London and South East now to enter tier 3,567 ...
don't even breathe :'(
at the risk of being political, as if I would, why is christmas day ok to mix, but no others ?
answers, on a :censored: small postcard please :veryangry:
Your wrong mate tier 4 in London, we are staying in tier 3 for what seems like a lifetime.
I agree, it's only Christmas. You don't *have* to see Granny. Stay at home and watch the Bond film uninterrupted for a change.
I'm afraid as a non-religious person I don't see why communal worship should be ok to continue? The imaginary sky-beings will understand things are a bit tricky this year :)
Tier 4 lockdown here in Wales from midnight tonight. Was planning to have my two sons, plus partners, and grandson on Christmas day, cancelled that due only two households to mix. Brought Chrismas dinner forward to tomorrow (Sunday). This afternoon they moved to goalposts again so that has gone up the swanny too. Bugger!
The goose has actually been cooked :(
Quote from: ntpntpntp on December 19, 2020, 05:40:42 PM
I'm afraid as a non-religious person I don't see why communal worship should be ok to continue? The imaginary sky-beings will understand things are a bit tricky this year :)
Surely "they" created the damned virus in the first place :veryangry:
Quote from: chrism on December 19, 2020, 07:08:12 PM
Quote from: ntpntpntp on December 19, 2020, 05:40:42 PM
I'm afraid as a non-religious person I don't see why communal worship should be ok to continue? The imaginary sky-beings will understand things are a bit tricky this year :)
Surely "they" created the damned virus in the first place :veryangry:
Well, that's an interesting take on the situation.
:hmmm:
The exception for Christmas day is presumably (like the five days that it was going to be) a calculated risk. They know that many people will see family no matter what the rules are over Christmas, especially when they have not seen them for months. I probably will not see my parents over Christmas, but if I do it will be for a couple of hours on Boxing Day or the day after, not Christmas day ... following the spirit of the law, but not the letter.
isn't that a bit like saying that although there are speed limits, and you are not allowed to use your phone when driving, they know that people do, so they'll relax the laws for a couple of days :-\
ie we know people won't obey, so why bother with the rules in the first place.
The Boris Johnson school of management.
From November there has been two people I know die of Covid and 9 friends who have caught and recovered from the virus. And to top this last night my wife tells me the brother in law and our nephew have just tested positive!
And yet there are still people out there in denial, refusing to wear masks and not excising social distancing. Its these feckin idiots that are mainly to blame for cancelling Christmas! :scowl:
And yet there are still people out there in denial, refusing to wear masks and not excising social distancing. Its these feckin idiots that are mainly to blame for cancelling Christmas! :scowl:
I could not agree more, 'Covid does not travel people do!!!'
Totally disgusted with the behaviour of so many people at the moment, and am gutted about the government U turn about Christmas, really messed up our plans!!
It seemed that as soon as it became compulsory to wear masks, social distancing went out of the window as well!
Merry Feckin Chrimbo to one and all!
Grouch mode switched off!!
Simon
Simon
A new toast to be heard as the midnight chimes resound in 11 days time:
"Happy New Lockdown one and all!"
- as the whole of the UK reaps the benefit ;) of Christmas.
Stay home, stay in your tier, stay distanced, stay safe.
Stay alive.
My local model shop is fighting for survival, he told me yesterday he still has customers turning up with no mask. Perhaps if more of us obeyed the rules for a few months we could get rid of this virus. Keep safe everybody, merry Christmas with your trains uninterrupted.....lol
Peterborough is now an island of Tier 4 in a sea of Tier 2.
Quote from: class37025 on December 20, 2020, 10:21:06 AM
isn't that a bit like saying that although there are speed limits, and you are not allowed to use your phone when driving, they know that people do, so they'll relax the laws for a couple of days :-\
ie we know people won't obey, so why bother with the rules in the first place.
