Next June our club loses it's hosting on the local county councils site.
At present it is being administered by a bloke who is well into his sixties, and he is using software called "Serif Webplus" and over the last six on so years this is what he has manage to produce usig that software
http://www.amrc.hampshire.org.uk/ (http://www.amrc.hampshire.org.uk/)
To me as a web administrator and site builder, that looks about as good as a five year old could produce.
At a recent meeting I was asked to get find some hosts ( cheap) and try to get a domain name ( cheap), I managed to convince Hawkhost to give me two years free hosting, and a free domain in return for any affilation commission I may get over the next two years.
I offered to build them a site from scratch, writing the code etc, but this bloke said he wanted to use this Serif Webplus, to tell you the truth I couldn't get on with it, it is just not flexible enough for what the club needs.
So I raided Wordpress ( Free), tweaked the code a bit, to get a better look, added some plugins, tweaked those to suit the club, tweaked a bit more to add some decent gradients, and an easier back end for anyone to work with.
This is what I came up with :
http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/ (http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/)
His reply was "thats not what I wanted, ... I wanted webhosting"
How do you deal with someone who hasn't a clue what he is talking about !
EDIT: Please excuse the logo, the club insisted I keep that, yes I know it's :poop: but they insisted, and it took me over an hour to clean it up using photoshop.
If he is still using serif software he needs dragging kicking and screaming into the 21st century. :no:
Quote from: Ditape on October 30, 2015, 10:10:34 PM
If he is still using serif software he needs dragging kicking and screaming into the 21st century. :no:
Exactly, when I was learning HTML all those moons ago, I asked if Serif was good to practise with, the lecturer looked at me and said and I quote :
QuoteYes if you want to create websites that look like they were produced by a kid in primary scchool, that is who Serif is aimed at.
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 30, 2015, 10:05:10 PM
Next June our club loses it's hosting on the local county councils site.
At present it is being administered by a bloke who is well into his sixties, and he is using software called "Serif Webplus" and over the last six on so years this is what he has manage to produce usig that software
http://www.amrc.hampshire.org.uk/ (http://www.amrc.hampshire.org.uk/)
To me as a web administrator and site builder, that looks about as good as a five year old could produce.
At a recent meeting I was asked to get find some hosts ( cheap) and try to get a domain name ( cheap), I managed to convince Hawkhost to give me two years free hosting, and a free domain in return for any affilation commission I may get over the next two years.
I offered to build them a site from scratch, writing the code etc, but this bloke said he wanted to use this Serif Webplus, to tell you the truth I couldn't get on with it, it is just not flexible enough for what the club needs.
So I raided Wordpress ( Free), tweaked the code a bit, to get a better look, added some plugins, tweaked those to suit the club, tweaked a bit more to add some decent gradients, and an easier back end for anyone to work with.
This is what I came up with :
http://www.amrc.hampshire.org.uk/ (http://www.amrc.hampshire.org.uk/)
His reply was "thats not what I wanted, ... I wanted webhosting"
How do you deal with someone who hasn't a clue what he is talking about !
EDIT: Please excuse the logo, the club insisted I keep that, yes I know it's :poop: but they insisted, and it took me over an hour to clean it up using photoshop.
Those two web page links appear to be the same!! Or am I missing something?
:beers:
As Bob says, they point to the same place. Also the links within the page need to be clicked several times and the layout videos don't work on an iPad.
Sorry I've fixed the OP now
Style wise it's basic but I prefer the original page layout for clarity. Especially as the welcome page for the club. Apart from being simpler and much less text heavy the buttons for navigation are obvious and it works well on my iPhone (your navigation pull down isn't too obvious and doesn't pull down on Safari on the iPhone). That's just a case of bug fixing though. I think my main is how text heavy it is.
So the old site does look pretty basic and unprofessional but then again it's functional and people aren't expecting a professional looking business site.
Quote from: Zwilnik on October 30, 2015, 11:56:23 PM
Style wise it's basic but I prefer the original page layout for clarity. Especially as the welcome page for the club. Apart from being simpler and much less text heavy the buttons for navigation are obvious and it works well on my iPhone (your navigation pull down isn't too obvious and doesn't pull down on Safari on the iPhone). That's just a case of bug fixing though. I think my main is how text heavy it is.
So the old site does look pretty basic and unprofessional but then again it's functional and people aren't expecting a professional looking business site.
Thanks for the comments.
