I,m thinking of buying a shed to house my model railway, can anyone advise me a cheap way how to insulate the shed and the cost if anyone has done it, also fitting mains electrics the shed will be 8 foot x 6 foot
My shed is 24ftx12ft and I put polystyrene sheet .between the uprights and then the plasterboard with the silver foil on over that then we wallpapered over it all to hide all the joints .
If you insulate the roof as well remember to leave an air gap and air vents either end otherwise you will get some condensation on the ceiling, dont ask me how I know but I came down one day and found I had a water feature that I hadnt planned.
Bob Tidbury
I too fitted polystyrene between the battons for insulation, I then clad the interior of my shed with cladding boards(thin pine planks) not the cheapest but easy to manouver in a small space. Building your own shed rather than a kit is Cheaper, but that depends on your skills and tool availability.
Polystyrene sheet a 2400mm by 1200 by 25mm is about £7 you might need 10 of them or 20 if you can get a double layer between your battons. so thats £70 or 140.
What you cover them with is, is up to you, plaster board is cheapest but soft weak and liable to absorb damp if you are in a damp area thats about another £70. My preference would be thin ply, but that would cost you double that.
If your Shed has a window don't forget to insulate that with a clear sheet of plastic, it makes a suprising difference.
Shed electrics, Are you a qualified electrical technician? what skills do you have that way?
If not, then if you want a permanent electrical connection you'll need some one who is.
How much? that would cost depends on how far you are from the supply, whether you need armoured cable under ground or a suitable cable overhead. Then what sockets and lights you'll want inside the shed. That will not be cheap...
The cheapest way would to be a proper extension cable run it out to the shed each time you want to use it.
here's a tip for insulated windows. Keep your eyes open for a local window installer in your neighbourhood who is replacing someone's double glazed units. Ask all concerned nicely and you could walk away with a freebie double glazed panel or two. It certainly beats putting clear plastic sheeting up at a single glazed window. I did it on my shed and it worked a treat. It looks smart with Georgian inserts. :laugh:
Sorry I,m a bit late thanking you all for your info but thank you. Can anyone advise me how high my layout should be when I eventualy get my shed, I,ve been advised it should be 1 mitre from the floor for an ideal working height, would that be correct?
That's a bit difficult to answer as we all have different body heights and lots of us have back problems.
I'm 5ft 9in tall but am prone to putting my back out so my main layout is 44" from floor to baseboard top. I can crawl under the layout to do something provided I am very careful :)
My end to end layout is carried on 3 x height adjustable trestles so I can adjust things to how I feel at the time.
I have opted for a little over a metre. I find 42 " to be a comfortable height and that just gives me that little bit extra wriggle room for any work I will have to do underneath. If you are of average height and suppleness then it would be just as well to bear that need for extra space underneath in mind
Steve
Because both stations are built on gentle hill sides.
The Base level of my layout is 36 inches, the minimum and normal track level is roughly 40 inches, but will go up in places to 44 inches.
So thats about the Metre height at 40 inches. I am 6ft tall, but will not be crawling under layouts, as all the wiring / pointmotors will be brought to the front or back of the layout.
My layout is 48" off ground. Always been happy with that, but
with advancing years, find even that hard to get under.
Thanks for all your advice, I,m 6 foot and have a bad back problem and dodgy knees so higher might be better do you think !!!!!!!!
There are a lot of enthusiasts (popular in America) who like layouts at eye level.
Eye level in most uk sheds, will leave no room for a railway on top of a layout!!! :bounce:
:laughabovepost: :laughabovepost:
Quote from: first timer on May 17, 2017, 10:54:20 AM
Thanks for all your advice, I,m 6 foot and have a bad back problem and dodgy knees so higher might be better do you think !!!!!!!!
That's a 'Yes' from this old scroat
Hi first timer,
With your back problem, I think you would be wise to build it at eye level. IMO it is great to view the locos at that level without stooping and certainly makes wiring beneath a lot easier. I am just under 6ft tall, do not suffer from a back problem myself but as mine is a large layout, to hopefully fill my retirement years, I have opted for eye level and modified a wooden chair (slightly cut down but castors added) which makes wiring underneath a dream as I can remain seated and do not need to duck when messing about below the layout.
Regards Dennis.
If you ae going round the shed with the layout, I'd go for a lift up / or swing away section by your door.
If you build it on a permanent frame work but with the boards removable like a show layout. you can have it any height you like because you can always lift the board up or away, to work on it No more crawling around, no soldering upside down with hot solder dropping on you. It also means you can use all the space beneath the layout for storage. And possibly a nice seated work area.... a bit like a teenagers bunk bed with a desk for school work beneath..
Not at all convinced by the idea of eye level layouts. Surely it would pretty much spoil the view you would get when it comes to loco operation? I would be much more in favour of individuals devising their own comfortable supports when working underneath the layout
I'm not convinced about eye level layouts either, especially in N.