Not quite. I think that they recognise that for the sake of people's mental health, they need to allow families that have not seen each other for many months, meet up and Christmas is simply the time that most people will really want to. It has long been recognised that, in normal years, for those that are isolated from their family, Christmas is an awful time, with high levels of depression and suicide.
5 days of calculated risk (scientists and doctors increasingly warning it will cost a lot).
To cancel this would be inhuman.
72 hours later, after the same scientists and doctors presumably made some really BIG and really COLOURFUL charts.....U turn so screeching Ken Block would be proud.
Skyline2uk
It's the politicians who made the u-turn, based on the evidence the doctors and scientists had been shouting in their ears for a long time.
The whole 5-day Christmas 'break' from the ravages that Covid19 inflicts daily was a joke from the outset, and one only the virus would find funny as it didn't agree to ANY cessation of its activities. In fact, it welcomed the chance to spread its message of illness and death, cos that's what a virus likes best.
The single day freedom that is now allowed (but advised against) is still a mistake.
I have not seen my step-daughter or her children for about a year now, and my step+son and his three youngsters have only been seen twice since March (other than via the magic of the internet etc). I have also only had electronic contact with my three siblings and their families since March.
So I and my wife miss them all deeply and long to be with them once more, but we will wait, for however long it's takes, as we have no desire to be ill or die, not do we wish to inadvertently carry this insidious virus to them or to others.
Christmas and the days that follow will be very different, but that is how it must be if we are to survive.
Got the news that my daughter from Adelaide will not be joining us on Christmas Day because the new outbreak in Sydney has imposed travel restrictions. Wollongong (my home town) has been grouped in with greater Sydney.
That's just the way it is.
Hi all,
Haven't really read all the answers on this thread properly but just to say with regard to the OP about Christmas Day, my sister, who lives in North London wanted to come down on the 27th to meet for a lunch in a restaurant as they were tier 3 and we, living in Hampshire were tier 2 so in the 5 day thing of last week that was fine. It would be their only escape for Christmas. There are four of them and only two of us.
I then spent all week thinking whether it was a good idea or not, mainly siding on not, but didn't want to disappoint her. Had just texted her yesterday saying that I didn't think it was a good idea when Boris announced his tier 4 for them. She wasn't happy with him or me but today texted me back saying that my 16 year old nephew had tested positive for Covid. He had been sent home from school 4 times recently during his mock exams because of other pupils testing positive and now he's got it.
I don't know what's going to happen with them or what to say really except why risk one day. It could of have happened to me and my wife next Sunday so everyone, just think, be careful and stay safe.
Cheers, weave.
Were I live we have the highest levels of Covid in the county and our negligent council allowed a stupid Christmas market to take place last weekend, our high street was packed as a result, and hardly a mask was seen
It no wonder we are so high with our local hospital 100% occupied is it with those sort of idiots in charge locally.
NGM
I canned my Christmas trip from London back to Yorkshire at the start of December. It was just not worth the risk, and these restrictions always seemed a strong possibility. Once my parents have the jab I will be up there for a while to make up.
Quote from: N_GaugeModeller on December 21, 2020, 08:57:04 AM
Were I live we have the highest levels of Covid in the county and our negligent council allowed a stupid Christmas market to take place last weekend, our high street was packed as a result, and hardly a mask was seen
It no wonder we are so high with our local hospital 100% occupied is it with those sort of idiots in charge locally.
NGM
It is not just the idiots in charge. No one made the fools attend the Christmas market without masks. The only way we will beat this thing is for everyone to take personal responsibility for their actions and keep social mixing to the absolute minimum. The idea is surely not to think 'Oh the govt. has announced new restrictions - how can we get round them and enjoy ourselves as if nothing has happened' just look at all the fools that left London as soon as a travel ban was announced serve them right if all travel was stopped and they could not get back.
You can't rely on personal responsibility. If you could, you would not need laws against drink driving or burglary.
