Evening all
So myself and the Mrs are looking for our next car.
This will only be my 4th car and only the second time dealing with a dealer....
Considering investing quite a sum of money (for me) into this used car, so I am nervous.
Research and reading plus my experience with my current car have led me back to Ford, specifically the Focus and it's new(ish) Ecoboost engines.
Last Friday I test drove the 125 version and was suitably impressed, but the dealer wouldn't come within £400 of what I wanted to spend so walked away.
There are a couple of examples advertised on the net with the spec, mileage and age combination I am after, but not local enough.
So, whilst I wait/search for the next potential candidate, I ask the Forum:
Does anybody have one of these / had one of these / experienced one of these?
Known issues online range from the catastrophic (but related to a recall that hadn't been done) to the silly (some guy couldn't get the indicators to self-cancel?!).
Skyline2uk
Can't help you with the Focus, but have the Fiesta 1.0 Ecoboost 100 Titanium so if I can help with anything suitable let me know.
Thanks Nobby
That's the same basic block so general experience would help.
How long have you had it/ how old is it would you mind me asking?
Skyline2uk
It's just over 2 years old and I've had it from new. Only 999cc but turbocharged engine so stirring the gearbox is a must but Ford do make excellent gearboxes. I paid to have the Sony DAB radio/satnav fitted but digital radio is fairly useless up here. I also paid extra to have a 'skinny' spare wheel rather than a compressor to inject crap into the tyre if it gets punctured. No problem cruising on motorways at (il)legal speed and on a long run I get around 48-50mpg (petrol). No road tax.
No problems encountered so far although the engine cut out/restart takes a bit of getting used to at first. In current weather conditions the heated front windscreen is a boon! The 'dimming' rear view mirror is also an excellent option but standard on the Titanium.
My only dislike is the intermittent windscreen wipers have a control supposedly allowing you to decide how often they make a sweep but it is, in fact, controlled by a sensor up by the rear view mirror which controls the speed of the wipers dependent on the amount of rain hitting it. Therefore I can twiddle the adjuster as much as I want to no avail ::)
Go for the highest spec you can afford.
I have owned/had as company car 3 Mondeos, a Focus and 2 x Fiestas
Hope this helps.
P.S. Twice I've taken it to Ford (Evans Halshaw) for service and have drooled over the Mondeo Vignale
Quote from: newportnobby on December 12, 2017, 09:53:58 PM
It's just over 2 years old and I've had it from new. Only 999cc but turbocharged engine so stirring the gearbox is a must but Ford do make excellent gearboxes. I paid to have the Sony DAB radio/satnav fitted but digital radio is fairly useless up here. I also paid extra to have a 'skinny' spare wheel rather than a compressor to inject crap into the tyre if it gets punctured. No problem cruising on motorways at (il)legal speed and on a long run I get around 48-50mpg (petrol). No road tax.
No problems encountered so far although the engine cut out/restart takes a bit of getting used to at first. In current weather conditions the heated front windscreen is a boon! The 'dimming' rear view mirror is also an excellent option but standard on the Titanium.
My only dislike is the intermittent windscreen wipers have a control supposedly allowing you to decide how often they make a sweep but it is, in fact, controlled by a sensor up by the rear view mirror which controls the speed of the wipers dependent on the amount of rain hitting it. Therefore I can twiddle the adjuster as much as I want to no avail ::)
Go for the highest spec you can afford.
I have owned/had as company car 3 Mondeos, a Focus and 2 x Fiestas
Hope this helps.
P.S. Twice I've taken it to Ford (Evans Halshaw) for service and have drooled over the Mondeo Vignale
Wow, so a job offer from Autocar magazine expected any time soon then?
I have a previous generation Fiesta with those wipers, agree they can be odd!
Heard DAB can be hit and miss, but seeing as it's standard on Focus's (Foci?!) with the 125 engine it's not an option for me! The one I test drove worked on two random stations, suppose I should check it picks up something I like!
Focus 1.0 Eco has £20 road tax, the 125 I want is £30.
