which item of railway / trackside / track infrastructure is most often forgotten about / not modelled when it perhaps should be?
the item has to be something big enough that it is noticeable in n gauge!
any thoughts???
Interesting topic :hmmm:
I've seen many a layout on the exhibition circuit that has little or no fencing and telegraph poles. I'm not suggesting for one moment anyone should actually string telegraph wires (although big admiration to those who have) but please, at least have the poles.
Trap points.
Quote from: bluedepot on August 02, 2014, 09:35:40 PM
the item has to be something big enough that it is noticeable in n gauge!
Another item very much not modelled are electricity pylons which are certainly big enough to be noticeable in N gauge. I will admit they must be a nightmare for exhibitors in transporting layouts and I'd be clumsy enough to keep breaking them whilst reaching for something on my layout if I fitted them :doh:
I think utilities in general. I know I have poles, but I need propane tanks, electrical boxes, etc...
I'll agree Pylons are not often seen on models, however I suspect most people hate the sight of the things striding across the country side and hence try to avoid them on the layout.
But for something not modelled, I think the "next step down" from Pylons, the rural overhead power lines on poles like phone poles but much heavier wire some with just one cross piece and some twin poles with a transformer hung between.
Signal and point wires/rodding, as well as other associated wiring - for track circuits etc. Almost always missing on layouts (including my own, I'm afraid!); but makes a huge difference when added...
I'll try and keep a list...
It can be used as a check list of items to at least consider!
fences
pylons
telegraph posts (and wires)
point and signal rodding / wiring
relay cabinets
trap points (only where needed obviously)
seems like there is a lot more infrastructure clutter nowadays. I made this thread looking out the window of a 170 dmu and taking note of it all.
I suppose you don't want too much infrastructure clutter making it look too crowded so has to be some balance.
on a personal note I have added signals, dummy point motors, cable trough covers, relay cabinets, point levers, yard lights, speed signs, stop boards but not pylons or telephone poles or fences yet. probably need a few more cabinets and signs. modern railways have tpws, gsmr etc equipment as well of course.
tim
Quote from: Dorsetmike on August 02, 2014, 10:20:51 PM
with a transformer hung between.
aka. "Pig on a pole" or distribution transformer.
It has been a long time, so willingly stand to be corrected, I think from typically 11kv down to 415v delta (approx 240v star) for local distribution in the UK.
Hence loadsa poles, with crossbars on top and 3 (phase)wires, crossing fields all over the place.
It's an interesting question, and thanks for posing it. You do realise I trust, that, as the membership is an international one, you will get answers reflecting that fact?
Are you asking specifically about items that are not modelled on layouts located and set ONLY within the UK, or is the question wide-open to include all us 'f'rnners?
Thanks.
I was thinking of the UK but people can tell us what infrastructure modellers of other countries often forget to include too.
Tim
TV aerials, ok for youse modern folks where its all digital ans you can just glue a small circle to represent the Sat dis have done though?
I have so far made 1 old style aerial for my 100 odd houses out of plastic toothbush bristles (NEW ONES) but my sanity couldn't handle doing any more...for now.
How about:
Catch pit covers,
AWS ramps,
Line speed boards,
'No trespassing' signs
Bridge plates,
Tunnel names,
Would love to add signal wires and point rodding, but it might be too fiddly in N...
Chris
If it's U.K. and a) a rural scene - shouldn't the fields all be "part-flooded", and b) if it's urban with people and Summer - they should all be holding umbrellas. :D
Nope! My layout is a sunny mid July day sometime in the 1950's
;-)
Chris
I think 'season' in general is forgotten lots of times, autumn and spring colors/flowers etc. mixed, the same for the clothing of our little N-folks.
Bart
Excellent thread, particularly as this sort of detail is exactly what I'm striving for and enjoy replicating :thumbsup:
Quote from: bluedepot on August 03, 2014, 12:15:47 AM
point and signal wiring
relay cabinets
Yep.
