Are we over the Golden Age of N Gauge?

[NeMo]

The bigger problem for the hobby I suspect is that the next generation of railway modellers are going to be building virtual models when they retire and the simulators world models are getting extremely high quality - even if not yet very editable.

I disagree. As some here know, my main hobby is keeping tropical fish. 20 to 15 years ago, there was a lot of buzz over virtual pets, starting with things like Tamagotchis, but eventually quite sophisticated virtual aquaria. You could buy new fish on CDs, you'd have to feed them, and could arrange the tank with virtual plants and rocks. It was all very swish.

But the thing is, the best part of keeping pet fish is sitting on a chair with a cup of tea while mindlessly watching the fish swim about. Sometimes the unexpected happens and you find eggs or baby fish, and that changes things some more into a new branch of the hobby with its own challenges and rewards.

The virtual pet "fad" died down because, I believe, a real hobby lets you toggle between mindless relaxation (e.g., watching trains go round an oval) versus intellectually engaging self-betterment (e.g., building a kit). Computers can't do both of these easily, because at the very least you have to turn the thing on, start the appropriate program, and then (if available) switch it to 'screensaver' or whatever mode and watch random stuff happen on a screen you can't control. It's not relaxing like watching fish or letting your Flying Scotsman do laps of your 6 x 4 oval!

Cheers, NeMo

[Bealman]

Thanks, Ben.

I admit to being quite dismayed when the bloke I met on the bus told me he'd gone over to sims rather than the real model railway.

However, there is another factor involved which has been hammered home to me this year... getting older or incapacitated for medical reasons.

I've been subject to both this year! Even though my brain is telling me I want to fix my layout or even start a new one, me body's saying "You're kiddin."

So to some extent I can understand the computer stuff. 

[crewearpley40]

Lots of good for and against arguments. Constructing a layout can be therapeutic . But have to be grateful for what models we own, we have seen, what layouts we have viewed. Heres to the future

[Bealman]

Thanks Neale, also, by the way. 

You got in just as I was typing on my phone!

I remember those Tamagotchis!! They were must haves for the two oldest Bealettes. Well, oldest Bealette is now mom Bealette, and I'm grandpa Bealman.

How the world goes round! 

[njee20]

Like others, I don't see virtual modelling as a genuine threat to the physical hobby. Some people may well move across for whatever reasons; financial, space, health, but it'll always run in parallel, it may even boost physical modelling.

I'm quite into 'gaming', and have always enjoyed Train Simulator in its various guises, but it's absolutely no substitute for real modelling (if you can call my mediocre efforts that!). Kids that are currently playing Fortnite or Minecraft etc overwhelmingly aren't going to come to railways in any guise, so that's pretty moot.

I still think we continue to enjoy the golden age, it's a fluid concept which I think Ben encapsulated very well, yes ok some prices have undeniably gone up, but with it so has the range and quality of models, and that can only be a good thing.

[crewearpley40]

quote :

I still think we continue to enjoy the golden age, it's point which I think Ben made  very well  - njee

agreed

[tcox94]

I think this is an interesting topic regarding virtual trains sets and being at the age of 25 I feel I give a younger generations view. I for one have used train simulations and although enjoyable they do not capture the imagination quite like an impressive hand made model railway nor the personal satisfaction of seeing your own models run through a station you have hand built.

I was first enticed by model railways when my grandparents took me to the SVR and there was a carriage at Bewdley station that contained an rather large and impressive n gauge layout.

I wish heritage railways like the size of the SVR still had this layout as it is a good way of encouraging people including children and parents with an interest in the British railways to take up the hobby that otherwise would not think too. A really well made layout can really capture the imagination. Model rail shows are great for people who are already invested in to the hobby, but a layout at a heritage line would attract a more diverse range of people into the hobby.

This is maybe a bit off topic but I think it is an interesting way Of ensuring we continue to enjoy the golden age of n gauge by encouraging more people to take up the hobby.

[Bealman]

Not off topic at all.

Great to hear a younger viewpoint.

And you're right... not everyone goes to a show, but an accidental exposure to model railways such as you experienced can't be a bad thing. 

[kirky]

But I don't see them as competition because IMO humans need physical as well as mental stimulus.  Computer games provide great visual and audio experiences, but modelling satisfies the sensory need for touch, and even smell, in addition.

Cheers

Ben A.