There has to be a lead taken, including in setting an example. It is difficult for the government to argue that Londoners shouldn't be escaping to places such as County Durham.
The way to stop fools from not wearing masks at Christmas markets is to not have Christmas markets. And compensate the businesses involved.
There is no simple answer to this problem. The govt is damned if they do and damned if they don't. We are not yet in a totallitarian state like China where they have allegedly brought the virus under control. Perhaps the answer is martial law and a total ban on all travel and a curfew. The fact that any action taken now takes two or three weeks to show evidence of effect is also a hindrance.
The sheer stupidity and selfishness of the general population makes me so angry as does the clamour for 'compensation from the government' who don't have any money anyway but will lots more of ours for years to come.
The government has an extremely high capacity to borrow. Our national debt is still lower than it was during the Victorian "golden age". It is less than half of what it was after WW2.
Government debt is like a mortgage, except the interest is lower (much lower than inflation) and you have infinity years to pay it off. The mortgage is currently equivalent to one year's salary. In an emergency, you can decide to earn more money at will. Better still, the interest you pay out ends up in the pension funds of the people who live here.
Government borrowing is cheaper than the alternative. For example, I quite like having a main line railway network, a Health Service and a basic rate of income tax below 40%. So borrowing it is please!
The last government to pay off its national debt was Romania under Ceaușescu. In June 1989. The population gave him a nice Christmas present in gratitude...
I've just been to my local Marks & Spencer Food shop for what will be the last of our Christmas shopping, picking up some odds and ends and a turkey crown joint for my 81 year old neighbour who has COPD.
What a load of idiots I came across there, even with a booked buying slot and restricted numbers allowed in. Nobody, but nobody was making ANY attempt at social distancing. Quite the opposite!
All I can say is I'm glad I don't have to go out again between now and New Year as we can exist on what supplies we have.
As for the future?
Hospitals overloaded, crematorium staff on overtime, and great numbers of people wondering where it all went so horribly wrong.
And very few of them looking in a mirror for the answer.
But, ''tis the season of goodwill to all, so Merry Christmas everyone, and may you find happiness without spreading something other than joy and love.
Daffy, I assure you that social distancing is not relevant in supermarkets. After all you can't catch the virus there, can you? You are immune aren't you? Aren't you?
I work for one of the big four supermarkets and trust me when I say this. Unless people are queuing up at check outs, there is little or no social distancing in the aisles. People barging past each other, barely leaving a hair's breadth between each other as they struggle to get round. There are people there who wear their mask to get past the security man on the door and then take them off when they are in the store. Say anything to them and they glare at you and snarl "medical reasons" at you.
However, the good news is that you'll also come across people who do want to play by the rules.
It's just those who don't who have brought the south east into Tier 4. Expect everyone else to follow shortly.
And if you do see me shopping for people who are vulnerable, don't swear at me and give me a hard time because my trolley is adding three seconds to your shopping trip. Remember that my trolley represents eight households. If I wasn't there with my trolley, there'd be at least eight more people in the store, blocking your way!
Andy
UK
Stay Safe My Friends
Ahh....Personal responsibility.....I remember that :hmmm:
We are in tier 4 but we will have to travel down to Chertsey Hospital today with my brother in law as he had a hip,replacement and needs to have the staples removed otherwise they will cause an infection , on the downside of tier 4 we wont be able to have our grandchildren over to unwrap their presents which wont be very nice as that's what we enjoy most ,the upside is we wont be having Mother in law with us this time so it should be good as she allways manages to start a row about something .
So now I WISH YOU ALL a MERRY CHRISTMAS and a HAPPIER NEW YEAR .
Lets hope that the vaccine does get around to us all and does its job .
Maybe we might have an exhibition at the later part of next year but personaly I would rather wait untill 2022 and know it would be safer .
Bob Tidbury
I think this comes down to the usual doublespeak with these things.
"Exercise personal responsibility" = follow the rules.
"Apply some common sense" = break the rules.
