N Gauge Forum

Your Layout and Models => On My Workbench => Topic started by: DELETED on March 06, 2015, 08:10:19 PM

Title: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: DELETED on March 06, 2015, 08:10:19 PM
Hi,

So I was under the impression that the original plastic wheels on Peco goods wagons could be replaced with metal ones.  I have a batch of new packs of GF steel wagon wheels, but when I fit them the axle length is noticeably longer (though they will fit) but converted Peco stock now won't roll free and won't work on a full train at all.  I thought it was supposed to be a straight swap?  What wheels should I have bought? I put the original plastic wheels back and everything runs OK again.  I don't need to swap them (they'll be used elsewhere converting pizza cutters) -but just trying to keep a clean track, and I thought metal was better than plastic for that.

Cheers,

Rich
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: PennineWagons on March 06, 2015, 08:38:03 PM
I believe the Parkside Dundas metal wheelsets are specifically designed as a straight swap for the Peco plastic ones. The Farish ones will fit after a fashion but the axles are slightly too long, as you said.
PW
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: Jonny on March 06, 2015, 08:42:54 PM
I think what you will find is the recess that the axle goes into in the peco wagon is not as deepaa the gf or parkside ones.

The gf wheels fit into parkside kits no problem.  The options here are either gently drill the recess deeper to allow the extra lemgth of the axle to run free or file the gf axles down to the size of the peco ones

Hth

Jonny
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: DELETED on March 06, 2015, 08:50:42 PM
Hmm, fair points guys.  I know you can get little axle reamers, but I really can't be faffed to be honest.  I have a couple of Parkside Grampus kits left -I botched one so far so should try that pair of spare axles first I guess.  I wasn't sure if filing the points off the GF wheels was an option.  Might just live with the plastic wheels to be honest.  Maybe I picked up on the wheel swap options wrong -no probs, they'll be used elsewhere as-is :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: Hailstone on March 06, 2015, 09:52:09 PM


Hi,

So I was under the impression that the original plastic wheels on Peco goods wagons could be replaced with metal ones.  I have a batch of new packs of GF steel wagon wheels, but when I fit them the axle length is noticeably longer (though they will fit) but converted Peco stock now won't roll free and won't work on a full train at all.  I thought it was supposed to be a straight swap?  What wheels should I have bought? I put the original plastic wheels back and everything runs OK again.  I don't need to swap them (they'll be used elsewhere converting pizza cutters) -but just trying to keep a clean track, and I thought metal was better than plastic for that.

Cheers,

Rich

I have replaced all of the Peco stock that I have with modern Graham Farish wheel sets and to make them "fit" properly I pinch the axle box covers tightly over the wheel set, then see how it runs - usually on or two treatments make them run as good as the originals, and the metal wheel sets keep much cleaner than the plastic ones

Regards,

Alex
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: DesertHound on August 13, 2015, 08:47:54 PM
Hailstone

I just want to say thanks for your above tip, and thank you Rich (HST) for posing the original question.

I bought some Bachmann wheels yesterday to fit onto some peco wagons and had the same problem. About to put the project on hold as I too couldn't get them free running, I thought a quick use if the search function might be a good idea. That's when I came across this gem.

Okay, they're not yet as free wheeling as a Bachmann wagon, but they are good enough and for me, being used in a yard (not on vast lengths of track and not in long rakes), they will be good enough.

The pinpoints of the axles really do "drill" into the axle box covers.

Cheers

Dan
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: Webbo on August 14, 2015, 02:24:41 AM
Hailstone

I just want to say thanks for your above tip, and thank you Rich (HST) for posing the original question.

I bought some Bachmann wheels yesterday to fit onto some peco wagons and had the same problem. About to put the project on hold as I too couldn't get them free running, I thought a quick use if the search function might be a good idea. That's when I came across this gem.

Okay, they're not yet as free wheeling as a Bachmann wagon, but they are good enough and for me, being used in a yard (not on vast lengths of track and not in long rakes), they will be good enough.

The pinpoints of the axles really do "drill" into the axle box covers.

Cheers

Dan

Seems like a good idea to me too. I've filed a very tiny bit off the ends of my axles to make them fit and that seems to work just fine. My only concern with this method is that the way in which the slightly flattened ends might wear the axle boxes could be an issue in the long term. I first tried drilling the axle box and this proved to be a disaster as the material is so soft and thin the drill bit went straight through in a flas.