I think @Ben A  has a point here.
However, the sensory stimulation gained from modelling (or any enjoyable activity for that matter) goes way beyond the five senses. I have a bit of a background in sensory education. Since it is the senses that are responsible for the way we interact and understand the world, then it is the senses that we (teachers) concentrate on in early development. Much of this is done through parenting for neuro-typical children, but for those of us who work with young people who remain within the early stages of development, then sensory education is the way in.
So what has this got to do with modelling? Its important to understand there are way more than five senses, the obvious one missing from the list is balance. There are others. The relevance for modelling is that we interact with our activity and perceive it through our senses. This includes the way we feel about the activity. So when Ben says there is a sensory need for touch and smell etc, he is right, but it is way more complex than that. There are hundreds of thousands of sensory receptors in the body, possibly or even probably millions. I would therefore say the sensation of modelling is indeed complex.

Just my observations.

Cheers
Kirky

[crewearpley40]

My late grandfather started me young after i had a serious op and ive been hooked ever since. Being involved hn a preserved railway and its operation history plus modelling gives perspective i guess in history, maths, english. Design, technology, electrics, woodwork, plastic, metal, science , geography etc

[red_death]

The demands from "purists" who insist on more and more authenticity and detail have pushed prices up beyond an affordable level for the "average Joe". There may not be enough deep-pocketed collectors/modellers to sustain the industry unless manufacturers create a new line of railroad models appealing to those of us who don't need as much authenticity and detail.

We've done this to death in this topic and others and the "demands from purists" make very little difference to the end price. The reality is that the market has moved on from mis-shapen models and expects reasonable levels of detail. If you remove that detail or accuracy then people don't buy the models and the potential market would be much smaller.

The only ways you can feasibly create a railroad type line of more basic models is either have a much, much larger market (you'd probably have to multiply the current UK N Gauge market by 10 times) or use old, simple tooling (the fact that some tooling is reasonably old doesn't necessarily make it cheaper as it will depend on amortisation and the assembly/decoration costs).

Cheers Mike

[njee20]

Continuing the minor tangent about the younger generations, I watch with interest in my son's progression. I inherited my love of railways (large and small) from my dad, getting my first OO gauge layout for my 3rd birthday, which gradually grew, I drifted away in my teenage years before returning to the hobby in my mid-20s when I had my own house and some disposable income! Now 32 I have a 2 year old who is mad about trains, loves my N gauge, plus Brio, Duplo, and anything else he can turn into a train. I wonder if he'll follow a similar path, or whether the lure of other things will drag him away even younger.

The demands from "purists" who insist on more and more authenticity and detail have pushed prices up beyond an affordable level for the "average Joe". There may not be enough deep-pocketed collectors/modellers to sustain the industry unless manufacturers create a new line of railroad models appealing to those of us who don't need as much authenticity and detail.

I also don't buy into the idea that people are priced out, regardless of how much stuff costs (within reason). I certainly don't think the price rises in the last decade have made a significant difference to participation levels. I don't think model railways are a particularly expensive hobby. Yes ok you need to build a collection, and if you want to recreate King's Cross in each of 4 different time periods it'll be seriously expensive. But you can equally amass a modest collection and just keep it. There's negligible ongoing costs, stuff doesn't really wear out in any meaningful way, and unless you have to have the newest models all the time there's no reason to continually spend.

Ok for those people who have a set budget perhaps that doesn't go as far, but there are those who buy things they want and will just weather price rises.

[Jeff_W]

I'm not sure if I still fit in with the "younger crowd" age range (I'm 32), but as much as I enjoy playing train related games (almost 400 hours in Transport Fever already), there's nothing quite like the physical models to play around with. I've spent far more on model trains than I probably have on PC games, and I've played most that involve trains. Building something virtual is nice but you're only a hard drive failure away from losing everything, and I would argue that's more likely than having something happen to your actual models.

I am surprised that some of the model train companies haven't gotten involved in some way with the train simulator stuff. I know they can't license stuff with railroads' names on them (as railroads own those copyrights), but I figure they could at least sell structures or other items that are original to them.

[PLD]

I am surprised that some of the model train companies haven't gotten involved in some way with the train simulator stuff.

Hornby did...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hornby-Virtual-Railway-2-PC/dp/B0000A03N8

[Jeff_W]

I am surprised that some of the model train companies haven't gotten involved in some way with the train simulator stuff.

Hornby did...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hornby-Virtual-Railway-2-PC/dp/B0000A03N8

Interesting. I've never heard of the game (though I'm in the US). Now that I think about it, Lionel also had a game they produced in the late 90s, it was more along the lines of a puzzle game featuring their trains than an actual simulator.

I was thinking of companies producing a building for use in one of the popular train games (Train Simulator 20xx and the Trainz line of games), as there's already groups out there that produce stuff for those games (and charge $$$ for it).