Your experience with gearbox stirring also ties with my drive and research. Certainly had no issues with the one I sampled (six speeder, short throw number).
Heard some people complaining about a short clutch life, assume yours is holding up well?
Skyline2uk
This is a good site to do some research on.
https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/ (https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/)
Quote from: Dalek on December 12, 2017, 10:14:03 PM
This is a good site to do some research on.
https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/ (https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/)
Thanks sir
I did read his (their?) review. Different opionion on Power / Grunt available to Autocar and car buyer.
Appreciate the reccomendation though :thumbsup:
Skyline2uk
cant say about the 125 as i have the ST but the new focus itself is a great car,
I had the 125 fiesta which was a great car!!
Is the engine not a bit small for the bigger car ?
Quote from: cazadoom on December 12, 2017, 10:50:10 PM
cant say about the 125 as i have the ST but the new focus itself is a great car,
I had the 125 fiesta which was a great car!!
Is the engine not a bit small for the bigger car ?
This was my primary concern as yes, a one litre seems very small for a Focus sized car. In fact the whole engine block fits on an A4 piece of paper :goggleeyes:
However, it's not size it's power and 125hp is ok for the Focus which itself is lighter than the previous generation. It certainly felt adaquate on my test drive.
What I am looking for (if possible) is somebody who has put some miles on this engine, to gauge longer term reliability?
Skyline2uk
Quote from: newportnobby on December 12, 2017, 09:53:58 PM
My only dislike is the intermittent windscreen wipers have a control supposedly allowing you to decide how often they make a sweep but it is, in fact, controlled by a sensor up by the rear view mirror which controls the speed of the wipers dependent on the amount of rain hitting it. Therefore I can twiddle the adjuster as much as I want to no avail ::)
As you identify, with rain sensing wipers that's not the frequency of intermittent wipe, it's the sensitivity of the automatic wipers. Don't drive a Ford, but on all cars I've driven with rain sensing wipers there's been an appreciable difference. On my own Golf at one extreme they'll go onto double speed if someone spits within 50ft at one extreme, and stubbornly refuse to work at all in a tornado at t'other.
The concern about small capacity engines with large turbos is more the reliance on that turbo, which is having to work rather hard. I wouldn't want to buy a 1 litre engine with 125bhp and 100k miles on it.
QuoteThe concern about small capacity engines with large turbos is more the reliance on that turbo, which is having to work rather hard. I wouldn't want to buy a 1 litre engine with 125bhp and 100k miles on it.
This is my main lingering issue. I am looking for as low mileage as possible. FYI that turbo spins at 200,000rpm plus!
Skyline2uk
I can't offer as much as the above having never owned one personally. But I have had one as a long term loaner from a garage whilst my car's engine was replaced under warranty (long story). I had the thing for 7 weeks.
What I will tell you is this. Focus 1.0 ecoboost, manual. Very driveable if you are prepared to work the gearbox although I found it a pain. I drive automatics wherever possible but as manuals go this box is positive, easy to use and you can get some slick changes unlike a lot of the other stuff out there. You do need to keep the revs up to stay on power but that is to be expected from a tiny engine with a huge reliance on turbocharging. Fuel economy is a dream though, very frugal indeed. I was averaging almost 60mpg on my commute and I don't exactly drive with economy in mind. :hmmm:
Comfortable and easy to drive long distances, and this is not a "given" in this sector. Try doing the same in a French made car of similar size and you'll probably be booking in at an Osteopath. I was commuting 100 miles each way at the time (1000 miles a week!) and not once did I feel stiff or uncomfortable. The suspension does leave a bit to be desired on poor surfaces though, it can get a bit thrashy.
As for trim and toys, can't offer much. This one seemed to have loads of gizmos most of which I never used. Heated front screen was good, radio worked best on FM but then I don't tend to use DAB even where it is fitted as the range can be a pain. FM just keeps the signal a lot longer.