Quote from: Jerry Howlett on August 03, 2014, 07:59:14 AM
TV aerials, ok for youse modern folks where its all digital and you can just glue a small circle to represent the Sat dish have done though?
Done both. TV aerials made from single strands of 7/0.2 wire, satellite dish made from tablet packaging and microstrip.
Quote from: Wingman mothergoose on August 03, 2014, 08:32:24 AM
Catch pit covers,
AWS ramps
Got AWS ramps. What's a catch pit cover? ???
Quote from: Tdm on August 03, 2014, 09:23:09 AM
if it's urban with people and Summer - they should all be holding umbrellas.
Mine will be as I'm modelling wet weather, you have to make the umbrellas though as I've not found any in N gauge. Fiddly job ;)
Check rails on sharp curves? Before I did mine I'd never seen them modelled anywhere else?
(http://www.sprintexnet.co.uk/Images/res%20130224%20Check%20Rail%20156.PNG)
EDIT: Just thought of another one - details on vehicles such as numberplates, wipers, mirrors, even lights if they don't come ready-painted? See plenty of layouts with monotone plastic vehicles just plonked on ;)
Paul
Agree speed restriction signs are not often seen, and for layouts old enough to carry them how about 'WHISTLE' signs?
Does anyone know of ready to plonk signs as above please?
Yeah... Hornby Dublo mate an excellent one circa 1963.... maybe it could be reproduced with 3D printing.... or maybe just photographed, reduced and stuck on the layout.
Nooo..... :uneasy: ;D
How about a station notice board with "SERVICE CANCELLED"....wrong type of snow on line :D
Land Rovers and trucks with flanged wheel attachments, maybe you can get
them ready made , but I don't recall seeing any.
Quote from: Agrippa on August 03, 2014, 12:34:35 PM
Land Rovers and trucks with flanged wheel attachments....................
and what may they be.........
Track that uses crossovers between two tracks but without long timbers or through bearers going across both tracks in the area between the 2 crossings.
Dodger
Quote from: NTrain on August 03, 2014, 01:02:26 PM
and what may they be.........
What it says on the tin!
They have these so they can drive along rail lines.
one of these
SD40E and Track inspection vehicle. BEST HORN EVER (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jwq2LueUPiY#)
cheers Tony
I didn't know they used them in the US as well,cheers .
Quote from: NTrain on August 03, 2014, 01:02:26 PM
Quote from: Agrippa on August 03, 2014, 12:34:35 PM
Land Rovers and trucks with flanged wheel attachments....................
and what may they be.........
Starting at 30 seconds:
Road Railers Aka Land Rover Road-Rail Vehicle (1961) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eA9XLGrxDM#)
Roger
A working N gauge version would be pretty neat!
Ah, a road-rail vehicle, why didn't he just say so? ;)
Paul
Clarkson did the same sort of thing with a Jag :D
Was that the Top Gear chappie? Did he run it on a track? Seems a bit bit James Mayish.
However everyone should have a hobby. 1'm just off to put a Bristol Olympus in a Tiger Moth........
Hang on to your hats ..................................
Deffo Clarkson, XJS convertible with train wheels bolted to the hubs and towing a trailer. POWEEEERRR :D
Paul
B H enterprises do etched speed restriction signes but check with them first as posted else ware on the forum Ray has had a lot of problems lately both at home and restocking from other suppliers he will be at the Loughborough show and of course at TINGS in September , Email him for details ,but be aware you won't get an instant response.
Bob
Something which always causes me to fret - lack of movement anywhere else but on the rails. What buses, cars and lorries stand still all day? We need more than just Faller Raod systems, but that would be a good start.
Similar working road-rail vehicles are available in N from Marks in Germany, but they are not cheap!