I find the term " text heavy" a bit confusing, as the new one isn't quite in the finished state, and there are a lot more images and pages to add, layouts of menu's, and the GUI can adjusted quite easily.
The main thing is that the backend has better usability for more people than the back end of the old site, the editing controls are almost the same as a wordprocesser, and the GUI icons are indentical.
As for the usability on a mobile phone, as the old site isn't at all responsive I wonder how you even got it to work with safari, let alone on an i-phone, the new site ( On Android) works perfectly.
Whichever source you look at, Safari comes 4th in the top four browsers for usage, the big three are Chrome almost more than the other four added together, IE and Firefox.
Safari accounts for under 10% of users on tablets and computers, and even less on mobiles, so we are not upsetting a large audience, especially as most of our users will be UK based, and probably only visiting the site for exhibition details.
I would have preferred a different colour to green, but the club is obsessed with the SR, it's hard to get them to like anything else, they will only see it as one of the other big four !
Prefer the original.
Easy to navigate, clear purposeful layout.
New site looks messy, bit all over the place. Looks like someone let loose with a page layout program and a handful of cool code features.
CFJ
I can't believe what I am reading !!
The orginal site has an unco-ordinated colour scheme, terrible pixelish gradients, some of the headers are blurred, the pictures are too.
The menu is disjointed and all over the place, yet you think it's better !
This would be the type of site that would be displayed as "what not to do! nowadays !
The second site (http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/ (http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/)) is not working well in my Firefox either,
If I Zoom-down to get everything on screen (central panel, pictures etc plus background) the text is too small to read, if I Zoom-up to read it everything goes off screen to the side including half the text :(
I was about to ask what is the purpose of the background, , , till I Zoomed down so far that the text became silly-small then I realised there was a calender and other unreadable stuff even further off to the right.
Sorry not good for me, I would suggest dump wordpress and back to HTML in Notepad !
Quote from: MalcolmAL on October 31, 2015, 12:35:05 AM
The second site (andovermodelrailwayclub.) is not working well in my Firefox either,
If I Zoom-down to get everything on screen (central panel, pictures etc plus background) the text is too small to read, if I Zoom-up to read it everything goes of screen to the side including half the text :(
I was about to ask what is the purpose of the background, , , till I Zoomed down so far that the text became silly-small then I realised the was a calander and other unreadable stuff even further off to the right.
Sorry not good for me, I would suggest dump wordpress and back to HTML in Notepad !
What are you using to browse it ? Tablet, PC, Phone ?
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 31, 2015, 12:37:46 AM
What are you using to browse it ? Tablet, PC, Phone ?
Laptop
PS some silly typos corrected in my previous.
Quote from: MalcolmAL on October 31, 2015, 12:39:57 AM
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 31, 2015, 12:37:46 AM
What are you using to browse it ? Tablet, PC, Phone ?
Laptop
PS some silly typos corrected in my previous.
Thats weird because I'm viewing it through Firefox on a laptop as well, and it all looks good to me.
You should have a left sidebar, and the whole theme shoud be repsonsive, except for the background, I've goo that set as "fixed" not fluid.
I've checked it out on my android phone, it works OK on there too, and that is using IE 11
If it's not too much trouble, can you send a couple of screenshots to gnwalters@gmail.com so that I can exactly whats happening.
Anyone else is welcome to send me screen shots as well.
I'm off to bed now, work at 7am.
thanks for the input guys
TIA Graham
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 31, 2015, 12:28:31 AM
I can't believe what I am reading !!
The orginal site has an unco-ordinated colour scheme, terrible pixelish gradients, some of the headers are blurred, the pictures are too.
The menu is disjointed and all over the place, yet you think it's better !
This would be the type of site that would be displayed as "what not to do! nowadays !
1. Well duuh. Wouldn't expect otherwise. I assume all are supposed to praise the new and dump on the old.
2. Don't see the dis-coordination, the rest minor, easily fixed.
3. Yes, I think it is better. Can't see the claimed disjointed menu. Goes where it is supposed to, displays what is expected.
4. New one; seen much much better, needs a graphic artist to fix design and layout. This looks more like the 5 year old version.
Oh, this is odd, I thought I'd dump Firefox and try it in an old Opera,
copied over http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/ (http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/) into the address bar and :
it shows a big black screen with
http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/ (http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/)
is coming soon
well odd!