Webbo
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: Bangor Lad on August 15, 2015, 09:38:52 AM
I've just fitted Farish/Bachman steel wheels to three Peco wagon kits and following a good squeeze  ;) everything seems hunky dory!

:thankyousign: for the tip!
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: N Gauge Bob on October 29, 2015, 10:59:39 AM
I've just fitted Farish/Bachman steel wheels to three Peco wagon kits and following a good squeeze  ;) everything seems hunky dory!

:thankyousign: for the tip!

Just came across this thread. I too am replacing 400 pairs of Peco plastic grot collectors with nice metal wheels. This is a start to re-wheeling all my stock over the coming winter months.
Some many moons ago I purchased a bulk lot of 3 hole metal disc wheels on axles, I think from Bernie Taylor. I often speak to the supplier when I want bulk, and they ship without packaging for a discount.
I have done this too with Nick at N Brass when I bulk buy fencing. Smaller Suppliers seem quite keen to co-operate on this.
So does anyone know where bulk wheels are available now-a-days...I really won't pay Bachmanns prices?
Cheers
Bob
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: MikeDunn on October 29, 2015, 11:33:45 AM
Isn't someone on here actually selling these, maybe via Kickstarter ?  Sure there was a thread a few weeks back ?
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: Calnefoxile on October 29, 2015, 11:36:35 AM


Yes, Bob Davis, @NTrain (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=153), is doing some, not sure which variants he's doing, but I'm sure he'll be along soon to tell us  :D :D

Cheers

Neal.
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: N Gauge Bob on October 29, 2015, 11:49:41 AM


Yes, Bob Davis, @NTrain ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=153[/url]), is doing some, not sure which variants he's doing, but I'm sure he'll be along soon to tell us  :D :D

Cheers

Neal.


Just 1 more, Neal, for the 1000 posts  ;)
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: NTrain on October 29, 2015, 11:54:37 AM


Yes, Bob Davis, @NTrain ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=153[/url]), is doing some, not sure which variants he's doing, but I'm sure he'll be along soon to tell us  :D :D

Cheers

Neal.

 :claphappy:

www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-10-Pack (http://www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-10-Pack)
www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-50-Pack (http://www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-50-Pack)

(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

Did someone mention my name.  :D
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: Calnefoxile on October 29, 2015, 12:01:35 PM


Yes, Bob Davis, @NTrain ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=153[/url]), is doing some, not sure which variants he's doing, but I'm sure he'll be along soon to tell us  :D :D

Cheers

Neal.


Oh yes Bob, thanks and here it is  :claphappy: :claphappy: :claphappy: :claphappy:

I just wish it was a bit more prophetic  :D :D :D

Regards

Neal.

Just 1 more, Neal, for the 1000 posts  ;)
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: N Gauge Bob on October 30, 2015, 11:36:46 AM


Yes, Bob Davis, @NTrain ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=153[/url]), is doing some, not sure which variants he's doing, but I'm sure he'll be along soon to tell us  :D :D

Cheers

Neal.

 :claphappy:

www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-10-Pack (http://www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-10-Pack)


www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-50-Pack (http://www.n-train.net/N-Wheelz-50-Pack)

(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

Did someone mention my name.  :D

Nice wheels Bob and a good price, but what I need is 3 hole discs unfortunately.
Cheers
Bob
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: N Gauge Bob on October 30, 2015, 12:01:51 PM
Update from my research.

I was surprised and shocked to find that just looking at list or eBay prices there is a terrific difference in price.
Sadly I had to eliminate Bob@NTrain's wheels as they are not the 3 hole discs I require.
This left Bachmann and Parkside Dundas.
The cheapest I could find for Bachmann wheels 379-410 was 5.90 for 10 axles from Modelscape on eBay, the list price being 6.75 per 10.
The price direct from Parkside Dundas for 20 wheels was 19.25 per 20 axles.
Remember these are published prices and are not negotiated. This will be done when I am ready to buy.
I require 700 axles in total, so comparing one against the other, I would save (at list price) over 250.
So surprise, surprise it is Bachmann who are the cheapest...and in my original post I said I wouldn't pay Bachmann's prices  :doh:
Cheers
Bob
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: Dr Al on October 30, 2015, 12:28:38 PM
You need to be careful with some of the Parkside ones too - they used to have a nasty habit of shedding their metal tyres. They can be reattached, but it's more difficult to get them true.