Would I buy one? Yes, at the right price. It really is a decent way to travel. It's the whole pricing thing which bugs me at the moment though. Was looking at a Ssangyong to pull my caravan recently on the basis of it being cheap and cheerful, which it turned out not to be. To me it's a cheap far eastern import thing which would do a job. The dealer actually believed I was going to pay 37 grand for one. Deluded is one word, along with a choice of colourful adjective to accompany it. From where I sit it needs to be sub 20k, and it does seem entirely possible to spend this on a Fiesta now. It's a mad world.
Quote from: njee20 on December 13, 2017, 08:04:23 AM
Quote from: newportnobby on December 12, 2017, 09:53:58 PM
My only dislike is the intermittent windscreen wipers have a control supposedly allowing you to decide how often they make a sweep but it is, in fact, controlled by a sensor up by the rear view mirror which controls the speed of the wipers dependent on the amount of rain hitting it. Therefore I can twiddle the adjuster as much as I want to no avail ::)
As you identify, with rain sensing wipers that's not the frequency of intermittent wipe, it's the sensitivity of the automatic wipers. Don't drive a Ford, but on all cars I've driven with rain sensing wipers there's been an appreciable difference. On my own Golf at one extreme they'll go onto double speed if someone spits within 50ft at one extreme, and stubbornly refuse to work at all in a tornado at t'other.
That sums it up very nicely :laughabovepost:
I really do find it a pain int th'arse as it removes control from a driver (not boasting here) with more knowledge of when to wipe the screen or not and at what speed :unimpressed:
Fair enough. I love rain sensing wipers myself, just one less thing to think about, you can always give the stick a little flick if you think they need doing.
@Dsolds (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=6422)
Appreciate your input, again it seems to be correlating with the majority of feedback and reading I have done.
Re price; I find myself coming back to Ford time and again on this. I actually looked at Kia because hire cars I have had seemed well built BUT that seems to be because they are priced like Ford, Vauxhall etc. And tech wise, this engine seems to put Ford ahead IF it lasts like the more conventional 4 pots of old.
I will let everybody know if and when one appears at Skyline towers.
Skyline2uk
Can't see any issue with the head itself, no inherent reason for that, definitely going to be the turbos blowing on older engines IMO as they're working much harder. Not sure there are enough reaching big mileage to know yet.
The VW 1.4 TSI in the Scirocco from which they eek 170bhp had some bad press, but again no real relevance to other platforms. I recall the dodgy version was both supercharged and turbocharged.
My aged Focus has an intermittent wipe which is very controllable, and if on regular speed wipe the wipers switch to intermittent when stationary. But I have an extra vigilance device which sits on the front seat and knows much better when the screen needs wiping. An audible squeak produces a quick driver response, if he knows what is good for him.
My old Peugeot 206 had an intermittent wipe which increased depending on the speed you were going at. When stationary they only worked every 4 seconds, every 3 seconds up to 30mph, every 2 seconds up to 70 and every 1 second above 70 (making those numbers up slightly as it was more than 10 years ago). Was very odd, and quite annoying, as there's not really any reason for wanting the wipers to work more quickly at higher speeds if it's only raining very lightly!
Quote from: njee20 on December 13, 2017, 11:07:49 AM
My old Peugeot 206 had an intermittent wipe which increased depending on the speed you were going at. When stationary they only worked every 4 seconds, every 3 seconds up to 30mph, every 2 seconds up to 70 and every 1 second above 70 (making those numbers up slightly as it was more than 10 years ago). Was very odd, and quite annoying, as there's not really any reason for wanting the wipers to work more quickly at higher speeds if it's only raining very lightly!
Reminds me of the vacuum powered wipers on my first car - a Ford 100E Popular. With the engine struggling uphill the wipers could and did reach a standstill! Mind you in the pre- 70mph speed limit days it did manage an indicated 90 - 100 mph downhill on the M2 from Chatham to Strood. Very smooth at that speed though I was happy there was not much traffic around.
I've been running a Focus Ecoboost 1.6 182hp for the last 3 1/2 years with no trouble*.
I think you're right to go for the 125hp rather than the 100hp, though having driven the latter in direct comparison to an old 1.6 standard Focus, the Ecoboost was impressively identical - Ford tuned these to match the older non-turbo engines, and very well - you'd never know it was a 1 litre.
