Bad N gauge models

[martyn]

I might have got the balance wrong, but my Ivatt mogul could barely pull its own weight from new, even after adjusting the pickups and bogie spring.
The tank, by comparison, once some of the weight had been taken off the bogies, easily took four coaches.
I agree the Lima locos were dire-even though I had 2x31 and a Deltic (which overheated and melted the body!).
Martyn

[railsquid]

I am quite fond of my Lima 86, leaving out the hopelessly inaccurate proportions (the chassis seems to be the same size as the 31) the body moulding detail is actually pretty good (we'll forget the pantograph) and it has a nice (for Lima) electric blue paint job. Runs OK (compared to other models with the same mechanism) though it needs a burst of speed over points sometimes. It will also happily haul trains more recent British outline locos struggle with.

[Byegad]

Lima Class 31. The wheels spin, it goes nowhere.

I had one! Useless pulling power but better than the minitrix Ivatt 2-6-0 tender I had at the same time.

[Chris Morris]

I only started in N during 2013. The current models all look very good and this is what attracted me to N. I consider pretty much all the older locos to be bad models as they just don't look the part at all. I would like a large prairie for my layout but the old GF model looks so bad I can't bring myself to buy one even at a bargain price. Same goes for virtually all earlier models - the GF Western,GF Castle, minitrix warship etc etc. I wouldn't use any of them on my layout even if I was given one. The one exception I have found so far is the GF GWR railcar which I think is a reasonably good model although the original chassis was useless on the one I had.

Does anyone know which was the first well detailed, correct scale, realistic loco to be produced?

[belstone]

I am quite fond of my Lima 86, leaving out the hopelessly inaccurate proportions (the chassis seems to be the same size as the 31) the body moulding detail is actually pretty good (we'll forget the pantograph) and it has a nice (for Lima) electric blue paint job. Runs OK (compared to other models with the same mechanism) though it needs a burst of speed over points sometimes. It will also happily haul trains more recent British outline locos struggle with.

The 86 was the first British N gauge model by Lima, and I always thought it looked a lot neater and closer to scale than the ones that followed.  I'd be intrigued to know how far off 1:148 the body dimensions are - it sits high on the bogies, but the body width and height don't look obviously wrong. 

Lima's next British model was the 2-6-4 tank loco about which the less said the better.  Even Railway Modeller struggled to say anything good about it, and that was back in the days when model reviewing was a gentlemanly affair with major faults ignored or glossed over.

[belstone]

Does anyone know which was the first well detailed, correct scale, realistic loco to be produced?

Peco / Rivarossi Jubilee, early 1970s.  Lacking in detail by modern standards, moulded handrails and simplified valve gear, but ran well and the dimensions were spot on.  The first and for a very long time the last really good British steam loco in N gauge. Such a shame they didn't follow it up with anything else, they were promising the Collett Goods in around 1975 IIRC.

[Dr Al]

promising the Collett Goods in around 1975 IIRC.

They did fulfil that promise....albeit it took them about 30 years! 

Cheers,
Alan

[railsquid]

I am quite fond of my Lima 86, leaving out the hopelessly inaccurate proportions (the chassis seems to be the same size as the 31) the body moulding detail is actually pretty good (we'll forget the pantograph) and it has a nice (for Lima) electric blue paint job. Runs OK (compared to other models with the same mechanism) though it needs a burst of speed over points sometimes. It will also happily haul trains more recent British outline locos struggle with.

The 86 was the first British N gauge model by Lima, and I always thought it looked a lot neater and closer to scale than the ones that followed.  I'd be intrigued to know how far off 1:148 the body dimensions are - it sits high on the bogies, but the body width and height don't look obviously wrong. 

Placed next to a Dapol model (which I assume are much closer to the proper propotions) it's clearly too short, but somewhat wider (IIRC I measured it and it's about 10% shorter and 5% wider than it should be).
I suspect the extra width is needed to accomodate the motor; as you say, by itself it doesn't look particularly wrong. I have acquired a couple with an eye to practicing repainting into BR blue before I let myself loose on Dapol versions, though I'll keep the nicest one as-is.

[belstone]

Placed next to a Dapol model (which I assume are much closer to the proper propotions) it's clearly too short, but somewhat wider (IIRC I measured it and it's about 10% shorter and 5% wider than it should be).
I suspect the extra width is needed to accomodate the motor; as you say, by itself it doesn't look particularly wrong. I have acquired a couple with an eye to practicing repainting into BR blue before I let myself loose on Dapol versions, though I'll keep the nicest one as-is.

Might be a good candidate for putting on an American diesel chassis if you can find one the right wheelbase. I seem to recall that right at the end of production Lima introduced a new mechanism with a centrally mounted can motor and also turned out a few 31s and 86s in Large Logo livery.  Too little, too late.  The CCT showed that Lima could produce really nice N gauge models if they tried.

[Dr Al]

For bad models I'm surprised nobody has brought up the original plastic chassied, Arnold motored Farish 94xx, Hall and Spam can. I've never seen one that ran well or didn't sound like a bag of spanners - and of course almost all seem to suffer with split gears, long before they became epidemic on the later diesels.

Cheers,
Alan

[Portpatrick]

My experience of Minitrix Ivatts was that while the tank could pull a respectable load, the Mogul was very iffy.  My first one was also an erratic runner - I sold it on!.  Later I bought 2 more, second hand, and replaced the tyres.  These ran fairly well but even with new tyres were indifferent pullers.  I converted on to the 78XXX BR Standard.  Eventually a plastic part of the valve gear snapped, on each one.  I removed the associated parts, but was very glad to eventually get my new Farish model (pre-ordered for £58!), and ditch the Minitrix.

I had a  Lima Clayton for a while, with a speed range from 60 ish to 100 ish.  But now have a Parkwood resin kit and am awaiting the DJM.  I also had a 4F briefly but apart from the Syphon and CCT, which looked good, gave up on Lima.  Their Achilles heal seemed to be that pancake motor.  Some worked fairly well, mine did not.

[belstone]

For bad models I'm surprised nobody has brought up the original plastic chassied, Arnold motored Farish 94xx, Hall and Spam can. I've never seen one that ran well or didn't sound like a bag of spanners - and of course almost all seem to suffer with split gears, long before they became epidemic on the later diesels.

Cheers,
Alan

Good call, my father had a Holden tank that somehow managed to beat the odds there.  It sounded as though it was powered by angry mice, but was the best slow-speed runner he had (thanks I suspect to those tiny driving wheels) and never ate any gears.  His scrapbox was overflowing with the remains of plastic-chassis Halls and Panniers. I would guess that Farish never had the sales volumes to be able to build German-standard mechanisms at an acceptable price, so they were always looking for ways to keep costs down.

[silly moo]

My Ivatt ran very roughly and noisily from brand new, I tested it on a layout at the show where I bought it from but I couldn't hear much because of the background noise.

I was very disappointed when I got it back to Africa and it ran so badly. Despite having been looked at by a loco repairer here it never improved. I think it was a Monday loco. At that stage I was on a very tight budget and only able to buy one loco a year.

All my other Minitrix locos run very well and I wouldn't part with them.

[Portpatrick]

THE Minitrix 27s I had (one for £6 in the 1980s) were superb runners, great pullers,  and sold for a good price when I upped to one of Carl Peplow's kits, and since then to Dapol.  I have found the 9F and Brit sure footed and smooth.  Still have one Brit - renamed and numbered as a Clan.

[msr]

It's nice to known that I'm not the only one to admitre the Minitrix Brit as a Clan!  Here's my 72009 "Clan Stewart":