needed until a couple of weeks ago.

Anyway I've added two more NCE Switch 8's, which will allow me to add 5 more sidings on each side of the yard. I also bought a twelve pack of Tortoise motors so I can get 3 sidings done with those.

AND A FIRST FOR ME.

One of the Tortoise motors was DOA and one of the connectors on a Switch 8 was dodgy and required some fettling before it could be used.
I could get the Tortoise fixed under warranty, but over here you have to pay postage yourself, so at roughly $5 each way, and just $16 for a Tortoise it's not really worth the hassle.

I now have nearly 100 Tortoise motors and 12 Switch 8's and this is the first time I have had any quality issues with any of them.

As this is a 3 day weekend I have manged to get 6 points laid on one side of the yard so that I can add 3 more sidings.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/96/3871-050720005043-96517331.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/96/3871-050720005043-965172233.jpeg)

The little pieces of track are Frog extensions, to save me wiring directly to the point frogs.

All have been tested and the frog wiring has been checked to make sure I've got the correct polarity.

As I had to move my rolling stock out of the way I took the opportunity to check platform clearances at Wigan North Western.

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/96/3871-050720005036-965041683.jpeg)

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/96/3871-050720005036-9650494.jpeg)

In reality it would be very rare for a Southbound freight to sit in Platform 1 like that, although it does allow access to the Atherton lines on the L&Y route to Man Vic.
I think Northbound freights sometimes end up there if they have been sent under the main as a get out of the way move.

I hope to get the rest of the track laid in these sidings tomorrow, and hopefully on Monday my decoders will arrive.

Regards,

John P

Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: crewearpley40 on July 05, 2020, 04:20:15 AM
Looking good john. Are you satisfied with the clearances that trains can sufficiently run through?
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Graham on July 05, 2020, 07:09:11 AM
that layout is really coming along.
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Innovationgame on July 05, 2020, 07:51:12 AM
It's all going to be very BIG!
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: Newportnobby on July 05, 2020, 10:56:07 AM
Monster, monster :goggleeyes:
A veritable Mighty Wurlitzer of a layout. Can't wait for the next vid (nudge, nudge)
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on July 05, 2020, 03:52:01 PM
It's all going to be very BIG!

It already is, AND I've had to completely miss Springs Branch out of the plan to get it into the shed.
I've got roughly 35' x 27', but even so, just to do Springs Branch to scale, would take up 20'.

The flyunder to scale would need even more space, so compromises have had to be made.
As it is, it'll still be quite a while before it's even close to being ballasted, let alone signalled, wired (OHLE), and all the scenery done.

Regards,

John P
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: degsy_safc on July 05, 2020, 07:19:55 PM
Great progress John, loving the long platforms in the 3rd and 4th pics. That fiddle yard is massive, youíll be able to get a lot of stuff stored there when itís all fully serviceable. For a train to do a complete loop of the layout, itíll take quite a while, it only takes 72 seconds for a train to do a complete lap of my layout  :laugh:

Keep up the good work..

Cheers Derek
Title: Re: Contemporary NW (Wigan Wallgate and North Western)
Post by: jpendle on July 07, 2020, 01:27:28 AM
Well, I got the track laid and tested on two of the three sidings before I ran out of track pins and rail joiners, I'll have to buy some more, and to make the postage worthwhile I might have to throw in a loco as well  :D

I also got my replacement motor bogie tower for a CL150 in the post from Barwell today, it only got posted to me on the 26th June, and with the July 4th holiday in the way I think that's pretty good going by RM and the USPS.

I hopped over to the shed and tried it out and the unit runs perfectly now. I have had to add a wire between the PCB and one of the motor contacts and the contact strip came away from the PCB quite a while ago when I was trying to get it running. This caused problems as I couldn't get the body back on as the wire was sitting outside of the PCB and chassis. I resoldered it so that it's tucked away inside the chassis and the body now fits fine.

Here's what I mean

(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/96/3871-070720011103-96604778.jpeg)

I've left the bodyshell off as I need to fit decoders to it, but they haven't arrived yet.

In contrast to RM, the decoders were shipped out with Fedex on the 23rd and by last Wednesday they were 'out for delivery', except they weren't  :(

I called Fedex on Thursday and I got a call back from their local office saying that, although they have the package, it can't be released for delivery, as they are waiting official docs to show they have cleared customs. So they are sat less than 10 miles away and I can't get them >:(

Regards,

John P
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