OK, lets try SlimBoat and Palemoon , ,
Nope, coming soon, what the , , I guess ,,,
back to trying Firefox , argh you've put the site in suspenders
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 31, 2015, 12:44:34 AM
If it's not too much trouble, can you send a couple of screenshots
I'm off to bed now, work at 7am.
No can do ! Cant reach it no more !!
I'm off to bed too
Hmm yes, I was expecting the original site to be a 90's Geocities style mess, with
bevelled graphics, animated gifs, "under construction" sawhorse logos, maybe the mouse
cursor changes into a steam engine. But it's... OK. Does the job. Not going
to win any design prizes, but it doesn't have to. Could do with a bit of
tidying up. Lose the shadow on the header. Update some of the images.
Make links clear which jump to external sites.
The new version, dunno, somehow I get the feeling I'm looking at a picture
of an SR steam loco placed in a murky aquarium obscured by bits of text. I know sans-serif text is all the rage these days, but personally I find it harder to read, especially
when grey on a dark background, and especially when the background picture
is static but the text on the left moves when scrolling so its background keeps
changing (aargh). Oh, and there's a bevelled movey-arrow
thing at the bottom right which crawls up and down like an insect
stuck inside my monitor. Please, kill it and bury it.
Personally I'd change the backend to Wordpress (or whatever)
but take the old design, fix it up a bit, convert it into template-based
standard-conforming HTML (first step) without too many bells and whistles
(so you don't need to worry about getting complaints from Chrome 221 users on
Android Bubblegum) then think about a new design.
Well you did ask :D
Using an iPad I get the old site and a black page "Andover MR club coming soon" when trying the new link.
In my opinion the old site is functional but rather old fashioned looking. It uses too many different fonts for a start, it could be tidied up quite easily without changing it completely.
As I can't see what you've done with the new one I suspect it's too radical a change so it might not go down well.
The person who designed the original site probably feels quite proud of his efforts, it might have taken him a long time to master the website software and produce the website. The other club members may also think that the website is perfectly adequate.
You need to tread carefully in situations like this, sometimes it's not worth upsetting people's feelings. It's a bit like being rude about someone's layout or scenery skills.
Serif is old hat but it served its purpose and yes, the current site is a tad all over the place but I've seen a lot worse.
I can't view the new site (via Chrome) so unable to comment.
Designing anything through a committee is always a nightmare but Veronica gives some nicely put advice.
Good luck with the project.
Dave G
I know ziltch about web designs and how to implement same, but I preferred the first version! :uneasy:
Quote from: silly moo on October 31, 2015, 04:40:32 AM
The person who designed the original site probably feels quite proud of his efforts, it might have taken him a long time to master the website software and produce the website. The other club members may also think that the website is perfectly adequate.
You need to tread carefully in situations like this, sometimes it's not worth upsetting people's feelings. It's a bit like being rude about someone's layout or scenery skills.
Not really a concern, don't forget the current web master is "well into his sixties" ( I'm 62 so that went down well :veryangry:) so obviously needs to be put out to pasture as his innovative and creative days are long gone. ;) :smiley-laughing:
I still preferred the first version. More eyecatching.
If I knew what all the jargon was about I'd be able to comment, but it
might as well be in Klingon as far as I'm concerned........ :(
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 30, 2015, 10:05:10 PM
To me as a web administrator and site builder, that looks about as good as a five year old could produce.
Crikey mate that's cruel, at 60 you are only doing your best and he has probably had the job 'cos no one else was able to step in.
Help him, and eventually you will be able to relieve him of the task an free him up for the real object of the hobby. Yes Trains.
Then when you are 60.....
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 30, 2015, 10:05:10 PM
His reply was "thats not what I wanted, ... I wanted webhosting"
He wanted a new web host not a new website!
I cant see the new one yet - but the old one is "typical model club website" - its neither good nor bad style-wise but it does the job in hand pretty well.
Your Topic header
"Have I done the right thing ?" :sorrysign: but :no:
Please don't alienate the current webmaster.
It's a Model Railway Club you joined not a Boxing Club!
First one is ok - perfectly adequate for its purpose.
Second one doesn't work, as others have said it just displays 'coming soon'.
Agree with everyones' comments about upsetting previous webmaster.
And remember... NEW is not always BETTER.
:beers:
Freeola at £4.99/month isn't too bad?
Peter
Just tried to access the new site on my laptop and all I get is a black page with the url displayed and "is coming soon" :confused1:
Can't see anything wrong with the current/old site.