I wonder what Winston Churchill's take on Covid would have been ?
According to the Netflix series "The Crown" he had to deal with a similar crisis due to smog, but that only lasted a few days.
Quote from: Paul J on December 21, 2020, 11:39:37 AM
I think this comes down to the usual doublespeak with these things.
"Exercise personal responsibility" = follow the rules.
"Apply some common sense" = break the rules.
Ok I think I follow this;
So common sense led us into tier 4?
Quote from: honestjudge on December 21, 2020, 11:08:35 AM
Ahh....Personal responsibility.....I remember that :hmmm:
#
what was the other thing there used to be :hmmm:
oh yes, self discipline !
precious little of either around these days. :veryangry:
There are similar restrictions here in Ireland. But what annoys me is that for most of the restrictions, the public are 'advised' to abide by them. The mentality of the general public is that it is only 'advice', so there will always be some who disregard that advice. And the Government set a bad example as the medical advisors will recommend a course of action, but the Government delay that course of action for a few days. :veryangry:. I know I have said this before and it is draconian and unfair on some sections of the public, but the restrictions should not be advisory, they should be mandatory. (I realise that there must be some exceptions). Stop the population moving about and you basically stop the virus. Louisa, as some of you know, works in a supermarket and the number of people who go in the shop without masks is beyond belief. The management seem to do very little about it, so Louisa and some of her fellow workers have started refusing to serve customers who are not wearing a mask. It does not make a right lot of difference, but it makes Louisa feel a bit better.
Basically the collective 'we' have brought the current situation on ourselves although I have noticed that as the amount of testing increases so does the positive cases so I reckon if all tests are cancelled there wouldn't be any more positive tests so problem solved ;)
As it is we are only a couple of miles from the tier 2/tier 4 border so we are currently building the barricades to stop the unclean nipping over into our 'safe zone' :)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/103/943-211220124555.jpeg)
Quote from: thebrighton on December 21, 2020, 12:56:18 PM
Basically the collective 'we' have brought the current situation on ourselves although I have noticed that as the amount of testing increases so does the positive cases so I reckon if all tests are cancelled there wouldn't be any more positive tests so problem solved ;)
As it is we are only a couple of miles from the tier 2/tier 4 border so we are currently building the barricades to stop the unclean nipping over into our 'safe zone' :)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/103/943-211220124555.jpeg)
How can you have tier 4 border tier 2, surely common sense would upgrade tier 2 to 3 around tier 4.
Quote from: Richard G Dallimore on December 21, 2020, 01:09:36 PM
surely common sense
where does 'common sense' fit into owt? ??? It seems to me that 'common sense' was removed from the vocabulary last March.
I thought we'd agreed the SS. COMMON SENSE sailed ages ago and is now in the mid Atlantic going too fast in an iceberg field with no binoculars for the lookouts ;)
Edit - beat me to it dannyboy
Don't all tier 4 areas border tier 2? Because they were originally upgraded to tier 3, and then universally changed to tier 4. That doesn't have a direct impact on the neighbouring areas, and I don't want 'upgrading' purely because a neighbouring area has a higher rate of infection. Particularly when it's generally being done at a country/unitary authority level, which are pretty large areas.
It's always going to be a problem with defined borders (but how else can you do it?). We are supposed to be going to get my daughter registered on Wednesday, in a tier 4 area, whilst we're tier 2. We phoned to cancel, but actually they're deeming it essential travel and have said they're a COVID secure site, and the likelihood is that it won't be changing any time soon, so crack on.
Unsurprisingly there have also been stories of the dirty tier 4 buggers rushing to our lovely healthy tier 2 towns once theirs shut down, so it'll be interesting to see what impact that has. That said, let's not pretend there's a material difference either side of an imaginary line on a map, particularly in more rural areas.
