This is something I like too see.
Where its nice to see a full rake of coaches in the correct matching livery.
Do any of you run mixed rakes?
I kinda missed out on dapols mk3 batch of virgin hst coaches. So im toying with getting a virgin hst set and using my intercity swollow hst coaches.
Whats your thoughts on this
I don't run them very often because I don't have space for long rakes of coaches but it is good to see mixed formations. My preferred era is the 1960s so I'll run a couple of 'blood & custard' coaches in a maroon rake for the very early '60s. For the late '60s I'll run a combination of maroon and blue/grey coaches.
Whilst it's very prototypical and it looks good on some layouts I'd never do it myself, my OCD would be screaming inside my head "It's WRONG WRONG WRONG !!" ;)
Paul
I have a DVD featuring the electrified line from Sheffield to Manchester (before it was closed) and one rake consisted of maroon, blue/grey and green MK1's :goggleeyes:
Quote from: Sprintex on September 25, 2013, 09:17:04 AM
Whilst it's very prototypical and it looks good on some layouts I'd never do it myself, my OCD would be screaming inside my head "It's WRONG WRONG WRONG !!" ;)
Paul
You and me both, Paul :D Although I think I could just about manage it if I was recreating a specific service at a specific moment in time, such as a couple of LMS coaches tagged onto a rake of SR coaches on the 1930s S&D.
The Midland Mainline Project Rio HSTs in 2003-2004 wore various combinations of original MML teal/orange, their later ocean blue/grey and de-branded Virgin red/grey liveries.
Occasionally they even had the odd yellow Network Rail liveried power car in their formations.
I also remember seeing the Poole-Edinburgh sleeper trains in 1989/90 stabled at Poole which had a mixture of ScotRail Executive (light blue band rather than red), InterCity Executive, InterCity swallow and blue/grey liveries.
Ideal solutions if anyone finds they can't get hold of complete rakes of rolling stock in one livery.
QuoteWhilst it's very prototypical and it looks good on some layouts I'd never do it myself, my OCD would be screaming inside my head "It's WRONG WRONG WRONG !!
Paul, I fear you may not like my (VERY) long way off next layout. My chosen modelling period being 1994-2000(ish), mixed livery HSTs really should feature.
Swallow set, GW Griffin Livery set and a mixture of the two :thumbsup:
I kept my old Poole era Griffen HST set for just such an occasion, because what are the odds on Dapol ever doing a book set in Griffin? Let alone the whole rake of matching coaches :confused1:?!
Mixing sets maybe more a case of necessity than choice :hmmm:
Skyline2uk
Quote from: Skyline2uk on September 25, 2013, 10:50:10 PM
my (VERY) long way off next layout.
Ooh, I have one of those already planned too! :laugh:
Hmm, HSTs :heart2: and mixed coaches :telloff: , how is my brain meant to cope with that paradox? :confused1:
Paul
Here's one for you Paul....
http://www.hondawanderer.com/43170_Coates_1987.jpg (http://www.hondawanderer.com/43170_Coates_1987.jpg)
Nurse! Paul needs his paradox pills. :laugh: :laugh:
And for those who worry about running mixed rakes or full length HST's
http://www.hondawanderer.com/43163_43040_Compton_Beauchamp.jpg (http://www.hondawanderer.com/43163_43040_Compton_Beauchamp.jpg) :D
Hi,
Some blue/grey and maroon Mk.1s behind steam but it's not the photos I was looking for - http://www.davidheyscollection.com/page44.htm (http://www.davidheyscollection.com/page44.htm) . I've also seen a photo of either a Fairburn or Stanier 2-6-4T with blue/grey Mark IIs but so far, can't locate it. This site has all sorts of coaching stock livery combinations which may be of interest.
Best Regards,
Andy Hoskins
Falkirk
An interesting combination which I want to model (having just bought a rake of old Grafar blue & grey Mk 1s) is the one described here: "I have some late 1965 pics of the Brighton - Plymouth train in which the rake was invariably a green Bulleid BSK and 4 or 5 Mark 1 coaches all in blue and grey." Trevor Page. I will be ordering some Bulleid SR green coaches for my North Cornwall layout so should have a Bulleid BSK to add to the Mark 1s! (A very interesting train to model the Brighton - Plymouth in the 1960s.)
In real life I liked to see matching coach liveries and the correct locomotive. I regarded it as offensive when the coaches were different and the locomotive wrong; as well as dmu's with different colours and or formations. On the other hand wagons of different shapes, sizes, colours etc. were so common as to be ignored.