Change isn't always what is required,you were asked to find a host and you've built a new website.
At the end of the day it is a bunch of enthusiasts just showcasing their group, the web solution needs to be simple, cheap and at a level where someone who is comfortable using Microsoft office can manage it.
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 31, 2015, 12:18:39 AM
Quote from: Zwilnik on October 30, 2015, 11:56:23 PM
Style wise it's basic but I prefer the original page layout for clarity. Especially as the welcome page for the club. Apart from being simpler and much less text heavy the buttons for navigation are obvious and it works well on my iPhone (your navigation pull down isn't too obvious and doesn't pull down on Safari on the iPhone). That's just a case of bug fixing though. I think my main is how text heavy it is.
So the old site does look pretty basic and unprofessional but then again it's functional and people aren't expecting a professional looking business site.
Thanks for the comments.
I find the term " text heavy" a bit confusing, as the new one isn't quite in the finished state, and there are a lot more images and pages to add, layouts of menu's, and the GUI can adjusted quite easily.
The main thing is that the backend has better usability for more people than the back end of the old site, the editing controls are almost the same as a wordprocesser, and the GUI icons are indentical.
As for the usability on a mobile phone, as the old site isn't at all responsive I wonder how you even got it to work with safari, let alone on an i-phone, the new site ( On Android) works perfectly.
Whichever source you look at, Safari comes 4th in the top four browsers for usage, the big three are Chrome almost more than the other four added together, IE and Firefox.
Safari accounts for under 10% of users on tablets and computers, and even less on mobiles, so we are not upsetting a large audience, especially as most of our users will be UK based, and probably only visiting the site for exhibition details.
I would have preferred a different colour to green, but the club is obsessed with the SR, it's hard to get them to like anything else, they will only see it as one of the other big four !
In terms of text heavy. When I view your version it's just a wall of text. No photos or anything showing the club or anything. The better back end is great and it's definitely a good idea in terms of making it easier for club members to use but if it doesn't work on a web standards browser like safari (especially if you're using Word Press) then you've got some debugging to do. Just saying "it works on my android phone" really isn't enough as there's no such thing as a 'standard' android phone.
Now that is nice and clean.
Well done!
CFJ
Quote from: Only Me on October 31, 2015, 11:43:08 AM
I only see the coming soon message too, here's our one which I made using WIX, its free by the way and I just happen to own a good domain name ;)
www.ngaugesociety.co.uk (http://www.ngaugesociety.co.uk)
:D
That's a very nicely done site. Shows off the club really well.
Quote from: Only Me on October 31, 2015, 11:43:08 AMI just happen to own a good domain name ;)
www.ngaugesociety.co.uk (http://www.ngaugesociety.co.uk)
Very well done site, I like it *
The only small niggle I have is that I did not at first follow your link because I thought it said ngaugesociety ( been to there before), not to your local club.
Then, as our chums thought it good, I'd better have a look see what had changed,,, only then did I find it went to the Northant etc. site.
Errr, cant afford to scratch my head too much, not enuf left, errr
oh I see, eventually, one is a com and yours is a couk ! Ha !!
You might want to use brackets Northants etc. ! :)
* consider yourself co-opted as Peace Envoy to the Andover Dependencies and Confederated Territories, idem.
It is a case of understanding the customer's requirements, which seemed to be web-hosting and not a new site.
Don't really understand what someone being well into their sixties has got to do with anything :hmmm:. For example, Monet, Picasso, Michelangelo, Einstein, Newton, Sir Alex Ferguson didn't give up when they turned sixty ;)
Quote from: Pengi on October 31, 2015, 04:07:11 PM
Don't really understand what someone being well into their sixties has got to do with anything :hmmm:. For example, Monet, Picasso, Michelangelo, Einstein, Newton, Sir Alex Ferguson didn't give up when they turned sixty ;)
Nor have many of us N gaugers :P
Quote from: newportnobby on October 31, 2015, 05:06:06 PMNor have many of us N gaugers :P
You beat me to it, I was just about to say to Pengi " You forgot me NPN and DorsetMike" ;D
Quote from: MalcolmAL on October 31, 2015, 05:10:05 PM
Quote from: newportnobby on October 31, 2015, 05:06:06 PMNor have many of us N gaugers :P
You beat me to it, I was just about to say to Pengi " You forgot me NPN and DorsetMike" ;D
And 41% of those who gave their age in a recent poll, Malcolm :D
Quote from: Pengi on October 31, 2015, 04:07:11 PM
Don't really understand what someone being well into their sixties has got to do with anything :hmmm:. For example, Monet, Picasso, Michelangelo, Einstein, Newton, Sir Alex Ferguson didn't give up when they turned sixty ;)
Neither did Joan Collins, Sean Connery, Joseph Stalin.............