Quote from: dannyboy on December 21, 2020, 01:13:57 PM
Quote from: Richard G Dallimore on December 21, 2020, 01:09:36 PM
surely common sense
where does 'common sense' fit into owt? ??? It seems to me that 'common sense' was removed from the vocabulary last March.
Common sense has been very uncommon for years... :(
Here's the Squidlet's kindergarten class here in Tokyo performing their Christmas play last week:
(https://japan-train-blog.infogogo.com/static/misc/squidlet-play.jpg)
Apologies for the blurry pic, selected deliberately for privacy, but you can see each and every one of them is wearing a facemask. It beats me why grown adults have such problems doing something a bunch of 4 and 5 year olds can do on a regular basis...
Quote from: railsquid on December 21, 2020, 03:15:04 PM
It beats me why grown adults have such problems doing something a bunch of 4 and 5 year olds can do on a regular basis...
Far too many adults have no more sense than they were born with, whereas 4 and 5 year old kids have 4 or 5 years development on those adults
Quote from: Newportnobby on December 21, 2020, 04:06:38 PM
Quote from: railsquid on December 21, 2020, 03:15:04 PM
It beats me why grown adults have such problems doing something a bunch of 4 and 5 year olds can do on a regular basis...
Far too many adults have no more sense than they were born with, whereas 4 and 5 year old kids have 4 or 5 years development on those adults
Yep you are so right!
(https://i.imgur.com/g8uoEEX.jpg)
Quote from: thebrighton on December 21, 2020, 12:56:18 PM
As it is we are only a couple of miles from the tier 2/tier 4 border so we are currently building the barricades to stop the unclean nipping over into our 'safe zone' :)
You mean like this for a cycle track:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/103/9432-221220150135.jpeg)
or this for the greener areas:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/103/9432-221220150939.jpeg)
These went up in mid-March when the green border between Germany and Switzerland was temporarily closed for casual visits (like my favourite walk down the above cycle track). The border opened again on June 15th and has remained open, despite the second wave. Both sides depend too much on each other for workers/shopping and the seven day incidence is roughly the same on both sides of the border.
People are very disciplined when it comes to mask-wearing (required in the centre of town, in shops and on public transport) and all supermarkets/DIY stores provide disinfectant for your hands and trolley. At the moment only shops with essential goods are open (in the first lockdown the DIY stores were open), but there is no blocking off of aisles with e.g. electrical goods, if the store happens to sell them. We do have an 8pm to 5am curfew on this side of the border, but this will be lifted for three days at Christmas. As someone has pointed out, a calculated risk, but the Deutsch Bahn has put on extra trains on the most frequented routes to stop people sitting too close to each other.
Peter
PS: It took me two hours to load the pictures, the link did not copy into the post!
Funnily enough, I stayed overnight in Weil am Rhein just before the crisis hit in March.
I'm in Lörrach-Stetten - about 5 minutes down the "customs-free road" from Weil.
The No. 8 tram from Basel to Weil kept running all through the lockdown, as did the SBB No. 6 train from Zell to Basel Badische Bahnhof - the railway line is to the right of the first picture and passes our flat. I believe around 3000 people commute across the border every day - I was one of them for 13 years.
I know Weil well - I play squash and have a senior "workout" course there. My old company also has its German Sales Centre there.
Peter
Quote from: Richard G Dallimore on December 21, 2020, 01:09:36 PM
Quote from: thebrighton on December 21, 2020, 12:56:18 PM
Basically the collective 'we' have brought the current situation on ourselves although I have noticed that as the amount of testing increases so does the positive cases so I reckon if all tests are cancelled there wouldn't be any more positive tests so problem solved ;)
As it is we are only a couple of miles from the tier 2/tier 4 border so we are currently building the barricades to stop the unclean nipping over into our 'safe zone' :)
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/103/943-211220124555.jpeg)
How can you have tier 4 border tier 2, surely common sense would upgrade tier 2 to 3 around tier 4.