At the time, I was not aware of the difficulties that nationalisation, lack of cash, and perhaps more importunately lack of cohesive policy was having upon the operating departments of British Railways and their successor British Rail.
For my railway (1976 - remember that summer ?) the locomotives are TOPS numbered blue / yellow and the mainline coaches are blue / grey. Some dmu's are blue and others are blue / grey to add some variety. It's wrong but it is my improvement on real life. So there !
Quote from: BobB on September 27, 2013, 08:16:09 PM
In real life I liked to see matching coach liveries and the correct locomotive. I regarded it as offensive when the coaches were different and the locomotive wrong; as well as dmu's with different colours and or formations. On the other hand wagons of different shapes, sizes, colours etc. were so common as to be ignored.
At the time, I was not aware of the difficulties that nationalisation, lack of cash, and perhaps more importunately lack of cohesive policy was having upon the operating departments of British Railways and their successor British Rail.
For my railway (1976 - remember that summer ?) the locomotives are TOPS numbered blue / yellow and the mainline coaches are blue / grey. Some dmu's are blue and others are blue / grey to add some variety. It's wrong but it is my improvement on real life. So there !
It's the complete opposite philosophy for me. ;) I model 1964-1976 so that I can mix and match as much as possible. On the Western Region this period covers from the end of steam to the first HST. Most of my Mk1 coach rakes are a mix of blue/grey and maroon, with a couple of chocolate/ cream and green ones for good measure.
Diesels are a mix of green, maroon and BR Blue, with one even in Desert Sand (no prizes for guessing what that one is!). Even in 1976 it is amazing to see how many diesels were still wearing green:
http://www.railblue.com/rail_blue_history_2.htm (http://www.railblue.com/rail_blue_history_2.htm)
Yep I remember 1976. My last big layout was set in 1976 so I could run HST and Westerns together :beers: plus sneak in a green 47.
I'm not sure when all blue DMUs finally went away if ever. Certainly I remember Tysley sets being plain blue at that time. They used to turn them out as proper sets back then too. It all went downhill later on as they got the dregs of everyone elses DMU stock including 105s and other weirdness.
And it was back in the days when Birmingham - Paddington trains ran through Solihull where I grew up so you'd get the odd Western on a mix of Mark1 and 2 stock if you were very lucky.
I am modelling Bournemouth in the era mid-50s to early 60s and looking through some of the colour reference books I have, it wasn't uncommon to have a mix of BR(SR) Green and Blood& Custards together in a rake, although the greens were more commonly old Bullied stock which hadn't received B&C mixed in with BR Mk1s in B&C.
Regards
Timothy
There truly is a prototype for everything!
"NOT A LOT OF GREEN IN THIS TRAIN!
This is an item from the SRC&W Society Notes from July 1965:-
'the most remarkable train seen on the SR for some time was in use on the 12:00 Waterloo to Exeter in July: BSK E26595M
SK W792W
SK W3911M
SKs M27263M
NE1573E
NE25445
SC24293
CK W15104
SK W784W
BSK M34085.'
By the way the motive power was not recorded.
Glen Woods
Brighton
W792W was a gangwayed third to diagram C.82 lot 1691 completed 12 Jun 1948, or so sez this book on the coaches of the GWR what I just happened to come across.
Also according to this tome, by one M Harris, Esq., it sez that 3911 was a Main Line and City non-corridor third (diagram C.37, lot 1274, completed June 1921) which somewhat contradicts what you have said above. Maybe something got renumbered in the meantime.
John Sullivan
I can't answer for the ex-LNER vehicle, but I reckon the ancestry of the rest was as follows....
BTK E26595M LMS Derby-built 'Period III' 57' Corridor Brake Third, Lot 1448, Diagram 2123, #26546-#26665, built 1948-9.
SK W792W GWR Swindon-built 'Hawksworth' 64' Corridor Third, Lot 1691, Diagram C.82,# 781-#832, last of Lot delivered by June 1948.
SK W3911M LMS Wolverton-built 'Period III' 60' Corridor Composite (presumably later downgraded to all-Third), Lot 729, Diagram 1898, #3899-#3933, built 1934.
TO M27263M LMS Wolverton-built 'Period III' 57' Open Third, Lot 1402, Diagram 1999, #27250-#27349, built 1947.
SK NE1573E LNER Pre-Nationalisation design (& build?)
SK NE25445 BR Mk. 1 Wolverton-built Corridor Third, Lot 30350, #M25403-#M25454.
SK Sc24293 BR Mk. 1 York-built Corridor Third, Lot 30026, #Sc24280-#Sc24299.
CK W15104 BR Mk. 1 Metro-Cammell -built Corridor Composite, Lot 30005, #W15100-#W15131.