It's obvious from remarks good and bad, that what is needed is a cleaner lighter site.
My brief was not just to look into hosting the site, but also claim the domain, and look into giving the site a better look and feel.
The only way you can find out if you have achieved the second is by asking people who you know will be honest, asking friends and family is the worst thing to do.
The aim is to have a backend that anyone can use, and to be able to add content without going into the mysteries of FTP, with Serif Webplus from what I understand you have to update it with FTP, that is not what is needed, also at the moment only one person knows how to use it, if some thing happens to him we are up the creek, ( a few years back our exhibition organiser died unexpectedly only two weeks before the exhibition, and all the details were on his PC, behind a very secure password) we had literally two weeks to organise it !)
I have taken the site down for the moment to look at it deeper, and to make it lighter and easier to use.
Thanks again for all the comments and input.
Quote from: Graham Walters on October 31, 2015, 05:28:43 PM
It's obvious from remarks good and bad, that what is needed is a cleaner lighter site.
My brief was not just to look into hosting the site, but also claim the domain, and look into giving the site a better look and feel.
The only way you can find out if you have achieved the second is by asking people who you know will be honest, asking friends and family is the worst thing to do.
The aim is to have a backend that anyone can use, and to be able to add content without going into the mysteries of FTP, with Serif Webplus from what I understand you have to update it with FTP, that is not what is needed, also at the moment only one person knows how to use it, if some thing happens to him we are up the creek, ( a few years back our exhibition organiser died unexpectedly only two weeks before the exhibition, and all the details were on his PC, behind a very secure password) we had literally two weeks to organise it !)
I have taken the site down for the moment to look at it deeper, and to make it lighter and easier to use.
Thanks again for all the comments and input.
Good luck Graham. I think we would all be interested in what you come up with. But don't forget that its all those guys and gals out there who use the site that will be the judges of what is good or bad. Don't forget to include them in you deliberations.
:beers:
Quote from: newportnobby on October 31, 2015, 05:11:44 PMQuote
You beat me to it, I was just about to say to Pengi " You forgot me NPN and DorsetMike" ;D
And 41% of those who gave their age in a recent poll, Malcolm :D
Ah yes,
well you see, I was going to leave a space for others to sign in,,, but I forgot ! :(
Not sure I like being grouped with Stalin !! :o
Bah, these B**** youngsters, no respect for their elders! Dunno what the world is coming to. Mumble murmur discontent, rhubarb rhubarb rhubarb. (http://thenewpopinn.myfreeforum.org/images/smiles/angiespicks/old.GIF) (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-fc/massmoon.gif)
Quote from: MalcolmAL on October 31, 2015, 09:12:43 PM
Not sure I like being grouped with Stalin !! :o
I'm sure if you asked nicely, Pengi would replace Stalin with Dzhugashvili ?
Quote from: MikeDunn on October 31, 2015, 09:41:02 PM
Quote from: MalcolmAL on October 31, 2015, 09:12:43 PM
Not sure I like being grouped with Stalin !! :o
I'm sure if you asked nicely, Pengi would replace Stalin with Dzhugashvili ?
Hehee nice one, but no thanks, poor little Vasily,
but actually the miscreant was Agrippa not Pengi :)
Quote from: Only Me on November 01, 2015, 12:40:39 PMour other address
,
So we have all angles ;)
:) :)
yes I did come across the other but bowed to your prerogative :) and thort a gentle poke might be in order :laugh:
,
Yep, including a few on a hyper-cube,
You will of course pass by the armourer for some chain-email before you take up my mission ??
I started coding websites back in 1997, and it's all changed so much. So many different languages to use, and the possibility of using software. Absolutely no shame in using software to create a site. It all depends on the content itself, and where the user places it.
Funnily enough, I have Serif Webplus on my PC here at work, and I decided to learn how to use it a few months ago and create a railway website. It's in it's early days, and I've certainly found the software's limitations, but it's saved me hours of coding - which is what stopped me making the website in the first place! ;D
Going back to the whole point of this thread though, I didn't see your new website, but the old one looks fine to me.