I decided to go for some more oomph in the end with the 1.6, which has a decent amount of poke, but is not more expensive in terms of insurance. The current version of that is a 1.5 (which is a derivative of the 1.6 tuned to match the Chinese market where above 1.5 tax is higher).
In terms of buying secondhand, as long as it's had basic servicing there should be no trouble - these engines service schedule comprises virtually nothing - oil and filters every 12k miles, no spark plug changes even until many many miles (100k IIRC) and for the 1.6 no timing belt (chain).
The only strange thing I've ever had occur was to wake up one morning to come out to the car to find all the windows down....I never got to the bottom of why (I tend to sit on the key fob, so not sure if I managed to send a weird combination of bum-button presses inadvertently), and it's never done that again in over a year.
Cheers,
Alan
* Heart FM on the DAB radio is a bit intermittent, but perhaps that's a good thing.... :D
Often just holding the unlock button will open all the windows. Never worked out why.
Quote from: njee20 on December 13, 2017, 12:00:50 PM
Often just holding the unlock button will open all the windows. Never worked out why.
Interesting - you prompted me to google it, and it seems like it was a lucky/unlucky press combo on the key fob:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wl30u3tvdGE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wl30u3tvdGE)
Cheers,
Alan
@Dr Al (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=263)
Thanks for that, all noted!
Skyline2uk
Quote from: woodbury22uk on December 13, 2017, 11:32:30 AM
Quote from: njee20 on December 13, 2017, 11:07:49 AM
My old Peugeot 206 had an intermittent wipe which increased depending on the speed you were going at. When stationary they only worked every 4 seconds, every 3 seconds up to 30mph, every 2 seconds up to 70 and every 1 second above 70 (making those numbers up slightly as it was more than 10 years ago). Was very odd, and quite annoying, as there's not really any reason for wanting the wipers to work more quickly at higher speeds if it's only raining very lightly!
Reminds me of the vacuum powered wipers on my first car - a Ford 100E Popular. With the engine struggling uphill the wipers could and did reach a standstill! Mind you in the pre- 70mph speed limit days it did manage an indicated 90 - 100 mph downhill on the M2 from Chatham to Strood. Very smooth at that speed though I was happy there was not much traffic around.
Hmm... no it didn't unless you attached a rocket booster to it. :smiley-laughing:
Max they are capable of is 70mph and you would need to be deaf or mechanically unsympatheticto try and do that speed in one. :o
I'd guess the speedo was grossly over reading !
Mine used to sound like it was going to blow up at 55 mph !
105E on the other hand was much better, kent engine was light years ahead of the old side valve, even had 4 gears ! :)
He did say "indicated" for that very reason one presumes...
Quote from: njee20 on December 13, 2017, 01:48:14 PM
He did say "indicated" for that very reason one presumes...
Yep, i'd guess so, unless its a "pub" 100mph :laugh: ;) :D :) ;D
Adam @Skyline2uk (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=1081) , it'll depend on what it's used for I suppose. If it's for commuting around town, then it'll be fine. Cruising up and down the motorways like me, then a big diesel is much more economical. I get 65+ mpg out of my 2.0l 140bhp Insignia all at £30 a year road tax
Admittedly it's not great around town but it's not designed for that, it's a motorway cruiser, which it does brilliantly.
Also, you won't get a very big train set in a Focus, or much camping/ Scouting/Guiding equipment in the boot either ;)
Cheers
Neal.
Quote from: Calnefoxile on December 13, 2017, 02:32:39 PM
Adam @Skyline2uk (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=1081) , it'll depend on what it's used for I suppose. If it's for commuting around town, then it'll be fine. Cruising up and down the motorways like me, then a big diesel is much more economical. I get 65+ mpg out of my 2.0l 140bhp Insignia all at £30 a year road tax
Admittedly it's not great around town but it's not designed for that, it's a motorway cruiser, which it does brilliantly.
Also, you won't get a very big train set in a Focus, or much camping/ Scouting/Guiding equipment in the boot either ;)
Cheers
Neal.