SK W784W GWR Swindon-built 'Hawksworth' 64' Corridor Third, Lot 1691, Diagram C.82,# 781-#832, last of Lot delivered by June 1948. One of the very first
coaches to be experimentally interior panelled in 'Formica' (Duckegg Blue & Iron Grey) to offset post-war wood veneer shortages)
BSK M34085 BR Mk. 1 Derby-built Corridor Brake Third, Lot 30003, #M34011-#34094.
Mike South
Michael Harris book "LNER Coaches" shows 1573 to be a York built 1949 Vestibuled Third (or SK in post 1956 speak!), built to diagram 329, order 1220, with seven compartments seating 42.
Tony Walmsley"
Quote from: Jack9465 on September 26, 2013, 09:26:09 AM
Here's one for you Paul....
http://www.hondawanderer.com/43170_Coates_1987.jpg (http://www.hondawanderer.com/43170_Coates_1987.jpg)
Nurse! Paul needs his paradox pills. :laugh: :laugh:
And for those who worry about running mixed rakes or full length HST's
http://www.hondawanderer.com/43163_43040_Compton_Beauchamp.jpg (http://www.hondawanderer.com/43163_43040_Compton_Beauchamp.jpg) :D
Some great 43 action on that site thank you lots of b/g - exc swallow mixing going on.
I recall seeing a very mixed lot in early BR days
Maunsell 3 set in the short lived Plum and Spilt Milk at the front followed by a Maunsell 2 set in Maunsell olive and a Bulleid 3 set in blood & Custard
Quote from: Dorsetmike on September 28, 2013, 07:14:40 PM
I recall seeing a very mixed lot in early BR days
Maunsell 3 set in the short lived Plum and Spilt Milk at the front followed by a Maunsell 2 set in Maunsell olive and a Bulleid 3 set in blood & Custard
Yes, Mike, truly if one looks hard enough there is (almost) always a prototype for everything!
Whilst these are all in BR Blue and Grey livery it just shows how pre-Natationalisation carriages lasted a long time (from the excellent BRCoachingStock group):
"A couple more up today:
Ex-GCR 'Barnum' in BR days:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9980190715/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9980190715/#)
LMS-design SLF in blue/grey - note the all-capitals lettering:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9980261866/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9980261866/#)
Robert C
---In brcoachingstock@yahoogroups.com, <BRcoachingstock@aol.com> wrote:
A few more:
Track recording coach DW139:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9724326198/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9724326198/#)
Hawksworth full brake in later life:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9721096627/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9721096627/#)
Mark IId second - note it has 'SO' on the end not 'TSO':
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9721096661/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9721096661/#)
Robert C"
Pregroup stock lasted into the 60s and in departmental use much longer. It would have been common into the 60s in some locations.
There was then a concerted attempt to switch over to the BR built mark 1 and to DMU stock and only a few grouping and earlier passenger vehicles hung on - Hawksworth sleepers scraped blue as did a tiny number of staniers and a few Gresley buffets made the mid 70s.
Parcels stuff lasted longer.
Some pregroup types proved extremely well built - LSWR ironclad stock remained in departmental use a very long time for example.
If mixed rakes are your thing, run a railtour - you can guarantee pretty much every time the coaches will be different liveries.
(http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5531/9637377125_09ab166997_z_d.jpg)
(http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2811/9478772495_00f2cf6fcc_z_d.jpg)
(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7261/7866625084_e0bfb21fd1_z_d.jpg)
(http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2809/9838706425_a72183b733_z_d.jpg)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8123/8705260084_5335036df4_z_d.jpg)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8007/7326000692_705bb6eb00_z_d.jpg)
Thanks peeps.
I just something you never see either at shows. And looking at your replies its more common than I 1st thought.
Just waiting for Dapol to release another batch of Virgin HST mk3's.
Quote from: porkie on September 29, 2013, 04:24:26 PM
Thanks peeps.
I just something you never see either at shows. And looking at your replies its more common than I 1st thought.
Just waiting for Dapol to release another batch of Virgin HST mk3's.
Are there really any virgin HSTs after all these years, or are they just telling fibs? :P
Quote from: Pete33 on September 29, 2013, 04:41:51 PM
Quote from: porkie on September 29, 2013, 04:24:26 PM
Thanks peeps.
I just something you never see either at shows. And looking at your replies its more common than I 1st thought.
Just waiting for Dapol to release another batch of Virgin HST mk3's.
Are there really any virgin HSTs after all these years, or are they just telling fibs? :P
Hens teeth comes to mind lol