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Marks-4321-Vomag-Schienen-LKW-Deutsche-Reichsbahn-Spur-N-NEU-in-OVP-/151362668240?pt=DE_Modellbau_Modelleisenbahnen&hash=item233deb06d0 (http://www.ebay.de/itm/Marks-4321-Vomag-Schienen-LKW-Deutsche-Reichsbahn-Spur-N-NEU-in-OVP-/151362668240?pt=DE_Modellbau_Modelleisenbahnen&hash=item233deb06d0)
Rather cheaper is the bus from Hobbytrain:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Hobbytrain-N-2653-Strasen-Schienenbus-BS300-motorisiert-der-DEBG-Ro1377-/360770767278?pt=DE_Modellbau_Modelleisenbahnen&hash=item53ff9d09ae (http://www.ebay.de/itm/Hobbytrain-N-2653-Strasen-Schienenbus-BS300-motorisiert-der-DEBG-Ro1377-/360770767278?pt=DE_Modellbau_Modelleisenbahnen&hash=item53ff9d09ae)
Mike
Other items (sorry if I missed them in one of the other posts):
A loading gauge (Vollmer 7542 e.g.)
Free gauge markers near turnouts (white sleepers in NL (http://www.lemland.nl/Lemland.nsf/dx/schakelkasten-vrijbalken.htm), red/white poles in D)
Bart
Oil spillage between the tracks, especially on places where locomotives often halt. And, talking about dirt on the tracks: very very small amounts of white calcium near uphill tracks (more exhaust) and very very small amounts of brown brake dust near downhill tracks.
Bart
Quote from: Lemland on August 04, 2014, 11:26:43 AM
Oil spillage between the tracks, especially on places where locomotives often halt. And, talking about dirt on the tracks: very very small amounts of white calcium near uphill tracks (more exhaust) and very very small amounts of brown brake dust near downhill tracks.
Bart
Or on SR 3rd rail layouys black lines just inside the rails. Caused by the grease leaking from the traction motor gearcases.
dodger
Quote from: Sprintex on August 03, 2014, 10:29:30 AM
Quote from: Wingman mothergoose on August 03, 2014, 08:32:24 AM
Catch pit covers,
AWS ramps
Got AWS ramps. What's a catch pit cover? ???
Paul
On the modern railway it's a grille that goes on top of the railway drain catch pits to stop track workers falling down them! In the old days it would have been a couple of sleepers or other stout lengths of timber. The catch pits are usually regularly spaced and can be either side of the line or even in the 6 foot, depending on the location.
Chris
Bridge numbers. Every railway bridge is numbered to identify it, either with a cast plate or a number painted on somewhere.
Point levers in goods yards.
Quote from: belstone on August 04, 2014, 05:41:19 PM
Bridge numbers. Every railway bridge is numbered to identify it, either with a cast plate or a number painted on somewhere.
Point levers in goods yards.
It is not only bridges that are numbered, mostly everything that appears along the track has a number on it for maintenance purposes ;)
cheers John.
Quote from: scotsoft on August 04, 2014, 05:48:00 PM
Quote from: belstone on August 04, 2014, 05:41:19 PM
Bridge numbers. Every railway bridge is numbered to identify it, either with a cast plate or a number painted on somewhere.
Point levers in goods yards.
It is not only bridges that are numbered, mostly everything that appears along the track has a number on it for maintenance purposes ;)
cheers John.
Yes, but numbered differently to structures. Things like location cabinets, OLE masts, lamp posts, signal posts etc have a numbering system, usually from a datum at one end of the line, London in the case of most main lines, and whichever is the more important junction/terminus/wherever in the case of branches and secondary lines. Tunnels are numbered as structures, even though they all have names also. Viaducts are just a structure number, although over the years they have gained unofficial names too, a tunnel will have the name, length(in yards for old skool, and yards and metres for modern) and usually the structure number on a board mounted on the wing wall or on a post/posts next to the track.
Another thing you don't see that often on layouts is lineside huts, they were once common when a section of track was maintained by a dedicated track gang, nowadays they're mostly covered in undergrowth and forgotten about...