There's a Lidl store in Portchester straddling the boundary between Portsmouth City Council (Tier 4) and Fareham Borough Council (Tier 2) :laugh:
Shoppers cross over the boundary when in store! :laugh3:
https://planetradio.co.uk/wave-105/local/news/shoppers-in-tiers-in-the-aisles/ (https://planetradio.co.uk/wave-105/local/news/shoppers-in-tiers-in-the-aisles/)
My hometown which has been grouped in with greater Sydney has now been put on high alert by the Premier of NSW, as we have had a positive case overnight. :(
Sorry to hear this George. Stay safe.
And judging by this BBC headline this morning, some youngsters are being b***dy stupid in Sydney.
"Covid: Sydney beach party sparks UK backpacker deportation threats."
QuoteOn Christmas Day, hundreds of unmasked backpackers were seen drinking, dancing and singing in the park next to Bronte Beach, which neighbours the famous Bondi Beach in east Sydney.
Holiday parties among backpackers in the tourist hotspot have been a common occurrence in other years.
Witnesses told the BBC they believed the majority were from the UK or "not Australian".
"You could hear lots of clearly English accents, and several people were wearing the white English football jerseys," said Peter Hannam, a local journalist who had passed the crowds while on a walk with his family.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-55471235 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-55471235)
I don't know if this article link will work, so here's a screenshot of one of the pics:
(https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/103/5634-291220083317.png) (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=103781)
Disgusting. :veryangry: And with some Brits doing a moonlight flit to escape imposed quarantine in Switzerland ski resort of Verbier over the weekend, I despair! :(
Thanks, daffy. Yeah, that happened and is ridiculous.
Unfortunately, the covid case here was in the shopping centre I frequent, and right next door to the bowling club I'm sitting in now!
It should all be closed down by New Year, I hope. :thumbsup:
Good. And hopefully they will properly lock down here very soon too.
Until Governments have the courage to make the 'advice' mandatory and give the Police and Army the powers to enforce it, we are going to continue to have these :censored: idiots on the streets. (As this comment might be deemed to be political, I'll say no more ;)).
They have made significant parts of it law, but there's a process around that.
Speeding is illegal too, still happens.
Using just the Republic of Ireland figures, there have been 144 fatalities on our roads this year - I do not know how many were due to speeding.
There have been 2,205 Covid related deaths.
Not really the point though, is it? Making something law won't immediately stop it happening.
What are the medical exemptions for not wearing a mask? If it is due to breathing problems should they really be out as Covid attacks the respiratory system? There is only one logical reason not to wear a mask, they have no ears!
Geoff
I am on medication for anxiety and panic attacks (Propranolol) which also lowers blood pressure. If I can wear a mask for seven hours a day at work, people can wear one for half an hour at the supermarket or on a bus.
Andy
UK
Stay Safe My Friends
Looks like I've started another covid war.
Just keep it to the current situation, without a side agenda, please. :thumbsup:
I feel wearing of mask's is no way the silver bullet in reducing the risk of this virus from spreading, although when in close proximity of other people, masks could reduce aerosols being directly sprayed in your direction if someone coughs or sneezes that's wearing one.
Peoples attitude, behaviour and hygiene is the main factor.
This new strain of virus is highly contagious, I know of many people now that have caught it. In my direct family we have now 11 members that are currently infected, two yesterday rushed to hospital. Three friends have now died from this new strain, one very close aged 54 died on Christmas day.
All it takes is just one slip up being in contact with the wrong person, family, friend or a stranger!
just had a call from a relation is aus, seems they actually have a government that is not afraid of imposing rules, rather than giving out advice, that changes every day, it seems.
result....
they are living nearly normal lives, or as near normal as you can manage at this time.
can anyone explain to me why I am less at risk if I have a meal with my drink, than if I sit at a table by myself and just have a dram or two ?
perhaps we should import some aussie politicians, they seem to have a grip, unlike our pratts.
