Hello
I have been doing that dangerous thing, late night browsing of Ebay and came across these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313850311434? (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313850311434?)
Are these any good and what is the prototype please? I am tempted to try a couple of the plain grey with red ends ones as they look Railfreight-ish and some sort of overseas run to a local factory seems like a good Rule 1 to run. I have had a few HO scale wagons from the same source before for my Little Lad's operation and they have been pretty good all be it the prices seem to have risen lately a bit.
I presume this seller has obtained the rights to use out of use moulds from other mainstream and/or defunct manufacturers?
I think they might represent IHA steel coil wagons.
https://flickr.com/search/?text=IHA+wagon
Mike
just noted the code ...TTU
does this mean @Trainfish (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=262) is going to be ordering some TuTUs :*(
It's a European shimmns wagon, which yes, is similar to an IHA. They'll be 1:160 scale, but being European wagons they may scale ok.
Real thing:
(https://on-rail.com/fileadmin/_processed_/6/6/csm_Shimmns_287_OK_4ffbeffc6a.jpg)
Ah, another Everest Models N wagon. I didn't know about this one, looks useful. Thanks for the heads-up :D I've ordered just one for now to see if they're any good and how they compare to my other Shimms types.
Watch out, some of the photos are of HO models :)
I have some of their bogie open wagons, which look similar (but not the same as) the common European Eaos type. They're quite well produced, I think I wrote a post about them a while back.
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=19028.msg649501#msg649501 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=19028.msg649501#msg649501)
Everest do quite a bit of stuff in HO, I don't think it's a case of them re-using old moulds from other brands.
Quote from: njee20 on February 25, 2022, 01:29:14 PM
It's a European shimmns wagon, which yes, is similar to an IHA. They'll be 1:160 scale, but being European wagons they may scale ok.
Actually they are shown as 1:150 (and they do indeed look too big for 1:160), so would suit British
Quote from: ntpntpntp on February 25, 2022, 01:49:28 PM
Watch out, some of the photos are of HO models :)
It's not quite as simple as that! If you look at the site there is all sorts of contradiction, for example on one set it is listed as 'Gauge:HO' then 'scale: 1:150'...
Quote from: Gordon on February 25, 2022, 07:34:32 PM
Quote from: njee20 on February 25, 2022, 01:29:14 PM
It's a European shimmns wagon, which yes, is similar to an IHA. They'll be 1:160 scale, but being European wagons they may scale ok.
Actually they are shown as 1:150 (and they do indeed look too big for 1:160), so would suit British
What they're listed as and what they are are not the same.
A shimmns is 12040mm over buffers, which is 80.2mm in 1:150 or 75mm in 1:160. The model claims 70mm, not clear if that's over buffers, one presumes not, which puts it bang on for 1:160. The height and width are very close to 1:160, so I stand by my comment.
This is common among Chinese models, they're often marketed as 1:150; I presume to try and appeal to the world's largest (and their geographically adjacent) market - in Japan, but they're not 1:150. This is particularly prevalent with the containers available via eBay, AliExpress etc, which are marketed as 1:150, but are almost exactly 1:160.
That said, because it's built to the European loading gauge actually they often size up ok against British models, despite being 'under scale'. 18mm width is a bit narrow for British N, but the other dimensions are reasonable. Personally they look too crude for me for £21.
Hi,
The price is for one pc or for 3 pcs?.....if it is £21 for only one...they are not so cheap-ish.
Thank you.
Marco
Quote from: marco neri on February 26, 2022, 07:32:47 AM
Hi,
The price is for one pc or for 3 pcs?.....if it is £21 for only one...they are not so cheap-ish.
Unfortunately that is for one, their prices seem to have definitely gone up in recent months, you could have got two for that price not so long ago.
I have ordered one to see what it is like.
Meanwhile, what are these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313865698663? (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313865698663?)
They look useful although I suspect may need weight adding.
Quote from: jmupton2000 on February 26, 2022, 08:43:06 AM
Quote from: marco neri on February 26, 2022, 07:32:47 AM
Hi,
The price is for one pc or for 3 pcs?.....if it is £21 for only one...they are not so cheap-ish.
Unfortunately that is for one, their prices seem to have definitely gone up in recent months, you could have got two for that price not so long ago.
I have ordered one to see what it is like.
Meanwhile, what are these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313865698663? (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313865698663?)
They look useful although I suspect may need weight adding.
Thank you.
Quote from: njee20 on February 25, 2022, 07:59:05 PM
What they're listed as and what they are are not the same.
This is common among Chinese models, they're often marketed as 1:150; I presume to try and appeal to the world's largest (and their geographically adjacent) market - in Japan, but they're not 1:150. This is particularly prevalent with the containers available via eBay, AliExpress etc, which are marketed as 1:150, but are almost exactly 1:160.