Chris
Hi All
Not strictly infrastructure but I notice on a lot of buildings there are no lintels above windows so brickwork / stonework held up by fresh air
This is even on the best layouts
I am as guilty as others as some of my earlier scratch build buildings have them missing!
:hmmm:
Private level crossings used by farmers etc.
Buddleia.
I've never taken a train and not seen some buddleia growing somewhere.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-28196221 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-28196221)
can you buy bridge number signs suitable for the 80s and 90s anywhere?
"Bridge numbers. Every railway bridge is numbered to identify it, either with a cast plate or a number painted on somewhere."
anyone got any ideas on making buddleia??? does this flower in the summer? (not infrastructure but i'll allow it as a suggestion!)
many other good suggestions! a useful thread to reference when people are thinking about adding details to their layout...
tim
Very useful thread... How about taking the compiled list and having people add photos (model or prototype) of the item, and info on eras and locations that apply?
Example, concrete cable trunking or AWS ramps... When did it appear? And does it look different on different regions?
We could even include info on where you bought the bits to make it...
Quote from: bluedepot on August 05, 2014, 09:02:47 PM
anyone got any ideas on making buddleia??? does this flower in the summer? (not infrastructure but i'll allow it as a suggestion!)
I have some ideas; but I ain;t putting my head above the parapet until I've tried it.
Note to self: Do some Modelling Mitch!
Quote from: Mustermark on August 06, 2014, 12:29:38 PM
. . . . AWS ramps... When did it appear? And does it look different on different regions?
Originally called ATC one of the earliest was in 1905 on the Fairford branch that is part of my Claywell railway and until is closed, the 22mile Fairford Branch was devoid of any distant signals.
"The system was called ATC, Automatic Train Control. It was developed in the company's Reading Signal Works as a combined effort of signal engineers and craftsmen starting in 1905, and was tested on the double-track Henley branch, where 6 ramps were installed. Later the same year, it was tried on the 22 mile, single-track Fairford branch, where the distant signals were removed. The later decision was taken to retain them in future installations, possibly because drivers were uneasy at their absence, but also to permit non-equipped engines to work trains on equipped lines. The GWR was a true pioneer; nothing like its system existed elsewhere, and it was adopted as standard, not as a mere experiment. "
Quote from: Rabbitaway on August 04, 2014, 07:35:52 PM
on a lot of buildings there are no lintels above windows so brickwork / stonework held up by fresh air
:hmmm:
... but I can cite my 120-year old house as an occasionally worrying real world example of having windows without lintels (and fireplaces without too, if you're mad enough to model interiors to this level of accuracy in N gauge)!
Quote from: bluedepot on August 05, 2014, 09:02:47 PM
anyone got any ideas on making buddleia??? does this flower in the summer? (not infrastructure but i'll allow it as a suggestion!)
I bought some OO budleia which with a bit of tweaking is fine for N (especially railway sized ones)
A steaming heap on the sleepers, with wind blown paper, because someone pulled the chain whilst in the station.
Train spotters.
I was going to suggest that, but decided to wait in case someone with a sense of humour like mine
thought of it.... :D
Just a thought, but everywhere there are notices about dog fouling and the penalties
for such , but rail tracks can be absolutely manky. I suppose it's like s kind of weathering.
:offtopicsign: BUT I Remember a Track gang bloke in the 70's showing off a particulary unusual bruise that he obtained from a passing fast train....
Ouch and ughhhhh!!!!
Quote from: Mustermark on August 06, 2014, 12:29:38 PM
Very useful thread... How about taking the compiled list and having people add photos (model or prototype) of the item, and info on eras and locations that apply?
Example, concrete cable trunking or AWS ramps... When did it appear? And does it look different on different regions?
We could even include info on where you bought the bits to make it...
As a novice, I would find this invaluable.
PS Thanks EP
Quote from: Kipper on August 06, 2014, 03:20:02 PM
A steaming heap on the sleepers, with wind blown paper, because someone pulled the chain whilst in the station.
