I am currently looking to add my loco stable, my layout will only allow about 8 working locos on the layout at a time and thats using every loop and fiddle track I have, so realistically 6, plus a loco yard/shed and perhaps a station pilot engine.
I was toying with the purchase of a Farrish green class 47 or the Farrish 46521, mainly as I have had a driving turn on it at the GCR. My period is 1963 - 1972 time, late steam/early diesel. The 47 would fit with the D6827 I am running and driving at least 4 ( 6 ?) axles should pull well. 46521 got pretty good reviews when it was launched but these are frankly what you might expect in a magazine supported by advertising. Would only want that pulling maybe 3 or 4 coaches on a local stopper.
But reading through loco reviews I see many posts about defective locos, had 3 before I found a decent one, name plates not on straight, wobbling etc etc. None of my local ( within 20 miles) carry any N gauge stuff to speak of, so I cant bowl up and get three of four of a given model out and test them in a showroom without with one possibel exception who specialises in European stuff at least a 2 hour drive. I also dont have a DC test track to try before chipping.
As most of you realise I am not the sharpest knife in the box re getting locos set up and working so having locos not performing as they should straight from the box is a pain I can well do without especially as I usually then have to inflict that on you good folks here and sometimes on the ECOS forum.
I am DCC otherwise Union Mills would be a good bet for an 0-6-0 or super D, shame they dont do something like a rebuilt Scott or 8F. I was very tempted by a Flieshman 2-10-0 with sound I saw on demo a couple of years ago at A&H down in Brackley but Flieshmans financial issues are a worry, quality looked wonderful though. I see you can now buy Minitrix N steamer with sound.
http://www.aandhmodels.co.uk/minitrix-n-gauge-1160-1458-c.asp (http://www.aandhmodels.co.uk/minitrix-n-gauge-1160-1458-c.asp)
Price is pretty eye watering though,
Or Flieshmann,
http://www.aandhmodels.co.uk/715290-dr-br52-epiii-35404-p.asp (http://www.aandhmodels.co.uk/715290-dr-br52-epiii-35404-p.asp)
So where to go, are things really as bad as they appear with GF and Dapol with quality very much where you find it ?, what does that say about a products service life. Or are things not to bad and I just need to travel to a better shop such as maybe A&H.
Thanks for your input.
A
In my experience the newer Farish and Dapol diesel and electric loco's are pretty good, I wouldn't touch the older Dapol stuff any more.
There can always be problems, mainly with poor quality assembly on the PCB's
and lets not forget the Farish split gears. By one mail order and if it doesn't work on DC be prepared to send it back. I've purchased 5 locos in the past 2 years and all have worked out of the box.
Regards,
John P
In my experience Fleischmann and Minitrix are not necessarily better.
I have locos of both makes out of service for things that should not happen to a lowish mileage loco just out of warranty. Showcase babies......
As to getting them mended, £200 worth of Minitrix 2-10-0 waiting for a valve gear part now for NINE YEARS. Unsaleable in its current form and still away at the repair centre.
My large fleet of UK outline has about 5% failures, though they do seem to be particular types- Farish tender drives are my Achilles heel, the latest one being a Black 5 which I've had but not used much. I decided to fit it for DCC but no chip of any make would read in the loco, even one taken straight out of another working loco. I then replaced the blanking plug being careful to follow the markings on it, and moved it into my analogue only fleet. Testing it this morning it ran the opposite way to every other loco. It was only when I turned the blanking plate upside down (pin lettering on the bottom) that it runs correctly. The 6-pin socket seems to be incorrectly wired.
Les
It took me 9 months to get my HTC phone repaired, that got sorted pretty fast once I started telling it as it was on the WWW.
Thanks for your input.
A
So many attempts at modelling Gauge which by the way is my favourite gauge, each time I felt let down by quality issues, I think it is disgusting that N gaugers experience faulty locos straight out of the box but this occurs far to often, although being a British Steam addict I gave up trying to build a layout because of quality issues, instead I modelled Japanese and American N Scale and found almost zero problems with the locos.
Still being a fan of British N gauge I decided that I would not pay top price for locos instead choosing to buy Farish and Peco rolling stock but build my own diesel shunters out of Evergreen Plasticard. the shells will be fitted to Kato Mechanisms from Japan, there are dozens of different industrial diesel shunters in the UK so I believe just about anything I build will be acceptable, to me anyway.
With regard to paying top price for locos that already have faults, there is no way I would try and repair a Rolex Watch if I bought it new so I cant understand why manufacturers half expect buyers to fix their faulty products, to do so IMO shows desperation on the buyers part and the knowledge that if you want something bad enough you are prepared to go to any length to get it working, pretty sad but I admire those that can do it.
On a positive note, I have 33 locos, all Farish and Dapol diesels bought from a variety of sources and all of them worked fine straight out of the box. And that's probably put the kiss of death on the next one I buy...
Quote from: Western Exile on May 11, 2016, 05:42:02 AM
On a positive note, I have 33 locos, all Farish and Dapol diesels bought from a variety of sources and all of them worked fine straight out of the box. And that's probably put the kiss of death on the next one I buy...
I hope not :D I found the Farish diesels were just about as good as the American models :thumbsup: its just the steam locos that I had trouble with :thumbsdown: its been a while since I was involved with N Gauge so I hope the quality has improved :)
Until recently, I also thought that it was mainly a problem of Farish and Dapol. I have had to send back more locos than I care to remember. Recent examples: A wobbly Farish Fairburn 2-6-4T, a noisy-as-hell and unreliable Dapol Pannier Tank, a Dapol A4 with so much grease in it (right out of the box) that it was hard to see the gears, and, just today, a Farish 5MT that was mostly moving vertically instead of horizontally (apparently very bad quartering).