Personally I think Diesels are still better than the petrol option for the reason you give but the difference is marginal and only due to the manufactures betting on the wrong tech due to Government incentives.
As this car is going to need to be a workhorse for 7 plus years, I can't afford to be banned from anywhere (as the legislatative wind is blowing) and the road tax incentive isn't there (125 Ecoboost also £30).
I also have a commute that is more stop-start than anything so Diesel isn't for me.
Skyline2uk
The first 2 Mondeos I had I put over 100,000 miles on each, and 30,000 miles on the 3rd one and the gearbox/clutch were always damned good so I never fear anything about that side of Ford engines. The early ones had a timing belt which would have been expensive to service but they were company cars. Then Ford changed to chain so no issue.
I love Dr Al's story about the windows and can only assume it was a pane from the backside :-X
Well, no going back now....
Picked up my "Deep Impact Blue" Focus this afternoon.
Got me a cracking deal, having walked away a couple of weeks back, the dealer rang me back and said I could have it at my price if I covered the delivery fee.
Big chunk of change off the sticker price (suspect end of year quota comes into play) and buy far the lowest mileage example I have seen for sale.
Thanks for all the info folks :-)
Skyline2uk
Reminds me of the vacuum powered wipers on my first car - a Ford 100E Popular. With the engine struggling uphill the wipers could and did reach a standstill! Mind you in the pre- 70mph speed limit days it did manage an indicated 90 - 100 mph downhill on the M2 from Chatham to Strood. Very smooth at that speed though I was happy there was not much traffic around.
[/quote]
weren't those the ones that when you pulled out to overtake and accelerated ....... slowed down so you could see sod all ?
Quote from: Skyline2uk on December 21, 2017, 05:22:20 PM
Well, no going back now....
Picked up my "Deep Impact Blue" Focus this afternoon.
I'll be interested to know what you think of it after a suitable time
Just got a 2 year old eco boost fiesta. Nice car but always have to drive in a lower gear than I would in our older fiesta, otherwise it labours.
Quote from: newportnobby on December 21, 2017, 08:02:48 PM
Quote from: Skyline2uk on December 21, 2017, 05:22:20 PM
Well, no going back now....
Picked up my "Deep Impact Blue" Focus this afternoon.
I'll be interested to know what you think of it after a suitable time
Will do mate
Quote from: Plainline. on December 21, 2017, 09:21:28 PM
Just got a 2 year old eco boost fiesta. Nice car but always have to drive in a lower gear than I would in our older fiesta, otherwise it labours.
The dash informs me to change up very often in this, but that is a trait I have noted on many cars these days. It's not an issue as the 6 speed in this is a joy to use.
Skyline2uk
:laughabovepost:
Young dealer who won't say that again!
QuoteSo back to the changing gear questions i notice it has to be driven well to get good acceleration and performance then it works really well, if i drive it like a granny it doesnt move well at all
Agreed. Mrs Skyline drove it home last night and as she was taught by her father who is somebody who uses all the gears (up and down without skipping), she didn't have any real issues. Other than forgetting the box goes beyond the 4 in her Rover Mini that is!
Both myself and Mrs got in trouble with our "proper" instructors as we used gears / engine breaking and not (say) going from 4th to 2nd under breaking for a red light.
Skyline2uk
Quote from: newportnobby on December 12, 2017, 09:53:58 PM
Only 999cc but turbocharged engine so stirring the gearbox is a must but Ford do make excellent gearboxes.
My quote about my Fiesta Ecoboost ↑
My Mum, following an operation which left reduced strength in her left arm, has recently bought a 2 year old Fiesta automatic and I have warned her if she's not careful she'll lose her licence as it's a little rocketship!
Quote from: newportnobby on December 22, 2017, 09:59:02 AM
Quote from: newportnobby on December 12, 2017, 09:53:58 PM
Only 999cc but turbocharged engine so stirring the gearbox is a must but Ford do make excellent gearboxes.