Train spotters.
Bangers and mash ;-) lololol
Quote from: Agrippa on August 03, 2014, 12:34:35 PM
Land Rovers and trucks with flanged wheel attachments, maybe you can get
them ready made , but I don't recall seeing any.
Oxford diecast do a superb Landrover Defender that could be adaptable, if not, it still looks good.
Steven
:NGF:
Quote from: Agrippa on August 06, 2014, 04:07:26 PM
Just a thought, but everywhere there are notices about dog fouling and the penalties
for such , but rail tracks can be absolutely manky. I suppose it's like s kind of weathering.
I do have some bird poo on one of our layouts, though. Just a few tiny white lines.
(http://www.lemland.nl/Lemland.nsf/dx/vogelpoep.htm/content/M6?OpenElement)
:D
Bart
For the modern image guys, what about axle counter boxes? Or hot axle box detectors?
Flange greasers anybody? ;-)
Chris
On the subject of poo, it's not a common sight out in the middle of nowhere, but in stations the tracks can be positively rank! Despite there being signs in train toilets, people still flush in stations on the older stock...
Quote from: Wingman mothergoose on August 27, 2014, 05:23:34 PM
Flange greasers anybody? ;-)
:goggleeyes:
Family forum remember? ;)
Paul
Quote from: Caz on August 06, 2014, 01:11:32 PM
Quote from: Mustermark on August 06, 2014, 12:29:38 PM
. . . . AWS ramps... When did it appear? And does it look different on different regions?
Originally called ATC one of the earliest was in 1905 on the Fairford branch that is part of my Claywell railway and until is closed, the 22mile Fairford Branch was devoid of any distant signals.
However the ATC system was different from the AWS system we use today and the ramps looked very different. It actually was a ramp, which lifted a shoe on the bottom of the train, whereas AWS relies on magnets rather than physical contact.
AWS started appearing in the early 50s and is now universal. ATC would only have been fitted on GWR routes and was gradually superseded by AWS, with the last ones going sometime around the mid-70s.
For us olduns how about a wheel tapper?
Neatly forgot ---water troughs both on track and in street
Must admit I'd not thought of water troughs. Now that would be a neat piece of detailing :hmmm:
Quote from: steve836 on August 28, 2014, 07:04:57 PM
For us olduns how about a wheel tapper?
and a shunter.
and a club for them,
run by a committee :D :smiley-laughing:
Quote from: class37025 on August 28, 2014, 09:22:43 PM
Quote from: steve836 on August 28, 2014, 07:04:57 PM
For us olduns how about a wheel tapper?
and a shunter.
and a club for them,
run by a committee :D :smiley-laughing:
And there was me thinking I was old for referring to Green Shield Stamps in another thread :hmmm:
Quote from: newportnobby on August 28, 2014, 09:13:30 PM
Must admit I'd not thought of water troughs. Now that would be a neat piece of detailing :hmmm:
Especially if they worked
I think Peco sell them (non working).
I added id plates to my two signals today. the signs were pre cut but so tiny it was a challenge to stick them on the signal posts and get them square. I added a phone to one of the posts as well.
I have also re-done the limited clearance signs on my bridges so they line up a bit better.
I added detailing to two of my 37s at one end but had to remove some bits as they were hitting the coupling socket on curves! multiple working cables can stay on though.
Tim
If you're modelling the modern GW lines, then ATP circuits are needed, and the loops with then. They look like extension leads laid along the centre of the rack, with the return part attached to the inside of the running rail.
Also the TPWS grids for overspeed and stop grids. In bay platforms you have overspeed grids 55yds before the blocks, and must be under 10mph over them.
On the subject of toilet flushing, at Paddington the platform lines are covered with a membrane to collect the flushings, and every so often a company come along at night to replace them. When we run HSTs into Waterloo during blockades, NR lay the same membranes there on 1 or 2 platforms and the HSTs must go in those.
Cheers, Timmo