However, in addition to the 5MT, I have also had to send back 2 (very basic) Fleischmann B'B' Diesels in the last week. Both were practically new but would not move at all (DB class 212) or stop after a couple of inches and then start again (DB class 204).
In order to provide some perspective: On average, I buy about one loco a month (fewer in the summer months, more in winter).
Some of my locos seem to travel a longer distance in delivery vans back and forth between the shop and my home than their prototypes did on the rails... :veryangry:
One of the things I have learnt the hard way in recent years is that Dapol and Farish locos seem to be very picky about which decoders they will accept. I once tried no fewer than seven different decoders in a Dapol loco before I found one with which it would even move. This is an extreme case, but I do notice that the decoder makes a huge difference. A loco that jerks and produces unhealthy noises with decoder A will be a perfect runner with decoder B. With another loco, it may be the other way round. My knowledge and understanding of electronics is minimal at best and it all is like voodoo to me. When I buy a new loco and pick a decoder it always feels like playing the lottery: Will the loco be mechanically functional? Will it like the decoder? Will I have to print another DHL return label?
Quote from: Alycidon on May 10, 2016, 08:44:31 PM
I am currently looking to add my loco stable, my layout will only allow about 8 working locos on the layout at a time and thats using every loop and fiddle track I have, so realistically 6, plus a loco yard/shed and perhaps a station pilot engine.
Is your layout based on any particular location/era? Of course, sods law will dictate any recommendations based on perfect looks/running will result in you buying the only lemon in the country, but the Ivatt 2MT you mentioned is a beauty, as witnessed in the reviews................
http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=7322.105 (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=7322.105)
QuoteOne of the things I have learnt the hard way in recent years is that Dapol and Farish locos seem to be very picky about which decoders they will accept. I once tried no fewer than seven different decoders in a Dapol loco before I found one with which it would even move. This is an extreme case, but I do notice that the decoder makes a huge difference. A loco that jerks and produces unhealthy noises with decoder A will be a perfect runner with decoder B. With another loco, it may be the other way round. My knowledge and understanding of electronics is minimal at best and it all is like voodoo to me. When I buy a new loco and pick a decoder it always feels like playing the lottery: Will the loco be mechanically functional? Will it like the decoder? Will I have to print another DHL return label?
Very important observation.
Different DCC chips either have a single frequency or several frequencies with which they modulate the motor to give different speeds. Different types of motors and gear combinations have frequencies they prefer and others that stress the motor. Picking a chip that likes the motor is going to drastically affect performance. Personally I keep a selection of decoder types, try them out and fit the one that works best. I then go and buy a replacement decoder of the type fitted.
NB I have reticently been fitting sound decoders and every loco so far I have tried with Zimo 648 and 649's works fantastically.
With decoders there is an element of "you get what you pay for".
I find the blue Bachmann decoders work fine (mostly) in Farish engines but not that well in anything else- for a start they physically won't go in Evening Star's tender or in Dapol Pannier tanks. The other problem is that if another loco shorts out the track while they are running it often causes them to lose the plot, leaving a dead loco out front in front of the paying punters....
I've not had any loco of any make (UK or Continental) perform badly with a Zimo, Lenz or Digitrax decoder inside, and nowadays I tend to use the small Digitrax 6-pn decoders for all makes.
Problem children- two Farish locos where the decoders blew because of poor soldering behind the 6-pin interface shorted out the decoders when pushed right home. Both of these ran OK as analogue so were sold on as analogue only. One Dapol B1 bought as a non-runner had the circuit board pushed downwards so the soldering on the underside was touching exposed solder of the opposite polarity- cured with a small piece of insulting tape.
Looking at other scales- In OO, the Dapol Sentinel has an 8-pin interface that is mounted so high that with most plug in decoders fitted you can't get the body back on. Similarly in the Hornby Sentinel the recommended Hornby decoder doesn't quite fit the space allowed for it. Also in OO my Bachmann 64xx had an interface so weak and poorly supported that the weight of a blue Bachmann decoder caused the PCB to become banana shaped. I'm sure there are plenty of other examples but I only have seven OO locos with DCC interfaces- three poor designs out of seven.....
The grass isn't greener in other scales.
Les
Quote from: newportnobby on May 11, 2016, 11:36:39 AM
Quote from: Alycidon on May 10, 2016, 08:44:31 PM
I am currently looking to add my loco stable, my layout will only allow about 8 working locos on the layout at a time and thats using every loop and fiddle track I have, so realistically 6, plus a loco yard/shed and perhaps a station pilot engine.
Is your layout based on any particular location/era? Of course, sods law will dictate any recommendations based on perfect looks/running will result in you buying the only lemon in the country, but the Ivatt 2MT you mentioned is a beauty, as witnessed in the reviews................
http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=7322.105 (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=7322.105)
Northampton /Rugby area, early 60s, so very late steam and early diesel. With Warley coming up will add the new Farrish D5031 and/or the Ivatt 2MT as both are relevant to the area, D5036 was a well known local loco in the area in the period. Both will serve my short 4/5 coach stopping trains.
Apologies for the delayed reply, I sell stoves and once the heating season kicks off in late summer its murder till about xmas.
Thanks
A
A
I lived in both Wolverton and Northampton during those years and have some great memories of trainspotting around there. :)