Graham Hughes J50

east anglian · December 16, 2019, 08:50:58 PM

Shapeways do a 3d print which may look very good in a display cabinate but will lack the weight and whould not pull the skin off a rice pud, even their tender locos need a weighty tender drive,

njee20 · December 16, 2019, 09:09:23 PM

Shapeways aren't a manufacturer. A printed body will always be lighter than a metal one, but that doesn't necessarily mean you can't make one perform well.

thebrighton · December 16, 2019, 09:21:24 PM

Quote from: east anglian on December 16, 2019, 08:50:58 PM
Shapeways do a 3d print which may look very good in a display cabinate but will lack the weight and whould not pull the skin off a rice pud, even their tender locos need a weighty tender drive,

I've a few 3D printed tank engines and there's always plenty of space to add weight. Easiest option is a thin sheet of lead on the inside of the tank sides, the smokebox is hollow so more room as is the bunker. They're no different to a RTR tank with a plastic body. They too have weight added.

east anglian · December 16, 2019, 10:37:32 PM

No disrespect to Shapeways as they do produce some excellent 3D prints and I have made a few for friends but this is what I found that was the weak spot and yes in some cases weights could be added to improve traction,

njee20 · December 16, 2019, 11:32:34 PM

Again, Shapeways are not a manufacturer, they just print other people's designs. In the same way eBay is not a shop.

A metal body will obviously weigh more than a plastic one, but adding weight is rarely impossible, and I'd say it's a bit disingenuous to suggest they'd only be good for sitting in a display cabinet.

east anglian · December 17, 2019, 12:16:53 PM

There have been many comments about the tractive effort between 3 D printing and white metal kits and adding weights to improve traction, can any 3D Tank locomotive come close to my J50 on my test track, as the 1st photo shows it hauled a 300gm weight 4ft on a level track, unfortunately it slipped when it was raised to 4 inches but it did haul a 150 gram tin of sardines up the full 4 inches, I did at first try this on my layout but unfortunately it got stuck in a tunnel and it took me over 1 hour to free the load and locomotive.

east anglian · December 17, 2019, 12:18:39 PM

2nd photo

thebrighton · December 17, 2019, 01:02:03 PM

But why would I ever want one of my tank locos to pull a can of beans? Mine pull prototypical length trains and that's good enough for me and I'd guess a lot of people will have shorter trains due to space constraints.
Sure, a lump of metal will always give more tractive effort (if the weight is in the right place) but to simply dismiss all 3D printed locos as display items is way off the mark. There are numerous RTR locos with plastic bodies that weigh less than a 3D printed one and also without a fair but of work white metal kits tend to lack the detail/finesse of plastic.
If I do ever find myself in the position of having to transport baked beans and only have N gauge locos to perform the task I'll be sure to go for a metal bodied one

east anglian · December 17, 2019, 02:48:56 PM

Unfortunatly my test track is only 6ft long so the weight of the can of beans is about equal to 15 coaches, this was only done to prove a point that 3D printing lacks weight and if there is no room to add weight then your stuck with a display cabinate locomotive

njee20 · December 17, 2019, 04:20:42 PM

But that's not what you've proved. You've proved that your model can haul a tin of beans. That doesn't automatically mean that any 3D printed model is only for display. That's a ludicrous strawman.

If you have no room to add weight you have a large chassis, which is probably quite heavy. Ultimately 3D printed models are plastic. Virtually all mass produced models (not UM) are plastic. Are you saying the only locos you have are metal? Everything else is for display purposes only.

thebrighton · December 17, 2019, 04:29:01 PM

We'll have to agree to disagree then. I've numerous 3D printed locos and by their nature they are hollow so allow stacks of weight to be added. The can of beans doesn't prove any point as when would you need a J50 to pull 15 coaches and if for some reason you did the 3D J50 I posted a link to can have weight added to the inside of the tanks, the boiler and the bunker and depending what medium you use you could probably get it to weigh more than the white metal one.
Just wondering if you are basing your opinion on 3D printed locos to experience or hearsay?

east anglian · December 17, 2019, 05:32:55 PM

Not really I have 3D diesel locomotives and they are great both in looks and performance, Im old school and find it hard to accept 3D and DCC however we in the small world of N Gauge must accept the change for better or worse and support these small companies that offer alternative models that the big boys don't produce

njee20 · December 17, 2019, 05:40:26 PM

Small (indeed one man) 'companies' like Graham Hughes, who are producing the J50 you're waxing lyrical about...? Meanwhile the big companies, like Dapol and Farish are making locos out of plastic, which you're saying isn't good enough. Not sure I get your point.

Still, agree to disagree, I think it's amazing that we have the option of 3D printing to help deliver prototypes you're never going to see otherwise (or are only available in kits worth a small fortune due to their rarity!), and if you want to resign them to being good only for display purposes then more fool you.

Roy L S · December 17, 2019, 06:56:04 PM

I have two 3D printed locos, both by Stevie DC which he kindly made and finished for me. I would challenge anyone to be able to distinguish these from the best of RTR except by dint of the fact that neither loco is available as such.

One is a beautiful V3 Tank loco, this runs on a Farish N Class chassis and having replaced the traction-tyred wheelset with a plain one, without any extra weight at all, it manages 11 coaches. It isn't just about absolute weight, it is about distribution of the weight and the balance of the chassis.

In my opinion 3D printed models are a totally credible alternative to whitemetal, brass and other media. It's horses for courses as with all things.

Roy

thebrighton · December 17, 2019, 09:15:40 PM

Quote from: east anglian on December 17, 2019, 05:32:55 PM
Not really I have 3D diesel locomotives and they are great both in looks and performance, Im old school and find it hard to accept 3D and DCC however we in the small world of N Gauge must accept the change for better or worse and support these small companies that offer alternative models that the big boys don't produce

So if I'm reading you right you have decided all 3D printed locos are only fit for display solely based on you finding it hard to accept new technology despite happily using 3D prints for diesels which are fine. I'm baffled.