I recently gave in and bought one of each of these locos and thought it would be interesting to see which is favourite with NGF members.
I can see disadvantages and advantages with both models, but they are both generally good locos. I have owned a Manor in the past, but this one is more recent with the wire connection. It is much quieter than my first one. This is my first Dapol Hall. Both locos had faults when purchased but the Manor, which wobbled was exchanged with no quibble by Rails. The Hall had a missing splasher side but the part was replaced by the Ebay seller I bought it from.
Both my locos are in plain GWR green - both a little pale but slightly different shades.
HALL
Advantages:
Generally cheaper even though RRP is slightly more.
DCC ready
Traction tyres fitted (depending on whether you like them or not)
Disadvantages:
Bent running plate (which is nowhere near as noticable on the model as in photos)
Grey driving wheels (again not so bad as it looks in photos and not so bad when the bogie wheels are black rather than painted grey)
Oiling requires one screw to be removed.
MANOR
Advantages:
Easier oiling
Black driving wheels
Getting rare now so possibly a wiser buy
Disadvantages:
Con rods do not move completely horizontally - also a problem on the Hall but not so noticeable.
More expensive
Not DCC ready
No traction tyres - though it seems powerful enough without
The tender wheels tend to drop into and out of peco frogs - possibly because the flanges are so fine.
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So far the Hall is noisier than the Manor but most of the loco noise vanishes when the tender top is removed, so I am experimenting with making it quieter..
The Hall has some detail errors such as lining not being quite right and lacking fire-iron tunnels (all the models produced by Dapol should have them fitted). I like the darker motions on the Hall, the Manor is a bit bright and silvery.
I prefer the GWR plain livery due to the lining being a bit off. Both the Hall and Manor I have are in this livery. It is a shame that the green is so flat, but I can live with that.
The only Halls I have seen in unlined GWR livery were one or two converted to oil burning. I wonder if the Dapol model is accurate?
I have two Halls and two Manors. The Manors worked fine out of the box after oiling.
The two Halls both worked but neither would negotiate 9" radius curves until I had worked on the drive mechanism (See separate thread). It appears to me that the Manor has a sloppier drive linkage. While that might sound bad, it means it will take 9" radius curves with no fuss whatsoever.
That is interesting about the drive mechanism. My Hall derails on 9" curves too.
I was not particularly worried by this for 2 reasons. The instructions state 10.5" or above so I was not particularly expecting it to. Also the only 9" curves I have are on my loop of test track, my layout uses larger radius curves.
Still, if there is a solution it would b good to see.
I like the Ixion Manor, but then I also like the Dapol Hall, but which is better?
Only one way to find out . . . . .
(http://www.tomashtonbooth.co.uk/files/gimgs/19_harryhillfight.gif)
FIGHT !!!!!
;D
Paul
Quote from: Karhedron on February 14, 2012, 04:01:36 PM
The only Halls I have seen in unlined GWR livery were one or two converted to oil burning. I wonder if the Dapol model is accurate?
I'm no expert on liveries, but there is a mention here of the GWR taransitional livery on Pitchford Hall: http://www.eorailway.co.uk/departments/rollingstock/steam-locomotives/ (http://www.eorailway.co.uk/departments/rollingstock/steam-locomotives/)
Some photos here: http://www.docbrown.info/docspics/midlands/mspage20.htm (http://www.docbrown.info/docspics/midlands/mspage20.htm)
Quote from: Karhedron on February 15, 2012, 08:55:43 AM
That is interesting about the drive mechanism. My Hall derails on 9" curves too.
I was not particularly worried by this for 2 reasons. The instructions state 10.5" or above so I was not particularly expecting it to. Also the only 9" curves I have are on my loop of test track, my layout uses larger radius curves.
Still, if there is a solution it would b good to see.
I've looked and looked and even Dapol Dave never gave me an answer to this, where exactly have you read in the instructions (Or the publicity for that matter) about 10.5" curves?
Quote from: Elvinley on February 11, 2012, 02:03:48 PM
So far the Hall is noisier than the Manor but most of the loco noise vanishes when the tender top is removed, so I am experimenting with making it quieter..
I've got a Dapol Class 26 that is considerably quieter without the body on so it would be interesting to know what you've come up with as regards reducing the noticeable noise.
Allan
I only got as far as lining the inside of the tender with tape and putting some foam towards the rear insidewhich seemed to make a small difference. You have to be really careful as the motor isn't sealed.
I have just recieved Foxcote manor in BR green which was on offer from Kernow. Much better colour on this than the GWR one. Definitely a darker green. Decoration looks great and a brief test run seems positive.
Quote from: Elvinley on March 27, 2012, 12:03:59 PM
I have just recieved Foxcote manor in BR green which was on offer from Kernow. Much better colour on this than the GWR one. Definitely a darker green. Decoration looks great and a brief test run seems positive.
Hi Ian,
Just got the same delivered to work today so will be lubing/testing tonight. Thanks again for the tip off :thumbsup:
I was running my Hall and Manor as a double header the other day and it was interesting to note the differences between them.
Both run about the same speed, but the Manor drops quite badly over turnout frog gaps as compared the Hall, which seems to glide over them much more smoothly. Makes me wonder about the weight balance on the Manor - folk say it's good but I'm less sure.
Also, the older style wheels on the Manor (black plastic spoke inserts) look better than the default Hall (grey), but less good once you paint the Hall wheels - the Manor rims really need painted to match up which is something I now intend to do.
Also the Hall bufferbeam is still bent on mine - though I suspect all the buffers on Hall/Manor would line up nicely if this wasn't the case.
The Manor cab interior could do with painting black too as green looks a bit odd!
Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Dr Al on March 27, 2012, 01:59:02 PM
I was running my Hall and Manor as a double header the other day and it was interesting to note the differences between them.
Both run about the same speed, but the Manor drops quite badly over turnout frog gaps as compared the Hall, which seems to glide over them much more smoothly. Makes me wonder about the weight balance on the Manor - folk say it's good but I'm less sure.
Also, the older style wheels on the Manor (black plastic spoke inserts) look better than the default Hall (grey), but less good once you paint the Hall wheels - the Manor rims really need painted to match up which is something I now intend to do.
Also the Hall bufferbeam is still bent on mine - though I suspect all the buffers on Hall/Manor would line up nicely if this wasn't the case.
The Manor cab interior could do with painting black too as green looks a bit odd!
Cheers,
Alan
I found the wheels dropped into frogs too and was one of the disadvantages I listed in my original post. I have filled in some of my frogs with a little wood glue which is filed down when dry to stop this happening.
Quote from: Elvinley on March 27, 2012, 04:04:41 PM
I found the wheels dropped into frogs too and was one of the disadvantages I listed in my original post. I have filled in some of my frogs with a little wood glue which is filed down when dry to stop this happening.
With the loco wheels though - the whole loco pitches slightly with the front drivers in particular dropping a lot.
In this respect the Dapol model is better balanced with more of the weight over the central point above the drivers - the Manor may have a little too much at the smokebox end.
Cheers,
Alan
Haven't noticed this on mine Al, will see if the new one does this later tonight.
Oh the fun we have. Got the aforesaid Manor home and very carefully eased it out of the packaging. Very good looking loco. As per the instructions I lubed the gears/motion and gently prised the plastic block out that fits twixt tender and loco as part of the transport packing. Placed loco on test track only to find I had dislodged the drive shaft. Having figured out how it fitted back in, I spent 10 minutes slotting it back into the loco. I'm still not sure it's fully home but my Manor goes and has been run in, although it is noisier in reverse. Whilst putting the front bogie back on the track (it does seem to jump off fairly regularly) the front coupler fell off but that was soon remedied.
I guess I shouldn't be allowed to have fiddly things :-[
Sadly my new Manor is rubbish. It runs with an awful wobble and obviously has a tight spot in the mechanism. My other Manor was my second after a wobbly replacement. I despair.
Quote from: Elvinley on March 27, 2012, 10:32:12 PM
Sadly my new Manor is rubbish. It runs with an awful wobble and obviously has a tight spot in the mechanism. My other Manor was my second after a wobbly replacement. I despair.
It sounds like it might be the quartering that is out. However as it is a new loco I think that returning it to the shop for replacement is the simplest option.
That is indeed the only option. I wish it wasn't such a gamble buying steam locos in N.
Don't be too put off - the Manor is still a decent model despite a few things that can be improved.
I have now painted the wheel rims on mine, and thinned down the crossheads significantly which completely transforms the look of the valve gear I think. I've done this on my Hall too. I did notice when doing this that on both these were quite stiff sliding on their slide bars, so may benefit from some freeing up and/or lubrication.
Best Regards,
Alan
My other Manor is fine. It is a case of getting a decent one through trial and error though.
I just contacted Kernow and they were extremely helpful.