Annual Wishlist Poll

[Newportnobby]

This is the area where their lack of N gauge knowledge was causing trouble - for every choice they were spending hours combing the web trying to find the right combinations.  For those of us familiar with any given era or region, that knowledge is probably already present.

That's the important bit to me, Ben. The expertise is already here on the forum so why spend hours in research? I'd like to think if someone is suggesting an item they have some knowledge of it. If it is as easy as collating all votes into a spreadsheet up to a closing date and then summarising the sheet then I'm perfectly happy to do it, but I do not have the time/knowledge to trawl t'interweb. I think it's being overcomplicated, sorry.

[Ben A]

The expertise is already here on the forum so why spend hours in research? I'd like to think if someone is suggesting an item they have some knowledge of it. If it is as easy as collating all votes into a spreadsheet up to a closing date and then summarising the sheet then I'm perfectly happy to do it, but I do not have the time/knowledge to trawl t'interweb. I think it's being overcomplicated, sorry.

Absolutely - that's their point too.  It was taking them lots of time to research stuff that poll team members could/should already know, and N gauge enthusiasts probably would know.

I don't know if it's being over-complicated or not; I think that Brian's methodology has been arrived at after several years of doing this, and lots of lessons learned.  I'd strongly suggest that anyone who wants to take this project on just speaks to him and has a skim read of his notes before coming to a final view.

Cheers

Ben A.

[njee20]

I've just offered my support on post privitisation matters, and I completed the OO gauge wishlist (which comprised a few things I selfishly would like because they may get scaled down or I'd buy just because), but my comment to Ben was why Brian et al don't just use the OO gauge list, removing the handful of items we already have (I don't know if it's different on earlier eras) and supplementing those we don't that are available in OO.

That is likely a gross over simplification though!

[emjaybee]

I don't have much in the way of in depth knowledge, but I'd have thought a good reference/starting point would be the last published wishlist results. I mean, you can stick 'The Twins' on for a start as they are usually top of the list.

I suspect a lot of the 'hard' work is actually in the collating of results as much as anything.

[Newportnobby]

my comment to Ben was why Brian et al don't just use the OO gauge list

Surely the 00 gauge wishlist cannot reflect an N gauge one inasmuch as there is so much already existing in 00 that doesn't in N? I really don't think it would be of huge help. Some, yes, but not a lot.

As said before, I have run 2 such lists for the forum but only for motive power in the 5 types I mentioned. Obviously coaches and wagons could be added to the list but I dare say folks know more about their wished for motive power than for rolling stock.

[njee20]

That rather misses the rest of my quote where I said you'd need to supplement the items that exist in OO and not in N.

Again as I said I only know post-privitisation though really where there aren't that many items in OO that aren't available in N, particularly if we're talking powered items. I know there are lots of esoteric steam locos and early diesels which probably make it a much harder task to collate.

[Newportnobby]

That rather misses the rest of my quote where I said you'd need to supplement the items that exist in OO and not in N.
I know there are lots of esoteric steam locos and early diesels which probably make it a much harder task to collate.

And that was the point I was trying to get over. I would venture roughly 50% of the locos you mention would appear on an N gauge wishlist and not on an 00 list as they already exist in that gauge. I know half of naff all about what does/doesn't exist in 00 so just believe we should let folks wish for what they want and grant they have the knowledge to know what they're wishing for.

[njee20]

You can't have free form on something like this, as it's just too difficult to collate any results IMO. You need to start with a defined list.

You can arrive at that list from scratch, or you can start with one you already have as a template. That may be prohibitive where there's very little overlap (or rather there is a lot in OO which isn't replicated), but again, IMO on anything from the last 20 years there aren't all that many gaps. The MPV, 87 and 90 spring to mind. Beyond that I'm struggling for powered models, although that's literally off the top of my head.

I freely ventured that I only knew about one era, and my thoughts on how I'd execute that. I've offered my support to Brian to do just that. Luckily I won't be trying to define a list on weird GWR 0-6-2s as they existed on a Thursday in November 1925!

[woodbury22uk]

Out of curiosity do Oxford diecast ever issue a wish-list, or has anyone ever created one ? 

The subject occurs quite frequently on here.

There is a whole Facebook Group devoted to that subject, across all scales.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/601429333223215/

It is uncontrolled wish listing rather than a thought-through poll, so I am sure Oxford take no notice of it.


There is also a long running thread on RMWeb started by Grahame Hedges.

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/116781-oxford-diecast-vehicles/

[Newportnobby]

You can't have free form on something like this, as it's just too difficult to collate any results IMO. You need to start with a defined list.

