N Gauge Forum

General Category => Crowdfunding => Topic started by: exmouthcraig on January 14, 2017, 09:15:37 PM

Title: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 14, 2017, 09:15:37 PM
Just throwing this out there??? Anybody
 want one?
Discussed one before???

In BR livery late crest ideally for me
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: snitchthebudgie on January 14, 2017, 09:55:13 PM
I'd love one or two, any livery, but if we can't get 'B' tankers produced, what chance a 'W'?
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 14, 2017, 09:57:25 PM
Well me dads just told me if we can get them he'd have upto 5 if we can renumber so thats 7 sold already clever people that can make this happen
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Bob G on January 14, 2017, 11:51:48 PM
I would have one.
Bob

PS I have also ordered a huge number of type B tanks (21 at last count).
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: PLD on January 15, 2017, 01:06:30 AM
How about you start with telling us about the loco in question and the rationale why you think it would be a viable model for crowd funding. (look at other threads in the 'Crowdfunding' forum for how to structure it and the kind of information others have put into suggested models)

BTW, The W class that immediately comes to mind for me is not a Tank - it is the NCC Mogul, the tank equivalent (which was basically a broad-gauge version of the Fairburn 2-6-4 we already have from Farish) was officially class WT.

I'm assuming that's not what you're talking about, but actually when you think about it; being the last Mainline steam locos in service in the UK, they would probably be as viable as any Irish Loco...  ;)
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Bob G on January 15, 2017, 09:31:23 AM
I am thinking this one:

http://www.semgonline.com/steam/wclass_1.html (http://www.semgonline.com/steam/wclass_1.html)

They were used all around London on inter-regional freight workings.

And looking at the sizes of the loco and wheelsets, a 3D print on a Standard or Fairburn 2-6-4T chassis would be more cost-effective than a totally new loco, given the likelihood of limited sales.

Bob
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 15, 2017, 10:00:39 AM
How about you start with telling us about the loco in question and the rationale why you think it would be a viable model for crowd funding. (look at other threads in the 'Crowdfunding' forum for how to structure it and the kind of information others have put into suggested models)

BTW, The W class that immediately comes to mind for me is not a Tank - it is the NCC Mogul, the tank equivalent (which was basically a broad-gauge version of the Fairburn 2-6-4 we already have from Farish) was officially class WT.

I'm assuming that's not what you're talking about, but actually when you think about it; being the last Mainline steam locos in service in the UK, they would probably be as viable as any Irish Loco...  ;)

Surely if it was a loco you were interested in and would want one on your layout we wouldn't need to waste pages on here telling people about it. It's obviously something you would not want or would already know. There's plenty of info relating to the loco everywhere else and it was a BROAD QUESTION if anyone would be interested or if it had already been discussed!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Carmont on January 15, 2017, 10:48:27 AM
In some respects Craig, I really admire your enthusiasm, but sometimes it's best to channel that enthusiasm in a different way.

PLD makes some very valid points. I think we all accept that your question was a broad one, and you weren't necessarily asking someone to make this for you (crowdfunded or otherwise). I, along with many others on this forum, I am sure, have no idea what a W class is. Now that's not due to any kind of idle ignorance, it's down to the fact that there are hundreds (thousands? of different locomotive types that have run on BR metals. Because I have no idea what it is, I have no idea where it ran, so maybe I don't know that It would fit in with my location/era?

Have a look on this forum section at the threads for the Class 28, the Class 21/29, the Class B tanks, The GWR loco (the type that eludes me right now, but promoted by Karhedron). I would bet my house that there are people on the forum that support or supported these initiatives because they were given some information on the prototypes. In other words, they didn't know they wanted it until someone came along and gave out some information about it. As a further example, how many modelers who model Scotland, would necessarily know that two examples of the GWR 1600 pannier tank engines spent a number of years plying their trade North of Inverness, and ending their days in Perth, unless someone had presented that information to them? We can't know everything, and we can't know everything about every class of locomotive.

You started this thread, presumably on the basis that you would want one. You'd stand a better chance of encouraging others and building momentum for the project if you gave them a little bit more to work on. Tell us why we would want one of these, because the more people you have on board the greater the chance of success.

Again, have a look at the other threads here to see what I mean.

A final point. "people who can make this happen" are very unlikely to pick up the batton and run with a proposal if the proposer doesn't make a compelling case. See some of RevolutioN trains comments on this forum in that regard. A thread full of "I'd buy two and my brother says he'd want five and his mate will take ten........"etc, isn't going to do much good I'm afraid. You need to convince a crowdfunder that the model will fly (or in this case steam). Please also bear in mind that the absolute minimum numbers required for a production run, within acceptable unit costs, is about 1000 models.

All of this is meant in a helpful way. Please, calm down a bit, take on board what people are saying, which isn't to be taken personally and direct your obvious enthusiasm in a more constructive way, rather than poo-pooing pertinent and helpful advice given by what appear to be experienced forum members. PLD was only trying to help you.