Yup, been caught by that one myself.
Yep, £21 each. So the same as plenty of Dapol wagons. Admittedly there's not an IHA model, so if you wanted to sub one, as theyre often mixed in in the Margam steel trains then you could potentially do worse. The IHA is 12820 long, so 87mm in 1:148, if these are genuinely 70mm long they're definitely on the short side.
Not for me at the price, but I'm sure they're fine.
The measurements given are the same as the Modellbahn Union 1:160 Shimmns wagons.
I don't think it's a particularly good price when you can get the Modellbahn Union version with close-coupling and added detail for 26.99 Euros although of course you do need to factor in the extra postage costs.
Hi,
the Fleischmann set of two Shimmns "On Rail" is at 39,99 euro by DM Toys.
Marco
The Everest Models Shop
https://www.ebay.co.uk/str/everestmodel (https://www.ebay.co.uk/str/everestmodel)
And some coupling / bogie sets
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313164319926 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313164319926)
Quote from: jmupton2000 link=topic=56267.msg751525#msg751525
Meanwhile, what are these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313865698663? (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313865698663?)
4-wheel container flats? They have what look like various locating points for different lengths of container.
Indeed if you scroll through the pictures there are some with containers on too.
Again, a European prototype (like all their stuff I'd say); I know there are some German ones, not sure of the UIC designation.
My example of the Everest Model covered wagon arrived today. Unbranded grey with orange/red ends.
Seems quite a decent model, NEM couplings (yes one is drooping in the photo but I sorted that afterward). Fine flanges and quite narrow wheel treads.
As said before, perhaps not the "bargain" of the earlier Evemodel offerings but not bad.
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/5885-050322235403.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120248)
Nice bit of detailing on the canvas side too.
Thanks for posting the links, I've just order two sets of American style bogies for when I get around to doing some FCAs to model the Severnside bin train
Jo
Comparing the Everest Model wagon with a Modelbahn Union version (based on a Dapol wagon).
More detail on the UM model, different bogies but put together they look ok I think.
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/5885-060322165547.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120279)
This thread prompted me to order some 1:160 containers, and they arrived by express courier from China in double quick time!
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/704-070322224927.jpeg)
Upside 1: The containers measure up as almost spot on 1:160 for a 40ft hi-cube
Upside 2: the CMA CGM carry the bang-on current 'bamboo' branding
Downside 1: they appear to be designed to have the tiny spigots on each bottom corner which would make them compatible with certain Arnold container wagons but the spigots have mostly broken off either in packing or in transit
Downside 2: The MSC container is lettered as a 42G1 which is the code for non hi cube 40ft containers
neutral: they have magnets inside the roof and on the (removable) base. This is helpful in many ways but in some stacking positions the magnets in two different containers repel
Quote from: jmupton2000 on February 25, 2022, 12:18:04 PM
I presume this seller has obtained the rights to use out of use moulds from other mainstream and/or defunct manufacturers?
My initial hunch was that 'Everest' products are moulds used by Chinese companies contracted to manufacture models on behalf of European brands - perhaps the moulds are modified slightly?
Factory seconds or additional models produced as part of a production run to ensure they had enough to meet their contracted order quantities would be my guess.
Either way, if I were the original commissioner of these models I'd be less than impressed.
Steven B.
Quote from: Gordon on March 08, 2022, 12:10:41 AM
Downside 1: they appear to be designed to have the tiny spigots on each bottom corner which would make them compatible with certain Arnold container wagons but the spigots have mostly broken off either in packing or in transit
Downside 2: The MSC container is lettered as a 42G1 which is the code for non hi cube 40ft containers
Surely the bigger downside is the fact the P&O Nedlloyd container is missing half the logo...?
I received my single example a couple of days ago and - naturally - the first thing I did was take it apart!!
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-100322091902.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120393)
The body simply unclips from the chassis, main reason being the weights had come loose in transit and were rattling around inside the body. Bit of glue sorted that out.
The chassis itself is fairly straightforward in design with two weights glued (usually!) in place resulting in an impressively heavy wagon. A pair of nice bogies are then screwed onto the underframe.
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-100322092122.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120394)
The bodyshell is a nice crisply moulded single piece, this one being supplied in a plain grey with red ends livery
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-100322105656.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120396)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-100322105739.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120397)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-100322105813.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120398)
The bogies are also nicely made, screw in with a single screw and washer into holes on the underside of the chassis and feature metal wheel sets and NEM coupler pockets, seen here with the supplied Rapido swapped for a Dapol EasiShunt:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-100322110031.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120399)
Two problems I have discovered so far, one bogie was very tight on the pivot and a little moulding flash needed removing from the chassis mounting point. The other problem is that if it is required to negotiate very tight curves, there is a part of the chassis that fouls the swing of the bogie:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-100322110223.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120400)
Quote from: Steven B on March 08, 2022, 09:09:30 AM
Factory seconds or additional models produced as part of a production run to ensure they had enough to meet their contracted order quantities would be my guess.
