if your ballasting looks like the surface of the moon can you file / sand it smooth in some way????
any ideas?
cheers
tim
Tim
I'm assuming this is after it has been glued down?
If so, it sounds like a bit of an ugly situation. Can you fill the craters with another ballast layer?
How hard would be to rip it up and start again?
Webbo
If it has been put there by the usual PVA method, it can be loosened with warm water to be reformed or even removed altogether.
cheers, i'm just trying to fill in any pot holes or remove any peaks now!!
i think it just looks bad really close up / in bright light!!! from a meter back it looks fine... i think close up photos will show it up to be rather uneven though!!! i know real ballast can be a bit like that but even so, i was hoping for much more even ballast distribution!!!
cheers,
tim
It can be tricky. I trickled the ballast onto the track and evened it out with a small brush between the rails but, even using an eye dropper at close range, it still caused a few craters here and there but I managed to smooth them out before everything set.
Cratering is much less likely if a wetting agent is applied to the ballast before the glue. The NGF had a recent thread on all of this that might be of interest:
http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=27354.0 (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=27354.0)
Good luck with the remediation effort.
Webbo
Trouble is, when I first ballasted some track I (a) couldn't find any fairies to help and (b) had a problem with liquid water as I'd bought some dessicated water powder but couldn't think what to dilute it with :dunce:
cheers for replies!
from 50cm - 1m away it looks good. i like to take pictures or look v close up though!!! thats when the ballast looks a bit crazy!!
i used scenic cement - which says you don't need a wetting agent at all... which was new....
anyway i will try to sort out any really obvious troughs and peaks but then i'll just leave it... it gets a bit obsessive after a while!!!
ballasting is not really my thing... but it is better looking than the fixed in place plastic ballast on kato etc. so worth the effort in the end!
cheers
tim
If you are using scenic cement then you don`t need to prewet the ballast as it already has a wetting agent....to avoid volcanoes try not to rush it and keep the nozzle of your dropper bottle close to the ballast and apply a little at a time....its when you "drop" from a few inches onto the ballast that causes it to move !....I have been ballasting nearly 120ft of scenic area track and 23 points over the last few weeks..it`s driving me slowly mad ! If you get a volcano just leave it to dry and then rewet it and move it a bit later....try not touch anything you ballast for 48hrs to make sure its fully dry then hoover,hoover,hoover and hoover some more !
I don't care how well I've done with diluted PVA before but I find scenic cement so much better I swear by it now (and it seems to go quite a long way) -BUT I find it still needs wetting lightly first. I use spectacle cleaner spray now, it's cheap and works brilliant. I've tried filling empty bottles with spaty water or dilute IPA and it never works the same so I stick to whatever they supply in new bottles now.
...nothing wrong with Kato track / ballast though if it's well done but that's going OT and everyone gets on OK with different things.
Cheers,
Rich
Sorry but I found WS scenic cement to be pretty awful and that was just sticking down scatters etc as per their Youtube video. In the end I had to go over it all again with a 50/50 water/PVA spray :thumbsdown:
I very much agree with newportnobby as I too find WS Scenic Cement pretty hard to use on ballast and for sticking fine turf and grass to landscapes. Life is very much easier if the surface is pre wet with a wetting agent. Yes, this step takes extra time, but is made up by not having to spend lots of time smoothing out craters and it looks better too.
Perhaps Scenic Cement works OK on larger scenic or ballast particles or maybe it works better in the Northern Hemisphere.
Webbo
Scenic cement still needs a wetting but only very slight compared to what I tried before.
Did anyone ever use cascamite (rewind back 25 years+) -I used to find cascamite powder very easy to use on OO mixed with ballast -alas these days cant seem to get it anywhere.
This thread is very interesting in that we have different experiences of using the same product...I have used scenic cement both with and without a light pre-wetting and the result was the same....maybe its how much is being applied and the interaction with different products...my ballast is the fine cheltenham model centre real grey granite...I am finding that all my ballast is very firmly sticking with scenic cement (well shaken not stirred !)...I am applying it generously and the tracks are saturated taking 48 hours to fully dry before I clean each section up...so far I have not had to restick any sections at all...I have had to fill odd gaps where I had no ballast to begin with but to date my experience of ballasting has been very good albeit mind numbing...still got about 20% of my scenic areas to do but currently running in a Blue BR Deltic which is much more fun...
When I ballast with the PVA/water/Fairy mix I use a syringe to put one drop of mix at a time onto the ballast from about 1/4 inch. It doesn't affect the lay of the ballast doing this if you are careful.
I use a left over syringe from an ink cartridge refill kit or you can buy them from a chemist. A little explanation to the chemist might help so he doesn't think you're getting into something illegal. :)
As others have said I use a brush to get between the rails, but it does need some help in settling, ballast should "lock" together when tamped down to form a fairly solid bed, in order to achieve this in the model world I tap the rails lightly with the brush handle, this takes time but really does settle the ballst.
In the past I have used PVA in a 50/50 mix with a dash or washing up liquid, I pray this onto the ballast from a couple of feet, pre-wetting does help it to flow quicker.
On my 00 layout it could take me about 1/2 hour to do a metre and get the ballast right, forming the cess etc, use a steel rule to get neat edges and stop the sprayer from disturbing the edges to much.
Quote from: Graham Walters on May 19, 2015, 10:20:19 PM
I pray this onto the ballast from a couple of feet
That's an unusual application method. Does it work? ;)
I suspect that the speed of ballast application is mostly determined by the size of the ballast grain. I have found that without pre wetting, my ballast goes all over the place when droplets of glue are applied. Even brushing the ballast between the sleepers is not a simple operation. I estimate that the major time required is getting the ballast into place before any wetting agent or glue is applied. My ballasting rate is no better than 0.5 m of ballast per 1.5-2 hours.
Webbo
I use a hypodermic syringe from a printer ink cartridge refilling kit to drop at a time of my wetted 50/50 mix between each sleeper individually and vary rarely get any movement of the ballast. ;)
Hypodermic needles and syringes are fairly cheap to buy through EBay. Before I knew what I really needed, I bought some 1 ml and 3 ml syringes as well as #18 (0.8 mm I.D.) and #22 (0.4 mm I.D.) needles. The combination of the 3 ml syringe with a #18 needle works for me for wetting agent and glue application. I'll keep the 1 ml syringes and the #22 needles for loco lubrication purposes.
Provided they are well flushed with water after each session the needles and syringes can be used over and over. After a while, the plunger becomes a bit stiff in the syringe, so I pull the plunger out and lubricate the seal with some silicon grease, then we are back in business. Having a smoothly sliding plunger minimises the likelihood of sudden squirts of liquid coming out of the needle.
Webbo