I, like you, have rewheeled any needy stock with Bachmann wheels, but slowly and steadily to spread the shock of the cost!!

Cheers,
Alan
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: N Gauge Bob on October 30, 2015, 12:32:29 PM
You need to be careful with some of the Parkside ones too - they used to have a nasty habit of shedding their metal tyres. They can be reattached, but it's more difficult to get them true.

I, like you, have rewheeled any needy stock with Bachmann wheels, but slowly and steadily to spread the shock of the cost!!

Cheers,
Alan

Yes Alan, I have experienced shed tyres in the past from the Parkside ones.
The cost will have to be spread, but I'm hoping I can place an order at a good price with a scheduled delivery.
Cheers
Bob
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: MikeDunn on October 30, 2015, 01:20:44 PM
I require 700 axles in total

Have you discussed your requirement with Bob @NTrain (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=153) ?  Maybe this is something he can develop as a 'sister' line ?
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: N Gauge Bob on October 30, 2015, 07:31:51 PM
I require 700 axles in total

Have you discussed your requirement with Bob @NTrain ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=153[/url]) ?  Maybe this is something he can develop as a 'sister' line ?


No I haven't as yet. I shall not be acting for a while yet, but sadly I think it unlikely I will have the cash to do a one hit order...more likely 125 per month over 6 months. Suggestion noted, thank you.
Cheers
Bob
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: NTrain on October 30, 2015, 10:46:35 PM
Not got any of the 3 hole wheels to measure up.

If someone can get me the measurements for the holes, I can get a price sorted.

I am about to get some wheels made, so could look at some other ones a t the same time.
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: NTrain on October 31, 2015, 12:26:55 AM
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

Is this what is wanted?
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: NTrain on October 31, 2015, 10:18:35 AM
I have been in contact with my supplier, and these seem to be coming out rather too expensive.

A pack of 50 would be about 68 and 10 for about 15

Plain disc ones are 50 for 42 and 10 for 9
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: NTrain on November 02, 2015, 09:16:59 PM
I have been doing some fast talking with my supplier and would be able to match the selling price of the plain disk wheels, but only if I order them at the same time as the 5.1mm disc wheels I am now ordering.

50 for 42 and 10 for 9

The manufacturing cycle is about 3 weeks.

Does anyone want to help this go ahead by pre-ordering any?
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: MalcolmInN on November 03, 2015, 12:04:56 AM
Is this what is wanted?
Does anyone want to help this go ahead by pre-ordering any?
Ummm, hi Bob the answer to both is " I dont know" !

All my peco wagons are less than a year old, and so am I, so I didnt know I had a problem till I read this thread !
So, which wagons would benefit from which wheel type ?

So far I am a bit agnostic on which wagons I need for what period etc, I just bought a few (well 2doz mixed rtr and kit ) just to see, practice and to have a few different 'things' for inglenooking. (dont laugh ! :) )

So,  ummmm ?? (hand-holding or educating may be required, so much to learn, so little time ! )



Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: NTrain on November 03, 2015, 08:26:53 AM
The Peco wheels are plastic and sometimes can be a bit 'light'. Metal wheels give a much smother ride, giving a small amount of extra weight as an added benefit.

Basically, you do not 'need' to replace any wheels. However, the Peco wagons can get a better ride with metal wheels. Any old style wagons and coaches, with very large flanged wheel rims, will get better looks and running with modern finer detail wheels.

Until I started doing my Wheelz, the choices were Farish, Parkside Dundas and ATM. I started doing mine, mainly to go with my EMU kits.
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: longbow on March 05, 2018, 12:15:30 PM
Bump - Bob, all your wheelsets are listed as 14.9mm axles so may I confirm please that they are a drop-in replacement for Peco wheelsets (reportedly 15.3mm axles).
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: NTrain on March 05, 2018, 12:22:33 PM
I tested them on  some Peco wagons myself, and have sold them to quite a few people for that purpose.

I can only assume that they work for these people, as I have had no negative feedback.

However, I believe that it may be necessary to 'bed' them in on some wagons depending on the age.
Title: Re: Replacing Peco Plastic Wagon Wheels with Metal ones
Post by: longbow on March 05, 2018, 12:28:29 PM
Thanks for your reply. I asked because I've just tried some of your wheelsets in a Peco wagon chassis kit. They look a little longer than the Peco axles and are a stiff fit. No doubt they will bed in.
SimplePortal 2.3.5 © 2008-2012, SimplePortal