My quote about my Fiesta Ecoboost ↑
My Mum, following an operation which left reduced strength in her left arm, has recently bought a 2 year old Fiesta automatic and I have warned her if she's not careful she'll lose her licence as it's a little rocketship!
My other half has one of those and its indeed really quick off the mark. Its quicker by nearly a second to 60 over the manual but you can still easily get high 40s to gallon from it, even weirder the automatic is only available as 100BHP yet it feels quicker than the 125!
Best ones to buy at the moment are the pre March 2017 cars as on the 1/4/17 they put the tax up so there is no incentive to buy one new as the first year tax is £240 and then £140 a year from then on. Before the manuals were normally free and the automatics £30 (with the first year free)!
Richard
Radio commercials here make 'ecoboost' sound like 'ego boost'. Which in Los Angeles is what a lot of folks need on a daily basis.
By way of an update on this (and by resolution of my not too recent rant on the Angry Thread re "silly" parking others :veryangry:), please enjoy this before and after of my rear quarter.....
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/61/1081-060218193735.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=61632)
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/61/1081-060218193842.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=61633)
My mates at the garage opposite my office saw me alright, at a price which softened the blow and using the proper kit (was warned off certain "Master" outfits who do the job in-situ).
General ownership notes on the Ecoboost;
1) 125 unit was the way to go, very acceptable performance but can see the 100 unit struggling with less power and resultant high revs to compensate would blunt economy.
2) Have not had average fuel economy below 42mpg in any conditions and have achieved over 55 between Bristol and London. On the motorway I am relaxed but I haven't really adapted my driving style to achieve this economy.
3) As told beforehand, you need to work the box to keep on power. No hardship.
4) Cabin isn't the most quiet on the motorway. Road roar results in the need to turn up the radio. A shame as the engine is actually very refined, so much so I have had to check it was on....
5) The "sync" system (Bluetooth with phone) isn't perfect, but improvement on previous system on old Fiesta.
I am still in the "honeymoon" period with this car, but after 2000 miles I don't think I have chosen badly (all fingers crossed).
Skyline2uk
You have the upgrade alloys on it and tyres on those can vary in terms of noise. I just replaced my 17s on my C-max to Avons (remember them) and the noise difference was massive. So much quieter and MPG is better. It originally had Hankooks on it which Ford seem to fit as standard when new which are considered a budget brand by many tyre fitters.
Richard
Quote from: Skyline2uk on February 06, 2018, 07:52:12 PM
1) 125 unit was the way to go, very acceptable performance but can see the 100 unit struggling with less power and resultant high revs to compensate would blunt economy.
Interestingly, Ford have recently introduced a more powerful still version of this engine - 140 now - it'll be interesting to see real world performance and reviews of this. I wonder too what they'll do with the 1.5L longer term - it does kind of imply that they could get more from that.
Still doesn't get to the reported 197 that they've had on test with the 1.0L engine (albeit IIRC with two turbos...)...but I wonder how long it'll be before a 1.0L can be bought with 200hp or more.
Cheers,
Alan
I have just checked and, as I suspected, the next generation Fiesta ST is going to have the 1.5L unit.
Given the power levels of the most recent "hot hatches", I would be amazed if this generates much less than 200BHP.
The 140 unit must be what Ford seem to be the top end of sustainable in the non-performance orientated models. Reading before and since buying my Focus, it's seems the milage limited part on the Ecoboost engine is more likely to be the Turbo, circa 90k from that before replacement.
If mine reaches that, fine with me, didn't do that many miles in 7 years with my old car.
Skyline2uk
197bhp. 0-62 of 6.7 seconds. No slouch for sure.
Quote from: njee20 on February 13, 2018, 06:50:17 PM
197bhp. 0-62 of 6.7 seconds. No slouch for sure.
What's the betting the advertise that as "200ps", given that the unit in mine is 123BHP but 125ps?
Anyway, splitting hairs, would love the hot Fiesta (or any fast Ford for that matter). Maybe I should have worked harder :'(
Skyline2uk
It's not even an advertising thing. 1 metric horsepower (ps) is 0.986 British horsepower. So yes, it'll be 200ps for sure.