For a starters, building up plaster scenery, etc. must be difficult. The electrical work underneath will be easier to get to, but you're still working upside down.
Q,s idea is good to an extent, but to an older bloke like me, it's still a lot of work.
That's why I am thinking of trashing my walk around garage layout and starting a smaller, simpler layout.
For me, there is something quite special about the eye level view and this is very much borne out by the amount of folk you see at shows stooping to achieve that viewpoint. Naturally it depends on your layout depth for reach, but I find, to sort the scenery at eye level all you need is a small 2 step platform and you are at an OK level for working and painting. These steps would also be available should you want to achieve a raised viewpoint during operation.
In my opinion, it is far easier to be wiring/fault finding underneath in a chair at eye level than crawling underneath, then laying on you back with arms outstretched. Another added bonus is that it keeps it out of the reach of the younger grandchildren with their grabbing hands. :) Each to their own at the end of the day.
Although my layout is set at 44" height, I was lucky enough to find a cheapo gas damped chair which means I can instantly drop down to eye level if I want to view from that perspective.
(Sadly I need to consume a few cans of baked beans to rise again)
Quote from: The Q on May 17, 2017, 12:55:53 PM
If you build it on a permanent frame work but with the boards removable like a show layout. you can have it any height you like because you can always lift the board up or away, to work on it
Agreed, I would definitely construct the layout as manageable and easily removable sections with properly aligned joins and wiring connectors as I would for for an exhibition layout. It's so much easier to be able to put a board up on its side to work on the wiring.
Also remember that at some point in the future the layout WILL need to be dismantled, either to move it to a new location, to sort out a problem with the shed, maybe sold on once you've departed to the great train set in the sky, or whatever.
If it were me I'd be really sad to think all that work might be destroyed if it can't easily be moved. Heartbreaking for relatives as well I would imagine. I've seen layouts up for sale at general auctions, where they've basically been ripped apart.
I know this is orders of magnitude larger, but there was a huge N gauge layout of Stuttgart station built by one man in a large room under the station complex itself. Over 30 years' work, but sadly he passed away as we all do. A group have set about rescuing it but it's been a nightmare, they've basically had to saw straight through boards, track and everything to extract it piece by piece.
http://www.stellwerk-s.de/#anlage (http://www.stellwerk-s.de/#anlage)
My mate is a retired carpenter so I,m going to ask him to make me 6 tresalls to lay the layout on, 2 across the end of the shed and two down each side to make an L shape down one side and a work bench down the other. My wife wants to know when I,m going to set it all up ( I think she wants me to move in ) There will be 2 windows in the shed so I may run it just under the bottom of the frame which in my old shed is 42 inches. that looks about right for under wiring and being able to reach to the back without to much difficulty. Next is lighting and heat for the winter, putting in mains electric is going to be to expencive for me I think so I am going to run an extension cable from the utility room to the shed which is only across the foot path (mains socket to shed is about 12 foot ) Summer 3 sockets and winter 4 so which sort of lead would be best?
Quoteso which sort of lead would be best
for an extension lead being used outside a minimum of 1.5mm 3 core ho5 cable such as http://www.screwfix.com/p/time-tough-flexible-cable-3183trs-3-core-1-5mm-x-25m-black/55534 (http://www.screwfix.com/p/time-tough-flexible-cable-3183trs-3-core-1-5mm-x-25m-black/55534)
One issue to be aware of is earthing,the safest option maybe not to use the earth from the house,but use an earth spike next to the shed,it all depends on the type of earthing arangement used on the incoming supply.
Is there a ready made up extention lead I can buy?
I'd seriously consider not running an extension lead and biting the bullet and paying to have a proper electrical supply installed if you wish to run a heater in there. Because the last thing you want to do is overload the extension lead and cause a fire. It is likely that the plug and socket will be the bit that gets too hot and you will be in your shed and the first you'll know of a problem is when you loose power which may be too late
It would become very easy to over load an extension lead in a shed if you plug in a 3kw heater, some lights, controller, radio, and small power tools like solderi iron.
Attached is a link to work out volt drop down a cable so you can work out what size cable you will need.
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technical/Charts/VoltageDrop.html (https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technical/Charts/VoltageDrop.html)
Sensible advice there!
Perhaps you can find a local sparks who can advise you and offer a solution that is safe and within budget.
As an idea, if you could get a list of the *safe* materials needed you could then buy these in stages so spreading the costs over a period while the basic shed and trestles are being sorted.
Good luck and please don't take risks. Better a bit of a delay than a frizzled first timer!
Look forward to seeing how you get on.
Dave G
Whichever system you use, make sure you have a RCB or ELCB (circuit breakers) so that you won't get any fatal shocks.