I've opened the site up again now, after spending more than a few hours on it over the week end.
To say I've tweaked it is an understatement, it's had a complete re-vamp, ony two colours, plus a bit of shading, it may still be considered to be a little heavy on the text side, but that will improve as I get pics of the layouts we have, the other site uses a lot of sliders, and I don't have access to those pics.
http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/ (http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/)
Initial thoughts ...
- Lifting the 'location' in the menu bar for the current page looks iffy to me; can this just not be shaded & remain on the same level ?
- Going to Layouts, I see no options for private or club ? And the text is far too far down the page !
- Top Layouts menu forces me to members layouts - can't access club layouts at all
- Exhibitions - "you need to catch the Saisbury – Andover service " - where's Saisbury :P
- Exhibitors table has a lot of wasted space - why not have the Gauge aspect under half of the Exhibit aspect ? Also, the table doesn't have the cells in fixed widths (again, see Gauges)
- Top menu doesn't have all the pages listed - and as you have a left-side menu why bother with both ?
- Left menu structure changes depending on what page you're at - standardisation required
- Left layouts menu - is this supposed to be hierarchical ? As it appears rather chaotic
- Categories menu - surely this should be on all pages if you're going to have it (only one category though ?). And I would say News should be on the main menu system
- Loss of left menu when in Newsletter
- "AMRC in the News" - argh ! menus etc now on right ?
- Dittto BRM !
And no, I don't like the logo either ::) But at least you're getting close to LNER's blue :D
Still needs work; do you have a page template defined ? If so, you haven't used it all the way through.
[edit] Must wonder why, if the current webmaster only wanted a hosting platform for the current site most here like, you're apparently trying to take over from him ?
Given the way this is going, we might move it into the computer thread. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Graham Walters on November 02, 2015, 09:28:58 AM
I've opened the site up again now, after spending more than a few hours on it over the week end.
To say I've tweaked it is an understatement, it's had a complete re-vamp, ony two colours, plus a bit of shading, it may still be considered to be a little heavy on the text side, but that will improve as I get pics of the layouts we have, the other site uses a lot of sliders, and I don't have access to those pics.
http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/ (http://andovermodelrailwayclub.co.uk/)
That's lot more clear and more readable. The pulldown at top right still doesn't work on mobile Safari (and there's no option to not view it in mobile mode, which is a bit of a downer, but I'm guessing that's just an aspect of that particular WordPress plugin). At least it's not a huge scroll down to the menu at the bottom now and it's looks great on desktop.
Quote from: Only Me on November 02, 2015, 11:10:34 AM
PS you need a cookie disclaimer (its the law) and an explanation of what you do with your cookies..
https://silktide.com/the-stupid-cookie-law-is-dead-at-last/
Quote from: Only Me on November 02, 2015, 11:10:34 AM
Also these are the errors from your site :-
With luck correcting one or some of the aforementioned will correct the misbehaving under Firefox Zoom.
:(
But since I never expected to visit Andover anyway, I will stop worrying about it :laugh3:
My thoughts are that the site could do with some better images.
For example, the most dominating parts of the Frogpool image on the front screen are the cream doors and the back of the piece of wood used for the back scene. If only the photographer had walked a few paces nearer . . .
The picture of Andrew Fendick could be enhanced by cropping out the person walking by or better still getting a close up of what he is doing.
The other two images make it look a bit like a jumble sale :sorrysign: Try and get some more close-ups and of youngsters and women too so as it looks more welcoming.
I also am not sure about the line image in the logo - it is a not immediately obvious what is was (but then I am not a fan of steam)
Just trying to help
Quote from: Pengi on November 02, 2015, 02:01:02 PM
My thoughts are that the site could do with some better images.
I totally agree, at the moment I have had to use stock images, rather than orchestrated or posed ones.
For example, the most dominating parts of the Frogpool image on the front screen are the cream doors and the back of the piece of wood used for the back scene. If only the photographer had walked a few paces nearer . . .
See above
The picture of Andrew Fendick could be enhanced by cropping out the person walking by or better still getting a close up of what he is doing.
Some people are idiots, the bloke knew a pic was being taken, and decided to walk in front of me right at the wrong moment
The other two images make it look a bit like a jumble sale :sorrysign: Try and get some more close-ups and of youngsters and women too so as it looks more welcoming.