Either way, if I were the original commissioner of these models I'd be less than impressed.
Steven B.
Have a Google for "third shift counterfeits" and China. For example see https://scholarship.shu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1825&context=student_scholarship (https://scholarship.shu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1825&context=student_scholarship)
Richard
Yes it is fictitious but I thought, why not? Applied some spare transfers and it looks the part:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-150322183600.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120533)
Quote from: njee20 on February 25, 2022, 07:59:05 PM
This is common among Chinese models, they're often marketed as 1:150; I presume to try and appeal to the world's largest (and their geographically adjacent) market - in Japan, but they're not 1:150.
If that's the case then they don't know the Japanese market very well, as anyone interested in genuine European or N. American models will want something at 1:160, and models of actual Japanese wagon prototypes at 1:150 can be purchased retail in Japan for the same or even less than the unit price of the models listed.
What you do see in quite often in Japan imported from China are the cheap scenic items (particularly people and cars), so possibly it is a carry-over from that.
Quote from: jmupton2000 on March 15, 2022, 06:37:04 PM
Yes it is fictitious but I thought, why not? Applied some spare transfers and it looks the part:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-150322183600.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120533)
The UK branding has made a big difference. I'd suggest BHA as the TOPS code:
https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bgabhabja (https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bgabhabja)
One minor observation - BR owned its own wagons so it's unlikely you'd see "Railfreight" and "Procor" branding on the same wagon. Procor was/is a wagon leasing company.
A couple of OHLE warning signs would finish it off nicely.
Steven B.
Thanks for the suggested TOPS code, I will see what lettering I have in my spares tray. There are OHLE flashes on either end but not on the sides (yet) and I will lose the Procor logo later.
That's better...
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/120/4232-180322124315.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=120647)
OHLE warnings added on the sides, Procor logo ditched and replaced with a Speedlink logo, looking much better.
Would anyone with the models be so kind as to measure the wheelbase of the bogie on the steel wagons and the please?
This should help answer the scale question!
The bogies on the steel wagon are Y25s, so 1800mm wheelbase which my calculator reliably tells me is 12.162mm in 1/148 and 11.25mm in 1/160
Jo
Rough measurements I admit but putting a ruler up against mine shows the wheelbase to be a fraction over 11mm so the 1/160 stands up. They sell them separately as well which looks useful:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/373406249158?hash=item56f0bf30c6:g:XIYAAOSwwoRf5qE1 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/373406249158?hash=item56f0bf30c6:g:XIYAAOSwwoRf5qE1)
One image shows some dimensions although not the wheelbase ironically.
Righto, cheers for that! Presumably means the US style ones I've ordered will be 1/160, bit since noone does the style in 1/148 still a cheaper avenue than Microtrains
Jo
I decided to purchase an additional two of the wagons to make up a matching rake of three. Whilst I was about it, I also added one of the same company's two axle flat container wagons to the order:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/121/4232-020422124933.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=121215)
The wagon is a decent one piece moulding sitting on metal wheelsets with NEM pockets and standard Rapido couplers. I went for an undecorated one in black but others are also available both in plain colours and with printed decorations.
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/121/4232-020422125158.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=121216)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/121/4232-020422125235.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=121217)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/121/4232-020422125302.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=121218)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/121/4232-020422125328.jpeg) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=121219)
To me it looks useful as either just a container wagon or the basis for some sort of specialist wagon or departmental stock. It comes with some weights in a separate bag which are designed to be included in any load added to the wagon but are just as useful as spare parts on their own.
Whilst looking for something else, I stumbled on these 'spares' on the DCC website:
https://www.dccsupplies.com/product-category/dapol-spares/n-gauge-spares/n-gauge-wagon-spares/canvas-hood-n-gauge (https://www.dccsupplies.com/product-category/dapol-spares/n-gauge-spares/n-gauge-wagon-spares/canvas-hood-n-gauge)
Which is interesting, because as Nick pointed out, Dapol don't do IHAs. Maybe they will soon?
Mike
Dapol have been making the Canvas hood wagons for Modellbahn Union for several years.
Available for around 27Euro:
https://www.dm-toys.de/en/list/search/Shimms.html (https://www.dm-toys.de/en/list/search/Shimms.html)
Unfortunately for UK modellers they're of the Shimms variety, rather than the Sfhimmns type that runs in the UK.
Steven B.