Quote from: Mr Sprue on December 29, 2020, 12:07:23 PM
I feel wearing of mask's is no way the silver bullet in reducing the risk of this virus from spreading, although when in close proximity of other people, masks could reduce aerosols being directly sprayed in your direction if someone coughs or sneezes that's wearing one.
Seems to be a bit of a problem with coughing. I have been out once in the past 7 seven days and saw two people take off their face covering to cough. doh!
Quote from: Mr Sprue on December 29, 2020, 12:07:23 PM
I feel wearing of mask's is no way the silver bullet in reducing the risk of this virus from spreading, although when in close proximity of other people, masks could reduce aerosols being directly sprayed in your direction if someone coughs or sneezes that's wearing one.
Peoples attitude, behaviour and hygiene is the main factor.
This new strain of virus is highly contagious, I know of many people now that have caught it. In my direct family we have now 11 members that are currently infected, two yesterday rushed to hospital. Three friends have now died from this new strain, one very close aged 54 died on Christmas day.
All it takes is just one slip up being in contact with the wrong person, family, friend or a stranger!
It's all about probability and reducing that probability. Masks, distance, avoiding enclosed spaces etc. don't 100% prevent Covid, but each of them reduces the chance you'll infect someone else by a significant amount. It also reduces the viral load and thus the lethality of the transmission.
Think of it as rolling dice. Roll three dice, if all of them come up 1 then you or someone you know is dead. That's with a mask, social distancing etc. For each of those you or each person you meet don't do: Roll them again and again...
Quote from: class37025 on December 29, 2020, 12:48:44 PM
can anyone explain to me why I am less at risk if I have a meal with my drink, than if I sit at a table by myself and just have a dram or two ?
No explanation (it's all mad in my view) but it's even less of a risk to stay at home and knock back as many drams as you like, with or without a meal.
:beers:
and I can read posts on the forum as well !!
Quote from: class37025 on December 29, 2020, 12:48:44 PM
perhaps we should import some aussie politicians.
Isn't ex-PM Tony Abbott advising the Board of Trade?
Seriously, though, no politician has it easy in the current situation, although they could think before they speak sometimes. We had one politician here in Germany playing to the crowd by saying that Pfizer/BioNtech should license other companies to produce the vaccine, as though it was like making beer or coca-cola. Actually, Lonza built new production facilities in record time in Visp, Switzerland to produce the Moderna vaccine and started production in December. 250 million doses a year just waiting for approval.
We've had the same mixed messages here too, mostly due to the federal structure, but at the same time because health is a matter for local authorities, more success in fighting the pandemic. At the moment all state premiers are in agreement: only essential shops and services are operating, we are limited in the number of people we can meet and we have a curfew from 8 pm to 5 pm every day. This was relaxed over Christmas, but will be in force on New Year's Eve, when normally most people would gather on the streets and let off fireworks. Looks like 2020 is going to end like a damp squib.
Peter
Quote from: class37025 on December 29, 2020, 01:39:32 PM
and I can read posts on the forum as well !!
Up to a point. :pint: A saturation point. :D
Quote from: zwilnik on December 29, 2020, 01:01:41 PM
Quote from: Mr Sprue on December 29, 2020, 12:07:23 PM
I feel wearing of mask's is no way the silver bullet in reducing the risk of this virus from spreading, although when in close proximity of other people, masks could reduce aerosols being directly sprayed in your direction if someone coughs or sneezes that's wearing one.
Peoples attitude, behaviour and hygiene is the main factor.
This new strain of virus is highly contagious, I know of many people now that have caught it. In my direct family we have now 11 members that are currently infected, two yesterday rushed to hospital. Three friends have now died from this new strain, one very close aged 54 died on Christmas day.
All it takes is just one slip up being in contact with the wrong person, family, friend or a stranger!
It's all about probability and reducing that probability. Masks, distance, avoiding enclosed spaces etc. don't 100% prevent Covid, but each of them reduces the chance you'll infect someone else by a significant amount. It also reduces the viral load and thus the lethality of the transmission.