That would be great, if we had some younger members, and we don't have a single female member either
I also am not sure about the line image in the logo - it is a not immediately obvious what is was (but then I am not a fan of steam)
Totally agree that the logo is mess, but, they want to keep it, I did try a BR totem, but that didn't go down too well.
Just trying to help
Ive guessed that the average age of members is in the middle to late fifties, but, and it's a big one, six of the older members are original ones, and they are all approaching or past retirement and can't see the need for change, they are under the impression the club is doing fine, when in reality it isn't, I am the only new member to join in the past 12 months.
Even though this years exhibition made a profit, it was well down on last year, and the comments I've heard at other shows, and read on forums remark that the show lacked atmosphere, and had too many second hand stands, Also it wasn't advertised as well as last year, this time round they seemed to rely more on what they could get for free via forums and the like.
Quote from: Graham Walters on November 02, 2015, 06:54:14 PM
Ive guessed that the average age of members is in the middle to late fifties, but, and it's a big one, six of the older members are original ones, and they are all approaching or past retirement and can't see the need for change, they are under the impression the club is doing fine, when in reality it isn't, I am the only new member to join in the past 12 months.
Graham - you do seem to have a fixation on age. I'm not sure that age has anything to do with anything. Now your talking about how the club is doing rather than whether your updated web site is better than the original. Getting a bit off topic here.
:hmmm:
Quote from: austinbob on November 02, 2015, 07:02:38 PM
Quote from: Graham Walters on November 02, 2015, 06:54:14 PM
Ive guessed that the average age of members is in the middle to late fifties, but, and it's a big one, six of the older members are original ones, and they are all approaching or past retirement and can't see the need for change, they are under the impression the club is doing fine, when in reality it isn't, I am the only new member to join in the past 12 months.
Graham - you do seem to have a fixation on age. I'm not sure that age has anything to do with anything. Now your talking about how the club is doing rather than whether your updated web site is better than the original. Getting a bit off topic here.
:hmmm:
It's not a fixation on age, I myself am 58, I think it's just a coincidence that the longest serving members are also the oldest, and they seem the most loathe to change anything.
This was offered by way of an explanation as to why those six in the main were against changing the club logo, and was not meant to come across as ageist.
Quote from: Only Me on November 02, 2015, 10:20:32 PM
So at 58 you are old too then compared to me lol :D
If thy mocks thy will be mockered back ;)
Oh I don't mind a bit of mockery ! 8)
Quote from: Only Me on November 02, 2015, 11:10:34 AM
I think you should create modify the style sheet, standardise it and apply it to the whole site, so all pages are regular, text is the same style, fiont and size etc, IMO you don't need the same menu at the side that you have at the top, its just clutter, maybe make the side menu clickable so the boxes don't auto jump down all over the place? :)
PS a bit more blue and you have the Midland Pullman ;)
PS you need a cookie disclaimer (its the law) and an explanation of what you do with your cookies..
Also these are the errors from your site :-
GET http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/js/adsbygoogle.js (http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/js/adsbygoogle.js)
aaron81uk:49 GET http://www.google-analytics.com/analytics.js (http://www.google-analytics.com/analytics.js) (anonymous function) @ aaron81uk:49(anonymous function) @ aaron81uk:50
aaron81uk:704 GET http://connect.facebook.net/en_US/all.js (http://connect.facebook.net/en_US/all.js) (anonymous function) @ aaron81uk:704(anonymous function) @ aaron81uk:705
aaron81uk:1 GET http://pixel.quantserve.com/pixel;r=1149316293;a=p-84eFbbejjm53s;fpan=0;fpa (http://pixel.quantserve.com/pixel;r=1149316293;a=p-84eFbbejjm53s;fpan=0;fpa)...48603;tzo=0;ref=;url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.soundboard.com%2Fsb%2Faaron81uk;ogl= 403 (Forbidden)
buttons.js:1 GET http://seg.sharethis.com/getSegment.php?purl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.soundboard.com%2Fsb%2Faaron81uk&jsref=&rnd=1446462848656 (http://seg.sharethis.com/getSegment.php?purl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.soundboard.com%2Fsb%2Faaron81uk&jsref=&rnd=1446462848656) 403 (Forbidden)stLight.createSegmentFrame @ buttons.js:1stLight.log @ buttons.js:1(anonymous function) @ buttons.js:1(anonymous function) @ buttons.js:1
aaron81uk:1 GET http://l.sharethis.com/pview?event=pview&version=buttons.js&lang=en&fpc=6ed (http://l.sharethis.com/pview?event=pview&version=buttons.js&lang=en&fpc=6ed)...d%20-%20Soundboard.com%20-%20Free%20Sounds%20%26%20More&ts1446462848655.0= 403 (Forbidden)
buttons.js:1 GET http://edge.sharethis.com/share5x/index.3c401b929c426b4aced880852aeb0d98.html (http://edge.sharethis.com/share5x/index.3c401b929c426b4aced880852aeb0d98.html) 403 (Forbidden)
After consulting the guru's at Wordpress it would seem these errors are being reported on your computer, most of them are stat gathering.