I fail to follow your logic at all. It is the wishers who define the list and that's not difficult to collate providing people wish for something that stands a chance of getting made by a manufacturer with minimum runs e.g it's no good wishing for a '1927 Stanwardley 6-6-2 of which 23 were made to run on the Isles of Scilly'
Sorry, but as they say on a certain programme, I'm out

[njee20]

But from a logistical point of view you can't just provide a free form box and say "here you go, what d'ya want?" because it's nearly impossible to collate in any meaningful sense. You need to tell people what the options are IMO.

That also means people will think "oo, yes, I would like one of those", whereas asking people "what is it that you want" will yield the one or two things they really think are critical.

[Newportnobby]

It's a wishlist for N gauge toys, not an election with defined choices.
If you want it so complicated I wish you luck with it.
The implication is people know nothing so we must tell them, and that really sticks in my craw

[JimSan]

Not sure if this is how things are done already, only recently gotten back into N gauge (a couple of months) and wasn't here for the last poll.
But would the poll be categorised into era/regions?
For example, would there be a poll choice for most wanted Southern loco? (and same for other big four, blue BR/TOPs and modern categories), would mean that modellers of any given era/region would have a say on what they'd like to see without competition between the different eras/regions.

[woodbury22uk]

The French N gauge Forum has just completed its ninth annual wish list poll. This ran for one month from 1 to 30 September 2018. They have 10 categories with various quantities of items in each category, selected by the ones which have been popular in the past surveys but are not yet made, new suggestions from members, less the ones which have been announced for manufacture.

Very similar types are grouped, so the 5 variants of the Z2 EMU appear as one category, on the assumption that a manufacturer would tool up two bodies, but with some mixing and matching could cover at least 5 different types. So it would be a bit like including the Electric Multiple Units in the Class 507/508/313/314/315 family as one.

Each category has its own topic, and I attach a link to just one (EMUs) so you can see the layout:-

http://le-forum-du-n.forumotions.net/t30373-sondage-dsidratas-pour-2019-automotrices?highlight=sondage

Members can vote for as many items as they wish in each category, BUT the criterion is that you would buy your choice if released. Obviously that is a matter of honour, and honesty, but judging by the number of votes in each category, I do not suspect that people deliberately abuse the rule. The Forum has 1070 members who have posted in the past 12 months, and 555 members who have posted since the survey began. This latter category will have been directly exposed to the poll.

Their categories reflect the French market and are not directly applicable to the UK, but also focus largely on motive power. The categories are:-

Steam locomotives (23 choices)
Diesel locomotives (15)
Electric locomotives - 1.5kV (12)
Electric locomotives - 25kV (6)
Electric locomotives - multi-voltage (7)
Electric Multiple Units - including hybrids (17)
Diesel Multiple Units (18)
Passenger coaches (16)
Freight rolling stock (25)
Departmental, shunters  and other service stock (15)

154 items in total to be voted for.


So the poll is a distillation of what is likely to be made if it  polls well, rather than a scattergun approach that aims to list every possible option.

One of the problems I found with the N gauge incarnation of the RMWeb poll was that there was too much listed, which:-

1) made it a very time consuming exercise to complete, despite being allowed multiple sittings;

2) Made it very easy to miss things in the reams of lists.

The 2016 results are linked here, which I think illustrates the number of choices, and the 900 in this .pdf are just the ones people voted for.

I always complete the French survey in all the categories which interest me, in a fairly painless way.

Whoever takes on the poll I would suggest reducing the range of items listed in total, and subdividing them into manageable categories rather than having a single all embracing poll, albeit split by type of equipment/operating company as it was in the RMWeb poll.

[red_death]

Definitely useful information if enough people fill it in.  As Mike and Nick have hinted at - the difficulty is the balance between making it simple enough for people to fill in and simple and consistent enough to actually be able to analyse the results.

If you let people submit free form then you potentially get a. mixture of inconsistent data eg someone writes 142, another writes Pacer, another writes Skipper and another writes Class 142 - you then have to rely on whoever is pulling together the data to know that all are the same thing; and b. if you only ask for say the top 5 things to make the data manageable do you then miss out on less "glamorous" wishes.

Certainly a difficult one (and I definitely don't have the answers). FWIW I always thought Brian and his team did a good job of a mammoth task and I don't doubt that they need some N gauge volunteers to help. So if you've got a bit of time and knowledge why not volunteer to Brian - I'm sure he'd welcome the help.

Cheers, Mike