As a final, final point, if presenting a proposal is not something you are comfortable with, or can be bothered with, I would be more than happy to put together some sort of proper proposal on the forum if you want, if you can give me a bit more information.

I hope the above makes sense and is helpful.
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 15, 2017, 10:55:57 AM
Indeed it does make sense and as I asked if it had ever been discussed it was a simple throughout and like we all know there are MANY cleverer people on here then me relating to this process.
If we could gauge interest with a simple question and someone like yourself interested and comfortable inputting the case together to attempt to try and get someone interested in producing it then that's the next step.
I could never contemplate the VAST AMOUNT of work needing to go into producing anything and as discussed elsewhere the issues that are encounter along the way!!
But yes let's have a decent discussion about it, the written word is often misread and leads to tempers flaring.
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Newportnobby on January 15, 2017, 11:20:27 AM
I think the main 2 limitations for demand would be the small class size (just 15 made) and the fact it obviously fell out of the ugly tree :laugh: It was banned from passenger working as it was too unstable, and was concentrated around London so although maybe a desire for Southern Region modellers the operating area was very narrow. At least they survived until the early 1960s so transition modellers might be attracted as well as SR diehards. Personally I agree with Bob G in that a 3d body would be a quicker and more successful route to market.
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 15, 2017, 11:25:24 AM
Yeah definitely agree with NewportNobby here, if that means we can get them onto a dcc chassis without hitting the issues other manufacturers are having with their new motor.

Maybe not the prettiest in the world but class 67s got built 😄

Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Newportnobby on January 15, 2017, 11:27:16 AM

Maybe not the prettiest in the world but class 67s got built 😄

And class 70s :sick2:
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 15, 2017, 11:29:17 AM
Oh indeed. Pretty good job looks don't influence the decision making (in modelling anyway)  :laughabovepost:
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Dorsetmike on January 15, 2017, 12:34:17 PM
Being an SR/ex LSWR modeller, I've contemplated either a Maunsell W or Urie H16 class myself; my thoughts however lean towards a kit bash of either a Langley S15 or  BHE N15 on one of the Farish 2-6-4 tank chassis or a Hack of a Farish N class.

I've not gone as far yet as measuring up drivers and other dimensions.
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Western Exile on January 15, 2017, 12:41:49 PM
What did this loco score in the last wishlist poll? That should give you a very rough idea of likely demand.
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 15, 2017, 12:47:34 PM
What did this loco score in the last wishlist poll? That should give you a very rough idea of likely demand.
I have absolutely no idea hence the original question to see if it had ever been discussed as to any detail
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: Bob G on January 15, 2017, 01:11:23 PM
  :whisper: I think the suggestion was that you should do the research  :read2:

However, if you want one, why not bypass all that and ask a 3D expert like Mr Atso Cad here:  :admiration:

http://www.atso-cadmodels.co.uk/page4.htm (http://www.atso-cadmodels.co.uk/page4.htm)

He has a preference for all things LNER, but you should not hold that against him  :) and maybe he will produce a W tank designed to fit a Fairburn chassis, for example, given the interest on here.

I would definitely pay 25 or more for a 3D printed body (his LNER L1 2-6-4T is about that price), given that a whitemetal kit of an early variant LBSCR E2 0-6-0 tank I bought last week is 27 and a late variant E2 tank 37, and those kits are (1) not detailed and (2) date from the 1970s.
The thing about the W for me is that it is ugly, iconic and did in fact run all around London including the north London lines on inter-regional freight movements, and was also used as a banker at Exeter St Davids for a while too, so it was better travelled than many folk might think. Folks like the Bullied Q1 for similar reasons of ugliness.

HTH
Bob
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: dodger on January 15, 2017, 01:53:06 PM
I think the main 2 limitations for demand would be the small class size (just 15 made) and the fact it obviously fell out of the ugly tree :laugh: It was banned from passenger working as it was too unstable, and was concentrated around London so although maybe a desire for Southern Region modellers the operating area was very narrow. At least they survived until the early 1960s so transition modellers might be attracted as well as SR diehards. Personally I agree with Bob G in that a 3d body would be a quicker and more successful route to market.

Until some migrated to Eastliegh to work the Fawley branch and Exmouth Junction for banking between St Davids and Central Stations.

Dodger
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: exmouthcraig on January 15, 2017, 02:00:37 PM
I have no problem trying to work everything out and be as involved as I could be in the process of it, this was the reason behind posting this to see what people thought about it as opposed to just post on here

I want a W class Tank (as the title names to clear confusion over which loco were talking about) someone needs to build it me

So if people can recommend which direction we go in order to workout the next step that would be fantastic
Title: Re: W class tank
Post by: longbow on January 15, 2017, 10:58:50 PM
You already have some good recommendations. Acting on them is up to you.
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