The soundboard error relates to a site for ringtones.
None of these errors have anything to do with my wordpress as I don't have those plugins installed.
So in short, the problem is your end not mine.
Quote from: Only Me on November 03, 2015, 10:13:29 AM
Whilst maybe some of those are inherent to my cookies, if you run your web address through here, you will see all your coding bugs and bad links, mispelt code..
http://www.websitecleanup.com/test.php (http://www.websitecleanup.com/test.php)
I'm not really concerned with W3C compliance, very few websites do comply, broken links, most of what is being reported is blocked by Robots.txt, so that isn't a biggie either, I know about those.
404 error, I'm not really worried about bots getting lost, this isn't really a site to compete with other sites for an audience, I'm not trying to appeal to Google and other search engines, it will still get indexed no matter what, that's the nature of bots.
If bots were that good you wouldn't see sites that haven't been updated for years at the top of the organic search pages.
500 errors are sever side, so I can't do anything about them.
I never trust a site that finds errors for free, then wants to charge you a fortune to "fix them"
First of all... I'm a web testing professional.
Next...
The old one is clearly outdated, from the previous century. That is BAD for a simple reason.... try to open it from a mobile.
The new one is technologically compatible with latest devices, it can be viewed in a mobile without problems.
That being said... the responsive design of the page is WRONG.
If you resize to mobile screen resolution you miss the menu, that goes BELOW the content. That should be avoided IMHO because the user will get lost and won't know where to go. Keep the menu first.
My two cents.
Another bug.
The logo is not responsive, goes out of the page when resizing.
QuoteThe new one is technologically compatible with latest devices, it can be viewed in a mobile without problems
Meh, I much prefer the old one looking on an iPhone, just zoom in to read text. Mobile sites annoy me. The new one has a massive logo at the top of the page which doesn't resize, it takes far longer to load, I couldn't see what I wanted within 5 seconds. The old one looks dated, but I'm ok with that!
Quote from: njee20 on November 03, 2015, 03:03:48 PM
QuoteThe new one is technologically compatible with latest devices, it can be viewed in a mobile without problems
Meh, I much prefer the old one looking on an iPhone, just zoom in to read text. Mobile sites annoy me. The new one has a massive logo at the top of the page which doesn't resize, it takes far longer to load, I couldn't see what I wanted within 5 seconds. The old one looks dated, but I'm ok with that!
What I said... defects in the new one that need fixing. Other than that, the new one IS mobile compatible. :D
But I'm saying that doesn't make it better. Fix the defects I mentioned and I still prefer the old one functionally.
I've done a crop on the Andrew Fenwick image - the resolution is poor because I took the picture direct from the site but it will give you an idea
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/14/thumb_31317.png) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=31317)
I had a go at cropping the other images too but was pushing the limits a bit
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/14/thumb_31319.png) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=31319)
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/14/thumb_31318.png) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=31318)
Quote from: deibid on November 03, 2015, 10:40:49 AM
Another bug.
The logo is not responsive, goes out of the page when resizing.
Al I have done is increase the allowable size for the logo, via the CSS. I'm not sure why it is suddenly not responsive.
My coding skills really don't stretch that far :'(
Quote from: Graham Walters on November 03, 2015, 07:40:04 PM
Quote from: deibid on November 03, 2015, 10:40:49 AM
Another bug.
The logo is not responsive, goes out of the page when resizing.
Al I have done is increase the allowable size for the logo, via the CSS. I'm not sure why it is suddenly not responsive.
My coding skills really don't stretch that far :'(
I've tried cropping some of the images as well, but I have a feeling they were taken on a mobile phone, and not a decent camera, my plan would be to take fresh pictures as RAW images