Think of it as rolling dice. Roll three dice, if all of them come up 1 then you or someone you know is dead. That's with a mask, social distancing etc. For each of those you or each person you meet don't do: Roll them again and again...
Or just stay at home and wait when its your turn for the jab!
And being on the mental health crisis the impact of which far outstrips COVID :confused1:
Great news - the first patient to receive a Covid vaccine had her second dose today
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-55478675 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-55478675)
Quote from: gc4946 on December 29, 2020, 06:22:39 PM
Great news - the first patient to receive a Covid vaccine had her second dose today
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-55478675 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-55478675)
It would be nice to get the 1st one!
The astra Zenica vaccine is approved..so that can now be shipped.
As it only needs a domestic fridge to store it, all surgeries can issue it. This will vastly increase the numbers of people vaccinated per day.
Isn't this for the less effective full dose/full dose regime?
I thought that the more effective half dose/full dose regime is still under test because the control group was not large enough (a fortunate mistake by someone). It seems the EU is waiting for these results before they consider approval in March.
Peter
Happily my locale has moved into Tier 4 along with three quarters of the population of England.
Better still, my GP Surgery has announced vaccinations will begin at a venue in my nearest town very soon. They are ready, the exact timings will be dependent upon the supply from the NHS of the vaccines, but they are hoping to be up and running in the next week or so.
With the Pfizer vaccine, as an example, only reaching its maximum efficacy rate soon after the second dose has been administered 21 days after the first, it will be sometime yet before any relaxation of strictures or personal controls can be considered. And even then we shall have to be a lot more circumspect about the way we live together.
A lot will depend on how many take up the vaccines, and how effective they each ultimately prove to be. But it is a start.
Light at the end of the tunnel? :hmmm: I hope so.
I am led to believe the second dose of vaccination is now going to be delayed by up to 12 weeks.
It seems someone has decided it's far better to have many half dosed than few fully dosed
I heard that as well. I also heard that if there were, (for example), 100,000 doses available, only 50,000 people would get the vaccine. That is apparently so that if there was a supply problem, those 50,000 could have their second dose. Presumably, there is less chance of supply problems in 12 weeks than in 3 weeks.
If that's true Mick, we'll all be doing a merry barn dance!
Now Dosey D'oh! your partners.....
Quote from: Newportnobby on December 31, 2020, 07:56:43 PM
I am led to believe the second dose of vaccination is now going to be delayed by up to 12 weeks.
It seems someone has decided it's far better to have many half dosed than few fully dosed
I can recall our wonderful Tony Blair was suggesting this a couple of weeks back, hope he's not BoJo's new adviser! :worried:
:sick: what a thought :'(
no further comments , don't want to break my new years resolution to be happier / more upbeat so soon .
instead, let me hope that 2021 will be a much better year than 2020 was.
Quote from: class37025 on January 01, 2021, 10:33:40 AM
:
instead, let me hope that 2021 will be a much better year than 2020 was.
I will drink to that, all the best everybody.....
Quote from: Mr Sprue on January 01, 2021, 10:00:28 AM
Quote from: Newportnobby on December 31, 2020, 07:56:43 PM
I am led to believe the second dose of vaccination is now going to be delayed by up to 12 weeks.
It seems someone has decided it's far better to have many half dosed than few fully dosed
I can recall our wonderful Tony Blair was suggesting this a couple of weeks back, hope he's not BoJo's new adviser! :worried:
More of a case of information being leaked and Blair seizing another opportunity of self promotion.
Quote from: lil chris on January 01, 2021, 10:42:29 AM
Quote from: class37025 on January 01, 2021, 10:33:40 AM
:
instead, let me hope that 2021 will be a much better year than 2020 was.
I will drink to that, all the best everybody.....
Yes me too.... Cheers everybody :beers: