As some of you may be aware ive changed era and sold all of my Sectorisation N gauge stock and gone to model the mids 60s (1964 in particular). Now ive been able to identify many things but i cannot find a reference to what wagons carried fuel in that era. I know there are the new class B tanks from revolution but thats it. Can anyone point me in the direction where i may be able to find which would be most suitible for my era?
Thanks
Richard
I had a nasty feeling that was the case, next question is which livery is the most sutible, im looking at the ESSO livery but im not quite sure which one of those is the most suitible.
Richard
Hi Richard,
The Class B tanks were offered following a well reasoned campaign on here by Bob Gregory and Scott Stitchell.
They may be the guys to ask, though I am not sure Scott is still on the forum.
I am more familiar with the modern era, in which the tankers used are dictated by the refinery providing the fuel. So the fuel sent to Leeds HST depot is in EWS liveried tanks from Lindsay refinery, while the fuel that goes to Ipswich Freightliner stabling point is usually in VTG liveried tanks from the Humber/Phillips 66 refinery.
For 1964 I would suggest either the Esso tanks (fuel from Fawley) or possibly the Regent tanks though I am not sure which refineries were operated by Texaco/Regent in that era.
Cheers
Ben A.
Hi Richard
Welcome to the world of transition era modelling :)
Oil tanks just got bigger and bigger with time.
Some of the PECO and Farish 14T ones would have still been about early 1960s and into the 1970s, but not on block trains.
Next up is the 35T Class A (light fuel) and class B (heavy fuel) tanks. Revolution is producing the Class B and this is the iconic one from Airfix in the 1960s.
The class A is just a longer barrel on a similar chassis, for more volatile fuels.
ESSO commissioned these originally, in 1956, but as Ben says, Texaco/Regent also used them. Regent in the 1960s, Texaco then bought Regent and took the branding off and added their own. The unbranded versions are circa 1970s - 1980s for fuel oil to depots etc.
These tanks were the last tanks to be designed with discrete mounting points.
Move on to 1958 and the first TTA monobloc designs were produced (Peco, and Farish tanks). these are 45T tanks, with the body sunk into the chassis the entire length of the body.
These were developed throughout the 1960s.
The Farish ESSO monobloc is one of a very small batch used by ESSO - their monobloc TTAs usually had a single ladder down the end of the tank, but you can use the Class B and TTA together in a single train.
HTH
Bob
Here's an 8F pulling the old 14t tank wagons in 1962 at Nuneaton if it helps.
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/52/1816-200617201555.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=52828)
Oh Dan that's lovely. Even got the Superquick low relief buildings in the background :)
And proper weathering on the mineral wagons too!
Surprised there isn't a barrier wagon between the steam loco and the first tank wagon - which doesn't appear to be Esso. These are class A 14T tanks with the orange solebars, so would have been carrying very volatile fuels and should have had a barrier wagon at this time. Perhaps the first tank is a barrier wagon of sorts?
Bob
Quote from: d-a-n on June 20, 2017, 08:16:41 PM
Here's an 8F pulling the old 14t tank wagons in 1962 at Nuneaton if it helps.
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/52/1816-200617201555.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=52828)
Nice photo, although the location is Coventry rather than Nuneaton, but the train looks like it is heading to Nuneaton. I think Foleshill station was just the other side of the road bridge (there was certainly a station there).
The line and bridge are still there but the sidings are long gone.
Hi all,
Very atmospheric photograph. The lead tanker appears to be a bogie wagon. What type was this? I don't think I have seen a model of any bogie tanker pre-dating the 1960s era 100t TEA types.
Cheers
Ben A.
It looks like an ICI 40t Caustic Soda bogie tank wagon although there were bogie Chlorine wagons too. Four different types over the years, some registered by the LMS and over a hundred built during World War 2 IIRC. These wagons used to turn up in ones and twos in trains and didn't run in block trains as far as i'm aware. Do a Google search for 'ICI 40t Caustic Soda Wagon' @Ben A (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=94) and your modelling interest might start to slip back earlier in time!
Paul Bartlett has the answer! And so do my Triang catalogues.
Vac braked design is here: http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bpcmchlorinetbv/h76e0e5a#h32a1f757 (http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bpcmchlorinetbv/h76e0e5a#h32a1f757)
Quite a short bogie chlorine and caustic wagon, derived from LMS originally pre war unfitted designs for ICI, but vac braked ones from 1958 running up to 1980s.
Liveries
1. Unfitted Imperial Chemical Industries Ltd http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/iciunfittank/h3156a729#h2bdd01dc (http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/iciunfittank/h3156a729#h2bdd01dc) probably 1930s?
2. Unfitted "big" ICI http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/iciunfittank/h3156a729#h3367d5ea (http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/iciunfittank/h3156a729#h3367d5ea) later than version 1
3. Fitted Murgatroyd chlorine (Triang R349 and also IIRC Hornby Dublo), see http://www.tri-ang.co.uk/murg.htm (http://www.tri-ang.co.uk/murg.htm) for Murgatroyd's. NB the website says the model was moulded in a cream lower body - I suspect this is colour ageing from the original white plastic used. 1958 - 1970 ish
4. Fitted ICI caustic soda (Triang R247 and Hornby Dublo 4685) see http://www.tri-ang.co.uk/ici.htm (http://www.tri-ang.co.uk/ici.htm) for red and blue ICI versions 1958 - 1970ish
5. Fitted modern BP livery late 1970s (Murgatroyd was bought by BP) see http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bpcmchlorinetbv/h14f3d878#h14f3d878 (http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bpcmchlorinetbv/h14f3d878#h14f3d878)
Nice early hazard warning notice here http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bpcmchlorinetbv/h76e0e5a#h1271ae27 (http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/bpcmchlorinetbv/h76e0e5a#h1271ae27) - basically if the tank starts leaking chlorine, keep upwind and call your boss for help!
As @Cooper (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=852) says, these did not usually run in block trains.
HTH
Bob
Quote from: Ben A on June 21, 2017, 12:30:28 AM
Hi all,
Very atmospheric photograph. The lead tanker appears to be a bogie wagon. What type was this? I don't think I have seen a model of any bogie tanker pre-dating the 1960s era 100t TEA types.
Cheers
Ben A.
When this photo appeared on RM Web there was a discussion as to its authenticity - comments about it being a model trying to look authentic. The evidence it was a model is the static grass, the uniform grey backscene, the cardboard kits used in the background, and (the killer blow) a bus belonging to the wrong municipal corporation carefully placed on the bridge!
Bob
Quote from: Bob G on June 21, 2017, 11:45:24 AMWhen this photo appeared on RM Web there was a discussion as to its authenticity - comments about it being a model trying to look authentic. The evidence it was a model is the static grass, the uniform grey backscene, the cardboard kits used in the background, and (the killer blow) a bus belonging to the wrong municipal corporation carefully placed on the bridge!
Bob
Call me gullible but I was struggling to believe that was a photo of a model. A quick bit of Googling turned up that thread and my take was that the original "model" comments were very much tongue in cheek. Perhaps more to the point, it also turned up the original here:
http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrf2075.htm (http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrf2075.htm)
With apologies to Bob if his own tongue was firmly in (his own) cheek!
If that pic isn't the real thing then I'm a Dutchman if you please, or should I say als-tu-bleeft :D
Quote from: PeteW on June 21, 2017, 01:04:45 PM
Quote from: Bob G on June 21, 2017, 11:45:24 AMWhen this photo appeared on RM Web there was a discussion as to its authenticity - comments about it being a model trying to look authentic. The evidence it was a model is the static grass, the uniform grey backscene, the cardboard kits used in the background, and (the killer blow) a bus belonging to the wrong municipal corporation carefully placed on the bridge!
Bob
Call me gullible but I was struggling to believe that was a photo of a model. A quick bit of Googling turned up that thread and my take was that the original "model" comments were very much tongue in cheek. Perhaps more to the point, it also turned up the original here:
http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrf2075.htm (http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrf2075.htm)
With apologies to Bob if his own tongue was firmly in (his own) cheek!
Of course they were tongue in cheek :laughabovepost: :P :P :P
But it makes you think that the card kits of old were very good at capturing the atmosphere of the 1960s. I did think they looked like Superquick even before I found the RM web discussion.
Bob
...plus we are talking RM Web, where anything short of perfection is not considered respectable modelling.
Bob
Quote from: Bob G on June 21, 2017, 02:38:09 PM
Of course they were tongue in cheek :laughabovepost: :P :P :P
Bob
I knew that :-[. You're demonstrably a man of acuminous perspicacity!
Quote from: PeteW on June 21, 2017, 06:17:30 PM
You're demonstrably a man of acuminous perspicacity!
Does that make me a good model maker? I think not!
Presumably the caustic soda wagon was acting as a barrier wagon as caustic soda is non-flammable.